Expressing...with no let down...

So my milk has come in gradually over the last 2 days. Yay!
Lots of it apparently.

But I have no let down. I mean I can't feel it at all, there is NO leaking at all, and even getting anything by hand expression immediately after she pulls off (to try help heal the grazing) is fruitless. Is this normal? Had massive room crossing let down with Charlotte, even after 6+ months.... this is all just different lol

My right breast is now so full, it is like a basketball and she cannot even latch on, so I thought I would express a little off and that would be ok. The Swing I bought last week is proving thus far to be a waste of money - not sure what I am doing wrong, but it isn't working. I am getting less than an ounce of milk after expressing for 30 mins. All I am left with is a deformed, over stimulated nipple. :wall:

And sore boobs, that she can't feed from.

I am doing the warm shower, massage things, the lumps are going when she does feed and she is getting plenty when she does feed (so much actually *have* a let down - but the only thing that obviously does it is her mouth.) Even if she pulls off during a feed, there is no squirting, not even a drip...

Argh. Just so cranky today and this is just making it worse. I know it will settle down, I know the pain from the grazes will stop and she will get better with the latching. She has a really high palate which is also adding some pain, but she does feed well and does a good job draining the boob, even though the is clearly 3 times as much milk as she needs - I just want to be able to express it and store it!

Thanks for reading this dribble... feel free to offer any advice etc, especially re the expressing - I really want to be able to do it this time. TIA

I'm sorry, I don't have any advice apart from what you've already tried- can you express while she's feeding?
Congrats on bubs feeding so well! You sound like you're doing an excellent job.
I'm sorry I can't be of more help but wanted to offer support :)

Dumb question but are you sure your milk is in already and not still 'coming in'? It sounds to me like it's only just starting, hence the basketball boobs! And your DD is only 3 days old so that sounds about right. My boobs were HUGE and so painful when my milk came in (on day 3 ;)) and the things that worked were icing them (ice packs, frozen peas, what ever works) and keeping DD plastered to my boob so to speak.

As for expressing, I wouldn't be expecting to get much at three days in especially given what I've suggested above. I'd give it a couple of days. With the Swing, you need to use the letdown setting first then either switch it to a full pump after your letdown or it will automatically do it within a minute or two (can't remember the exact time). Also, the standard nipple shields that come with Medela pumps are often too small for most women (according to my LC) so you may need a larger size or you could end up damaging your nipples. They sell the shields and baby stores and some chemists.

I think it will all start working for you soon hon, I just honestly think your milk is only just arriving from what you've said.

PS I didn't start leaking for a couple of weeks with DD and my let down really kicked in (ie firehose :lol:) at about 6 weeks. I think you're expecting too much from your boobs too soon hon. Be patient ;)

i agree with Taurean. don't worry about expressing and just put bub to the boob whenever she is awake.

I think the worst time is when your milk is just coming in :hug: Hun, not feeling the let down doesn't mean you're not having one. This could be totally different to last time. I would start with the basics - if the pump isn't giving you a let down and you have expressed fine before, it's probably the pump. Are all the parts together properly? Does it fit so that there is a good seal? What happens when you hand express in the shower - it sounds like you are getting milk out when you hand express. Other than that, try and relax. It's hard work getting breastfeeding established, even if it's not your first time around. If the pump isn't happening, you don't need to use one. If you are still engorged after feeds, you can hand express for now and if you want to keep the milk hand express into a container.

But feeding more often is always going to the best thing for engorgement. If Marley isn't attaching well, try Baby Led Attachment, and if that doesn't work, pay careful attention to the basics with position. Support her neck not her head, make sure she is nice and close to you, and that her head is at the right height for your nipple. Chin to breast and head tilted back on the same angle as if she was drinking from a half-full cup.

Don't forget that 1800 mum 2 mum is always there, and that if attachment just won't work that you can contact an LC to check for other issues.

Best of luck hun. I'm sure this will get easier for you once your milk is more properly in. Hang in there :hug:

No advice, but to back up the above, I too found the shields/nipple things that came with the swing to be too small for me when I pumped for P and I ended up very sore and odd-shaped. However, a bigger one was more comfortable and got more milk out.

Hey LS!

Congrats on birthing your gorgeous little girl!! What a gorgeous name!

I was going to say something similar to Taurean..and I was a bit like this with my last baby. I think your milk sounds like it's not quite fully 'in' and I think in a few days time, you'll be be feeling those let downs more and spraying milk all over the place :)
I think, being so early, I'd just try and keep Marley feeding and not bother about expressing unless you just can't get over that engorgement no matter how much she's feeding. Keep it simple I reckon and let things be just how nature intended :)

Yep I agree with Taurean and MR. But just wanted to also say with DS I felt the let down as a tingly pr!ckly feeling but no squirting. With DD, I got (and still get) nothing, nada, zip. I don't feel a let down and I don't squirt or leak. So yep completely normal not to feel a let down. I found when I was overfull from DD going on a feeding frenzy, I'd get in a warm shower and hand express to get some milk out 'cause I was pretty crap at the pump.

Not much advice that hasnt already been said but a little reassurance I have not leaked at all with Xavier even when i had massive boobs i told the midwife i was worried he wasnt getting enough cause i wasnt leaking so i assumed there wasnt much milk but he has been putting on mass amounts of weight ( on day 5 he was already 100g heavier than his birth weight :) ) so try not to stress about not leaking.
like the others have said it is different every time and if bub is feeding well, latching properly and is generally settled im sure everything is fine. Boobies were not made to be milked by a machine, they were made for babies!

try and relax hunny!

Only a quick one babe, will be back later... but expressing is best after 6 wks.... beforehand it is quite tricky, and can interfer with your feeding... your response at first will be for "bub" not "pump".... remember a LOT of it is emotional/hormonal...... if you can just express a little in the shower for comfort just for now, you might find it a lot easier after around 6 weeks.....
will try to get back soon... xoxoxo

Well, I certainly didn't have the engorgement problem you're experiencing, but I leaked all the time with DD1 even though I had not much, and I never leaked with DD2 my body had just learned from dD1, AND it took me a couple of weeks before I was able to let down to a pump but I can thoroughly empty my breasts to a pump now in squirts (not heaps) but it still squirts whereas the first few times was just trickles as boobs getting used to it. It might be the same for you as far as getting that letdown for the pump.

Are you feeling confident enough to try feeding bub on one side football side while expressing the massive side you want to alleviate, to 'trick' your body into letting down to a pump?

Thanks girls :hug: :)

I should have been clearer I think, I was expressing because I was getting nothing by hand at all, it was almost too painful to even try and my nipples are cracked and bleeding. She wasn't feeding often enough to help with the engorgement, so thought with the pump I could at least express off enough to just be able to get her to latch.

We are having a better day today, despite starting the day with a mouthful of blood and then vomit full of bloody milk. But I am leaking and although she still isn't feeding enough to help the engorgement, the midwife who came today gave me some new buts for my pump - a bigger nipple shield ;) - and a longer tubing etc and I have managed to take enough off the side she isn't draining to help with her attachment next feed.
Will be off to the LC clinic tomorrow I think though, she has a very high palate and I need some help with her attachment I think, again my nipple are too hard and too broad to manipulate enough of the areola into her mouth properly, so she ends up pulling the nipple itself so far up to the roof of her mouth it is having trouble healing, and just creates more pain with trying to attach her in the first place, itms.

The boobs have settled tiny bit today though, less lumps.

The other question is though - do I wake her in the early morning to feed or let her sleep? She will feed around 2-3am but then she sleeps for 4-6 hours. Do I wake her to feed for the sake of a week or so until the supply settles a bit to save the lumps, or leave her sleep and express off enough in the morning if there are issues latching? (Never had to worry about this one before, Charlotte woke at the most every 4 hours to feed! lol)

Anyway, thanks again :) It is so bizarre... Like the moment I gave birth everything I learnt last time has gone out the window or no longer applies and I feel like I have to relearn it all. Plus, the bleeding cracked nipple hurts like a ***** and I don't like it!! :p

I would only wake her if she NEEDS the feed... if she is feeding 8-10 times in 24 hrs, I think she is fine.. but if missing that feed means she only 6-7 a day, I would do it personally.....

With the high palate, can you try feeding her up/down instead of sideways? It generally works.... holding her head at your breast, nose on TOP of areola, and chin on the bottom, might get a better possy for her.. and help the nipples too!!! Might be worth a try, it works for most.....

Oh hun..big :hug: in regards to the bleeding nipples. Far out that hurts :(

If she's feeds well at other times, I'd let her sleep..She was a good bw wasn't she? and sounds like you have a good amount of milk going on (Just make sure she's getting enough overall, and if not start waking her)..BUT if your boobies are already full when she goes down for a sleep, then it's probably best to get up and express some out at some point..My boobs used to wake me up, even if bubby was still asleep :doh:

You're doing really well mate. Bleeding nipples are horrible :hug:

Never mind, just read your update. :)

Relax as much as possible, put bubs to the breast whenever he's awake, in a month you'll have forgotten all about this :)

I'm really pleased to hear that you have had some progress at least. Hopefully the LC clinic will bring more good news.

I'd probably be tempted to wake her. She will drain your breast better than the pump so it will probably help the engorgement settle more quickly. However if she is having good output (from today you'd be expecting at least 5 wet nappies in 24 hours and 2 or more poos, and the poo should have changed to a light green-brown colour or already be the mustard colour) and feeding well during the rest of the time, if you would prefer to pump that should be ok too.

Best of luck hun. It sounds like you have a challenge there :hug: