Advice with optimizing quality and quantity of embryos!

hi there,
I am going in soon for my 2nd IVF round - last time I got 9 embryos and 7 of them were just lovely ...but sadly, none took.

I have a couple of months until I go for EPU and I would love some advice about to do to produce the best eggs I can through diet/supplements etc.

Drink lots of water
Fresh fruit/veg - market fresh or organic
Organic proteins (eggs, meat, chicken etc)
Wholegrain cereals
NO alcohol or softdrinks (this is easy)
Limit sweets (this is harder!!)

Can you help me in this list?????????

Accuputure again is on my list.

i would recommend seeing a np - with the 2nd IVF epu i had i had been doing herbs before and got a BFP twice with that lot of embies collected, i believe that helped me with the quality of my embies, i didnt do acupuncture, and wasnt looking at my diet, but hope to for my next FET - when ever that will be!!!

GL

Hi runnermum

My FS also told me to limit my caffiene intake - although it is low (1 to 2 cups per day) I am considering removing caffiene from my diet altogether! Not sure how I am going to cope with my mornings then!

My FS also suggested flossing regularly (daily) - apparently there has been some research which shows a build up of bacteria on the gums can affect the viability of a pregnancy.

And the other thing was increase your anti oxidant intake - both you and your DP - berries are good or herbal teas - or you could try a supplement from a np if you decide to see one.

And one more... avoid taking any ibuprofen eg. Nurofen etc - apparently it can seriously affect your egg quality!

I hope that helps you.
Cheryl

Hi chez
Does it really make a big difference doing all this stuff. I always thought the egg quality didn't change, as they were there from birth. Does caffeine make a huge difference as I love my coffee. Apparently coffee has more anti oxidants than green tea etc they have discovered. I guess it's the caffeine level that is bad though. Is ibuprofen really bad or just suspected as paracetamol don't work on me at all, could you tell me what ways it effects things. Does it affect fertility much?
Thanks :D

Hi Jules

I am no doctor, but this info came from my FS here in Canberra - Dr Nicole Sides. According to Nic, the eggs are 'chosen' (her word) 8 months before the cycle and things like stress, alcohol intake, diet and supplements can really affect egg quality. Any changes made to what you eat and drink can therefore take a while before you notice them on a cycle. I have dragged out the notes that Nic gave me from my visit with her in October last year and this is the list of things I should be including in my diet each day:

- fish oil
- multivatimin containing vits B, C, E, Selenium and Zinc
- 5mg folic acid
- Coenzyme Q10

Late last year I found a new Blackmore's supplement called Conceive Well Gold which contains all of these things except the 5mg of folic acid (it contains 500mcg which isn't enough apparently). I have only been able to buy it from the discount chemist near my work. It comes in a 28 day supply box and you need to take one capsule and one tablet per day. You might be able to buy it on-line - I haven't checked. I take one Megafol tablet per day for the 5mg of folic acid.

As for the ibuprofen being bad, I got that info from the nurses at MIVF last year. I used to take it quite regularly for neck and back pain otherwise I couldn't sleep but I have gone off it completely now that I know this and getting some chiro treatment has helped as well. Maybe check with your FS or nurse next time you have an appointment? I would be interested to hear what they might tell you.

And as for the caffiene, there is a link somewhere on a Conception advice thread on BB that says caffiene can reduce your chance of a pregnancy by 10% - that was from a midwife I think? I know my FS grilled me on my coffee intake - when she asked the question I hesitated and she told me that the correct answer to the question was 1 or 2 cups per day, which is what I have anyway. She was very particular about this. Again I don't have any other information than this.

If you find out any other sources I would be very interested to find out more.
Good luck,
Cheryl

Hi Chez
Thanks will definitely look into all those things, and am staying away from ibuprofen. The coffee will be hard though. WIll get those vitamins, am glad it's available in the one mix, which does simplify things.:)

thanks for all the advice and info everyone!! Looks like it is useful for others as well.

I don't drink alcohol,coffee or tea, or take anything other than panadol occassionally.

Interesting about flossing - will do that much more reguarly!

I will also look for 'concieve well' - you said this by Blackmores?

My problem last time was not getting the embryos, but convincing my body to 'take one'..but getting some nice ones sure does make you feel more confident.

Now, if I could only reduce my stress.. (about to flight home from o/s and it is a very, very long flight..

The thing with ibuprofen is that it is an NSAID (non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug), and like all other NSAIDS, it inhibits ovulation, and can interfere with embryo implantation. The only pain medications you can take during a cycle are paracetamol and codeine - if panadol alone isn't touching the pain, try panadeine, it's just that bit stronger and still safe. The nurses at the clinic have also told me that I can have mersyndol, but I tend to avoid it anyway.

My FS is a big believer in the link between weight and fertility, particularly in women with PCOS. He has a very strict eating plan with limits on the amount of carbs, fat, protein, and calories you can have each day. Any carbs you consume should be low GI. There's also a list of things you should avoid - cheese and tropical fruit being the only real surprise on the list.

He used the plan with me because I was severely insulin resistant, despite not being overweight. He gets very good results with it. The surprising thing is that he also uses this plan for women who have absolutely nothing to explain why they are not pregnant and why IVF is not working. He claims to get good results there, too.

A friend of mine who sees the same FS doesn't have PCOS, is not overweight, has no explanation for her infertility (apart from age) and has been through a couple of stim cycles, being lucky to get around 3 eggs, one embryo and the transfers have not been working. Our FS has now put her on this plan, and she's just had an egg collection and is about to go for transfer. 8 follicles, 6 good eggs, 4 fertilised with ICSI - it's her best result yet! We'll know later on today whether any get to the freezer, but the evidence is looking pretty convincing so far.

I can pass on the information if anyone wants it.

BW

Hi BW

Thanks for providing the reason behind ibuprofen - yet again you are so knowledgeable - where would we be without you? If only I had known that 2 years ago when I was taking it most nights because of neck and back pain. We probably wasted more than 6 months TTC when our chances were just about minimal because of neurofen! The things you learn afterwards :(

The case you have recounted of your friend and her unsuccessful cycles sounds exactly like me! I would really appreciate getting more info about the eating plan David has you on... I am willing to give anything a go!

ETA: I checked and you can get Blackmore's Conceive Well Gold at lots of the on-line chemist sites.
Thanks, xx

No problems at all, Chez. If you PM me your email address, I'll pass the file along. Sadly for my friend, it was no frosties this time, but it's still a much better response than she has had before.

BW

Thanks BW - have sent you a PM.

Bad news about the frosties but is your friend going to transfer from any of the 4 fert eggs?
Chez

She did get one transferred, we're very nervously sitting through the TWW now. The others failed to progress much further, but the one that went back was looking really good, I'm told.

BW

BW

That's great news about your friend - hopefully she will be another success story for David and NGF!

Chez

thanks heaps Butterfly warrior,
How can I PM you to get this file you mentioned of Davids? It sounds very useful and I just want to keep trying new things - I am so frustrated.

i think I just figured out how to send a PM !! HOpe you got it Butterfly warrior and thanks so much