Why does my 2 yo play SO ROUGH with other children?

My DD is getting progressively worse when it comes to her temper tantrums and playing with other children. She pushes, pulls, screams and throws herself dramatically to the floor if a toy she wants another child has. She will sulk around with a sullen face if I tell her off. I have been told this is normal behaviour for a toddler, but is it really? Is it normal for a toddler to hurt other children who are playing nicely? It makes me sad and embarrassed, its to the point where I dread mothers group or going to a friends place, for fear that my DD will turn into the bully child. What can I do, I am seriously at my wits end with her angry behaviour??? HELP

I just wanted to say I feel your pain. I jsut posted in the plat sect about this same issue (as well as the way I am treated about it!!)

I knowi t is normal, but it makes you feel bad doesn't it??!!

Yes it does, it makes me look like a mum with an out of control undisciplined child & that I dont care. While the truth is of course I care 100% & I discipline her, but to an extent, how do you discipline a 2 yr old who doesnt speak much or who doesnt seem to understand why she is in trouble? Apart from that she is a very spirited child, she doesnt need me to dote on her, as she is so independent. Some people see this as a bad thing. I am at my wits end with it, I love her to bits but I sometimes wish she could be more like other children, how terrible does that sound :(

Temper tantrums is just normal to toddlers but you should show him that what he did is wrong like you let him face the wall for 30 minutes after he acted that wrong behavior. This is how I disciplined my 2 and half year old daughter when she acted the same and it really works.

30 minutes, she wouldnt even stand still for 30 seconds. I use the time out method but it seems like every 5 minutes she is in time out. Its beyond a joke now

how our kids act is often a mirror image of how we act, perhaps she is seeing you as being a bully for putting her in T/O regularly. so she sees when she is a=in a positon with others the way to get what she wants is to be aggressive..
perhaps looking at other ways of dealing with her tantrums at home will help her to deal with situations out of the house..

I know my children often mirror my less desirable personality traits

I dont really have any advice but what Doudou said makes sense. Personally I wouldn't be standing her facing a wall for 30 min, thats a really long time. Does distraction work?

Good point, I am just wondering how else I can teach her that this behaviour is wrong, without smacking etc. Time out seemed to be the best option, I over eggagerate as I dont use it often come to think of it. I really only see this rough behaviour when she is around other children. I wonder if its something she has learnt through childcare. Sorry just grasping at anything here.

Oz - No me either, 30 mins is way too long. Supernanny says 2 mins for a 2 yr old. Distraction works but I am forever distracting!!!

I'm pretty sure even the most tough baby trainers only suggest a minute per year in age in time out.

I did a Triple P positive parenting course which suggested a minute per age as well.

MadsMum I find it completely normal for them to go through these phases. I generally ignore bad behaviour unless its hurting someone else, and then praise and praise when they play well with other kids, even to a point where they get a reward and heaps of attention when they do play well and happily. If they do hurt another child, I get down to their level and say "Ouch! It hurts when you xxx, you wouldn't like it if someone xxx you would you? You need to say sorry right now!" and then I move to another play thing and involve them in something else. It is HARD work, but it is effective and pays off in the long term, teaching them how to play is very important.

30 mins? is that a joke? i couldn't make my dh stand quiet against a wall for 30 mins, let alone a 2 yo!

hugs H xoxo

30 minutes is comepletely ridiculous and really wouldn't work. You would end up with a frightened and understimulated child.

With the roughness, you can fight like with like, but maybe not the way you imagine. Get her dad to have some more rough play with her (you can do it too) where you rumble, tickle, turn upside down etc. This will help her to learn about the limits associated with being rough, and when it's time to stop.

When she's upset about something, label her feelings for her, let her know that it's OK to feel that way, and give her some alternatives for her behaviour, e.g. "I can see that you're feeling sad/angry. When I feel sad/angry, sometimes I stamp my feet/squash some playdough/kick a ball/whatever"

When she wants something from another child, calmly tell her "X is playing with that right now. Maybe when she's finished you'll be able to have a turn." The distract.

Distraction is a great technique, especially if she's emotional. Be blatant if you have to "Hey, where did that dog come from?" and then when she looks, a quick "Oh, no, it's gone now." Not for overuse!

If she does hurt someone, get her to focus on the consequences of her action, e.g. "It hurts Jackson when you hit. That has made him very sad. I'd like you to sit here with him until he feels OK" If she is being rough but not hurting, say "Just touch gently. Show me gentle touching." Physically assist her to gently stroke the other child's arm gently so that she understands the term.
I personally don't like "sorry" at 2. They don't get it, and it leads them to think that sorry makes it OK, so will whack, say sorry instantly, run away, only to whack again later. If they are removed from play, and follow up on the consequences of the other child, it also helps to develop empathy and an understanding of emotions.

If you have mroe examples of behaviour, I can give more example responses.

Good luck!

Hi MM - perhaps you could do some role playing with dh and M. Play with toys and act out what to do when someone has a toy that you want - in this case your dh.
Have you spoken to her teachers at Daycare? Does she do the same thing there? I would say that she would definitely witness that kind of behaviour there.
This Mummy job definitely keeps us busy hey :)

30 minutes facing a wall is verging on child abuse! I wouldn't even do that to a child at primary school.

I too am the mother of "that child" (you know the one always hitting etc) I have actually modified DS's diet as per the list of additives and preservatives NOT to eat on the Failsafe website and have found that it made an enormous difference. I sure it won't work for everyone but its amazing the difference it has made to Riley so maybe give it a go.

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30 minutes facing a wall is verging on child abuse! I wouldn't even do that to a child at primary school.

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hmm i was thinking the same thing.

MM- i could have written your post word for word. Lu is always the roughest, she snatches toys, says "no, don't! Go away" If she wants it and another kid has it. I too get really embarrassed. I try distraction, i try explaining, i try timeout, i try everything. It has really been getting me down lately, i felt like it was a reflection on my parenting. But the truth is, i have come to realise, that she is a very strong willed, independent, spirited if you like, almost 2 year old. Just this week i have come to terms with it a little more and have gone more for the avoid approach. Not avoid the situation, but try and foresee an incident approaching and and avoid it. Then lots of praise when she is okaying well and sharing.

I have also told her that if she doesn't play nicely we'll have to go home. (i am still to decided if this a good tactic or not, happy to take constructive criticism from you wise ladies. ;) )I don't know about M, but Lu definitely understands this. And i followed through the other day and took her home when she kept taking all the toys off the kids and pushing. She has been a lot better the last couple of days, not sure if it a co-incidence, or if this phase is passing.

I don't have any answers, except to tell you that you're not alone, and i do think for some toddlers it is a normal phase. Let just hope it doesn't last too long, it's wearing me down.

My DS1 is the same. Sometimes I just feel like the most useless mum in the world. It actually makes me happy when other children throw tantrums in public... it makes me feel like I am not alone. ;)
Try not to get mad if she hasn't actually hurt anyone, simply encourage more gentle play. Don't threaten her with anything you don't intend to follow through with... if you say you will take her home then you need to take her home when it happens again. Definietly lots of praise when she plays nicely!
I have found that it doesn't work if I suggest that DS plays with something, like 'why don't you play with the trains instead?'. I have to actually shove something I know he likes in his face and get him playing with it.
Snugglybean's advice was really good. I am still not sure whether DS really understands what sorry means, I found it much more helpful to sit them down with the child they have hurt and make sure they are ok. Try to make it very clear what it was that they did wrong and why without yelling or smacking. They understand much better if they can see how upset the other child is rather than just being punished.

Falguni - the only thing with threatening to leave is that it can always backfire on you ;) I've used it before and had to leave when I didn't want too because I had threatened M with it. Because you always have to follow through with one of those threats.

You could have something that you use when out. Like piece of fabric they have to sit on for a minute or so in order to take them away from the activity. Generally at 2 years of age they can't remember enough to use stickers for good behaviour, or something like that but you can remember to reward them everytime they are quiet and playing nicely how wonderful they are.

Sometimes you do have to play the leaving card... because otherwise your whole time will be a fight. Whatever you can handle as a mummy on that day.

I too think that kids learn so much from childcare. Some of it is really good (e.g. my DD has learned counting - I didn't think to count with her until she started doing it at home! Now it is one of her favourite 'games' to do in the car.) They learn weird stuff (e.g. DD started growling one day. Apparently she trails after the older boys at CC and they play dinosaurs. She picked up on the 'growl-and-lunge' manouvre and does it at home! Weird.) Plus they learn some negative stuff too (e.g. DD occasionally pushes me and tells me to "move away". I never say this to her, neither does DH, so it has to have been another kid.)
Now, having said that, I think some kids are just more spirited and they know what they want and are less shy. It is embarrassing for us parents because we understand social customs. Kids don't.
I'll bet if you take a look around from week to week there wont be one kid there who doesn't act in an antisocial manner at some point (or the entire time). It's how they learn, and we need to try not to expect too much of them. That's not to say that we don't instruct them of the correct way to behave, but please understand its not necessarily a reflection of you, but just a stage in a kid's development. Robin Barker reckons its unrealistic to expect toddlers to play together nicely for any lengthy period of time. With playgroups and such, I wonder if we sometimes put too much pressure on our little ones to be sociable for a long period of time.
Sorry, I know I've waffled! But I really just wanted to reassure you that, yes, antisocial behaviour in a toddler is TOTALLY normal. It is something I have struggled with for the last year. Our struggle at this point in time is more about how she behaves for me than how she behaves around other kids...

Have you tried getting down and showing your child how to play nicely? (I know it sounds obvious but it isn't always) It's something I would often do with the kids that I could see were struggling with shared play (not just my own). It is hard as a toddler who doesn't yet understand or is very reactive when expressing emotion. However it is equally hard for those children around them(as you know and is probably why you are at your wits end). Try role play. Share with teddies, dolls be nice to teddies/dolls etc It really does help. At this age imitation is the best way of teaching when time out and "No" don't work (or even along side). And it doesn't reflect badly on you as a mother so please don't think that. Every child learns differently and responds differently, just because a child lashes out doesn't mean they are bad or should be punished in most cases they are often the children who need more nurturing as thats their way of showing they aren't coping in social situations as well as others are. And thats not to say that your child has a problem either, just that why help a child that obviously doesn't need it, a child that isn't understanding their own emotions or how to express them needs help. As do we all at one point or another. I went through this with my DS and sometimes still do. We've recently started hitting a pillow or throwing a pillow instead of throwing toys (as he would often go to his room and trash it when he got upset or didn't get his way) the pillow he can't hurt himself or his toys he can. And after he has calmed down he comes and sits with me and we talk through (he's 3 so easier to communicate with obviously) how he feels and why and what we can do to help him and help me. This gives him an outlet that is safe whilst he learns to express his emotions, and eventually hitting the pillow will be a thing of the past because he will have learnt how to express what he needs to with words.