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Hello, just wanted to say like a lot of others we were told there was little chance as we had no sperm, not even one... but DH went on to have a little operation in hopes he was producing some in his testies or epididymus...... And yes,,, much to the suprise of all, we now have lots of great frozen sperm awaiting our first attempt at IVF... so dont give up, even when they say no, you have no chance. Can share our info with anyone else if others are in the same predicament... :p
Tracey2010,
We are in the same boat as you. Found out a year ago that we had severe MFI. In DH's first SA they found no sperm and in the second only 4. We start ICSI in late July and DH will have a biopsy straight after my egg collection to see if there are any sperm. All of DH blood tests have been fine and they cannot find any blockages.
Can you give me a bit more info regarding your DH SA?
Did he have bloodtests and does he have any blockages? What is the reason the sperm isn't coming out naturally?
Sorry for all of the questions but we do not know anyone else who's SA have come back so bad yet biopsy has been good.
Good luck with your IVF journey and I hope it is a short one!
Hi yes happy to share with you, well the bloods that were done showed hormone levels normal for DH, so we then went onto having the biopsy. His sperm analysis both times showed zero, not even one. They could have timed both EPU and his Biopsy the same day, but to be honest, they held little hope to find any sperm at all. The urologist operated and went straight to the epididymus first as thats where the most mature sperm are and thats where he found all great samples. :clap:
If he did not find anything there he was then going onto seeking in the testies.. Very hard to determine if he had a blockage as we are talking micro surgery... So my only advice for you is go for the best ones in the epi first as they freeze better as well... If we are unsuccessful with IVF we will inquire into micro surgery but its very intricate...... hope this helps you and keep me informed.... cheers Trace x
Tracey2010,
I was a bit worried when the FS told us that the biopsy would be done on the same day as egg collection. I questioned the FS and he seems to think that he will find some good sperm, so who am i to argue with him? On a letter that he wrote to our referring Doctor he states that there is a 65% chance of finding sperm when doing a biopsy even if no sperm are present during a SA. Our FS doesn't know why sperm are not showing up in SA. I would love to know why, but i suppose i should be happy that they have found any.
Keep us up to date with how you go on your IVF journey.
:pray: that you have a baby soon!!!!
Its so reassuring to hear there's some other couples going through the same thing as us.
We have been TTC for 4 years and after much persuading finally DH did a SA to find zero sperm count, twice:wall: DH has since had ultrasound, no blockage found and blood tests which were all good, what came up though was abnormal chromosomes, DH is XYY, but to make it worse his two Y chromosomes somehow got mixed up when he was conceived! We went to see a genetics counsellor before going further down the IVF ICSI track and he told us there is no other case of this happening before so couldn't really tell us what to expect! As you can guess poor DH is very upset and now we are waiting for a biopsy to see if there is any sperm :pray:
Anyway, what I wanted to know was after we see our FS next week, how long from that appointment does it take to book a biopsy? I know there is going to be lots of waiting with this whole TTC journey, am so over it already thou!
If you go through public system it may take a while as its not emergency surgery, we went private as it was the only way to get things moving quickly.. The cost was not all that bad from memory. We are now paying rent on the frozen sperm which we will take out of their pocket money when they are born ha ha... best of luck with it all.... let me know if i can help any further..... it was nearly 12 months from finding no sperm to having some frozen, most of that time was waiting to see urologist and timing things in between my DH work.
Thats a little ray of sunshine, we will be able to go private too so fingers crossed a biopsy can be done in June, DH plans to take a week off work after the surgery as aparently the bruising and swelling is bad:(
What was your partners experience?
Thanks again for sharing, while everyone around me is very supportive its good to get advice from people who have had to go through this too.
Good luck with you baby making:bluedust:
Hi and glad to help.... My partner was a little sore, but panadol and 3 days rest seen him feeling quite ok.. he said it was well worth the sore goolies for a few days to have sperm... He was very proud indeed. Frozen bag of peas worked well wrapped in a towel. Its not a nice thought for the guys, but well worth it if it will produce a baby of their own, especially if donor sperm is not an option. He was back to normal within a week for sure, best of luck with it,, hope you find lots a good swimmers to freeze. xx:pray:
Hi Ladies :)
Im glad to see this post! It gives me a little bit of hope that we may be able to concieve! We have only had our bad news in the last few days, and we have a long journey ahead..DH has bilateral microlithasis and atrophy, basically the doctor described his testes as "dead". As you can imagine, we are struggling a bit right now :(
So reading things like this makes me teary in a good way! Maybe it is possible :) Thank you for sharing this.
bextaj
you said you DH is XXY
this is called Klienfelter's syndrome- one of the commonest genetic and most livable genetic conditions- most men dont know that they have this syndrome until infertility is investigated
just so you know- when we did assisted conception 7 years ago, our clinic had just had success with the birth of a child conceived from a man who had klinefelters and sperm was collected through a biopsy!!
that was 7 years ago so i am sure they have had more success since then. There is plenty of info out there on the web and there are support groups in Australia that your DH can speak to - there are men who are quite happy to talk to him about their experiences!
i hope this info helps and if you want any more- please feel free to say
Det she said xyy not xxy. They'd be different yeh?
Bextaj, when you say mixed up, did they (drs/specialists) use the term mosaic/ism? Just trying to figure out what you mean.
Xyy is not uncommon and not usually detected unless investigating for another reason
Hey guys, sorry its taken me a while to get back to you!
My DH is XYY so he has an extra Y chromosome, what is so unique about him is that when he was conceived as an embryo his two Y chromosomes got mixed up, the way I can describe it is the two tops of the Y chromosomes joined together and the two bottoms, I don't think it is called a mosaic, there is no reported incident in the medical journals of this happening before according to our genetics counsellor:doh: I have spent hours searching the net for answers I found something on an experiment with mosquito's which might be similar:D but basically its a big unknown if DH has sperm, technically all the dna is there to make it, its just mixed up. Secondly our next worry is if DH does have sperm how it is splitting into X and Y sperm and what will happen when it is joined with one of my eggs using ICSI.
Specialist app is tomoz so hopefully more light will be shed then, until we do a biopsy though we are at a bit of standstill on knowing what our next step in the baby making process is.
Until we do a biopsy DH doesn't want to talk about donor options which is fair enough, everything is crossed for a good biopsy result:pray:
oops sorry about that - read it wrong
hope info helps anyway
good luck
OMG I cant believe I stumbled across this thread....I feel like im reading about my own life.
DH and I have been trying ton conceive for 26 months naturally. After I had all the tests under the sun done, we decided it was time for DH to have some tests done as well. His first sample came back with 0 sperm in it. We thought it was just a dud sample (or so I kept telling myself!) but the second one came back the same.
We went to the FS about 8 weeks ago and she had a 'feel around' and said it was def not a blockage and that she thinks he has a chromosome problem. The tests take 5 weeks to get the results, which wasnt to bad because we were going to Europe for 3 weeks anyway.
So we got back about 3 weeks ago and went back to the FS (5 weeks after the tests had been done) and the results still werent back :(
Our FS is now on holidays and we go back on 7th July to get the results and have our conselling to start IVF. Im scared but excited/hopefull at the same time. Im so scared that we are going to go through everything and then Ill go in to have the egg retrieval done and they will find nothing in DH for us to use.
They think that he is missing part of the Y chromosome which means he produces no semen or if they can go in and find some and we have a male then we will pass the same problem down t our male offspring.
To make matters worse he works up in the mines, so he does 2 weeks away and work and only 1 week home, so it makes it very hard for us both to talk about it.
Aim xxx
Aim,:
Our story is virtually the same as yours, only we were not actively ttc. When DH told me he wanted a baby i made him have a sa and that's when they found no sperm. He gave up all alcohol for 4 months and his SA came back with 4 sperm.
We start ICSI next month and when i have EPU he will have a biopsy straight after to get my eggs some sperm. I am very worried that they may not find anything, but our FS is very confident that he will, so I can only trust what he tells me.
DH had all of the blood tests as required and they found nothing on them and he has no blockages, so we actually do not have a cause as to why there is no sperm. :shakehead:
Goodluck on your journey and i hope they find some answers for you! :D
Megan
Hi, dont know much about the chromosome thing, but we too were scared that we might find nothing to do IVF with, so hubby had sperm biopsy done and froze what they found. that way I can now safely try to do ivf knowing that we have frozen sperm there waiting. He will only have to do this once, (bit painful) but you can then go onto trying to concieve while he is away at work like my partner does... Fly in fly out for 5 weeks at a time... best of luck with it, at least you guys found out the prob early so lots of positive vibes to you both.. Tell DH he is not alone and not out of the race. If you pass on the chromosome thing to your son,, IVF will be way advanced by the time he wants to have kids too... hope this helps you to go on your journey with positive outcome...
Hi everyone,
Just an update on our journey, Biopsy is booked for the 9th of August, only a week and a bit away and there will be answers! I have been trying to find out what the cost will be as a bit of uncertainty over if our private health will cover the hospital costs given the surgery is not 'necessary'. Tracey could you guys claim on private health for hospital and anethetist? Medicare has given me a rough idea I will get around $500 out of the $1800 surgery costs but thats all I can find out so far.
:bluedust::pink-babydust:
Hi Bextaj,
My DH will be going in around the same time as yours. At this stage ours will be the 14th August if all goes to plan with my ivf cycle. Are you doing a cycle of ivf at time same time???
We are with Concept and we have been told to expect about $100 over and above what our private health cover for the anesthitist.
Hi girls,
DH and I are going through similar things right now, although not quite up to the IVF stage just yet - we're waiting on the test results, and we're booked in for an ultrasound each on Tuesday. Something interesting the FS said to us was about DH's testosterone level, and I was wondering if any of you have had the same worries? He said if DH was low or borderline, then the biopsy to get some sperm might effect his production of testosterone and - worse case scenario - he could be on hormone replacement therapy for the rest of his life. It's something we're taking seriously before considering the possibility of IVF. We've got another 4 weeks of waiting to go, so I suppose I'll find out then :redface: but I do think about it occasionally, and havn't found out much online about it either.
We don't yet know the cause of his zero sperm counts, but it's IVF or nothing at this stage - and we're not keen on donor sperm.
It's so nice to read others have a similar experience, and we're not alone in this!
Frugal.
Hi Tracey,
GL with your IVF cycle hun! My DF had a 'snip' a long time ago (was married then and had 3 kids already the last one almost cost his ex her life, so decided to have the snip) so when he got divorced and met me we wanted children of our own (as you often do!). We tried for 3 years w/o protection thinking maybe a sneaky sperm might find its way into my eggie, but of course no luck. My DF had a vesectomy reversal done which was very expensive, and surprise surprise, the count was zero!!!!!! Hello!! What a waste of money. They did say that if it's been longer than 5 years since the vesectomy the chances of the revesal working is pretty small. Anyhoo, we had the biopsy done on the day of EPU, I was really worried that there will be no sperm, but luckily they got some good ones as we ended up with 7 fertilized embies. That was back in 2008, so I'm now wondering if it's a good idea to get DF to get some sperm taken out for when we're ready to have another go (I don't have any frozen embies) as he'll be 46 this year???? Sounds like you have a clever urologist, ours actually told us to go straight to IVF before he charged us the 4 Gs, he just knew we were probably wasting our money on the reversal. The microsurgery in NOT cheap....
GL with it all hun!
B xx
Hi, we just found out that my DH has zero sperm count. We are both devastated and especially I am not coping very well at all. It is encouraging to see that others have been / are in the same situation and that there is some hope we may be able to conceive. We are booked in with a FS next week. The waiting and not knowing is the worst and I am sure there will be many more weeks of waiting to come.
Does anyone of you has thought about using donor sperm? Do you know if there is a waiting list or so? I know that this is still a long time away and I hope we never have to go there, but I just have to know that there are other options if worst comes to worst. I read a lot that it is more difficult to get donor sperm since the change of regulation.
I am wishing you all best of luck!
Kristine - Initially DH and I were against IVF (before his diagnosis).. but we changed our minds. I guess the donor sperm issue is a really hard personal one to make. I told DH that I would almost consider using his brother's but he lives OS, and it's not an option really. DH gave me "the look" and said NO WAY! We both laughed about it (our coping mechanism for all this mess I think) and agreed then and there not to use donor sperm. I understand why couples choose it, for sure, but it's not for us.
I'm trying to stay positive and I'll go with the FS's assumption that there'll probably be sperm hiding in there somewhere. :) I doubt he'd get me to get ready for IVF if he didn't think it was a good chance. We've seen him only once so far, but I agree, the waiting is the worst! :hug:
Hi Amy
I'm not doing any IVF stuff until we get the biopsy results, I guess cause DH is so 'unique' they are not sure what they will find so no point in starting anything until we have some sperm;)
I have just found out biopsy is considered 'necessary' surgery from our surgeon so should be covered by our private health which is just the hospital excess ($250 in our case) and the gap for the anethetist (think $50). I think all we will have to pay is the initial $250 on the Monday of surgery then everything else is billed and goes through medicare and our private health insurance before we pay what is left over.
I will let you all know what that turns out to be for anyone going through this later that wants to know:D
Wishing everyone luck on their TTC journey, its nice to know were not alone!
:bluedust::pink-babydust:
Hi, I was just wondering if anyone has any updates. We are still waiting for results and we already have been told that the next step will be a biopsy. I am just feeling a bit down in the moment and it would be nice to hear some more experiences from others in the same situation.
Thanks
Hi Kristine (again!)
Just wondering are they doing a biopsy to see if they might find any sperm before you do any IVF stuff? Our FS isn't going to, saying it would put him in a 60-40% or a 40-60% chance "group" (I think I got the percentages right? Head swimming with figures, I guess you know. :) ) and asked would it really make a difference to our decision to go IVF or otherwise. I wasn't sure, but he seemed to be pretty confident of finding sperm even without doing a biopsy. Has your DH had a genetic test yet? I wonder if that makes a difference to doing a biopsy or not..? Lots of questions, and only fluffy statistics of answers given so far.. :hug:
Hi frugal, I am not sure. My understanding so far is that he is thinking about doing a biopsy first to identify the reason for the azoospermia. We are still waiting on the blood test results, which also include a genetic test. We only talked to him on the phone about it and it didn't sound like the biopsy is such a "big thing". Of course it isn't nice for DH, but he said that DH would not need to be admitted to hospital and that it would be done as an outpatient surgery. He even would be able to go to work the next day. My understanding is that with a biopsy they can find out whether or not DH is producing any sperm. It's all so confusing. Have you already got any results back from your DH? What other tests did your DH so? What was the reasoning of your FS to NOT do the biopsy before ivf?
Hi girls,
Im half way through my IVF cycle. They are going in on 14th Aug at this strage to check for sperm in DH and do my egg retreival.
Aim x
Kristine - With the biopsy, they're going to do what Amy_jellybean's doing and getting sperm at the same time as the pickup. The reasoning seems to be that it's another risk for DH that they can avoid if there's no absolutes in the answer anyway. It might be different for my DH as it appears they're going to actually REMOVE some part of his testies when getting sperm! (Sounds terrible but...) he's about 1/3rd of the size of "normal", so I guess they're concerned about removing any more and risking testosterone production etc.
DH has had bloods taken for lots of tests, but to be honest, I don't know which ones exactly - at least the genetic test and testosterone.. and we both had bloods taken last time for Hep and HIV too. No results back yet. The genetic test takes about a month to come back, so a couple more weeks to go hopefully.
Amy - Good luck with everything! I hope they find lots and lots of sperm at the egg retrevial! :) Might sound like an odd question, but, how is your DH coping with the IVF stuff you're going through? The meds etc? I'm worried my DH will get a huge case of the guilts.
Thought Id pop in here again... Not great news for us DH has 47XXY , aka Klinefelters.
Absolutely shattered to be quite honest :( He has it in 20 cells. I dont know what that means, and google has been of no help.
He doesnt have all the "traditional" characteristics, weight problems, breast tissue, hip fat etc.. Its mainly the atrophy, height and verbal expression. And the passive, shy nature.
We have opted for a biopsy... the FS wasnt too keen on it at all, he only mentioned it begrudgingly after I questioned him. He wanted to send us home to think about it and see us in 2 months.... um yeah... NO! So we got the ball rolling. Now its just a matter of doing all the counselling and police & CPO checks. (I wont start on that!)
There's only a 25% chance of finding anything in the biopsy... but we are taking the chance. We arent going to use a donor so this is our last hope.
Belizeli - I'm sorry to hear of your news. :hug: Some of those symptoms sound like my DH - and that was where the FS was leading us to, but didn't say the name of it, just described the genetics getting mixed up. I hope the biopsy finds sperm for you.
Our FS just called DH and said he wants him to have another ultrasound for his clot and come in and see him late October, early November. What?! That long? That'll put back our chances of IVF for ages.. :( DH said it felt like he was seeing this as a different issue altogether. What if it isn't? What if the clot is causing his zero sperm count? Then again, many of the symptoms of Klinefelters describes DH (a bit pear-shaped, slightly enlarged breasts - he says that not me - bad teeth, small testies..) but not others (not lanky or tall, his libido is pretty high). Lots to think about... but we should probably wait for a diagnosis before stressing out too much (this time! :redface: ).. Waiting sucks.
Belizeli - so sorry to hear the diagnosis. It is very though to deal with. There have been pregnancies with Klinefelters. I know that the chances are a bit less than with other reasons, but there is still hope. It has happened before. :hug:
Frugal - Why does the FS wants to wait so long. That seems like a very long time just for an ultrasound. Are you considering getting a 2nd opinion? :hug:
Amy - Good luck, I really hope that they will find lots of sperm at the retrieval and that you get a BFP real soon :crossfingers:
Kristine - DH mentioned getting a second opinion today and I'm thinking it might be a good idea if we can't get this FS to move at our pace. DH is going to call him on Monday and ask some questions.
As for above.. just ignore that. I took a good look at DH in the shower when he got home :redface: :ROFL: and no, he's not pear shaped at all, and his chest isn't anything like the ones I saw on a website about the issue.. so I think my imagination was playing tricks on me for a while there (thinking the worst!). It's put my mind at ease a bit, but I guess it doesn't mean that there isn't a genetic issue just as the FS thought. Argh.
good luck girls
the stuff on the web about klinefelters is scary- but remember they are going to show only to worse cases on here!
remember it is a syndrome so the degree that you are affected varies cell to cell
you arm could have XXY cells in it but your leg might not!!! same as your mouth where take the swab from may be xxy but there testes may be XY!!
the 20 means that out of 100 cells they counted- 20 were xxy- that is a really low count- that is good!! or it could mean that 20 were xy and 80 were XXY- either way it means he is a mosaic as well- which is more chance for sperm to be present
also it is one of the most common genetic condition there is and most people go dx until fertility issues present themselves- its like 1:40 are affected!!!
hang in there girls!!
Thanks you for all the goodluck messages girls...it so lovely!!!
Frugal - Hubby is going ok as far as I know. He works away though so im actually kind of glad he is away while im doing the needles etc. He will be home when I do the last couple and the trigger so I think that will be testing times. Ive just pretty much told him straight that he is not to blame for this happening and that we are a team and in it together.
Belizeli - So sorry to hear about your news sweet. Im with you, if there is anything that they could do then I would want them to do it.
Aim x
Hi all, I thought I give a quick update. We just had an appointment with our FS and we have scheduled DH's biopsy for 23 Aug - so only about 10 days away. They seem to be quite confident that they will find sperm, but I will feel much better when I actually know. We got his hormone levels back and they are all normal, which is a good sign. We haven't got any genetic tests back yet. Really hope that they will be fine too. FS seems to think so, as DH has fathered a child before (that's however quite a few years ago) and his testis size is normal. Anyway, we won't know for sure until we have the blood tests back and the biopsy done.
We had the option to wait with the biopsy and go ahead with the IVF process and then have the biopsy on the same day as the egg retrieval, but we decided it would be better this way for us. We just want to know and we probably won't start IVF until towards the end of the year due to work commitments with travel involved. I don't think I can wait until then to know (im not really patient).
If they find sperm during the biopsy they will freeze it for when we do IVF.
Also, I asked the FS if the success rates with testicular sperm are the same as with "normal" sperm and she said yes. So that is a good thing and I thought I let you know in case you have wondered about this too. Once the egg is fertilised then the chances are the same.
Anyway, sorry about this long post.
Amy - :crossfingers: that they find some sperm next week. Remember they don't need many!
Frugal - hope you are feeling a bit better today :hug:
Bel - how are you?
Hi Kristine,
Thats fantastic news!!! Im almost at the end of my injections, I have to go for another blood test tomorrow (ive had one almost every day this week eerggghh!!!) My ER and DH sperm aspiration will be early next week, will jump in and let you know how we go.
Good luck everyone!!!
Aim x
Kristine - Sounds like you have a plan and everything is chugging along nicely. :) Great stuff!
Amy - :crossfingers: for early next week! Looking forward to good news. :)
I'm feeling ok! I think it's nearing O time, and I still feel a bit of loss associated with it. When I feel those cramps, it's another reminder.. BUT I'm trying not to let it get me down. DH has started joking about things and being a bit more relaxed about it all. I'm concentrating on renovating and painting the kitchen etc. We're looking to the future rather than sulking in the now. :)
Hi,
Wondering if I can join this thread (again)?
I posted earlier on in the thread about DH having no sperm and having to have a biopsy done.
I had EPU done on the 10th of this month (we got 19 eggs) and then after my procedure DH had his biopsy. Unfortunately they found no sperm. We have another appointment with the FS on Tuesday to see what went wrong. On a previous SA they found 4 sperm, so I am guessing DH must produce some. Luckily for us, they successfully froze 18 of my eggs for future use.
Just wondering has anyone heard anything like this happening before?
I hope everyone's DH's have successful biopsies!
Hi puffsgirl11, I am so sorry your DH's biopsy wasn't succesfull. :hug: I really don't know what to say and don't understand at all why they wouldn't find any sperm in the biopsy, if there actually was some sperm in the SA. As you said that means he must produce some.
What sort of biopsy did he have done? I think there are different ones. Did they do a needle one or an open biopsy?
I really hope you get some answers from your FS this week.
Big hug!!!!!
Kristine,
Thanks for your kind words!
DH had an open biopsy. They were only willing to do that as they only found a very small amount of sperm in the SA.