Why I leave my baby to cry...

I was attracted to bellybelly as a parenting site that reflected my natural views on childbirth and child rearing. I'm a pro-breastfeeding, pro-natural birth, baby wearing, cloth nappying SAHM. But I often read posts that are very negative about self-settling, leaving your baby to cry to sleep, babies can't learn to self setle etc. And for a long time I've wanted to share MY EXPERIENCE and why I think that leaving my baby to cry to sleep IS gentle parenting. So here goes:

DS1 would cry for 35 minutes before every nap from about 2 weeks to 6 weeks of age. I rocked, I bounced, I walked, I patted in the cot, I sung, I wrapped, I wore him all day, I put white noise on and always he would cry while looking absolutely tired. He would then finally sleep for 45 minutes. At 6 weeks of age, my patience was wearing thin. I was anxious, on edge, I wouldn't go out because I'd have to leave the room to deal with the 35 minutes of crying. A friend of mine said: have you tried just putting him in his bassinette and closing the door? My first reaction was "oh no, babies this young need to be patted to sleep" - like a good gentle parenting mother. But I thought, I need to give this a go, I need to stay sane and my baby needs to sleep.

Eventually, one day my husband was home and we decided to give it a go. I put the timer on and decided to go in after 10 minutes. My husband cuddled me while we waited. He cried for 8 minutes and then slept for 45 minutes. We repeated it for the next nap and he cried for 5 minutes. What mattered to me was that 5 minutes of crying was much preferable to 35 minutes of crying - for both him and me. I think he was too stimulated by being held by me and needed to solace and darkness to settle. From then one, we continued to put our son to sleep the way which pleased him. We followed his cues and responded to his needs and for us this meant letting him cry. Our limit was 5 minutes, but he was often asleep after only 1 or 2 minutes of crying.

When DS2 arrived, we decided to again follow his cues. And he also prefers to be left alone while settling to sleep - he settles very quickly often without any crying at all. In contrast if I try to settle him with patting and cuddles, the poor mite just cries until he is beside himself for about 30 minutes.

So sometimes, it is okay to leave your baby to cry, I believe. Sometimes, you need someone from another point of view to get you to try something different, if what you are doing isn't working for you.

When I see articles about the dangers of control crying, I always read them feeling guilty. But then I remember that I'm just responding to my babies needs in the way the suits them best with love - and isn't that what gentle parenting is all about.

Good stuff! Whole heartedly agree.

We only had to let DD1 CIO for one night (well, not the whole night, just patches of it) and she has self settled without crying ever since.

Totally. I think you need to do what works for your baby.

If it's working for you then that's great :) A well rested family is always a good thing.

Personally, I'm not a fan of CIO I could not hack it and I don't think I'd have the perseverance for it. We have never CIO with DD, she is similar to your DS in the way that she sometimes wants her own space to fall asleep. I didn't realise until DD was about 2 months old that I was leaving it too late, not picking up on those early tired signs and instead trying to put her to sleep at the yawning, eye rubbing, grizzling stage. Now, if she doesn't want to feed to sleep or be rocked/bounced/walked to sleep, I'll pop her in bed (we cosleep) with her blankie and dummy and lie next to her while she dozes off. Sometimes I'll stroke her cheek or sing to her. I really didn't realise before becoming a parent how contentious an issue baby sleep was. I think there is way too much pressure on parents to have a socially acceptably 'good' sleeper, when really, babies learn at their own pace, and respond in different ways, not how a book or your friend or the girls at mothers group say they should. I guess what works for one baby may not work for another. I know if I left DD to cry she would be beside herself because that is not what works for her. It sounds like your DS's just wanted some alone time (how funny are babies!?) and that it totally works for everyone involved. Sleep time shouldn't be a stressful time and you've found a way to get around that that works for your family, as you said, in the moat loving and gentle way possible.

I'm glad you've found something that works for you.

I think everyone just muddles along and does a real mixture of things until they find something that works. We all follow part instinct and part advice and of course the cues from our baby.

What you are describing doesn't sound like the CIO that many books discuss, which involves leaving your baby for increasing periods of time, up to an hour by a certain age, and not 'giving in'. Many babies vomit from crying, or loose trust in their parent and sob themselves to sleep.

You listened to your baby and followed your instinct. I think that is different from people telling parents to just leave their babies to sort themselves out by going out of ear shot of the child.

I don't like labels as a general rule, but I can see how what you describe is gentle parenting for your babies...as a general rule though, I think gentle parenting is listening to a baby's cues, so I have an issue with e mainstream version of CIO being assigned a GP label.

But that's all just semantics.

You do what works for your family. Good for you. Tick the "good parent" box. You also have found a method that works for you is accepted by mainstream society - fantastic. Slight amount of jealousy from me.

FWIW, my son will cry for hours and hours and not sleep. I can leave him, make and drink a coffee, and he's awake, screaming and furious. CIO didn't work here. It isn't OK for me to leave my baby to CIO - but clearly it was OK for you to leave yours.

If it works for you and your baby then that is great and you don't need to feel bad etc. I have tried EVERYTHING! including leaving my DD to cry but it didn't work, just made her worse, she was able to scream for 6-8 hours at times when put to bed and the next night no better, then worse, then worse. Th fact that she had reflux didn't help either and then when she would cry this would make the reflux worse too.

I think every family has to work out what is best for them and their bubs and do what they feel is right, without judgement.

I did CIO with all my children. My first two because that's what the books said to do, and my twins because after a year of trying the gentle way none of us were getting any sleep. And for the same reasons you describe it worked for us. So on paper I don't advocate leaving a child to cry but in practice I believe each mother will find her own way to helping her child settle. And sometimes that is 2 minutes in a darkened room.

Fwiw like another poster, I don't really see leaving a child in their room in bed for 1-5 minutes to be the CIO method :dunno:

Hopefully i can get this across the way i want without confusing myself or anyone.

With DS1 after the first few months of me rocking him to sleep it got to the point where every time i put him down he'd wake up. So i was talking to a cousin and she said he could now be old enough to be put in bed awake and have the chance to settle himself. This took some time and practice but we got there, yes it involved crying but i never did anything of what i considered to be CIO or CC. Once this was sorted DS1 just had to have the slightest whinge and i knew he was ready for bed, i'd put him in his cot, wrap him up and walk out and you wouldn't hear a peep from him. He was such a happy little sleeper and so content.

Then one day a few years ago i tried to help a lady in a post about getting her baby to sleep (or something along those lines). I was still a bit of a beginner to the forum. So i tried to offer what i felt was some caring advice to help this parent (it was in Gentle Parenting which i was not yet used to taking note of),the advice was along the lines of patting and shsssing and helping her little one to fall asleep. I actually got a not so nice post by someone other than the original poster in return. I was devistated that my advice had been taken to mean CC as it definatley was not what i considered myself to be doing when helping my son.

Anyway.... DS2 came long and i did take a different approach with him and it had a lot to do with what i'd read on here. I think my confidence in what i was doing took a bit of a dive from that post even though i had the happiest little sleeper and such a content little man. DS2 like you describe though was not one to rock to sleep, it was way too much stimulation for him. I can't remember what i did now (it's all such a blur) but he slept well and from about 15 months slept through as we'd weaned from breastfeeding. DS1 slept through way before that but that's ok.

Then DD came along and she was nothing like either of the boys. We had silent reflux to contend with so it didn't make finding a pattern that worked for us very easy, that and being #3 and trying to fit sleeps in amoungst daily activities. But i think with her i was even more affraid to let her cry and she cried plenty because of the relux. But i have often wondered to myself if i had of had the confidence to do things a little different with her (more similar to my boys) i might not be still getting up to a 12 month old every 2-3 hours during the night. If i try any settling these days without offering a feed i get so much screaming and she does not give up. So as to if it's just her or if i had tried to manipulate things a little earlier i don't know if we'd have it any different but i do feel her quality of sleep really isn't good enough and wonder if it's my fault.

When i saw the title of your post i imeadiately thought 'oh no' because of my own expereince but you explained yourself so well and i too do not beleive you were doing CIO just as i never felt i was. I applaude you for having the confidence to explain yourself in a post as you have. You sound like a wonderful mother and your children and extremely lucky.

Thank you :hug:

There was an article on this someone sent me recently, I will forward it through..

now where i thought it was, i cannot find it, but will keep looking for you..

Well, you know, it's one of those things. There's information and there's responding to your specific circumstances. Ultimately only parents can know what their kids need. The problem comes when we are not in touch with our kids and our instincts and try to override or ignore those things, following arbitrary advice from some book (or whatever).
So, although none of us are perfect and we will all get things wrong from time to time, if we are in touch with our kids' needs and our instincts, then we will most likely muddle through in a fairly satisfactory manner. Having said that, it does also tend to help to have good information as well when making decisions.

So I'm glad you've found a way you're happy with.

Great post, we did the same thing with our boys.

Great post, and quite brave really! I have three kids and they have all settled in different ways. DD1 would self settle and snooze anywhere. We never had to contemplate settling methods as she would just close her eyes when she was tired. She slept 12 hours from the night we brought her home. We co-slept for about three years. Our choice, we couldn't bear to be parted from her for a whole night!

DS would show tired signs and would settle into bed but would then have what we referred to as 'the last hurrah' where he would grizzle for 1-5 minutes before dozing off. He was never distressed, just making noise and would settle very quickly. He would not co-sleep and would only settle in his own space. He slept in a bassinet and then a cot.

DD2 does not self settle. She likes to be rocked to sleep, preferably with a boob in her mouth. I have left her to self settle and have tried a modified CC but she becomes truly distressed (as opposed to shouting a bit!). I have persevered with self settling beyond what I am comfortable with in the belief that she will 'learn' self settling. She doesn't, she just becomes more and more distressed. So, I cuddle her to sleep, usually with a boob, and she sleeps in our bed.

I think you are doing a great job by listening to your own babies cues and meeting your babies needs. Every baby is different and as mum's we have to meet their differing needs by using a variety of methods.

I think if we all just ditched the labels (CC or CIO) people could be more accepting of alot more. Because although there are a couple of EXTREME books out there promoting very firm guidelines; in 'my' experience most people use adaptive approaches that suit themselves and their children, and usually only after exhausting all other avenues.

The real problem is follow your own babies cues, do what works for them wouldn't make/sell a book, so elaborate methods and terms have evolved in my opinion to make money by selling books and methods. Parenting is one area I reckon where reading less is something I would advocate. My rule is babies are humans too, think how you would react to situations and use that to decide things to try, and it is trial and error and what works for a few weeks may then stop working, and something different is required. That is my other problem with books that prescribe methods, they don't treat babies like changing individuals - there is no one solution, but if books said "this may or may not work for you and may only work for a few weeks" they would not sell half as many.

I agree with what works works but I personally choose not to leave my DD's crying. To me it is a trust thing. Also, I think a routine trumps the need to use CC or CIO.

So well put and I totally agree. I find it hard to assert my views about this on BB because as soon as you DON'T mention feeding/cuddling to sleep or co-sleeping, a lot of people immediately think you advocate CIO. I also think that a few minutes of crying doesn't mean you advocate CIO. DS was the same as you describe, I could cuddle him all day every day and he'd still cry. He never slept anywhere near as well on/near us as when he was in his own space and because he spent every waking hour in our arms, I needed that space! We cuddled him to sleep when he was young, then rocked, patted, sat with him, whatever... I slowly started leaving just that tiny bit before he was asleep and now he points to the door if I outstay my welcome (which is about 1 minute, lol!). I constantly get comments about what an awesome sleeper he is, but we NEVER let him CIO and would never try it as it seems to be portrayed. I first read about CIO in gentle parenting books and it sounded horrific, but self settling is a totally different ball park and by far the best gift I have given my DS.

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self settling is a totally different ball park and by far the best gift I have given my DS.

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Really? Why's that?

Self settling is another label I think is problematic. The variables are too great and what one person sees as self settling another would see as partially comforted etc.

I can see how self settling is great, but it's not a prescription for all sleep issues, and certainly does not suit all personality types.

My 3 year old still needs me to sit with her to sleep...it's my favorite part of our day :)

Well put! There is a world of difference between CC/CIO and following your bub's cues for some peace and quiet to drift off to sleep. I did something sort of similar with DD when she was little, where if she woke during the night I wouldn't necessarily race in to her at the slightest grizzle, but would instead wait a minute or two, listening. If she continued with just muttering and so on, I'd leave her to it - most of the time she'd mutter and grizzle a bit then go back to sleep. But if the sound of her crying changed to a more insistent note, I'd go to her.

DS on the other hand is a bit hit and miss at this stage - sometimes he'll let me put him down drowsy but awake and he'll drift off on his own, other times he prefers to feed to sleep. It's early days, but I figure it's up to him and I'll just roll with it. Seems to be working so far :)

I was one of those mothers that just couldn't put my LO to bed crying. I'm too soft, I know, but I have also heard over and over again how very tiny babies just don't know how to comfort themselves so it's necessary for the parent to settle them. I have a GF who has done the CC on both her kids, so when DS was around 8-9 months, I thought I'd give a tiny go, but only leave DS crying for few minutes (well actually it probably wasn't more than 2 or 3 at the most! lol) and then I would go in a re settle him. I found that he still preferred to be settled completely by me, ie by rocking him to sleep, which was fine, but then one day he just learned to self settle himself and I thought, hooray!!!. I think one must do what he/she feels comfortable in doing and also what works for the LO.

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Well, you know, it's one of those things. There's information and there's responding to your specific circumstances. Ultimately only parents can know what their kids need. The problem comes when we are not in touch with our kids and our instincts and try to override or ignore those things, following arbitrary advice from some book (or whatever).
So, although none of us are perfect and we will all get things wrong from time to time, if we are in touch with our kids' needs and our instincts, then we will most likely muddle through in a fairly satisfactory manner. Having said that, it does also tend to help to have good information as well when making decisions.

So I'm glad you've found a way you're happy with.

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I think if we all just ditched the labels (CC or CIO) people could be more accepting of alot more. Because although there are a couple of EXTREME books out there promoting very firm guidelines; in 'my' experience most people use adaptive approaches that suit themselves and their children, and usually only after exhausting all other avenues.

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I agree with both of these posts. I think it is important to understand your child/ren and use whatever method is best for you & them. It is great to have different information and opinions too. Most of the time parents either need a different POV of support to know they are doing the right thing for THEIR family.

From what you posted Bloom, that is exactly what you have done and your little one is content with that.

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I was one of those mothers that just couldn't put my LO to bed crying.

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Me too! DS never went to bed crying. As you said, if he grizzled, I didn't go in, but if that escalated into crying, I'd go in. I couldn't stand to leave him upset - 2-3 mins is my max. But, if I did go in, I wouldn't automatically pick him up and cuddle him to sleep. We'd cuddle, pat, soothe etc and when he was calm, drowsy and happy, out I'd go. Sometimes I'd have to go back in, sometimes not. It wasn't an overnight thing, and it wasn't as if he was a newborn. I am talking about an 8 month old baby.

Mad B - Oooh, good call! I know this answer will not adequately explain my stance, but here goes.... Don't get me wrong, I didn't 'make' DS self settle. He did it himself, when he was ready and when I felt he was developmentally ready as well. Part of my role as a parent is to help my LO's be the best they can be, to help give them the skills they need to be productive, happy, healthy, resilient members of society. And to help them to get on in life, on their own - to see that life with mum/family/a partner/ children etc is fantastic, but that they don't NEED those things to be happy iykwim. He's not going to know and get that 'til he's well into adulthood. But it's like building a house - I'm giving him the foundations now and a skill to practise. Sleep is essential for our bodies for so many reasons and having a well rested bub means he can gain and retain new skills more easily, enjoy his awake time more happily etc How many adults are poor sleepers? I don't think I'm being 'mean' or 'cruel' by helping my DS gain a skill he WILL need when he's older. I think I'm attending to his needs in the best way that works for me, my marriage and DS. If another parent chooses to co-sleep, pat/rock/feed to sleep, then that's their choice. As long as they are happy with that. Unfortunately, I think a lot of parent's do the latter because they think they'll be judged harshly otherwise or don't know of any alternatives other than letting their LO scream hysterically. However, if it's what you want to do and it works and it makes you happy, go for it! It's the same as any other parenting choice, it's just that, a choice. It's not cruel or wrong, just different. Same as the choice to vaccinate/not vaccinate or what foods you give your LO's and the whole plethora of other parenting choices we make every day. None of these choices are taken lightly by me, or by others. I pay attention to DS' interests, needs and wants, speak to lots of people, read lots of literature and make my choices accordingly - exactly as you said. And those choices evolve and change everyday, as my understanding changes too. I love the way I parent, I think I am a pretty darn good parent and I am proud to say that out loud!

Ultimately, I think most people agree here, that we all do what's best for us and our LO's, using the best knowledge and understanding we have. The only difference is in what 'the best' is for each of us. Wouldn't the world be boring if everybody had exactly the same knowledge, thoughts and opinions on everything?! ;)

Well who likes to go to bed unhappy?

Thanks JL - I see you also answered this in my other thread about self settling :)

Obviously we do need to learn to self regulate - my understanding is that we teach children this by soothing them. Eventually - when they are developmentally ready - they are able to do it themselves. I think the 'issue' I have with the whole self settling thing is the presumption that you must teach your baby to do this. As you point out, however, it's a developmental stage that all children will arrive at at different times. And of course there is a difference between a baby that shuts down and gives up when left to cry in distress, and a child that has learned to soothe themselves.
For individual children, parents may find different ways of helping them learn - as opposed to forcing or teaching - as you and others have stated. I make no comment on individual parent's decisions or actions - I certainly do not presume to know what their children need.

I do take issue with some of the 'advice' that is commonly bandied around, however - you have to let them cry, you have to teach them, etc. The other thing I take issue with is the idea that comforting your child to sleep might somehow delay this development. Speaking *generally*, I believe the evidence would suggest the exact opposite - when you comfort your child you are teaching them how to soothe themselves.

But I apologise for going off topic here :)

There's a happy medium in here somewhere.

I also think some mothers have helped their kids learn bad habits that are distressing to break, and can be the result of many tears, but totally necessary to break. I have no problem with kids expressing some sadness and anxiety going through that process.

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What you are describing doesn't sound like the CIO that many books discuss, which involves leaving your baby for increasing periods of time, up to an hour by a certain age, and not 'giving in'. Many babies vomit from crying, or loose trust in their parent and sob themselves to sleep.

You listened to your baby and followed your instinct. I think that is different from people telling parents to just leave their babies to sort themselves out by going out of ear shot of the child.

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I think if we all just ditched the labels (CC or CIO) people could be more accepting of alot more. Because although there are a couple of EXTREME books out there promoting very firm guidelines; in 'my' experience most people use adaptive approaches that suit themselves and their children, and usually only after exhausting all other avenues.

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I agree. I also agree with the PPs who said that most people find a happy medium that works for them.
What worries me is that some people (I may have been one of them, once) don't understand that there are 50 billion shades of grey involving all kinds of ways that work for different families..and that think if you aren't getting enough sleep, you have one option, to shut your baby in a room on their own. My wish is that every new parent would be told all the variations there are - or even better, none of them at all! - and told trust your instinct, and do what works for you.

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I do take issue with some of the 'advice' that is commonly bandied around, however - you have to let them cry, you have to teach them, etc. The other thing I take issue with is the idea that comforting your child to sleep might somehow delay this development. Speaking *generally*, I believe the evidence would suggest the exact opposite - when you comfort your child you are teaching them how to soothe themselves.

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Yes, that :)

I think there is a difference between lettling them self settle with a bit of a cry and leaving a distressed baby to CIO.

You are doing what works for you. But to say leaving a baby to cry alone to sleep is gentle parenting, it sounds like you are maybe trying to justify what you are doing, and you don't need to. If it works for you that's great, but in my opinion it's not actually gentle parenting. There's no need to label what you do.

Bec, yes labels can be problematic.

I guess what I am saying it that I still consider myself in the realm of gentle parenting and that I still fit in here, even if the way that my gentle parenting expresses itself it different to most others on here.

If you consider it not to be gentle parenting, then what would be the gentle parenting response to a child who will settle quickest to sleep when tired by crying by themselves (given I had tried every comforting suggestion I had received).

Is it more gentle to hold them while they cry, but then make them cry for longer?

[QUOTE=Bloom;3010105

Is it more gentle to hold them while they cry, but then make them cry for longer?[/QUOTE]

Hmm.

For my DD, I would think its more 'gentle' to be held than left to cry alone, but I understand every child is different. It worries me that some parents expect too much of their babies/toddlers and forget that it does take some emotional intelligence and coping mechanisms to 'self settle'. These are only just developing in OLDER toddlers so I don't see any point in leaving them to cry until their old enough to understand ITMS.

Thank you for your post Bloom. I'm at the stage trialling different techniques. Always felt guilty when the thought of self-settling comes in mind.