Who regulates child care centres?

DH and I went for a tour at a child care centre which is close to my work for DS2. They are a larg-ish company and the their website seemed promising.
We are moving to the other side of town so thought that something closer to work would be ideal.

We couldn't get out of there quick enough. The children had no space to run (okay, it was at the back of a government building) but the child ratio at the centre was rather high. They certainly had not space inside they were just about falling all over each other. Certainly not the size of a "campus" as the director kept referring to centre.

I think we will stick with the detour and keep him at his current centre. It is attached to an early childhood school (which only goes up to year 2) so they have access to a large oval, playgrounds, trees, dirt, climbing equipment. Plus his room is about the size of the entire centre that we viewed today (which she told us has 65 children in it every day). The outdoor area is the same size as his old centre (at my work) which caters for a maximum of 35 children from 6 weeks to 3 years.

So, it got us wondering, who goes around to inspect these centres? Are they done independently? Do they have to just submit the paperwork, or does someone physically go out there?

Or, are we just so utterly spoilt by what we have had so far and this is quite acceptable.

Kind of sad really - no wonder so many mums and dads get "guilt" when dropping their little ones off.

In NSW, it's the NCAC. (Can't think of what the acronym is right now) I'm not sure if they are the same governing body in all states...gotta pick up DD from school, I will come back and expand!

Gee that doesnt sound right. I would definately speak to someone.
The ACECQA is the government body that regulates and grants accreditation to childcare centres. Get in contact with them and they should investigate, do checks on the centre and the staff to make sure they are comlliant. There are laws as to how much space for how many children, staff ratios etc.
It sounds like an awful environment. Did the children seem happy? If not, definately put that in with your complaint.

ETA- I did a Google to check before I posted (because I can never remember what its called:wall:) and discovered that the NCAC has closed in Dec 2011 and been replaced with the above.

Nope, the kids didn't seem overly happy. She said that they can't get out "at this time of day" due to the sun but that the yard "get's plenty of shade from the other buildings". I'm waiting for someone from head office to do their follow-up call and I will tell her exactly what DH and I thought of the centre ...oops, I mean campus.

DS2 comes home from his centre absolutely filthy. He's covered in dirt, sand, paint, food.... you name it! The kids all run inside when they arrive and then drag their parents around the yard in the afternoon to show them what they're doing. The differences are just astounding.

I'm trying to look into who the parent company is as their website is rather limited. On the whole, it looks fabulous. The pre-preschool and preschool children receive music lessons and they have French words on different things (this must be the learning another language thing) and the centres are "state of the art" designed. Sadly though, walking into it, the rooms are over-crowded, noisy and closed-in.

At least I can send DS2 to his centre in the knowledge that I'm doing the best thing for him.

There is a law stating the times of day children are permitted outside. Cant remember what it was, probably to stay indoors between 10am to 3pm, like the cancer council recommends. So that might be ok.

But definately report them. If Noone speaks up then things like this keep happening. Even if they do end up being compliant its worth having the centre checked over to make sure. But from the sound of it, they arent.

Your DS current centre sounds great!

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Gee that doesnt sound right. I would definately speak to someone.
The ACECQA is the government body that regulates and grants accreditation to childcare centres. Get in contact with them and they should investigate, do checks on the centre and the staff to make sure they are comlliant. There are laws as to how much space for how many children, staff ratios etc.
It sounds like an awful environment. Did the children seem happy? If not, definately put that in with your complaint.

ETA- I did a Google to check before I posted (because I can never remember what its called:wall:) and discovered that the NCAC has closed in Dec 2011 and been replaced with the above.

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Sorry, my info is so old (it's been almost 3 years since I worked in a childcare centre!). It's now called ACECQA.

There are laws and regulations governing how much space each child needs indoors and outdoors. As far as I am aware, all centres (ie, pre schools, long day cares, before/after school cares) need to abide by certain child:space ratios. It may just be that you're used to your centre, and that centre is lucky enough to have more space than is required by law. Maybe this new centre has just enough space to child ratios, and it looks tiny in comparison. The centre would not be able to run if it was not up to scratch.

But I would just check, just in case. It could be that the centre isn't accredited and that's how they get around it.

And I reiterate- that my info is a few years old now and that early childhood has had HUGE reforms since I have actually worked in a centre!

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There are laws and regulations governing how much space each child needs indoors and outdoors. As far as I am aware, all centres (ie, pre schools, long day cares, before/after school cares) need to abide by certain child:space ratios. It may just be that you're used to your centre, and that centre is lucky enough to have more space than is required by law. Maybe this new centre has just enough space to child ratios, and it looks tiny in comparison. The centre would not be able to run if it was not up to scratch.

But I would just check, just in case. It could be that the centre isn't accredited and that's how they get around it.

And I reiterate- that my info is a few years old now and that early childhood has had HUGE reforms since I have actually worked in a centre!

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You're probably right - I'm guessing that I'm spoilt from previous experience and that other people wouldn't batt an eyelid. It would be nice to think though that our kids were required to have a little more space.

Cass it seems like your DS is going to a centre that really suits him. It sounds like a good plan to keep him in the centre where he gets so lovely and dirty. Centres like this are not as common as I recon they should be!

As for sun smart, the cancer council document says to encourage children to seek shade between those times. It is usually interpreted as children can't go out at that time. In sessional kinder I can't imagine with our indoor / outdoor program and spaces open for the whole session having to keep 27 children inside all together at the same time. Recipe for chaos, headaches and more vino after hours!

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Sorry, my info is so old (it's been almost 3 years since I worked in a childcare centre!). It's now called ACECQA.

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Its been about 5 years for me Mrs Fabuloso. Which is why my info was so vauge. Lol

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In NSW, it's the NCAC. (Can't think of what the acronym is right now) I'm not sure if they are the same governing body in all states...gotta pick up DD from school, I will come back and expand!

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No NCAC ceased to exist in 2011. Everyone is under ACECQA - however you are governed by your local authority. ACECQA is the overall body, and each state has sub bodies - so in Qld it is OECEC (office early childhood ed and care) in NSW I believe it is DOCS (not entirely sure).

The space issues you mention are a licencing issue - there is a legal sq meterage required inside and out per child. The assessment and rating process that all centres must go through (which was formerly NCAC National childcare accreditation council) is more about the quality of standards that are being used in the service, as well as legal ratios, etc.

Thing we are finding in Qld at the moment, the OECEC is so very busy assessing centres, they are not doing their regular compliance spot visits like they used to. Where once they came maybe 4 times a year, maybe more, maybe less depending on how happy they were with your service, that's not happening so much now. I had a period of 18mths with no visit and we are almost at the same time since again - we are a great centre, so they do know who they need to keep a close check on but just the same, it allows centres to break the rules more easily when this is occurring.

As for the sun thing - there isn't exactly a law as such, but a requirement that centres have sunsafe practices. Every centre should have sunsmart policies and guidlines to follow - yes out of the sun between 10-3 - this does't have to mean staying inside though, my centre has big verandahs, trees, shade sails and covered sandpits so children easily can play outside - we are always in between 12 and 3 though in a Qld Summer!

Don't quote me exactly, but the space requirement is something like 1.5mtsq per child inside and 5.mtsq outside. This actually comes from building regulations and isn't in the childcare regs or guides themselves.

The hens from the farm that I buy eggs seem to get more square metreage than our kids are entitled to... :shakehead: ...go figure huh?

I understand with the sun thing - I like to keep DS2 inside during the hotter parts of the day. What I was getting at is that their shaded areas were limited. Nothing replaces a tree does it?

In an ideal world I suppose...

Was it an inner city place Cass? I worked in a centre in the city in Sydney and it sounds like it might have been similar. When you get closer to the city, space is not something that is abundant.

It is more important if you felt the vibes weren't terribly happy there. You can have smaller centres which feel awesome, and huge centres which feel terrible. It all depends on the staff and how they utilise their resources. If you didn't feel good about being in their space, then it isn't right for you. Always go with you heart and gut on these sorts of things, I say!

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Was it an inner city place Cass? I worked in a centre in the city in Sydney and it sounds like it might have been similar. When you get closer to the city, space is not something that is abundant.

It is more important if you felt the vibes weren't terribly happy there. You can have smaller centres which feel awesome, and huge centres which feel terrible. It all depends on the staff and how they utilise their resources. If you didn't feel good about being in their space, then it isn't right for you. Always go with you heart and gut on these sorts of things, I say!

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It was as "inner city" as you can get in Canberra. Yes, space is limited but they could have done a bit more with the yard - small though it is you can still make interesting spaces for children.

You're right about the vibes. The place just felt all wrong. Sad faces didn't help in the preschool room and the director was just sprouting almost word for word from their website. Just one of those big companies more interested in making the money. Our current centre is a little tired and run down but all the kids seem to be happy. They have loads of space and the carers (for the most part) seem lovely.

I guess if your little one is happy, it's a good sign.

I found the requirements for the ACT.

Indoor play areas should give each child access to a minimum of 3.25m2 unencumbered floor space in play areas. There must be a minimum of 7m2 of unencumbered outdoor play space per child.