TTC & Taking Clomid &/or Metformin ~ November 2006 # 2

Debbie, it was Michelle that increased her dose on her own, and I asked her about it because I was going to do the same but never ended up doing it. My gyno wanted me to stay on 50mg because my prog. levels were good that cycle, my FS increased me straight away to 100mg. I asked him if it was risky to do so (thinking about OHSS) and he said "No, i always start on 100mg" so I think it depends on the Dr.

When I was discussing a dose increase with my gynae, he told me a story about a patient that had twins on clomid - it wasn't until they were 12yo that she admitted to him that she went home and took the WHOLE PACKET!!!!!

Willow - The whole packet!! That did make me laugh! Seriously, I think I will wait until AF arrives (by spotting I would say Wednesday maybe Thursday) and then give my OB a call. Will also have prog.test results by then. If the result is high I may do as Deb suggests and try 50mg again. Would taking only 50mg be a reason why I had no side effects at all? I was waiting for any or all of the bad things to kick in and nothing happened (thank goodness). I though I would at least be ratty but my DH said I was even calmer than normal.
Do you know what difference it makes taking it day 2-6 or 4-8 or 5-9 makes? What is the reason for FS/Obs to choose different days? I am so ignorant when it comes to this. I really should have asked him when I was there but sometimes you have the best intentions and then you go blank.

Anyway, must get some work done.
Hugs for now,
Debbie

Hi all,
Just a quick post to let you all know that I got my results today and yes I did ovulate this month and pray that we have caught the little eggie.Oh well I guess the waiting game begins again and I should know either way on Monday next weekas af is due then, same day I see my specialist.

Hope you are all ok. Will check in again later.

I'm feeling so much better today! Thank you to you all, and particularly Michelle. Your email arrived this morning just before I left, and it helped so much to know that someone understands and can sympathise... it made me feel NORMAL!!! I will try to reply a bit quicker this time!

Work today was quite good - kids were a bit ratty, but it is the end of the year, and we did have storms in the middle of the day... One of my colleagues bought me some socks (with sheep!) to cheer me up, which worked more than she can imagine... on my blackest, darkest days I would always go sock shopping to cheer myself up, which is why I've got a drawer stuffed full to overflowing with socks, but very few of them are plain - all sorts of patterns and colours and weird things... I often end up buying outfits to match a particularly nice pair of socks! Yes, I'm strange! I then arrived home to find two packages in the mail... soaps from Liz and a book on PCOS that I ordered a while ago... I'll be off to read madly in a bit...

Oh, and lots of clear gooey CM today, so much I was conviced AF had arrived! So I'll be making sure to jump on my DH as soon as I can!

:grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: You're all wonderful, wonderful women!

BW

Hello my gorgeous girls

I just wanted to pop my head in very quickly to see how you were all doing. I miss not being part of this group anymore, but I did want to drop by and sprinkle everyone with a little bit of baby dust as I think you guys deserve it more than most! I know what you have to go through to get that BFP and it ain't pretty!

Princess and BW - how are you guys? Princess, so sorry to hear about the MC hon... nothing worse, and I'm so sorry for you hon {{HUGS}}

Hi to all of the 'newies' since I was here last :D

Soph! I've been looking for you!

I've been wanting to pester you with questions about your experience with clomid as my first cycle has been a complete and utter disaster! Is there any way I can get in touch with you? I've put my msn address back in my profile, can you email me there? Then I can reply from my normal email address.

BW

Debbie, in my experience the increased dose/s hasn't made the side effects worse at all. I had a few headaches my first cycle (25mg) and nothing at all since then (am now up to 100mg). I don't know about others, I know BW had pretty horrid hot flushes but she was on 50mg I think - BW?

Had a phone call from my FS this afternoon following an email I sent him (gotta love that service). He wants me to take clomid again this cycle (AF appeared this morning and has since gone all shy - grrrr) which I was a bit surprised about considering my lap is in 9 days. He thinks it best to keep everything consistent and regulated considering the improvement in my cycle this month (no spotting and 14 day lp).

He also said that obviously I won't fall prg before cd9 and there's no harm in me falling prg 5 days after the lap when i should ovulate!!! He said "actually that's probably a very good idea if you have your tubes flushed out etc, but you may not feel like trying"!!! You think?? I could barely get out of bed last time, let alone bd!! Maybe this time I'll be lucky and will have a recovery as quick as Debbie's and jump straight back on the band wagon LOL!

Mako, great news about your levels, hope you caught that eggie and it's getting nice and comfy in there!

**ETA: BW, so glad to hear you sounding so much better!

Yep, I was on 50mg, had headaches, insomnia and lovely hot flushes (not!)... and it didn't work! :angry:

I think I'll be doing a 100mg cycle once we hit the school holidays with monitoring done by my GP as an interim measure... I flat out REFUSE to have anything to do with my gynecologist again, and I doubt I'll get into a new FS too quickly at this time of year.

BW

Hi everyone,
Debbie - specialists have their own "recipe"some favour cd2 as a start others vary. It doesn't really much matter. I like the cd2 start as I get to be proactive earlier!
I didn't get side effects either. I reckon I was crankier than normal but my husband doesn't think so! I did feel emotional though... I would probably go the 50mgs again and double it the next cycle if need be... But that is only my opinion and not medical advice!

Mako - Yay on the ovulation!!!! So, I am sending all of the best vibes your way. Let's hop0e this is your month!

Butterfly - glad today is a bit better for you!

My new obs has been in contact with Dr Matthias from IVF Sydney (obstetric immunologist). He is faxing me his questionaire to fill out. He will do a phone consult with me on December 5th "sometime in the afternoon" for 15 minutes for a cost of $250 non refundable from medicare. WHAT THE???

I am undecided. I have phoned my friend the obs/fetal med specialst in Brisbane and he will phone me after dinner tonight so we can chat.
Dr Matthias is a great believer in the NK cells theory of recurrent miscarriage which is a little controversial but makes sense. I have read some papers by his contemporary Gavin Slacks and it seems his method of treatment is steroidal (prednisone) from ovulation and clexane/asprin. Whereas Dr Matthias goes with the IVIG. So, I am wondering if there is any benefit as that has been the decided treatment for me anyway after consulting with my friend and the two obs down here...

I am in a bit of a quandry now!

Take care everyone... :hug:

Deb, Dr Gavin Sacks is my FS!!! He's such a lovely, caring man. I always get excited when I hear people refer to his work, makes me feel like I'm in good hands. He will be doing my surgery next week.

There is a thread in the LT AC forum on this subject, I remember reading it because Gavin was mentioned there too - here's the link, I thought it might be of interest to you. I remember the girls saying you can do a questionnaire on line or something??

https://www.bellybelly.com.au/forums...ad.php?t=23131

Thanks Willow for the link. I intend to contact Gavin Sacks tomorrow. I have heard he is a nice fella. I spoke to my friend and he couldn't believe the 15 mins for $250 that I was quoted for a phone consult. I think it's very ordinary and I don't feel it's ethical. I agree people need to be paid for their time but I do think that's a bit rich.

My prof here concurs that the treatment will still be as he suggested. Prednisone and clexane with or without asprin...

I am a bit weary. I will talk more tomorrow.

The WHOLE packet of clomid in one go!!! I agree about the 100mgs. My obs has me on 50mgs next cycle but we'll see....!!!!

Hey BW!

Aww, I hope the next cycle goes better for you and you don't end up like me (mind you, as I've always said - clomid is not the be all and end all for PCOS... you may have a puregon baby like me!)

I did 4 failed cycles of clomid - started on 50 and ended on 150. Was just deemed to be clomiphene resistant.

Then I was put on daily injections of fsh instead (puregon) and that was the cycle I got my BFP! I still had a long cycle, but I had to be monitored closely with the puregon, as we had to up my doseage over the course of the cycle to get me to O (50IU, 75IU and finally... 100IU!) Honestly, they weren't bad and I would do them over and over for the rest of my life if I knew it would help me in getting another BFP one day.

So hon, don't dispair - clomid is a sh*t for people that don't respond to it and put all of their hopes into it but I am proof that it takes a few cycles to see how you'll respond, and even then, there's another way ;)

xx

Debbie - it was me who increased the dose without consulting (the doctor anyway - I did do lots of research. Not that it is an excuse. I am still naughty) I went from 50mg to 100mg on days 2-6. I actually had less side effects from the clomid on the 100mg dose (weird I know :rolleyes:). My progesterone was around 90+ when I was on the 100mg. Caitlyn and *alf* were both conceived on 100mg.

BW - I am so happy you are feeling better (even if I was nearly late for work after sending you an email at some ungodly hour of the morning :D)

Deb - there is a plan!! Are you going to be trying the clexane again or one of the other options?? I am assuming IVIG is intravenous immunoglobulin????? I might have to go and do some reading ........

Willow - go for the BD post op!!!!! Wooo hooo what a Christmas bonus that would be. I have everything crossed for you but please let me know if you need anything. I am not that far away (and closer still to St George).

Mako - everything crossed for you too!!

I have been working so much recently that Caitlyn's anniversary and birth day has come up rather fast. I can't believe an entire year has passed by. Who would believe I would give birth to a little angel and be pregnant again within 12 months. So much in my life has changed as a result of Caitlyn - both good and bad. The positives I think have made me a better person with a new appreciation for life and what it means. Deb has had a major impact in helping me see this pregnancy with a positive view that, after Caitlyn, I doubted I could ever do. We continue to pray for a healthy baby in mid June. I couldn't have got this far without your support (and I hope you will continue to let me stay - even with a belly)

Sweet dreams :hug:

Soph, I believe Danni has passed on my email address to you, I'm really interested in knowing what side effects you had with the clomid even though it wasn't working for you.

Of course you can stay, Michelle! It's so nice to have reminders that this evil, nasty drug actually works! I'm getting into that state I was in last night when I emailed you, where the medication is making me drowsy and I tend to babble on (typing's getting damned awful, too!) so I shall wander off to bed now and speak more to you all tomorrow.

BW

Morning Girls,

Deb - you are welcome, I hope it was helpful. Let me know if you need any contact info for Gavin, although I'm sure it's all on the website.

Michelle - LOL on the post op BD! I'm determined to give it my best shot if at all possible!! We'll see how we go. You are so sweet, I really miss you around here now that you have 'graduated' but obviously I wouldn't have it any other way! I think it's great that you are still around so please don't go anywhere! I know you will find a beautiful way to spend Caitlyn's bday and I will be thinking of you all tomorrow. ((hugs))

As for me, I am getting really frustrated because AF won't make up her mind whether she's here or not and it makes it really hard to work out what is cd1 and when I should start taking my little pills. Have decided to start tonight because I'm pretty confident that today will be cd2 and I have found in past cycles that taking the clomid actually helps to make up her mind about staying put and putting on a good show! LOL!

Off to St George tomorrow for my pre admission clinic apt. Bit anxious (esp about being weighed! LOL, Not too happy with myself these days) but I'm sure it will all go well. I feel so much more positive after speaking to Dr Sacks yesterday, hearing him talk like this might actually happen was a huge boost for me.

Hope everyone has a great day, will pop back in later to see how you went with Gavin Deb.

Pollyanna - are you around? I hope you are doing OK ahead of Thursday.

Willow - I am hanging around. I am not posting much anywhere at the moment. I am having one of those *I don't belong anywhere* moments but I think it is more related to this week than anything else. Good luck with the pre-admission clinic. And seriously, if you need anything please let me know. :hug:

Michelle, Just want you to know that I'll be thinking of you tomorrow:hug:

I want to say thanks to Michelle, Flowerchild and Willow for keeping things crossed for me. I hope this is my month for a bfp but doubt it somehow.Oh well only time will tell.

Hey girls

Well...I officially became a clomid girl today!

After nearly three years of TTC, I'm so hoping that this will help.

I'm on 50mg...currently taking it from day 9-13 but beginning of next cycle, it will be day 2-6.

Not quite sure why I'm taking it...as I appear to ovulate and my oestrogen levels are not too bad...but hoping it helps...

Have many of you guys had any side-effects?

Anyway...hoping I get to know you girls (but hoping more that we all get out of this thread!!!)

All the best to all!

Willow - good luck with the BD fest post Lap. I agree girl, I don't know how much I would be looking forward to it either. The things we do! Thanks also for the Clomid info.

Deb - Got my prog test results and it was 53.4 on CD21 so that was good as the last time I had it done it was only 26 on CD22. AF will definitely arrive in force tomorrow. Still spotting but some red blood today so I know it is close. Did an HPT this morning and it was a BFN so pretty sure it's not implantation bleeding. Spoke to to FS today and he was pleased with Prog result and he would like me to do 2 more cycles on 50mg as he feels that the LP should sort itself out as the dose seems to be working for me. I will see how I go this cycle and then and depending on that may up to 100mg.
Mind you, temp still up this morning (although a little lower than it has been) and no other AF signs other than the spotting of course. Can't wait for this all to be over one way or another.

Chelle, BW, Mako - a big fat hello to you all.

Michelle - glad you are still expanding nicely. And don't you even think of leaving us no matter how big the bump.

Monnie - a big welcome to you. Hope your journey in this thread will be short. But no matter what, we are always here for you. Good luck. Oh, I have just had my first cycle of Clomid 50mg. I took it day 2 -6 and thankfully didn't have any side effects. My prog. increased well but my luteal phase was still a bit short for me (it will be 12 days). Let us know how you go.

Hugs to everyone,
Debbie

Thank you Mako - it is just starting to sink in that one year has passed so today has been a little emotional (add to that pregnancy hormones :rolleyes:) I found out *lentil* had died aound this time last year and 4.40pm tomorrow my baby girl was born.

Debbie - I am not planning on going anywhere. You girls are my greatest support. Yay on the great progesterone though.

Princess - how are you? Best wishes for tomorrow. May any discomfort be ultimately rewarded with a warm cuddly bundle in your arms.
Hugs as always,
Debbie

Welcome Monnie!

I've been lucky too and i haven't had any side effects. I had headaches the first cycle but I am not sure if they were related as they happened later in my cycle. I am now up to 100mg and no side effects at all the last 3 cycles.

Hope your stay here is a short one - good luck with the hsg tomorrow!

Sometimes clomid is prescribed to help give you a 'boost' for want of a better explanation. There are quite a few of us here who were ovulating on our own but had low prog. levels or luteal phase problems (I had both).

Hi everyone,
I spoke to Gavin Sacks today and that was interesting. However nothing new really in the treatment arena. He states though that he sees a great deal of good results from the use of anticoags in cases such as mine. So, I just gotta get pregnant again!

Debbie that progesterone looks wonderful! It can take a cycle or two to pan things out. Let's hope if that period is coming that it gets a wriggle on so that you move forward into the next cycle. :hug:

Monnie - welcome to this thread. You will find lots of wonderful support in here. Lots of us in here ovulate without clomid. However clomid can help with increasing all those wonderful fertility hormones - especially helping with the progesterone levels. I hope that soon you get that lovely BFP - I hope we all do!

Mako - fingers still crossed!

Have a great night girls!

I just noticed my new avatar! Lookin good!

Ooooh, I just noticed it too Deb, you are lookin' good!

Why the change? Do you get to design them yourself? I still haven't gotten around to platinum membership, keep meaning to.

Yes, you can design them yourself - what colour you would like to wear anything you particularly want. I changed because I needed something new to forge ahead with!
I also wanted something to depict my five angel babies. The doves are my five angels. Three larger ones and the two smaller ones...

Deb, I love the new avatar... I figured the birds would symbolise something, it's very sweet. I keep meaning to update mine, but just can't decide what to do with it, so it stays as plain and boring as ever.

I'm currently reading a book on PCOS by an Australian doctor - it's great, I'm finding out lots of stuff that I didn't know before, but it's also confirmed for me that the gynecologist I was seeing (I refuse to go back at all!) is a complete ass! It appears that he's done enough reading to know that metformin is useful in treating PCOS, but not enough to know that it needs to be at a higher dose for PCOS than it is for type II diabetes... I'm increasing my dose tonight, and then we'll see what happens, may need another increase later on as well. I feel very informed right now, very empowered by learning about my condition and how it should be managed... That's gotta be a good thing!

BW

That's a great thing BW!!!

Well done for empowering yourself...information is power!!!

Hoping the increased dosage helps!

And Flowerchild...your avatar is really gorgeous!

Thanks Butterfly and Monnie,
My avatar does look good - I just want some flowers and for my birds to be flying free. I have emailed poor Kathryn I hope she won't mind too much. I know she has a new baby so I am sure she has MUCH more pressing matters than my birds and lack of flowers!

Butterfly have you tried to get a consult with Professor Michael Chapman? He is a bit of a PCOS guru. I would give it a burl if I were you... I hear you there are some cowboys out there (don't get me started on THAT one) and it is very important to be as educated as you possibly can be. It is also important to have a specialist who you can really talk to, debate with, negotiate with and feel heard. You keep on reading and I am sure wonderful things will come of it

Michael Chapman isn't in an area of Sydney that's particularly accessible to me. I'm at the extreme North-West corner, and he's located decidedly South-East. I was contemplating getting a consult with the Dr who wrote the book, but I'm sure that just simply finding a specialist who knows what he's (why do I always assume he?) doing will at least set me on the right path... I can seek out the big guns if things don't start working for me. The big thing that's come out of tonight's reading is that clomid isn't the end of the story, there's another drug it can be used with, and FSH injections, and so on.

It's kind of strange to think that forgetting to take my pill nearly 12 months ago has set me on this path. Depressing to think that I'm still not pregnant, but if it had been a quick and easy process I would never have encountered the wonderful women here. I'm certainly feeling much more positive and starting to see the good in things again. :)

BW

BW, knowledge is power, you go get em girl!

Deb, I thought the birds might represent your angels, it really is lovely.

I'm off to bed now, I have a big day ahead of me with my trip to St George hospital. The things we do hey....

Butterfly,
I do understand about accessibility. Perhaps another option is to phone Prof.Chapmans rooms and ask for a recommendation of a specialist closer to you. This is often a good way of weeding out the not so great options.
I hear you about the wonderful women we meet going through these very difficult journeys. I feel precisely the same. If this trial hadn't been thrust upon me I wouldn't have met you all - life is certainly richer for the sharing, love and compassion in here.

If you could see the work I am supposed to be getting through... I must go for tonight.
Sleep well Butterfly...

Willow - we posted at the same time. Good luck tomorrow! We'll all "be" there with you holding your hand.
I look forward to hearing how thing went.

Willow and Michelle, you'll both be in my prayers for tomorrow. Michelle, I hope tomorrow is as peaceful as possible for you. Willow, I do hope this surgery doesn't put any more obstacles in your path and that you have a quick and speedy recovery.

Time for me to take my tired, sleepy, hayfever-fuzzed brain to bed.

Goodnight, sleep well.

BW

michelle, im thinking of you also. hugs to you

Willow, good luck, hope everything goes well!

wahey Deb, your looking very KOOL!!! just love your little 'angels', just gorgeous.

nothing new going on here.... have opks in hand, will start on cd10 i think, u just never know!
Big Hi to everyone else,Debbie,mako, BW...computer wont let me go back now, stupid slow thing... kids downloading everything insight, makes it all sluggy..
have a greatday

welcome Monnie, like all the others have said, I hope your stay is short and sweet! you will find all the support you need here on this site...
Goodluck with your journey to the BFP!!!

Stupid AF. Wish it would just make up it's mind and start. Still passing brown stuff and the occasional red blood. Not normally like this. Usually once the brown spotting starts then AF follows in force about 2 days later. This has been going on for 4 days now. I'm not pregnant so lets get on with the next cycle if you please. Is this Clomid trying to lengthen that Lp? Hope so.

Hi, to everyone,
Debbie

The first cycle can be a bit iffy Debbie. I hope it starts up in earnest for you. I would give your obs a phone though. She/he may think it's a good idea to begin the next round of clomid now since there has been four days of bleeding... Just a thought...

Hi girls, today wasn't my surgery, was just a pre-op appt at the hospital to do paperwork, bloods etc etc. I just meant that it would be a long day because it's so far away (left home at 7am and only just got back now!) sorry for the confusion, but thank you as always for your warm wishes and support. My surgery is next Tuesday and after today's appt I am getting nervous - I wish it was today and then it'd be all over and done with.

Debbie, I totally know what you mean about AF, mine has been exactly the same for the last 6 months since my lap in May. It is soooooo frustrating!! I have found that since taking clomid my cycles just keep improving, this one has been my most 'normal' cycle to date in relation to AF. Deb might have a point there though, I'd probably considering taking clomid from tonight, I usually find it actually helps to 'bring on' AF.

Michelle, sweetie, I hope today has been a very special day for you and your DH. I have been thinking of you.....

Thank you girls for your thoughts for today. DH has popped out for a minute so I thought I would fill you in on my day.

We went to mass this morning at Calvary chapel (I was right near you holding your hand too Willow) with the nuns and they had Father John (who did our service for Caitlyn's funeral too) include us in the mass which was so lovely. It made me feel very special to have her recognised out loud. He is a lovely man who had a few tears this morning after remembering our service nearly 12 months ago (he cried then too).

Greg and I went to Coogee for breakfast and did the cryptic crossword before coming home for me to have a nanna nap.

The only good / bad part of the day is that friend's of ours had their little boy today - which I predicted they would when we found out they were pregnant. They said to Greg they felt priveliged to share Caitlyn's birthday but it was still hard to hear. I am mourning the loss of my baby and they are celebrating the birth of theirs. Life keeps giving challenges to overcome.

Anyway, there is a beautiful cloudy storm front coming in just in time for Caitlyn's arrival time of 4.40pm. I knew she would visit :) For those of you in Sydney, watch the storm and think of my baby. For those elsewhere, thank you for thinking of us today and sending your love. Having people remember our daughter and her birth means so much to us on this special day.