It hurts!!

Sounds like a great night, SJ! I'd reckon there's no harm in letting her demand the feeds as long as you're confident she's not too tired to demand them, KWIM? I have heard that advice before - in the early days they may be too sleepy to demand the feed, and not feeding makes them more sleepy, etc. BUT in your case it doesn't sound like a problem - sounds like she's quite happy to demand more frequent feeds before bedtime, and this morning, etc. So I'd just go with it!

Hey :D About your cracked nipple . . .
My really badly cracked nipple once it was cracked so badly still hurt like hell when attachment was perfect right through feed, felt like sharp hot pains shooting into my boob because same prob, big crack on the side that kept opening up with each feed as even with the righ tattachment, the suction immediately opened any healing skin. So, I had to use nipple shields for 2 days (though still hurt through them was bad) but bit better though didn't have time to heal it, got mastitis through the crack, so I totally (gently) expressed off that boob for a while as well and that was the best thing for healing it though not good for my supply. It took 3 weeks to heal so it didn't hurt or weep, and now it feels fine. But there still looks like there's a hairline crack in that nipple even though there's not, it just scarred like a little divet. So, I feel your pain - and you should check with one of your many LC's (I hope that haven't all given you different opinions and confused you more, hated that) and see if you might need to do the same thing to allow the crack some time to actually heal.

I need help.
It still hurts on the left, really bad. It's not getting better. Maybe it's even getting worse.
Rang the ABA yesterday, they said keep doing what I'm doing but it's not helping.
Today I went to the pharmacy, they gave me nipple shields and paw paw ointment. I don't know if I should use them but I don't know what else to do, it hurts so much on that side it makes me cry and I don't want to do it anymore. The right side is perfect, I don't understand.
:(

Try the shield for a feed or two and see if it helps. Don't use it on the good side, and just use it until the crack heals up.
If the crack takes a long time to heal that may be an indication that you need more than the antiobiotic (perhaps a different antibiotic, perhaps an anti-fungal cream of some sort), so if in a few days there is no improvement then go back to the doctor.
Another option is to express from the sore side and then bottle feed - but that brings another set of issues with learning to express effectively and with bub learning to switch between boob and bottle.

Australian Breastfeeding Association - Breast and Nipple Care

Oh hun! Huge hugs!

I have been there, I really have. It's not fair is it? Why can one side be perfect and the other hurt SO much.

Have you tried Lansinoh? It was my lifesaver. I would lather that stuff on after every feed.

Do you have a breast pump and bottle? You could express from the left and give bub a bottle of EBM until the nipple heals a bit.

Bubs must have opened the wound again (this also happened to me). It sux because you have to watch it EVERY time, which is nigh on impossible when your eyes are falling out of your head with fatigue.

Hang in there hun. You are doing so, so, so well.

Is there someone who can come around and help you today? I called my midwife at this point and she came and showed me how to express etc.

Do you have any family close by, or a good friend? Just someone who can help settle bubs after a feed and make sure you have plenty to eat and drink. This is a fragile time, and you are doing so, so, so well!

Nipple shield was cr@p! She wasn't a fan. Can't work it :( So couldn't use it. Tried the football hold again, wasn't as bad but still hurts :(
Do I have to wipe the paw paw ointment off before feeds?

I'm not sure about paw paw, but I always left the lansinoh on.

Sorry to hear the nipple shield sucked.

Are you getting pain through the whole feed or does it ease after the first ten seconds or so?

Huge hugs hun. Just remember..."this too shall pass"...

It's been hurting the whole time which I know means that she's not on right and I keep reattaching her but something is different about this side and I'm so frustrated and sore I just can't work it out. I'm doing everything the same and it looks the same. I have NFI!!!
But good news, she just had a feed on that side and it didn't hurt the whole way so somehow I must have got it right.
Going back to the LC on Mon!!

If you aren't already, try giving her the good boob first. Every second time switch her over to the sore one after a couple of minutes and then put her back on the good one at the end - but don't let her start a feed on your cracked nipple. And maybe try hand-expressing the sore nipple just to get it flowing before you attach her - that way she will hopefully be less likely to suck too hard as she's trying to start things.
Wiping the ointment off is probably worth doing - the ointments that you can leave on before feeds do actually say on the tube that it's OK to do that, so if this one doesn't mention it then wipe it off to be on the safe side.
hugs
Kate

SJ I would suggest using Lansinoh over Pawpaw cream, if you're going to use something. I would err on the side of caution and wipe the pawpaw off, but you don't need to remove the Lansinoh.

I think you're going to need some help if you want to use a nipple shield on the left until it heals. It's not one of those things that you just pop on, and 'hey presto' you and your baby know what to do. Take it along with you to the LC tomorrow, and if they thinks it's good idea to use it, then they'll be able to help you with it.

Feed in whatever position is least painful, for as many feeds as you can, all of them if possible. If that's the football hold, then do that. I second Kate's suggestion of offering her the right side first and then the left. Is it hard to get her to attach? Does she fuss alot, or just latch on?

It WILL get easier SJ. Hang in there. I know it seems like it's taking forever, but Grace is only little still, it's early days. But you know, it won't be long before it all seems so easy! :hug:

Big :hug: hunny
You are getting there! I promise!
I agree that Lansinoh would be better than paw paw ointment. & it doesn't need to be washed off.
Breast milk is best yes, but I think the Lansinoh also kind of put a barrier over your nipple iykwim. To help protect it as well as heal it.
On my Paw paw tube nothing is said about BFing & nipples, where as on a Lansinoh tube thats pretty much what its sold as. I don't think one is wrong or right, but I've used the Lansinoh for BFing & it worked for me. & alot of people I know. But I haven't used paw paw for that reason & don't know anyone who has, so I can't compare.

Could you just not feed from your right side for a day. Just express. I wouldn't give her EBM, I'd just keep feeding from the right & do a bit of expressing on the left.
It would be a bit uncomfortable, but it wouldn't hurt your supply & it may only need that long to heal.
If you are going to hand express I found the best place to get the hang of it was in a warm shower.

I'd take the sheilds along to the LC. See what they suggest. What is the problem with the sheild? Which part of using them are you having problems with?

Have you been checked for thrush on your nipple? It can cause the same or very similar pain. From what I remember my nipple lookes kind of white after a feed. It wasn't milk, or all white, but there were white bits. I don't know how to explain it, sorry.

I hope the LC can help out more this time.
You are doing so well! You should be proud!
I still get a shiver when I think of the pain of a cracked nipple!
:hug: Your going to get through this!
xx

Hey Sara,

I've been lying down for all feeds the last 3 days and it's really helped my R nipple and the pain I was feeling has been reduced dramatically.... finally after 6wks I am feeling some 'light at the end of the tunnel' for my R side!! Perhaps not only have I perfected the attachment but also Ava has?
She still fusses and pulls on and off on L side sometimes particlularly when in cradle position but I've learnt to just take her off, burp her then try her again.

Anyway, just wanted to send you some :hug: and let you know it does get easier. I didn't think it would but it does. Keep persisting. You can do it.

If your nipple is really quite sore and b.feeding is painful, then try to express (with electric pump!) and that will help keep your milk supply up on that side and at the same time give you chance to heal your nipple. This is what i've had to do a few times with the R side when it was so damaged while it healed. Although I do hope you can avoid everythnig i've been thru as it's not easy expressing in between feeds and all that.... very hard work!!!! (I still am)

Thanks for the support guys.
I'm feeling down today. I'm just over it. I feel like giving up but the thought of that makes me cry.
It hurts so much and I don't know what else to do, it's not getting better. I've seen 3 LCs and called the ABA and no one can tell me what to do, they just tell me my technique is perfect. But it's not, something is wrong. On the left side my nipple doesn't look right when she comes off, there's a ridge. So she's probably damaging it more. I'm doing exactly the same thing as on the right side and it looks the same and no matter how many times I reattach I can't get it right :( I wish someone would tell me the answer!! I'm going to go back to the LC tomorrow AGAIN anyway, maybe she'll find something this time :( I can't keep doing it if it's not getting better.

Thanks for the advice about papaw and lansinoh! And I will take my nipple shield to the LC, I can't work it out at all. Oh and Ren, I tried lying down and I can't get the hang of it :( I tried it on the good nipple coz I didn't want to hurt the other one more but almost hurt that one!! lol. So I gave up quick.

Thanks so much everyone, your support is keeping me going, honestly.

Heaven :hug:

Matie I haven't read the entire thread so if my suggestion is mentioned previously I'm sorry.

I too had a funny looking nipple after DS feed, it was so painful I felt like I might faint. It sort of looked like a lipstick if that makes sense.

What I was told was to keep my back straight up against the chair (don't lean over, even a little bit) and bring him to the breast. I tried it and it worked. Even leaning forward a little bit would mean my attachment was all wrong. I can't explain why, but leaning over was what was putting his attachment out.

I would get up, sit on a kitchen chair (as opposed to couch) every time to feed.

It made all the difference, took a while to heal but we went on to feed for 13 months and I was at the stage where I couldn't face another feed.

HTH hun and as I said sorry if this is something you've tried.

:hug: Spring

:hug: I gave up with my girls at 6 & 4 weeks because of the same thing.
If thats what you want it is totally up to you.

I was at that point with DS also at 6 weeks. I actually had him on FF for 3 days straight. I tried maybe once a day to feed him, but the pain was way too much.
I rang my MCHN in tears, but she wasn't there. I was going to wait & ring the next day, but I couldn't stop crying so I rang them back half an hour later & they tracked her down.

I had thrush, so had to get Nilstat & use the nipple sheilds for 2 days.
Have you tried Bepanthen. Because its an antisptic it has an anaesthetic in it. You could try putting it on 15 minutes before a feed & try. You need to wash it off though. It might numb it enough to be able to feed.
It worked for me for a few days, but the thrush got worse, so it stopped working (I didn't know it was thrush, neither did the MCHN or LC, it was just a matter of elimination in the end).

I hope you can get some help tomorrow, I really do. But Bubby needs you to be happy too. Being depressed about not getting it right isn't going to help.
Do whats best for all of you.

Just remember you are a great mummy no matter what! :comfort:

BTW - have you tried laying down to feed? Its another angle again that might take some pressure off the crack.

Sara,

See your GP and get a prescription for a cream called "Kenacomb Otic" thats what my LC told me to get and I rub it on after every feed. It has helped my nipples to heal.
I'm sorry to see you having so many attachment issues and pain like i've had too, it certainly makes the start of BF'ing a very upsetting one doesnt it and I haven't been able to enjoy it most of the time due to pain and other issues etc since the very beginning. It's been tough but it DOES get easier and I'm only seeing that now at 6wks.
Yeah I have bad days and I have good days.
I've found reading the BF'ing threads very helpful as it makes me realise so many ppl out there go thru what we are going thru now. It's so common and many do overcome the issues. :hug: big hugs. I've had days where I've wanted to give up but my desire to BF my daughter is too strong to give up. And the threads help motivate me to continue.
Sometimes when she gets off, my nipples have a slight 'pinch' in them and a bit whitish. But they felt fine?!?! so it's very confusing.... other times there is no ridge or pinch there.


Just make sure, she is getting enough at each feed (you can tell from the nappies as you know) and if she seems content afterwards. Otherwise if she isnt on properly that can lead to supply issues and your milk supply dropping which is what happened to me (also she was a lazy feeder and very tired all the time) it was a bit of a cycle that i've finally broken.

re: lying down. I find it so restful. But now cos' im doing it often she won't want to feed off L side when i hold her in cradle position!! So more probs now.... :lol:

SJ, I'm sorry things are so difficult ATM :hug: But you know what, things can turn around so quickly with this BFing game. As quickly as the next feed, things can seem brighter. So just keep on hanging on in there, and think of what a wonderful thing you're giving your daughter, she is growing so beautifully on your BM :D good on you!!!!

Okay, three things for the LC tomorrow...
1. Take the nipple shield and get her advice and help with that.
2. Make sure she shows you how to feed lying down, and make sure you can do it comfortably before you go home!
3. Tell her that the pain you are experiencing is, well, as bad as it is. Don't put on a brave face, don't gloss over it. If she asks you to try something different and it's still painful TELL HER. YOU are the only one who knows what you are experiencing.

In the meantime, can you try feeding standing up? I'm aware that you haven't been well, so the whole feed standing up might be too much, but at least stand up while you attach her. Babies often attach much better when mum is standing up, crazy as it sounds. My DS went 2 whole months where he would only feed if I was lying down or standing up :rolleyes:. He certainly got over those preferences and decided I was allowed to sit down again one day :lol:.

Breastfeeding, when all is going well, is not painful. In fact it is beautiful! Clearly all is not going well for you ATM, but IT WILL. One day you will be past this difficult time, and your baby will be feeding and look up at you and smile......and it will all have been worth it. Really and truly, things will get better. They won't get better on their own, you will still need to put in some hard yards, but it will be wonderful and painfree. And in the long run so much easier than bottle feeding.

Hang in there, keep on asking for help until you get answers. We are all here to support you SJ! :hug:

heaven - hugs to you! It sucks that something that is supposed to be natural isn't! I have had trouble BF both my kids but we get there everytime and then you look back at how hard it was but how easy it is now - you will get there.

Lets talk nipples - at any time could you ever describe your nipples at flatish or not as perky as some? I would never have described myself as having flat nipples but they are difficult for bubs to latch on to - I have a large areola but the nipple itself is quite small which means even though bub has a good chunk of areola in their mouth my poor nipple is still getting trashed! Also my nipples both point in different directions - aren't I just painting the freakiest picture :-) A midwife told me to line up bubs head with the direction my nipple was pointing in and using pillows as a platform line her up like that.

nipple sheilds - used them with #1 tried at 1 week and rejected them. tried again at 3wks after 2 wks of being fed EBM via bottle and he took to them like a fish to water. We used them until he was 9mths old #2 I swore I wouldn't need thembut after having my nipple so cracked I thought it would fall off we tried again. She hated them but it was shields or formula. i would put her on normally, take her off and put the shield on and put her back on, she would crack, put her on again, she would crack, take shield off, put her on, take her off, put shield on, put her back on. with in a day she got that if she wanted milk she needed to put up with the plastic. Using silicone dummies and the occasional bottle aslo helped her get used to the shield. What brand are you using, i always found the Avent ones the best and you can get them in two sizes, go for the small.

What the other ladies have said about giving that nipple as much time to heal is true, try and rest that side as much as possible, you can always build that supply up later and there are plenty of ladies out there BF with only one boob! If you have a good fence get that boobie in the sun, best healing ever, esp if you mihgt have some thrush going on. Also there are these other things avent make, wish I could remember the name of them but basically you put them in your bra (they are like cups) and they should your nipple from coming into contact with anything - basically lets them air out. You can also use them to collect milk which lets down while you are feeding from the other side! They are super ugly and I wouold recommend wearing them at a black tie event but by golly gosh they work a treat to help heal those nipples.

All the best for tomorrow