im pulling my hair out

MY 4 1/2 yr old is getting more defiant and more challenging the older he is getting it seems...
He chucks 60mins screaming hyperventilating wobblies here at home and up to 2 hours with his dad (he told me)
He thru a 30 min screaming tantrum over a car i took off him as he was being mean to his 2 y brother.....

His attention spam is so quick it is frightening ....and it seems like he does things to annoy me (as im the authority figure iykwim)
He can be a bully to his little brother to the extreme....
and the demanding nature is a nightnare ....

His naughtiness has spilled over into kinder/daycare at times

I dont know what to do next what would you all do take him to the dr and get a referal to whom ever ie psych or pead.?

Please im at my witts end and im not enjoying him atm which isnt nice to sy let alone feel...as he can be such a delightful child.. And before anyone says anything no i dont tell him he isnt likes just the opposite that i love him dearly i can see and hear him and im proud of his good behaviour but the bad needs to stop.

Me too. My 5 year old is similar. He is a really nice kid...sometimes. Other times he is mean as hell to his 3 year old sister. He picks on her really badly. Some afternoons about 80% of what he says is something horrible to her. He is also a big fan of the extended hour long tantrum. The bullying is obviously attention seeking because he knows it will get a reaction. I can't ignore it if he is making his sister cry.

I don't have any advice because I don't know what to do either. We have been down the psych route and it didn't help us at all.

Omg I could far written this post about my 4 yr old daughter (dd2 is 2 also).
I'm finding that being really tough at the moment is the only thing to work. I've taken away toys, tv time, books, not allowed to go places she likes etc.
I'm not sure what else to suggest. Hope it passes for you soon.

Thanks for the replies girls ...
i feel horrible sometimes... i feel like all im doing is growling and saying 'can you please stop that behaviour and be nice' over and over again.
The weekends i have all my children i dread as it is 48 hours of constant demand for mums attention....i love daycare and when i do nightduty as i get a break and i love 50:50 as i need it as i couldnt cope 12 days with this constant i would go mad ...
I was a single mum to my 12 yr old and i thought he was demanding at 4 ...nothing like this child and even my 2 yr olds placid as they come .
The 4 yr old was a challenging baby from the day he was born but for crying out loud enough already please!!!

we bought the book dvd "the kazdin method" for parenting the defiant child and its helping us a lot, with all of them. its gentle parenting focusing on good behaviour patterns. its research based so not just some "gurus" ideas;)

Why is there a huge influx of kids do this defiant crap though ? MIne woke up at 1am today and cracked the poos yet again as i told him it was time for his bed(he was in mine and i always transfer him not a new thing at all but you thought it was from the tantrum that lasted 15 mins ...there was yelling screaming and tears and i lost it put him on the couch and i went to bed and shut the door (umm hello the behaviour is totally uncalled for and so damn disuptive for the entire house.... im totally over this behaviour . This morning it is 'mum im hungry i want breakfast now ...mum mum mum mum mum .....' i didnt raise him to speak to me or anyone like that so at the moment im feeling GREAT not ..... I know i know he is a child but holly **** it is a long long day when the wake up at 1am and then at 6am and then at 7am and demand demand demand !!!! grrrrrr

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we bought the book dvd "the kazdin method" for parenting the defiant child and its helping us a lot, with all of them. its gentle parenting focusing on good behaviour patterns. its research based so not just some "gurus" ideas;)

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Thanks i have googled it and had a quick read and yep that will go on my santa list for me :)

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we bought the book dvd "the kazdin method" for parenting the defiant child and its helping us a lot, with all of them. its gentle parenting focusing on good behaviour patterns. its research based so not just some "gurus" ideas;)

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Just bought the book online :) thanks for the tip

hope it helps :) we have had good results- most days. master 4 pretends he doesn't care when his stars get low so I give him 'practice' to boost them. I do 3 practice = 1 star.
we also do double star activities ;) if we really need then to be good.

let me know how you go with it

well i have to get the book first :) however today he has been just constantly having this 'weird' behaviour i cant pin point it but it isnt normal .... its like xxxx you mum im going to annoy my brother im going to not do what you ask on purpose, and he actually gave me the bird ....so he was marched to the toilet for a wee and staright into the room for a sleep and was told dont come out until you can behave and after a asleep..
He slept for 1 hour ....
Now he was on tramp for 5 min playing with his mototbike for 5 mins would love to be next to me everyminute but demand attention and i have even been on the tramp with both of them for ages twice.... so it isnt lack of attention from me NO WAY!

and i admit i lose my cool as it is only me no one else and it is very very frustrating..... the constant demand is draining .....

im not joking it has been exactly 5 mins on each thing he has honed (sp?) on (except tv which isnt on) .... he annoys his brother and teases him then when the 2 yr goes him for the toy or whatever it is muuuummmm and tears the works from the 4 yr old .. im watching everything.
Now it reads like normal stuff but there is a weirdness that i just cant pin point..... The 2 yr old has more concentration on things that the 4 1/2 yr old.... another toy played with and that was as long as i have typed this .....i have just suggested a huge drink and abnother big bounce on the tramp....

a trying day here too. :hug:

im on my 2nd wine :) and he loves the bath which is a godsend

Sounds like hard work!
I'd look into diet and screen time, too.

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Sounds like hard work!
I'd look into diet and screen time, too.

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TV time you mean ? he hardly gets much of that as it is

Any screen time, yeah. It makes some kids pretty mental.

true but he chucked a huge 12 hours crying stint (with eating pooing and weeing) at 8 months ... i rang the help line as this bub would not settle at all even when drinking he was unsettled....and he wasnt watching tv/laptop then .....