To spank or not to spank?

Since DD2's arrival, DD1 has turned beyond herself. From a nice, easy going toddler to an angry, rebellious "monster." I have been telling myself that I will expect some craziness during this time, but I don't know if I should tolerate DD1's behavior anymore. At the very beginning, we would say to DD1 that she has to be gentle with DD2... even when she was a bit rough (i.e. pulling on DD2's leg), we just tell her that it is not nice and she should be gentle with her little sister like we are gentle with her. Well, after about repeating this for a gazillion times, DD1 doesn't seem to like the message. She just comes and tap on DD2's face or she would throw her stuffed animals at DD2... so what I have done is spank her on her hand. I have tried putting DD2 away (i.e. in the inner side of the cot) but DD1 could easily opens the door to get into the room and starts throwing things on her. When I'm feeding, DD1 would also come and tries to poke on DD2's eye... so she's really playing with my limits... I just had to spank her yesterday (mind you, I'm not the harsh type, when I mean spanking, I do so once or twice on the bump)... so here, I'd like to hear your opinions whether I am on the right path or I should continue repeating myself and watch DD1 hurting DD2?

Hmmm thats a tricky one.

We used to be smackers. Then DS started to smack US whenever we would tell him off, so we thought "hmm... how can we tell him not to smack us, if that is what we are doing to him, he's just thinking its ok to smack".

So now we don't smack. I think I've been really really lucky - DS is really gentle with DD, there have been times though, he will rub her head too hard and she'll cry, or he will step on her foot as walking past - but he never does anything deliberately to hurt her.

If he does hurt her, I tell him "look - she's crying - because you hurt her. It's not nice to hurt people and make them cry DS" so he will go up to her and rub her head or something and say "sorry Kelti".

I think if you let them see the reactions of what they are doing, they are less likely to repeat the action - IYKWIM? He doesn't like to see her cry - so he doesn't do anything TO make her cry (or maybe he just doesn't like me forcing him to say sorry.. bwahaha)

DD is a pretty tough little thing now - suppose you have to be when your brother slams himself down on your chest when you are only a few months old - stacks on as they say!!

Good luck
xx

We used to be smackers too, and same as Arimeh's DS, ours started hitting us back too. We took a different approach to the way we disiplined him - using time out, explaining to him what he did wrong and how to do it right. We also worked out that now his language has developed better, he isnt as naughty. He is able to communicate better and tell us what his problem is, instead of getting angry and lashing out.

It's hard isn't it. I can't tell you if you're on the right path, but I think some questions might help you decide.
- does smacking work? As in, does it help teach your DD1 what is acceptable?
- is it the most effective way of disciplining? As in, there's nothing else that works better.
- Can you stay calm when smacking?
- Have you and DH discussed the situations when you smack? (for example, you might smack for 'wilful defiance', that is, when the parent says 'no don't do that' and child looks at them with raised eyebrows and parent says 'no, please don't do that, or you'll get a smack' and then child does it anyway. Fair warning followed by consequence that 'speaks' to them most effectively at that stage in their lives. For forgetfulness when they're doing something naughty that parent told them about that morning, or when the child's overtired, then a parent won't smack in those situations.) If mum smacks and dad doesn't, then it's not necessarily consistent discipline, and I don't think the child learns 'that's not good to do, there's a consequence for that', they just learn who lets them get away with things.

I think we need to figure out what's most effective. I have a biter/hitter on my hands (as Ubba described, DS1 isn't a talker, and hits out in frustration - you have given me so much hope Ubba about when he starts talking!), and smacking isn't appropriate when he's frustrated/angry. That's something we need to address with some sort of down time.

Anyway, that was a bit garbled, ds is playing in the ottoman, so I'm just watching to make sure the lid doesn't crash down on him. :p But I hope it helped a bit? All the best working your discipline out.

Nelle, you added some fantastic points in you post. Glad I gave you some hope - just to add on my previous post about my DS and his language, he also has a stutter and a couple of other speech difficulties that I feel has also contributed to his naughtiness/hitting/not listening saga. Makes me feel TERRIBLE now that I did result in smacking him when he really had difficulty communicating :redface: Just something else to possibly think about.

Arimeh, I never would have understood that DD1's smacking might be related with the smacking she's got! I am not a firm believer in smacking, but sometimes when she really does something outrageous (deliberately pulling on DD2's leg) then she leaves me no choice but to smack. Before DD2's arrival, there was occasional smacking in the house. The smacking she got was be related to climbing up to the table and picks up the phone/cell phone and starts dialing randomly. Reason why I am so upset when she keeps on grabbing for the phones (no matter how we put away, she still manages to get ahold) was when there was one time she called the police to our house whom did a house search when they arrived as they did not believe that she was the one who called them:wall:... I think she was about 15 months old. :redface: Another thing which led us in smacking her would be when she would get a hold of something and when we ask her to hand it back to us, she would deliberately throw it on the floor which some times does break things... Nelle, I think that's what you meant by "willful defiance." I don't expect her to understand that things could result in breaking, but she could definitely understand that I ask her not to throw it on the floor, and she purposely do it because she doesn't like the idea that we go after her when she gets her hands into something she's not supposed to touch.

I personally don't like smacking at all as I have found DD1 to be a smacker too especially to her sister. Is she too young for time out?

DH believes in smacking, and I remember when DH started to smack her, she started raising her hands and pretend to smack him. I never have thought her smacking would be related to what she's got.

I am a bit confused right now. I don't want to raise a rebellious toddler and to have much more difficult times later.

Carmen, I dont think she is too young for time out. As long as you explain to her why she is in time out "DD, you need to sit in time out for 2 mins because you hurt your sister". It is reccommended time out be no longer than the age of the child, be in a safe but boring area, and time starts again if they leave early or carry on while in time out. This is what I do anyway. It will take her a little while to fully understand that she needs to sit there for 2 mins, I have seen people use an egg timer, so when the bell goes the child knows they can get up. Try not to yell and dont hold a grudge. After her time is up tell her you still love her and prehaps explain again why her behavior isnt the right thing.

Good Luck!!

I think pretty much every toddler is rebellious. :p

I don't think your DD is too young to be removed from situations. As in, if she's playing with something she shouldn't, maybe try to pick her up and move her to another room/area. If she goes back, do it again, and again, til she gets the message. That's something that works if our kids are being curious as opposed to naughty - like if something exciting like an instrument or crafty thing are out but they're not allowed to touch it - but don't have the self control to restrain themselves, if that makes sense.

Ubba, Thank you. I will try the time out instead of smacking since DD1 definitely is showing signs of being a smacker as a result of getting smacked. Good advice on the egg timer... I will it won't make me go nuts trying to watch the clock tick. It's really challenging not to get upset. I find myself sometimes yelling at her when she doesn't listen and my anger just kicks in. SIGH, I feel horrible. This whole "terrible two" is really settling in DD1... I know my patience is running out, and I've been trying to calm myself down too and refraining from yelling.

:hug: Don't feel bad, I think every parent gets pushed to the limit by their 2 year old. Probably why 'time out' can be so effective, because it's something we can quickly do, move them to a chair, room, portacot and then go off and calm down. :p

Nelle, maybe DD1 is really showing signs of curiosity. I honestly don't mind to let her explore things... however, she has a really bad habit. She would go into my bathroom drawer and starts pulling bottles of cream out and opens the covers and make a mess on the floor repeatedly. She doesn't do it a few times... but many times. In the beginning, I would just pick it up and tell her not to do so, but this definitely isn't working.

My DS1 went through the same thing with our new baby. But instead of seeing him as "naughty", i could see hm as acting out his pain and frustration at having to adjust to sharing our attention. Its a big change for an only child to have a sibling, and i think they need to be supported through this change rather than punished. I think punishing them only reinforces their resentment to the new baby. And trust me the stage does pass! you just need to keep protecting the baby. I think my toddler learnt a lot more from watching me console the baby after it had been "injured" by my toddler, than he would if i had retaliated and hit him. He now goes to the baby "are you okay" and gives him a hug and kiss if he hurt himself. He learnt this from watching us - if i had hit him, i'm sure he would have learnt to be a hitter himself. Food for thought.

It's been a roller coaster ride for me the past few days. I have tried to refrain myself from smacking and tried to be as calm as I could. DD1 is just acting out in every possible way. She has gotten better compared to the first 2 weeks of DD2's arrival. But now, I have learned to protect DD2 as DD1 would go and pull her legs and just throw things on her head... well, she some times tries to poke DD2's eyes too. When I see that happen, some times my anger just go off and I would shout at DD1 for being so naughty.

At the moment, DD2's fighting off a cough and stuffy nose. With that, I already feel so awful and guilty of having her sick at such a young age... and when I see DD1 being mean to her, I go banana!:wall: Still, I have not smack her... but I could definitely say that she's pushing my limits. Hopefully things will look brighter soon as I feel really sh**ty for DD1's naugthiness, DD2's illness, and my exhaustion.

I haven't had another baby, however lately I have had HUGE behaviour difficulties with my just 3 year old. I tried everything. Timeout, negotiation, bribing, threatening, yelling, smacking. None of it worked at all. My friend suggested the Super Nanny. I have started using the 'naughty corner' today and DS has been a completely different child!! I am absolutely shocked at how wonderfully this tecnique has worked! It had also had an amazing effect on my friends 2 year old