How Would This Go Down? (teenagers and driving) *may distress*

We've moved to a country town and something I have noticed is the higher percentage of P-plater drivers per capita of the local population compared to the city. It's not uncommon for kids as young as 16 to drive the country roads alone despite being legally required to have a fully licensed driver with them at all times. A 16 yo girl had an accident recently where she failed to take a corner... she went off the road and hit a tree... lucky to survive. Another teen driver recently hit a pedestrian about a block away from where we live... the pedestrian survived because it was a 40 school zone and the driver had probably slowed down a bit but generally the young ones tend to fang around the streets with music pumping as if they own the roads :(

Anyhow as i was watching a car full of monkeys... erm... teen boys.... scream off into the distance an image flashed into my head (a bit like a TV TAC announcement):

Picture the above scenario... a car full of teen boys driving recklessly... music pumping... rubber burning... eyes on everything except the road. Then smash! An accident... bodies flung, driver slumped over the steering wheel blood running down his face... dead.

Then the TV screen splits so that an image of the drivers parents is shown. They look a bit wistful as they stand together and they say "Oh well, at least he died doing what he loved".

How would this go down as a message to the teenageers that choose to drive recklessly? Obviously the other TAC messages aren't getting through. Maybe it's time we stopped trying to scare the desensitized teens of today? The heart wrenching tears of distraught relatives don't seem to be saying anything to them. So maybe we need to remind them that at the end of the day the boundary pushing on the roads is going to ultimately hurt THEM and that no one is going to save them from a tragic end but themselves?

I think the shock-and-awe tactic needs to be used. It seems to be okay to see gruesome footage for quit ads, but not for TAC. I think there is a campaign of some sort where you can suggest to TAC what their next ad should be to help reduce the road toll.

I honestly don't know how to get it through - nothing seems to work. No matter what they see or hear, they still believe it won't happen to them. Here in SA there have been two cases of teenagers dying in car accidents due to their reckless driving. At their funerals, and at memorials at their crash sites, their friends have been "paying tribute" to them by doing burn outs and driving recklessly.

If the death of a friend won't stop them, I don't know what will

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I have no idea what the solution to that would be. I think that more needs to be done to make it seem 'real' for the teens - by that I mean the accident survivors who travel around the schools and tell them how hard life has been since they became a paraplegic/amputee etc. You're right, they are so desensitized to what they see on TV, that it doesn't seem real to them so that's why I think taking a personal, real life approach would work. I know there have been times where they have shown kids what a real wrecked vehicle looks like and even SES demo's of cutting people (dummys) out of cars. What worked for me years before I had my license was in yr10 and we went to Sydney for an excursion and part of it was going to the Surry Hills police station and we were shown actual crime scene photos of the Grafton Bus crash, Granville Train crash and other assorted vehicular crime scenes and seeing those real people with limbs missing, skulls broken really rammed it home for me.

It's something I'm thinking more about lately as my 16yo brother recently got his L's so we've been ramming home the need to drive responsibly etc to him.

I totally agree with the exposure to real accidents like you described Trillian. My mother worked at the base hospital here when i was younger and used to come home quite regularly upset by the weekends carnage on the roads... maybe that affected my attitude to driving... not blaming her BTW.

My 16yo DD witnessed a fatal accident on the day she got her L's. Driving home from the license office in Melbourne they were caught up in traffic and had no option but to drive slowly past a truck with a teenaged boy lying under it. DD said she didn't really want to look but "had" to. I think that has affected her. Some might say 'what a shame she had to see that'... i say "well that's the reality of driving" and i wish more teens (especially boys) got to experience that degree of reality.

Even real life exposure to the carnage of an accident still does not stop all of them. I know of one incident where some kids were caught speeding about the same time as a horrific accident involving the same age group. The country cops took them to the accident to show them what speed does, sadly an hour later the same cops caught them speeding again :(

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Even real life exposure to the carnage of an accident still does not stop all of them. I know of one incident where some kids were caught speeding about the same time as a horrific accident involving the same age group. The country cops took them to the accident to show them what speed does, sadly an hour later the same cops caught them speeding again :(

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There will always be some groups that no matter what you do, you will never be able to get them to change the way they think or act and it is those groups that will have to learn the hard way unfortunately.

Its just really, really scary.
A group of 3 boys were killed in a single car accident near my Aunt's house recently, they were speeding and wrapped teh car around a telephone pole.
To "honour" the memory of their friends, there mates went to the scned of the accident...to do doughnuts and burnouts :wall:
I dont know how to get inside their heads. Im dreading having 2 teenage boys in the house.

I seriously believe that some personality types should be excluded from driving. Recklessness is symptomatic of depression and other mental health conditions. I seriously think that driving is a priviledge and not a right and that if somebody has a mental impairment to safe driving then their license should be revoked. Police should have the right to determine who in society might be suffering from the types of mental illness that is dangerous to other drivers (speeding off after witnessing the results of a fatal accident for example)... they then should demand a psychiatric report and if that confirms a negative result then exclusions should apply for a set period until re-testing. Support evidence from doctors/teachers should also form part of the report so lying under interview can't be attempted. I'm not saying all people suffering from depression should be excluded... only repeat offenders that come under the attention of police. Yet another reason why mental health issues NEED to be taken more seriously by the government in terms of funding!

I cringe saying this - to some there is something glorious about the risk, something that is tempting about dying that way. I am not sure anything much can be done to stop those of that mind set. The big media articles, the huge funerals and today the burn outs, facebook pages etc. It all just glorifies the death and in some sick way, some teenagers are drawn to that glory.

When I was in yr12 the school put on a docudrama. This was a mock up of a fatal accident. It started with us all sitting in the auditorium with a talk about something and then a loud SMASH. We were taken out side and there was the accident. It was so real. They had used our classmates/friends in the accident. They were covered in blood and all sorts. One was even put in a body bag zipped up and put in a herse.
This put me off getting my license till I was 20.
I think more schools should do something like this. I'm sure it wouldnt have the same effect on everyone but I was a real eye opener.

I've since then had to say goodbye to a few of these people.

I get what you are trying to say Bath, but a lot of that 'recklessess' is a developmental issue and completely beyond their control in many cases. It is something they genuinely have to grow out of it. And then there are the special people ;) who think they are Peter Brock and that they are the best driver in the world :rolleyes: I know quite a few people who drove like a bat out of hell and were reckless as teens, but then they grew up, grew out of that type of behaviour and are now the most careful drivers you'd ever meet kwim? Oh and the special people usually stay special LOL. Maybe the key is to raise the age before they can get their license in the first place? They have to stay at school for longer now, so it is only a small amount that leave early for apprenticeships that would actually need a license. So most teens are well over 18 before they leave home so they don't really need a license before that point.

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I think the shock-and-awe tactic needs to be used. It seems to be okay to see gruesome footage for quit ads, but not for TAC.

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yeh that's so true, you see so many of those gross ads for cigarettes, but hardly any on speeding and drink driving.....i think it's scary how teenagers these days just have no idea of consequence, they're so la-di-da when it comes to driving. we live rural as well, and i have to say im scared to share the roads with some of the idiots around here. nothing seems to be getting through, it's ridiculous.

Take them to a morgue and show them a messed up body of a 17yr old who died being stupid in a car? :dunno:

I don't doubt that Astrid! And the red neck in me wants to reply; "Well send them off to bloody war so they can die in true glory!" Put the same monkeys in the passenger seat of their loved ones, say sweet old Nana, and suggest she say 'Oh... I think that it might be better to die in a blaze of glory than of dimentia... let's go hoon sonny!" I'd love to see their face as she floors the pedal. If only they could gain a bit of perspective.

That reminds me of another thread i wanted to start... about little old ladies and how they are changing...

ETA: missed your last post Trillian... i'm sure you're right... they lack the self awareness as it's developmental. I totally agree with raising the age of driving licenses... the human brain isn't fully developed in terms of risk assessment until the early 20's. Delay fully licenced driving until then.

Another thought. I was someone who got their licence later (early 20's) and it was hard. I no longer had the ****iness of a teenager, which really I needed to be able to hop into a car and not cry. To me I still suffer from getting mine later, I am missing that extra bit of confidence that I need now in driving everyday, if anything it probably makes me a bit dangerous on the road, as I don't have the guts to overtake when it is safe to do so etc. So to an extant, I believe it is a good thing to use that confidence to help teenagers learn to drive. As for when they should get their licence, I am not so sure.

Am yep, i get that point too Astrid... as you know I don't have my full license yet due to similar cautiousness. However when you are limited to doing 80km (as you are in NSW when you are on your L's) you're also a bit of a road hazard when everyone else is doing 105 on these country roads. it also basically means i can't drive onto a freeway or overtake. Silly law. Should be the same as Victoria; Learners should be able to drive at the sign-posted speed so they can fit in with everyone else.

Oh, that stupid 80 rule. Had that in Tassie when I got my P's. Totally dangerous. I certainly believe one of the most dangerous habits on the road is everyone doing their own speed, as opposed to the speed limit (if it is safe to do so of course). Someone doing 80 or 90 in a 100 zone when there is no need to (good weather, good road, good car etc), just frustrates other drivers. I find P platers are the worst for being impatient on the roads down here and they take big risks to get around other cars.

Bath, I reckon you've made a good point with the Nana. So many of these drivers are thinking just about themselves - oh it won't happen to me, and if I ding my car it's my fault and I'll fix it. They need to think about the people they're sharing the road with, so many innocent people who's lives they're endangering by choosing to drive stupidly.

My DH was a hoon in high school. Until one day a man came in to talk about how he lost his 10 year old daughter - she was a passenger in a car doing all the right things, but they were slammed into by someone speeding through a give way sign (this was all in the country, we grew up in small towns).

That's what hit it home for DH, that by driving recklessly he's endangering other people. It's worse for him now, thinking that he knows young people who drive like this, and the thought that our dd and I could be in their path one day - it doesn't bare thinking about.

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I have no idea what the solution to that would be. I think that more needs to be done to make it seem 'real' for the teens - by that I mean the accident survivors who travel around the schools and tell them how hard life has been since they became a paraplegic/amputee etc. You're right, they are so desensitized to what they see on TV, that it doesn't seem real to them so that's why I think taking a personal, real life approach would work. I know there have been times where they have shown kids what a real wrecked vehicle looks like and even SES demo's of cutting people (dummys) out of cars. What worked for me years before I had my license was in yr10 and we went to Sydney for an excursion and part of it was going to the Surry Hills police station and we were shown actual crime scene photos of the Grafton Bus crash, Granville Train crash and other assorted vehicular crime scenes and seeing those real people with limbs missing, skulls broken really rammed it home for me.

It's something I'm thinking more about lately as my 16yo brother recently got his L's so we've been ramming home the need to drive responsibly etc to him.

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this demo idea is one that Mum wishes would happen more often. she works for police and reckons that they should be shown the accident photos...

funnily enough i reckon the the approach of possibly going to jail for killing someone etc in a car accident would be more frightening than death itself ITMS. i saw on Oprah (yeah i love her lol) an episode where a boy killed a pedestrian and it was powerful stuff because he had to face the consequences. i know that it shut up the hoons that she had on the stage!

I honestly just dont think some teenagers get road safety. My BIL just got his P's and he failed 5 times before passing. My BIL and DP were ALWAYS blaming the tester for him failing. I had to keep reminding the both of them that the tester and can only fail on BIL's actions, he wasnt be nasty or harsh, the guy has a ticker box check list, and BIL kept failing basic things. On one occassion he actually stopped on train tracks waiting for traffic to clear. BIL was laughing when he was telling us how mad the tester got at him, like the tester should have taken a chill pill. seriously and now this kid is on the road.

In some cases I blame the parents. My inlaws were 100% behind BIL when he blamed the tester, rather then explaining he needs to pull his socks up, they went along with the conspiracy theory, it just enable that ego boast BIL was already on. I had my learners the day I was eligible but my parents always instilled it wasnt a right and they would take it away at any time if I acted irresponsibily.

I say harsher penalities, espec more jail time for those drivers that hurt or kill people with their car, start looking at cars in the same light as guns. A car, like a gun, by itself cant hurt anyone, its the driver that does. I feel like people, teenagers/drink drivers/hoons etc have had enough warnings, now its time to start penalising properly.

Hey Bath, having been a traffic educator in SA - I've got a few studies (and feedback) that state shock tactics don't always work. Teenagers / young adults (actually most drivers I think as no one wakes up in the morning thinking "hmm, I might have a car crash today" IYKWIM?), have the thoughts that they won't crash (regardless if they cause it or another road user does).

A lot of people do bag P platers - but I find I have trouble with fully licensed drivers more so - unfortunately for the P platers (and in SA, its only the 'P1s' that even have to display a P plate) they are easily identified. And having done country policing, locals recognise the sound / look of the local hoons and can sometimes assume who the driver was at any particular time. I find the older drivers bag the younger ones, taxi drivers blame the bus drivers, cyclists blame the pedestrians etc lol.

That being said, would it be worthwhile to speak to local Police, voice your concerns and see if, with the assistance of the other emergency services, to put on a mock crash in your local district? It may take awhile to orchastrate - but we've held many in SA with much success. Just an idea anyways.

i agree with Trillian, i think its a matter of these hoons growing out of it. ..or raising the age to hold a license. there are always going to be fatalities on the roads due to everyone having a different way of driving. these young people that do the crazy hoon driving might think its completely normal to drive like this. until they have a few near misses or even minor accidents. unfortunately some never get to learn from their mistakes..:(
The company i work for has compulsory safe driving courses that we must do every 2 yrs. its a total reality check. especially when they show you the real life accident scenes etc.

I've been thinking about this a bit since I posted.

Last night DH was training with our local fire brigade and they nearly got taken out by a hoon. He was doing burn outs past them, and almost side swiped a fellow member, leaving him very upset and shaken. They got the rego, and Dh called the police. But because they couldn't "see" who was driving, because it was dark, the police told them they couldn't do anything about it. They went to the house where the car was registered, where the person denied the car was being driven, even though the bonnet was still hot. The police returned to the group training to report back.

Tougher laws are needed. No tolerance is needed. I feel the same way about people who flash their high beams to warn others of a speed camera. I often wonder if a speeding driver is flashed, they slow down, and then go on to cause an accident where someone is seriously injured or killed. Is it worth flashing them to avoid a ticket? Because you're actually flashing to work against saving lives. If they keep getting booked for speeding, then they will either learn their lesson, or lose their licence. Either way, the roads will be safer.

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I've been thinking about this a bit since I posted.

Last night DH was training with our local fire brigade and they nearly got taken out by a hoon. He was doing burn outs past them, and almost side swiped a fellow member, leaving him very upset and shaken. They got the rego, and Dh called the police. But because they couldn't "see" who was driving, because it was dark, the police told them they couldn't do anything about it. They went to the house where the car was registered, where the person denied the car was being driven, even though the bonnet was still hot. The police returned to the group training to report back.

Tougher laws are needed. No tolerance is needed. I feel the same way about people who flash their high beams to warn others of a speed camera. I often wonder if a speeding driver is flashed, they slow down, and then go on to cause an accident where someone is seriously injured or killed. Is it worth flashing them to avoid a ticket? Because you're actually flashing to work against saving lives. If they keep getting booked for speeding, then they will either learn their lesson, or lose their licence. Either way, the roads will be safer.

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Bit off topic, but I've wondered about that too. And the fact that they advertise where the fixed cameras will be - so people either slow down or avoid that area, and then go on to speed elsewhere knowing they won't get caught.

My Dad spent over about 15 years in the Fire Brigade, and they used to do a lot of demonstrations like Leesa mentioned. I was involved in one at school, where I got all bloodied up and had to pretend I had a broken leg from a car accident. I was really sad that the other kids in my year level paid zero attention to the fact that this was supposed to be a horrific accident (where we had one person "dead") and were more interested in how they made my leg look broken :shakehead:

Speed cameras are more about revenue raising than saving lives so I think it's fair to flash oncoming drivers.
Australia's speed laws are crazy but then again Australian drivers seem to be incapable of driving with the same skills as nations with much higher limits (keep left people, it's not rocket science) so maybe they deserve highway speed limits designed for people driving cars from the 40's.

Driver training seems to be focused on passing the test not learning defensive driving skills. I think that subsidising defensive driving course for young drivers might be a better way to spend money than campaigns that don't seem to work. Let's face it, most teenagers are pretty cynical about the messages that TV delivers.

i havent read all the previous posts but it seems we are on to the topic of speeding. i have driven the roads of qld,vic and nsw. NSW is by FAR the most patrolled state. we went on a road trip last year. and as soon as we crossed the border from qld down to nsw, highway speed cameras and undercover patrol cars were everywhere. the closer we got to sydney, i noticed how well behaved the motorists were. no one was speeding on the highway. it was such a nice drive not having to wrestle with other drivers!!
so i think a police presence is very important.