Nursing/Midwifery students (or wannabes LOL)....

The masters is different to the post-grad mid. post-grad is aimed at nurses wanting to get their mid quals. Masters is a higher level of learning and aimed at those with existing mid quals. Does that make sense?

The duration of post-grad mid does vary from Uni to Uni but in most instances, it is only 12 months (like most post-grad courses) unless doing it part time. Several Uni's now offer the combined nursing/mid degree (4 years) but I think you have to apply for that straight off - I don't know that you can do your degree (either mid or nursing) and then just add the extra year straight away. I think you have to complete your nursing/mid training then do your Grad year and then apply for the post grad course in mid/nursing (depending on what your initial training was) which is usually 12 months (although I think some Uni's do 2 years for post grad nursing). It is best to check it out with the Uni you are thinking of doing it with - remembering that for post grad courses you need to be working in the field so need to also gain employment with a hospital affiliated with the Uni you want to do your post grad at. If that doesn't make sense or you want to know more - just ask or PM and I will try to answer.


MG

Hey ladies,
I have applyed to uac for enrollment to do my RN for next year..i am already an EN. i will have to commute for an hour to and from the campus that i will be attending. But it is alll for a good cause. i really want to do midwifery and this is the only way to get it.. :D

Hooray! good luck blue!! Have you thought about doing a bachelor of midwifery instead of a bachelor of nursing? The BMid is 3 years so it is shorter than doing a BN and then doing postgrad midwifery studies.

HI MG,

I think what you have said about masters applies in most states except in QLD (and an honours degree is 'ranked' higher than a masters). In QLD you can undertake a masters in midwifery straight out of your BN. There is much hoohaa about this at the moment as the masters is only a 1 year course so it is turning out midwives who have very little clinical experience and who have lower competency standards than other states. eg, 5 VE's compared to 10, 3 follow throughs compared to 30. The education standards are currently being looked at at the moment so hopefully this will all change within the next few years.

How interesting Sam! I know that "they" (whoever they are!) are also looking at bringing nursing and mid studies in all states and territories into line with each other so we all graduate with the same knowledge and experience etc. Seems we all graduate at different levels! Will be interesting to see the changes!

Moving to the new studying forum :)

Mother Goose, do you mind if I ask a question?
I remember you mentioning that you did your Nursing degree externally through UniSA. How did you do your exams and assignments? From my understanding of what is on the UniSA website, you can submit assignments online.. but what about exams? Did you have to go to Adelaide to do them or can you organise to do them at another uni local to you and unisa send the assignment in the post and you have the other uni supervise you while doing the exam?

Hi Karina,

No problems at all. Assignments: Some assignments can't be submitted via AssignIT (the online system) and so you post them in. So long as you have it post marked by the close of business on the due date - that is fine (they know it takes a couple of days to transport).
Exams: You CAN go to SA to do them or do what I did - organise an invigilator (supervisor) and you can do them here in Vic. There are places that you can call but they charge per exam. I used a Doc I know. There are certain professions that can supervise, police, justice of the peace, etc... the Uni sends a list of suitable porfessions to you.

Oh wow, thanks so much for your quick response MG! That sounds so much better than what I was imagining! Here I was thinking I might have to go to Adelaide for all the exams! Can I ask, MG, were you already an EN when you started your nursing degree or had you had no nursing experience yet?

No, I was not an EN before I did my degree. I did however, have extensive experience as a volunteer ambo in SA (but we are not entitled to credit - only EN's are and even then it is limited).

Thanks MG :)
I'm submitting my application very soon! Just need to ring them tomorrow about my transcripts from TAFE, then I'm going to send my application! Cant wait till Jan when I'll find out whether or not I got in.

Hi, I just registered for this site, having found you all through Google! It's great to see that lots of other people are experiencing similar dilemas to me. I have a science degree and have worked in science for a while but since having my son Oliver 2 years ago I am really keen to change proffessions and become a midwife. It's good to read all the information contained here but I'm still a bit unsure.

I have done lots of research about options for study then work and it's a shame that it's so difficult. I am in Tasmania and we are pretty backward as far as I can tell. I found out about the UniSA bach mid which I was keen to do (as we don't even have a bach mid here) but have talked to a lot of people in the industry in Tasmania and found out that without nursing it will be virtually impossible to get work even if I am a registered midwife. The birth center (where I delivered Oliver) is part of the hospital and the hospital require nursing. So I could do nursing through Tas Uni then work as a nurse then do the grad dip mid but this all seems very hard and I'm worried that I will get depressed studying something that I'm not interested in. I am in half a mind to go ahead and apply for SA and do it externally but I could end up a midwife with no work. As lots of you have already said I'm also worried about the highly medicalised/hospitalised model of care in Australia and would like to make a difference but am worried that I'll just be sucked into the system and unable to change it.

Does anyone know of a combined nursing and midwifery degree that can be studied externally? At least this way I would get to include some of the midwifery right from the start of the degree and it would be shorter than doing nursing first. I am really worried with the post-grad diploma of midwifery that I won't get enough experience before work.

Am doing uni applications at the mo.....

Thanks

Nina

Nina I will respond to a few of the things you wrote about. I am not a midwife so I can't comment on how easy or difficult it is to get work as a midwife if you are not also a Registered Nurse. However, I can tell you that the University of South Australia (unless they changed it this year) offer the combined Bachelor of Mid/Nursing externally. Also, at UniSA, they subjects studied in the first two years of mid and also in nursing are almost identical in title and content - it is only the final year that is dramatically different.
If you do the combined degree, you will find that the majority of employers want you to have done a Graduate year for both disciplines (nursing and mid) so it may be an option to do nursing, your grad year as a nurse, then apply for post-grad mid and do the mid grad year. The only potential issue with that is how competative mid actually is. Whether you do the combined mid/nursing or do nursing and then post-grad mid, the duration of tertiary study is 4 years both ways.

Karina Good luck with your application. I hope you get in!

MG

Hi girls,

Well today i bit the bullet and enrolled in the Bachelor of Midwifery externally through UniSA. I have ummed and ahhed the last few days about wether it was the right decision and i think it is. I guess i was worried about studying interstate the most. But for me to do it this way save's 4 years of studying externally at James Cook University in Townsville.

I know it is an extremely hard course to go into and i have prepared myself for the chance that i don't get in. I will be sitting the STAT next month. Fingers crossed i am one of the lucky ones!

Good to see there are a few others that a applying for the same course. It would be great to have someone to have a bit of support from and give support to. Thats if we all get in! Wishing you all luck.

Now the waiting begins....

Mother Goose - thanks for your speedy response - this web forum thing is great :o) I've done a search and it doesn't look like UniSA offer the combined degree anymore. So I'm left with deciding between the external Bachelor of Midwifery through UniSA and straight nursing through Tas Uni followed later on by the graduate diploma of midwifery. I will apply for both to keep my options open. Thanks again.
Good luck to you Sara - I might see you in Adelaide.....!

Sara, i'm applying for the same as you! Hope we can both get in. Good luck!!

Nina, good luck! I was reading some stuff on the UTS website about their bachelor of Midwifery and it stated that their graduates have a really high employment rate once they have finished their degree. Thats in Sydney, but I dont see why it would be so different in Tas? Maybe have a look at some of the job advertisements for midwives and see what they want in terms of qualifications.

I still havent submitted my application. I wanted to ask them if they need my tafe certificates, but I dont think I'll bother to include them as I'm doing STAT and I think that will mean my TAFE study wont be counted. Anyone know if thats the case?

its totally going to kill me waiting until January when they tell us whether or not we got in!

Hi Karina,

I applied yesterday and with my application i have to send of my certificates from Tafe. When you apply you have to print of a document list. Then it will is the certificates you have to send in. It says if you fail to send in the certificates it will affect your application.

I'd send them in just to be safe.

Oh ok Thanks Sara. I better send my certificates then!

No worries! Wishing you (and me!!!) all the best of luck!

Hi - thought I'd pop in as I am studying at UniSA and can offer some "insider knowledge" here :). While the subject lists for the two courses are similar for first year, the courses are very different - you are a student midwife from the first day, and you have placement in first semester which student nurses don't. It's hard to explain why, but nursing and midwifery are such different professions that there is little in common between them from a philosophical or literal approach and that's how it is taught.

There is a lot of extra work that BMID requires in follow-throughs and juggling placements while also studying, and it's a lot tougher than a straight BNURS.

There is no problem with getting a job as a midwife - there is a huge shortage of them around the country. A lot of places such as Tasmania and anywhere outside of metropolitan locations will require you to be a RN/RM though, which means that you can do an extra year after the BMID to also be an RN - it is mostly clinical placements and it quite easy to do.

Doing the grad year is entirely up to you and is also VERY competitive to get in to. It's not required by most employers, but it is of great use to the students themselves!

Thanks for that Emma. Very helpful.

Just a question...With the workshops...Do you know exactly when they are and how many days they run for?? I just am trying to work out how often and how many days for that i have to be away from my kids if i get in. Its a bit thinking ahead of myself but i just want to know how things will work.

TIA

Hi girls,
I too have just completed my application for Nursing, I thought about Midwifery Nursing double but have decided that the competion is so fierce and the work load for nursing suits me alot better :).
I need to fine tune my application letter that needs to be in by the 28th , I have next Wed off work and DD is daycare so that is my plan. I need to get my certificates certified thank goodness my brother is a police officer and lives around the corner oh it is starting to freak me out..imagine me by January. I have only applied at the local Uni so I hope fingers crossed I am accepted and that I dont get pregnant (I'm doing IVF atm) I am going to make up my mind what to do IF both happens
Argghhh
Bec

Up until this year, UniSA required nursing students to do placements in first year. They now do longer placements in 2nd and 3rd year (with an extra placement in 2nd year) to replace the first year placement. This reflects the changes set by the "Authorities" when working out what requirements students have to meet.

Having investigated the extra workload in Mid, I would agree that juggling the workload is tougher than any other degree (with maybe Medicine being an exception).

Sara- you will be given workshop dates at the beginning of the semester when you enrol in the courses that have a workshop component.

Emma - I would be interested to know which employers will employ if you haven't done a Grad Year. My experience is that it is very difficult to get work without having done a Grad Year. I have friends keen to skip grad year though so I'd be very interested to know who will employ without the Grad Year so I can pass it on to them... Perhaps it varies from State to State?

Karina - def send in those certificates. Better to give them too much info than too little!

Bec - Good luck with your application! If you do get pregnant and also get accepted into Uni, you could always defer for 12 months and then start Uni...

MG

I just got my Modules for my Doula course emailed to me! YAY!!!! I am so excited. Bout to go and start studying!!

MG - Thanks for that! So i won't even know unless i get accepted basically.

Bec - I bet just because you are applying for uni you will fall pregnant staight away! Fingers crossed you do! Thank god for the opportunity to defer! Good luck with it all....

Sorry Sara - it's a pain isn't it? Previously, the school has emailed/sent a list of placements to existing students which shows the placement dates for the following year (usually sent in 2nd semester but forget when). Although it lists all the placement dates for that discipline for the following year, it doesn't list when the workshop dates are. You can hazard a guess though. They used to be done 2 weeks prior to the placement dates but that changed last year and there were a couple a bit closer to the placements and some further away... I guess it depends on room and lecturer availability. From what I can work out, they try and hold placements for the externals either when the internal students are already on placement, or during the Uni holidays. If you know someone who is already studying at the Uni for the discipline you are applying for (Mid I assume?), perhaps they can let you know what the proposed placement dates are for 2008. But do keep in mind that although those placement dates are pretty accurate - they can change. Also keep in mind that due to how difficult it is to place nursing and midwifery students (all over Australia - not just in SA) you may need to be flexible in your placement dates. Your workshop dates won't change but you may be required to do your placement "Out of Sequence". This bears no impact on the rest of your studies other than potentially having to miss classes if you are internal or having to take time off placement to sit exams. I had to do the latter a couple of times. I don't think I ever did placement during the specified times - mine were always out of sequence.

i spoke to a "satac" person today who said there was only 20 places for midwifery external with unisa (dont quote me but ), very hard to get into so good luck and fingers crossed everyone who's applyied

yeah I was told a similar thing about midwifery external too - they told me "less than 30 places". They have bachelor of midwifery at a uni near me and its also ridiculously competitive with only 30 places (internal, they dont do it externally). I'll be happy to get into any of the degrees I have applied for!

sent my application in yesterday on the net. Just need to photocopy and certify my certificates and then I'll send them in once I go buy some stamps!

Its all very exciting!

Emma
Thanks for the insider information :o) I am from Tasmania (see my first entry earlier in this thread) and have been told that I will need to be a registered nurse as well as a midwife to get work (as you pointed out). You say that on top of the BMid course it's only an extra year - is this course offered at UniSA and do you know if it's possible to do it off campus? I will try and ask around here but Tas Uni and the hospital here are pretty hopeless so I wouldn't be surprised if they don't have the same recognision of the BMid from UniSA, especially when it comes to upgrading to include the nursing. I have applied for the external course (although finding placements in Hobart is likely to be very hard - the public hospital won't take me and I have only found one private hospital that might be able to help) but have also applied for nursing at Tas Uni. But what you say makes me really inspired to go for the midwifery degree if I get in. I really feel that as you say the premis of midwifery is completely different to nursing - as a midwife cares for almost entirely well people in a natural state. Unfortunately in Tasmania it is still considered in a practical sense to be a specialisation of nursing. Do you know what it's like to study the BMid externally? Ie - the web based stuff, the support for external students etc?? Do you have any idea how many times per year I would need to come to Adelaide?
Thanks again and to everyone else who's been so helpful with info....
Nina

Oops - forgot one other question - what exactly is a "grad year"? Does it include more study? I guess it must be different state to state.
Nina

just thought I'd mention - the ACM (Australian College of Midwives) actually recommends the undergrad Bachelor of Midwifery over the BN and postgrad Mid studies. On their website it says:

:

---

Bachelor degrees in Midwifery are the preferred avenue for education - being able to spend three years completely focused on midwifery, rather than a full nursing degree and only one year focused on midwifery.

---

So odd that they don't agree with this in Tas!!

is that strange then more places are not offered but i guess it's all a funding issue
it does make more sense to have midwifery as it's own program
good luck as I said

Nina - I did my nursing through UniSA (externally) and can answer some of your questions. You will need to go to Adelaide for workshops for every subject that has a clinical placement - they do a workshop shortly before the scheduled placement dates.
In regards to support for externals - you will be allocated a lecturer for each subject. Each subject has its own "webpage" and students are split into "discussion" groups (kind of like a tutorial group). You can email lecturers if you need anything although they also access the discussion groups (prferred method of contact).

A Grad Year is kind of like the nursing equivelant of a Doctor's Intern year. You work in a hospital (as part of a recognised Graduate Program) giving you the chance to consolidate your knowledge and clinical skills (whilst being paid for it) but recieving support, clinical guidance, and clinical education on the job. You can get information about it from the websites of most hospitals - go to the hospital website and search Graduate Nurse (or midwife) program. If you have any questions, please ask and I will try to answer.

MG

MG, I have somehow gotten into the website that you can book your external workshops through on the UniSA website.. looks like the workshops are mostly 2 - 3 days in length.. Is that what yours were?

Just out of curiosity, did you do any of your subjects through the Summer School?

Sorry for bombrding you with questions!

Hi Karina,

You are not bombarding and not bothering at all.

From memory - yes, my workshops were all 2-3 days duration. There is no accomodation on campus but plenty of other options considering the Uni is in the city. The Royal Adelaide Hospital has accomodation you can use - the cheapest in the city (forget how much). The fee is simply for the bed and room - you have to provide all linen, cutlery, saucepans etc etc. Cooking facilities are shared. I've heard awful stories about the accom there though - including Medical Students peeing in sinks... My advice is to seek accom elsewhere! If you live in a country area and are part of the CWA, the CWA can help organise accom at a good rate for you. I always staid in a motel about 4 or 5 blocks from the Uni.

I personally didn't do any subjects in summer school but if you have questions about summer school - fire away. I know someone who attempted a summer school subject.

MG

Thanks MG. thanks for the info on the workshops. Are they really full on? Are there many people there? What do they actually involve? Is it basically a simulated hospital environment or is it like a lecture, or something else?
Thanks for the info about the grotty accommodation at the RAH... I'll know to stay away from there if I do get in!

Hi Karina, ok, I will try and remember my workshops... ;)

Are they really full on? Hmmmmm, some bits were but for the most part - no. The idea of workshops is really just to teach students the practical components and skills required. A bonus is that it gives you a chance to meet some of the other externals, network, and to meet the lecturers. I can recall being bored out of my brain in several workshops. Towards the end of my degree, we also had some more intense theory components which was suppose to cover some of the more difficult theory so that we could access the lecturers for help if we needed it.

How many people are there? Well, that depends on the subject. Every external student who had to enrol in that subject should be at the workshop. They do divide students into groups and you rotate trough "stations" (all in different rooms - you usually spend half a day in each "station"). The most I had was for my last one which was every STUDENT enrolled in that subject (internal and external). Other than that, the "groups" were usually about 20 ppl max (from memory).

What do they actually involve? Depends on the subject and coordinator. You can usually expect some form of revision of the overall subject, learning and practising new skills (such as taking BP, setting up IV's, taking blood etc). There will also be skills demonstrated that you won't get a chance to practice. There is usually one or two theory components as well - things like watching Video's on pap smears etc. Every workshop involves a drug calculation test. Some do it on the first day and others do it on the last day. Depends on the coordinator - I only ever had one where we had to do it on the last day. You get the chance to play with equipment as well.

Is it a simulated hospital environment or lecture? Bit of both really. Some of the sessions are done in lecture rooms whilst others are done in labs. Some of the labs are set up to resemble a hospital ward whilst others are a bit like your high school science lab. We never had any full on practice scenario's where we had a "patient" in a bed in the "ward" and the lecturer called out stuff. We had a few sessions where there was a card with a scenario on it and a student would pretend to be the patient and the others would work out what to do. Nothing hard. Some of the sessions were "proper lectures".

I hope I've answered well enough for you - DD is carrying on on the floor in front of me.... Let me know if you have more q's

MG

MG, thanks so much for answering my questions. You've been very helpful. Its good to have some people here who are/were students there and give give some inside info!

The workshops sound really interesting.

Well I have actually done it - after thinking about it for ages today I went and applied to do a Bachelor of Nursing via distance ed at Central Queensland University. I was going to apply to do it at QUT internally but I realised that the workload (because for some reason they only offer full time at my nearest campus) and the need to go to uni nearly everyday would not fit in with my primary job of being a mum to 3 kids! So there you go. 2008 could be an interesting year!

Yay Bon, well done! Hope you get in.

Hi everyone,

I'm a SAHM of 4 and have always wanted to be a midwife, but i never tried to do anything about it because i was having my own family.
I have decided that ive been putting it off for too long now and should just go for it. I was wondering if there was a course i can do which is just midwifery? I'm not that keen on doing nursing first, but may have to grin and bear it if i have to lol
How old do you have to be to be considered a mature age student??

Thanks for your replies in advance :D