'Parent volunteer' - Working with Children check??

I have been a teacher in a special education unit and to be honest, most of it is learning on the job. I went in with very little experience with kids with disabilities and I learned while I was there from working with the kids, from the other staff and some training that I attended. Most of the teacher aides that I have worked with also start out with little to no experience but a keen interest to learn. I am not really sure that paying someone necessarily makes them qualified to work with kids with a disability. I did 4 years of teacher training and to be honest, still walked into my classroom on my first day and that is when the real learning began. The parent will have the teacher to support them and give advice and training and I think if she is willing, she could be a very valuable asset. My hat goes off to her a little bit, it can be quite an intense job and she is offering to do it for free.

I have read through your posts and I am trying to figure out what the biggest issue for you is because she is most likely going to get her working with children check approved and that is not going to be an issue - I don't really think that this is what you are actually concerned about (if I was to be completely honest :)). It sounds a bit to me like you don't want the parent in the classroom and you are trying to find excuses for her not to be there because you feel your child will be disadvantaged and you are paying for an education for your child to make sure they are not - I am not trying to be offensive in saying that, so please don't be offended. I am just trying to understand what it is you want out of this situation because unless you can articulate what it is that you want, it will be very hard for you to work out which solutions you will be satisfied with.

I think there are some things about that seem to be out of everyone's control - there is no funding for a full time teacher aide for this child and the school probably doesn't have the funds to provide it so alternative solutions need to worked out. I guess you could try putting yourself in the shoes of this child's parent and thinking about what you would want if it was your child and how you want the school to handle it.

From the perspective of the parent volunteer - if she has just moved here from overseas, the school community might be one of her only social outlets and she might just be trying to make herself a part of the community. Volunteer work is a great way to get involved. I thought that most people coming into our country were screened for criminal offenses before moving here so I would assume (maybe wrongly?) that she has a clean criminal record since she is allowed to be here in the first place.

Please don't take my post as judgemental. I am not trying to be harsh, I am trying to understand the issues for you. I kind of get the impression that even if her criminal history is clean, you still have a lot of other concerns and I am just trying to understand those. I think you are right to question what is happening - if you have concerns it is good to get answers but in many of these situtions it is about a good fit and it takes time to work out whether it is working for everyone. Even if the person was a paid, experienced person it doesn't necessarily mean they will gel will with the teacher, the classroom environment, the student with special needs and the other kids. I think it is one of those things where they have to give it a go and see how it works out. There are so many dynamics and variables, it is impossible to know.

That's my 2c anyway :)

JustMe, you are quite correct, I'm not entirely sure of my biggest issue either! Perhaps that's why my post's are so long and I feel like my brain is split in two!

I had not considered your point that the mother from overseas will have undergone a criminal history check as part of her visa application (I think so, anyway?). I agree, the school community is a great social outlet for someone who has recently moved here from overseas. I also admire her willingness to volunteer her time to assist although, as I previously stated, I'm not sure she knew what she was getting into in terms of the time commitment! I was present when she said 'Oh, I could help out' and the mother has run with it and now has her scheduled for several hours a day! Anyway, I assume that the mother who volunteered can speak up for herself if the commitment is too great.

Perhaps one of this issues is that we have been spoilt this year with a full time aide who is excellent. She is amazing with the child who has additional needs and also with all of the other children. The idea of losing this aide half time and replacing her with a volunteer who doesn't appear to have much insight into the child's needs is... disappointing. I guess I would like the school to cough up for the aide full time next year. But I understand why that is not viable. But then, that's where the fees come into it... we're all paying expensive fees, if the aide is required I expect the school to provide it. But I understand the funding is not available. And around and around it goes!!

I hear what you are saying about paying an aide not ensuring that they are the best person to fill the position and by even offering her time the volunteer has shown that she possesses both an interest and an empathy, which is a good place to start. But the way she deals with the child (loud and slow) concerns me. Whilst I recognise that she will have the classroom teacher available for guidance, the classroom teacher is not qualified in special education either. The school has never had a student before with such a high level of additional needs and I know from the mother of the child that many of the primary staff members have expressed concern at whether they are able to cater adequately to the child's needs. I fear it will be a case of the blind leading the blind.

If I am honest, my other issue is that I am tired of being manipulated by the mother of the child with additional needs. I have known her for three years and in that time I have nodded and smiled and tried to understand her motivation, although I don't think I can truly understand what it is like for her. When I questioned having an aide replaced with a volunteer her response was 'well, that's how it's gonna be, so you'll all just have to deal with it' (yes, this was her literal response, I believe word for word!). Part of me thinks 'no, my child and I have rights here too'... and part of me thinks 'bloody hell, this must be incredibly hard for you, I'm not going to make it any harder'. I am aware that my own motivation, if I do decide to act on this matter, shouldn't be that the mother pi**ed me off!!

I do honestly believe that my child will be affected. I assume that the volunteer, like the aide, will work with small groups including my child. It is important to me that the aide sets the correct example for my child. For the kids, there is no distinction between the aide and the teaching staff and if an adult will be in the classroom 'teaching' my child (as the aide does) I want to know that the adult knows what they are doing and they are qualified for the job! The aide takes the children and is not supervised by any other staff. I have always assumed that this is permissible and that direct supervision is not required because the aide is qualified and has all the appropriate checks? I have always been happy for the aide to teach my child unsupervised as she is excellent. Is this how it is supposed to work? I have never questioned before whether an aide can work unsupervised with the children? In doing this, the aide manages not only the behaviour of the child with additional needs, but also the behaviour of all of the children in the group, including mine. I am happy for the aide to be responsible for managing my kid at school, not so happy for a volunteer to teach my kid what is ok and what is not. How can a volunteer know what is acceptable and what isn't (in general not just in relation to one child) and how can that volunteer be expected to know how to appropriately manage and direct the behaviour of the kids? She is a volunteer, not a teacher, not an aide.

In the middle of all of this is a lovely little girl who seems to have settled reasonably well into the group. Initially, many of the kids were frightened of the child as her behaviour can be quite confronting. Now, the rest of the kids have, for the most part, accepted her as one of their peers and are keen to assist her. Most of the children are kind and caring and are inclusive of the child in their learning and their play. I believe this is partly due to the nature of the children, but also due to the example set by the aide and the way in which she has taught the kids to interact with a child who is very obviously different to themselves. Perhaps the kids could train the volunteer!

No offense taken, JustMe. I'm still not entirely clear on why this situation sits so uncomfortably with me. One of the things I have realised over the course of typing this post is that I need to clarify exactly what role the volunteer will take in the classroom - how much responsibility she will have and whether she will work with the children independently. I'm not sure how to do that when the school has not formally informed the parents of the plan? It is very valuable for me to hear from Lulu as a parent of a child with additional needs and from yourself and others as educator's working with kids. I'm also very interested in how other parent's would feel and whether they would be concerned. Thanks for taking the time to respond.

i dont know if someone's already mentioned this, but maybe you can say to her something along the lines of "it'll be much easier for me to help you get everyone on board with this if she has a WWC check, as alot of the other parents don't know anything about her, and nor do i, and it'll put everyone's mind at ease" that way you're getting that check done, and she still gets her aide.

i understand about the fact that she hasnt worked with children, but maybe she has had experience with kids with special needs? or perhaps the lady knows this child and the mother thinks she is suitable? either way, it seems like you dont have a lot of choice in the situation, but if you can do something to make YOU and the OTHER parents feel safer, and let her think shes getting her own way, it'll be (somewhat) win-win?

Nickle - I am so glad that you didn't take offense at my post - I was trying to word it carefully but you know how these things come across online sometimes. It sounds like an incredibly stressful situation and I am starting to understand more why you are concerned. I guess my big concern about what you wrote initially is that if you fight for her to have the check done and it comes back fine, and it still doesn't sit well with you then it just looks a bit petty. If you are clear about why you are concerned and can raise those issues with the school all at once, then it looks a lot more valid, if that makes sense.

I understand your concern about the other mum - I think it is hard when people decide something that is going to affect everyone and you get told to just lump it. I think one thing about lots of parents of kids with special needs is that they are used to having to fight every step of the way. I am not defending her because I think your point of view is valid, but I think her aggressiveness may come out of having to do a lot of fighting on behalf of her child.

I also think the loud and slow yelling is a problem - is the volunteer mum ESL at all? The teacher may also have an issue working with that going on in her classroom (I know I would). Noise begets noise - if you have an adult talking loudly it encourages the other kids to talk loudly to compete with it and I could see that causing a lot of issues for the teacher. I am surprised the little girl's mum is happy with her being spoken to like that too - it would bother me.

I didn't want to read what you wrote and not reply a little though. I think you are right to be concerned and to raise the issues with the school but it is good for your point of view to be heard if you know what you are worried about and can express it to the school so that solutions can be discussed. How you handle this with them will also give them an impression of you so you need to be careful how you approach it.

My greatest concern with them using a volunteer would be whether that person would be in for the long haul if you know what I mean - it could be a very stressful position, if they aren't being paid they may not be as likely to stick it out as if they were. In the case of the child, I think it would prove quite disruptive for them to be having a change of person should they not last the distance.

Hi Nickle

oooh what a tricky situation! I feel your pain. Will have to be quick but wanted to say a few things - hope they help.

-Re: what Ausgirl has said - absolutely right. I think vol mum has no idea what she's gotten herself in for, and I can't see her lasting the year. Why would you spend that much time helping a child that's not your own for free? I mean, hat off to her for volunteering, but as you mentioned before it seems to have snowballed from a "I could help out" to suddenly this woman is working part-time for free! The situation is unsustainable in the long term.

-I always think in these situations that I don't need to make a fuss because chances are someone else will do it before me, and do it louder! I can't see all the other parents being ok with it and I'm sure once the year starts it will be pretty quickly noticed what is going on and someone will speak up.

-re: WWCC. Not your problem, let it go (don't mean that to sound harsh). Not a mountain to die on here, KWIM? It's not the deal breaker. Plus, if you kick up a fuss you don't want volunteer mum thinking you think she's dodgy.

-you're not an awful person for feeling the way you do. I would feel the same. Just as the other mother's job is to fight for her child, yours is to fight for yours, because no-one else is going to do it.

-do teacher's aids actually have training? I have a feeling in NSW they have very little or nil. I don't mean any disrespect to teacher's aids - they do a great job.

-overall I think the whole situation will be self-resolving without you having to kick up a fuss, KWIM?

Will come back later, but hope that helps a bit!

If you are not being paid you don't pay for your WWC card. It is only if you are being paid that you need to pay the $77.

For the amount of time it takes to apply for a card, fill out the form, get a photo done and then take it to the post office I cannot see why there would be an issue. If she is going to be one on one with this child she needs a WWC card even if her child is in the classroom.

There has recently been a change in some of the rules so the school should know these. We get emails everytime something is changed in regards to WWC.

If anyone has changed their WWC details lately I hope you put down every place you volunteer and/or get paid to. If not, you are not longer registered at these places.

The thing that would be concerning me about this situation is the sneaking past the principal, the is all kinds of wrong to me. I think you may find at the end of the day, that both the principal and the classroom teacher may have something to say about this situation, I can tell you if this was going on in my classroom, then I would be right up there having my opinion heard.
I am not familiar with how the private system words, I have only ever worked in public school, but do the parents really have that much say in how things work? Can this mother really manipulate the system that much that she can sneak something past the principal?
I think for now maybe you should just take a back seat in the situation, I certainly wouldn't be listening to the mother and 'convincing the other mothers' or anything like that. If the mother approaches you about it again, maybe just tell her that it is not your place to get involved.
Can the school not apply somewhere else for funding for the assistant (this is probably a rhetorical question)? In the govt schools you apply for an assistant and you are funded for an asistant for that child, based on the students needs. I wonder how the funding works in the private system, because if the child is deemed needing a full time assistant and funded for one, then where is the other money going?- Anyway just my musings, I hope it helps!

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Can the school not apply somewhere else for funding for the assistant (this is probably a rhetorical question)? In the govt schools you apply for an assistant and you are funded for an asistant for that child, based on the students needs. I wonder how the funding works in the private system, because if the child is deemed needing a full time assistant and funded for one, then where is the other money going?- Anyway just my musings, I hope it helps!

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I was wondering the same thing. In childcare, which I know is a different kettle of fish, you seek assistance through an inclusion agency (so a govt funded body who assist to include disabled and ethnically diverse children). As long as the child is diagnosed as being special needs, you receive funding for a certain number of hours (5 hours per day in cc) for each day they attend. I was naively thinking it should work the same way in the school system but I could be very misguided in my thinking! I too would be wondering if they have approval for an aid for this child, just where that money is going to?

ausgirl - as we discussed earlier there is funding available, but not as much in the private system.

i have a real problem with the no WWC check.
i think this needs to be addressed and i would be going to the Principal with my concerns if i were you.
my dh has worked as a tradesman in schools around Vic and would not be allowed on site without a WWC.

Yeah, I don't care what this woman says about getting it past the principal, it isn't going to happen. There is no way a school would allow no WWC.

I don't know about the actual teachers aides, but parents volunteering for group work and literacy programs at our school (NSW) do not have to have the WWC check done - I've been volunteering there for 5 years now and never needed to have it.

Re the training of teachers aides, there is a 12 month TAFE course that they undertake. A friend of mine started out at the school volunteering in her sons class all the time, and the school offered her an aide position. She worked for 2 years as an aide before starting the course this year. There seems to be a bit of confusion about what the role of the aide is, and it's not a teaching role at all. The aide is there to assist the SN child with their work, reading it out to them so they understand and also keeping them on-task and much of the training is workplace assessment as well. If an aide assists with group work in the classroom, then it would be in no greater capacity than what a regular parent volunteer would do.

In my DD2's class there is a SN child who has an aide and she never takes part in the teaching of the class - she hangs back and sits at the back of the room with the SN child and keeps him calm (he has outbursts). She never works one-on-one with the other children and during literacy groups which needs parent helpers to help it run smoothly she may assist on a group if there aren't enough parents to help on the day.

And really, the WWC check is a bit of a farce because it's only going to show up any Convictions - if they have never been convicted for an offence then the school will not know if they are a paedophile/abuser or not. Not saying that it shouldn't be done, but it shouldn't be the main focus over why this person should not have the job. But the way it seems to be getting arranged doesn't seem right and the Principal of the school has the ultimate say over who works in the school.

I think aide qualifications vary state by state too - MIL used to work as an aide, her friend still does, and neither of them have any qualification at all.

Excellent points about the actual quals. I got quite a shock to hear that in Vic it's only a course of 6 months or less. In fact I started to panic about it not being enough and wondered who DS might be 'stuck with'. Since then I have met at least 6 different aides in the last few months and can't speak of them highly enough. So for me I understand I can't expect a teaching standard qualification....but have since found it's not always necesarry for them as an aide.

What Trill said about the role of the aide is accurate. It's not a highly paid job either, so I believe most people are drawn to it for good reasons. Again - the difference these people can make is amazing. Patience and a good sense of humour are the best qualifications.

** This post is a bit off tangent but I just wanted to clarify for anyone not familiar with the concept of a classroom aide, and the minefield funding can be.

Just a little further OT, but I agree Lulu about the minefield that it is. I have teacher friends and a friend with a boy on the spectrum and they all say that the day you have the assessment for aide hours done is the day you want them to be at their absolute worst so you can try to get more aide hours than what they would if they were having a good day.