Some one..Any one??

IM BACK!!!
And yes, SLEEP issues again...
I want some one to give me some help, info, something, that will help. Because nothing else does. And believe me, ive tried everything under the sun that has been thrown at me.
If anything were to work, itll work, for about 4 or so days, and then Isabell will throw it out the window, and thats that.
Ive tried patting her to sleep, rocking her to sleep, pusing her to sleep in the pram, ive tried music, ive tried singing, i have even tried controlled crying (no judgement, when your as desperate as i am, then hey, you will try anything). I have tried feeding to sleep, dummy, wrapping her, not wrapping her. I have also tried driving her in the car, she will sleep if its a long trip, with the price of petrol this isnt a reality.
Im considering day stay/sleep school/what ever you call it. I just called Ngala, and they are calling me back (WHY do they do this, WHY cant they just put me on hold while i wait for some one to be available??) and then i have to talk to a person, and then be forwarded to the appointment scheduler or something, and then i have to wait around 4 weeks for my appt..so really, if ic ant deal with the sleep now, how am i going to deal in the next 4 weeks?? I CANT.
Are there any other sleep schools or similar services that i can go to here in Perth? Or like other services are we alienated too??
I really feel like we are the only couple in this whole wide world with a baby that just doesnt want to sleep during the day,
Any way, night time, around 9:30pm, i can wrap her nice and snug, feed her till her tum tum is full, then put her in her cot, and she will sleep riiiight through til morning. Hows this..i tried this during the day, nope, no go, no sleep, zilch, still wide eyed and bushy tailed. Ive tried doing this in a dark room, nope, dim room, nope, light room, nope. It doesnt make a difference, it just doesnt happen.
Where have we gone wrong? Where are we going wrong? What arent we doing? What have we missed??
Im at the end...seriously, the end. I cannot take this any more, i really, really, really cant. We need to do something that actually works, we need to find something that works..i dont want to be the only person that has a baby like this!!

ETA: Add this to the list of things we have tried: Sling and carrier (HAB and Baby Bjorn) didnt work much, although we only got the Bbay Bjorn today, but she gets pretty irritible and upset. Yes i have them on properly when i have put her in and she has gotten irritible.

Meg, its awful when the little buggers won't sleep and you know how tired they are!!!

These are the things that worked for DS:-

1. Put a load of washing in the clothes dryer and put her in front of it in a rocker or something. I found the noise and the rhythmic action and the warmth would put him to sleep.

2. I put him in his swing chair and sat in front of him and pretended to fall asleep. I made my blinks really exaggerated and like I was finding it hard to keep them open. Sleepy eyes are contagious!!!!

3. Put a towel in the dryer for 10 minutes. Wrap it around bubs.... might work too.. nice warm cosy towel......

Hang in there, you are doing a GREAT job!!

When babies are that young then baby osteopathy can be done. Maybe there's some birth trauma in her spine that's making her uncomfortable - can happen even when you feel the birth was fine. That birth canal can't be easy.

PLEASE don't take this as a criticism, but for something to work you need to stick with it for AT LEAST a week. Then when it gets tough keep with it - if it worked once it will again. Also you need to expect a baby to not want to sleep when you do. Have you tried co-sleeping? That is great for regulating the daily rhythm in a baby. DS may have been awake at night but he always wants to go straight back to sleep at night. Whether he does or not is a different matter; sometimes the pain won't let him sleep (teething for us atm).

As well, she's sleeping at night. The whole "babies need 20 hours sleep" I think is a myth. Babies seem to either sleep well at night or well in the day, very few do both. I know it's hard, but at least you get a night sleep. I know that's not very kind of me but seeing your little angel asleep at 11am when you've been up walking the floors with a teether all night is NOT fun. Given time your baby will start to sleep in the day, just as others will sleep at night.

Will she play on a playmat on her own for ten minutes just for your sanity? I managed to get DS to play on his own for a good half-hour at that age if I sat with him and as he played just bat toys back to him and read my book or chat to a friend.

Oh yes, I'd also be out walking for up to an hour with DS sometimes before he fell asleep. It's great for your figure!

Any other ideas? Does she have a snuggly toy? I forgot to give DS his today, it's in my handbag and he needs a sleep at nursery. Hope he'll do that for them! DS didn't take to his until he was a year old, but it has been in his cot with him from about 1m old.

Oh yes, can any of your friends or family take her out in the pram for an hour while you rest? You don't need to do it all alone if there's an alternative.

Hope something in this ramble works! Even if it's just that it's a phase and will pass, plenty of people have babies who won't sleep during the day - one of my baby buddies had one JUST the same, slept through the night but not the day from 2 months or so. You're not doing anything wrong, just your baby can't read so doesn't know what all the books are saying she should do yet.

She sounds just like my DS was. I think that I have posted in another thread that you started before, but with DS it turned out to be reflux. Maybe take her to the docs just to weigh out a medical issue. Then you will know where you stand much better.

I know exaclty how you feel. So many people would say to me at least he sleeps all night.... But I was exhausted, I was pacing around with him all day without a break. Anyway he staryed a not so good day sleeper till he was 12 months old. But in a few months, she will be playing more independently, and you can at least have a sit down rest while she has a play on the floor.

Take care

With most things we have tried we have done it for a week, the first 4 days are great, they work, the last 3 days are hell and back to step 1 again.
We are seeing a chiro for Isabell, he has done wonders, but sleep just isnt one of those wonders.
I do think its a possibility she is teething, but really how can you be certain unless one pops up?? Til then it could be anything.
She wants to suck, i know it, but anything she tries to suck on isnt good enough. Dummies nope, blankie nope, fingers nope. We do have a comfort toy in the corner of her cot that she can see..but i dont think it does anything for her.
Sometimes i am lucky and can get her to play for a bit, but thats not what i need, what i need is for her to stop crying all day and sleep so that inbetween sleeps she can be happy and enjoyable and i can enjoy being a mum. ATM im not coz all i have is a screaming baby.
Yesterday she rolled from her back o her tummy, i was happy, but then the crying started and that was put to the back of my mind, and its like it hasnt hapened. I want to enjoy and chrish these moments like every one says to. but how can i when she is so unpleasant and difficult??

:hug: It is so hard when they won't sleep

the only tip I have is to stop trying to put her to sleep :) Sounds silly doesn't it

When you see her rub her eyes, or her arms get jerky.. Pick her up very quietly. Feed her if she needs it.. Take her to her bed and lay her down and gently say shhhh.. shhhh.. Slowly walk out of the room..

It is perfectly normal behaviour she is doing.. It sucks but it passes then it starts again..

And if that fails then just lay down with her.. Enjoy the quiet..

The biggest things are to be very quiet (not super quiet but calm quiet) and keep your movements gentle.. and to relax.. Please don't take offence but quite often the more you try the harder they fight.. Just sit on the couch with her.. hold her close and whisper or sing.. and no need to sing a lullaby.. Sing your favourite song if you want...

and baths sometimes help relax and wear them out.. As does going for a walk in the fresh air..

Meg - I don't think youre doing anything wrong darl :hug:
I hate to tell you but DD didn't really sleep during the day till she was mobile (4/5mths) but she was a great sleeper at night!
I know its frustrating when you need a break during the day, and then you get stressed, then she gets stressed... then its another horrible day :(
Hang in there - it won't be like this forever! I'm sorry, I know this isn't really what you want to hear... just know that youre not alone, and try and look after yourself - have you got family/friends that can help out some days so you can have a break?
I really hope things get better for you soon :hug:

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the only tip I have is to stop trying to put her to sleep :) Sounds silly doesn't it

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Have to agree with this one, coming from experience of a terrible sleeper she is picking up on your stress. Often I would find that DD1 would fall asleep when I was least expecting it. I gave up trying, and began to work on instinct rather than thought. If by instinct I picked her up to get her to sleep, she would sleep but not if I thought "is she ready for sleep". Consistency will be needed as she gets older, something I fought and found difficult to implement. She is still not the best sleeper, but I think that is just her now.

Just a tip with slings, try wearing bubs outside rather than inside. Outside for some reason works so much better. Try hanging out some washing, any type of walking or movement that is nothing like what you do to get her to sleep.

If you are breastfeeding, what is your diet like? Are you having lots of caffeine, or any caffeine? Food or drinks with lots of food colourings? You may have a sensitive bub.

hmmmm sooo not what you want to hear but my little girl didn't start sleeping during the day until around 9 months or so..... it also co-incided with when she started sleeping through the night.... give thanks that your little one is at least sleeping at night and you can get a rest...!!

the best thing i ever did was give up on searching for a solution and just accept that this is what having a baby is like for some people - and more importantly me.... as soon as i accepted that no matter what i did i couldn't force her to sleep, life became a lot easier.... it is tiring and relentless looking for answers and at the end of the day, the answer was, she's a baby, and babies do what they like when they like!!! all i could do was give her lots of opportunities to sleep in a lovely sleepy environment, the sleeping part was up to her.....

in the blink of an eye they have grown up and the lack of sleep is just a hazy memory...

hang in there it gets easier

Meg, you can enjoy it the same way I do when I've been up literally all night (11-5 some nights) and DS just smiles at me. Doesn't make you less tired but you realise that they aren't doing it to spite you. And your memories: I remember DS rolling over. I don't remember that he'd been up all night the night before, I don't remember the tiredness I felt, I don't still feel irritation that DH couldn't turn around from his fish for two seconds to see it when I realised he was going to roll over this time after trying all afternoon. You honestly do just blot out the bad things.

You're tired. I know this is going to sound harsh but you're a mum - did you expect to be well rested? Once you stop demanding YOUR rest it gets a LOT easier. I know, I have to remind myself of that a LOT too. My stamina with DS's sleep amazed my friends but a LOT of it has to do with expectation: I expected no sleep for a year so getting just 4 hours meant I was quids in. After the first year I did get cross! It doesn't mean you don't want sleep and you never lose it, nor does it mean you don't want a "perfect" child, but acceptance means you don't feel quite so tired.

Headphones on and out for a walk. You'll de-stress and have time to yourself, even if you are on the go, and your relaxing will maybe help sleep.

Failing that, just change the routine every four days. She's too young to remember what happened three weeks ago so just cycle the routine every four days.

I hope I'm not coming across as a meanie here, I do feel for you, but I do think that sometimes just going with the flow and not demanding your child to change to suit you is the answer.

But im not tired, its not that im tired, its that i cant handle the crying, i cant fight her to sleep. I get 8-10 hours a sleep at night, so its not sleep that i want or need, its sleepo that isabell needs.
Im going to keep trying, but if i go MIA, assume that im in a padded cell!

Meg, :hug: I know it's hard. My DS fought sleep 24 hours a day from 2 months til 13 months. He still doesn't love it, but it's better ;)

I have to agree with the others, she will be picking up on your stress. The harder you try, the less likely she is to go to sleep. And I hate to say it, but it seems that the babies who sleep through as young as Isabell, often don't sleep well during the day. Put her in the pram, stick the earphones in and go for a walk. Keep trying the slings (I would have thought the HAB would be more comfy for her that the BB), sometimes bubbas just need to get used to these things before settling down. Try it when YOU are relaxed. If you're putting her in it out of total desperation she will likely pick up on that and freak out. Go for a walk with her in the carrier.

Sometimes we just can't change them. They might be little, but they are people, with personalities, and trying to make things different usually ends up stressing us out, because it simply doesn't work. I wish I'd given up fighting it earlier with my DS, and spent less time stressing and worrying about his sleep (or lack of). I know it's very hard when you're sleep deprived, but sometimes there's nothing you can do. As RF said, she's not doing it to spite you..........she's just a little baby, crying is her only way of communicating.

I read somewhere once that if the method you're using to put them to sleep doesn't work within 20 minutes, it probably won't work at all. It seems pretty true to me. Persisting past that amount of time would usually lead to tears for both of us. But if I stopped, played with him, whatever, and then came back and tried again, sometimes we would have success. It's worth a go anyway. Hang in there, it will get better, that is for sure.

Hey Meg - big :hug: for you, cos this whole parenting thing can be the toughest gig in town.

Just reading your last post, where you said it was the crying that gets to you, maybe you need to change your focus slightly - forget about the sleeping, just concentrate on what you need to do to get her to stop crying. This way you're not fighting her, you're just comforting her, and you never know, the sleep might just follow. It's just a subtle change, but it might help you to find a level of calmness & control that you don't feel like you have at the moment.

Also, there's quite a lot of stuff written about the 4 month change - and looking at Isabells ticker, she's pretty close to 4 months. Maybe do a search on BB for threads about this stage, it might give you some hope/help.

I know it's probably hard to believe, and maybe a bit annoying to have people saying it to you, but it seriously does get better, or at least you get more experienced at managing it. There's so much that's changing in their 1st six months, but it does start to settle eventually, you will get there, and this phase will become just a vague memory. Then you'll have another bub....

Meg I just wanted to send you a huge :hug: My DD is a shocker (still...sorry) for day sleeps and yep fights me tooth and nail, screaming backarching and yep I have days when i wonder how to enjoy her.
I agree with what a couple of others have said about "relaxing" if you are the smallest bit stressed/frustrated whatever they do pick up on it and use the pram...i go out for her first day sleep and she will just drift off (took a few weeks of "tanties") 99% of the time and if we dont go out or go later than she is off kilter and i can pretty much write off sleep for the day.
I have recently found that reading...my books, DS's books, made up stories...seems to help her drift off...i cradle her and rock slowly and gentle pat the bum while reading and keep my voice at the same volume and she will go to sleep much easier...however sometimes i have to let her sleep in my arms as she has days of absolute bed refusal like today :(

I hope something works for you soon as i really do know how hard it must be for you atm. :hug: :hug: :hug:

Thanks so much everyone.
Im going to go MIA for a while, so i can figure and sort this out for myself. I will be back though.
Thanks so much for all your support and advice :)

Meg, I know you are MIA, so I don't know when you will get this, but I just wanted to give you my love and support and big hugs. I don't know the answer to what's going on, but I sure feel bad for you! I think you are doing a great thing by spending some time working out what you think is going on and trusting your mummy instinct.

Anywho, I really hope it all gets better soon for you. Miss you in chat!