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As the title suggests we are after a car seat for DD with an inbuilt harness that will last her til she is 7/26kgs as per VicRoads requirements!!
We have seen the Babylove one but wondering if there are any others out there! Have searched a few sites and lots seem to need a H harness separately and we would prefer the inbuilt one!
TIA :D
We have an infa secure one hun, has the 5 point harness until a certain weigjt, then h harness untill 7 yrs old.
WasOnly $ 180 at baby bunting
Its the infa exceed
H harnesses arent recommended, they are dangerous. Youll be hard pressed to find a 5 point harness accomodating up to 26kg/7 years old without importing (which is illegal).
I would personally recommend the Infa Secure 0-8 Luxi Crown. Google it. It has extended use of the 5 point harness and then converts with adult seatbelt.
0-8 Luxi Crown: Australia's only newborn to eight years child restraint.
VERSATILE
The 0 to 8 is the most versatile of any car seat. Suits the needs of: parents, grandparents, carers, childcare centres, taxi/hire companies, etc. by offering a single solution design.
COMFORT INSERTS
Multi use inserts for baby's comfort and enhanced safety. As baby grows, they are removed, making the 0 to 8 suitable through to eight years old*.
COMPACT FOR EASE OF FIT
The compact multi-recline action means the 0 to 8 in rearward facing mode fits most cars comfortably.
FIVE SHOULDER SLOT HEIGHTS
The 0 to 8 features five shoulder slot heights making it suitable for a vast range of different sized children, from premature babies through to most tall or large four year olds*. It can then be converted into a booster seat for use through to eight years old*.
We have a baby love ezi combo for dd2 it has an inbuilt harness until their shoulders are to tall then it switches over to a booster with seatbelt, it is fairly wide if you have a small car or lots of seats to fit in
Tan I don't think you can get a 5point harness for that weight. Reason being that the seats made here can't guarantee the integrity of the harness in an accident at that weight. The safety standards here don't say they have to, so they don't.
If your not keen on the Luxi Crown, the Cargo Marathon is the next best 5 point that has wiggle room for both weight and height. It has 50cm shoulder straps, the highest slots available. My 3yo is 19.5kg and 115cm; still comfortably in the 5 point Cargo and will be for quite awhile. 5 points are tested with up to 22kg of weight so you have until that point before you need to move up to the adult belt/anchored booster combo.
If your needing a booster seat w/ adult seatbelt, the Infa Secure seats are probably the best on the market with a 4 star rating. We have a Vario Max.
Your other option is to import, but its technically illegal.
Total can of worms you've opened here. There's no easy answer. I want a radian rxt but don't have the balls to import an illegal seat.
I am happy to be told I am wrong but I was under the impression that from age 4 they don't have to be in a 5 point harness and it seems to be very difficult to find a 5 point harness that goes to 26kg. I have found 1 but it was over $400 but I didn't believe my DS would fit into it until 7 with the height/shoulder length restriction it had. If I thought it would last him I would have got it as it was an awesome seat.
Goodluck in your search.
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Gosh it's so tricky hey! I don't want the harness until age 7 but maybe 6:rofl: nearly said 5 then realised she's 5 next month! I just don't feel like an adult belt is safe for a child even in a fancy pants seat but obviously they are?! She's a little mini , only just about to hit 18kgs and I can't remember her height but she's on 50th percentile at age 4.9 for age so not tall at all.
Lots of researching to do, thanks for all the suggestions. Wonder why they sell the H harness if it's not safe. So frustrating there are overlaps with the rules and different seat styles.
ETA: kelebek that's right hun- I just want one!!!
ds1 is in an adult seatbelt. i don't like it, but feel like its the best option we have at the moment.
lol I understand your frustration but as DS is almost 22 kgs at 4 I had to make some tough choices in the last 6 mnths about the seats.
I talk to my sister about car seats cause her 2 boys are 9 and 11 and they weren't even in booster seats at 3 yet we agonise about 5 point harness'. Don't get me wrong I am grateful that the standards have increased it just seems like the manufacturers haven't really caught up as ideally I would love him in the 5 point harness :dunno:
From the research I have done, the issue with the H harness is often they aren't fitted correctly they are more dangerous.
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Yes DS is in an adult seatbelt too. He is 110cm and 21kg at 4 years and I would much prefer had a five point harness. Funnily enough he can still fit in a compaq with 5 point quite comfortable (Seat at mums) but the instructions say not for use about 14 or 18 kg.:
We have. Just got our two Radians imported! Waiting until the girls outgrow their current seats very soon then dh will fit them in :dance::
Double:
Ginger he would be so much safer in a proper harness cars eat he's still too little for a adult lap belt. In a crash it could really endanger him. I understand you are nervous about importing but we were too but figured the risks of importing vs the benefits to our child's health were worth every $ spent importing, besides they were pretty cheap from NZ!:
Another bb member had done it before me and inspired me to do it too. Now DD2 can stay RF til she's 4yrs!!L!!
We looked into importing a car seat but our insurance said that they may not be insured and may even render you insurance invalid! It's such a tough situation! The maxirider AHR says up till 6-8 yrs or age, and when we bought it the lady told us to keep using the 5 point harness as long as she fitted in the seat.
Even in a bad crash, let's say the insurance doesn't cover and yes that would be so awful but nothing could be worse than losing the life of your child or your childs health.
But I understand importing illegally is a scary decision as it means going against the norm. I wasn't prepared to wait for Australian manufacturers/standards to get up to date with other countries like Sweden & the states.
Just FYI an adult belt is designed for a minimum height of 145 cm, as per the Vic Roads web site.
Totally agree Ren. My kids health is my top priority! Bella is still ok in the maxirider so I'm just researching at the moment. H will get that seat with B is out of it.
Just thought I would mention the insurance thing so people would be aware of it.
Far out I am so confused!!!:
Just FYI an adult belt is designed for a minimum height of 145 cm, as per the Vic Roads web site.
This is from the Baby love website, am looking at the Ezycombo seat
SO they are saying they can be in with a harness til they are 7 or is that wrong?? That is what I am looking for and it looks like this one and that Infa one are the only 2 on the market? WIll have to check out the Radian but I am not sure we would import but just buy one that is here that suits what we want it for.:
Forward facing
with a Lap Sash Seat belt or EzyGo Harness can be used for children until they reach the
upper shoulder height marker - most 7 year olds.
ETA: Just saw this tooThat is what we have for her in my car - how do you know when they don't fit it anymore? Is it where the shoulder straps sit?? At the moment they are still above the top of her shoulders.:
The maxirider AHR says up till 6-8 yrs or age, and when we bought it the lady told us to keep using the 5 point harness as long as she fitted in the seat.
DD is 18.1 kgs and 108cms tall. Just measured her!
I believe the reason most booster seats have the seat belt guide is because of the height restriction. Also if they have to be in the 5 point harness til 7 why are those booster cusion things legal?
My DS is in a booster but with the normal seatbelt for the same reason as Ginger and DC.
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Tan DD1 has just hit 18kg and is 114cm, in my car she is still in the maxirider 5 point harness, my understanding I'd that it is tested to 22kg even though it's not advertised, she will stay in it til 20 kg probably, she is in the Hi Liner in DH 's car with adult seatbelt
Tan the straps can't be anymore than 1inch higher OR lower than shoulder height, id keep her in it Hun
Lilima I assume that's for people who puts kids straight onto the seat,
Olive- yes you need to take into account the 'boost.'
Also Vic roads web site advised that booster cushions have not been part of their safetty standards since 2010.
That's what we are using currently also.:
Does this mean with the 145cm, I need to look at what the boost of the seat is? Who was it that said H harness are dangerous? Research link please?:
We have had him in the hiliner for not very long, he was way over the 5 point weight rating for our infa-secure booster which we hadn't even realised, but also outgrown the straps. I really want to import for my DD.
I didn't realise that. Will have to check the NSW RTA site. Why do they sell them if they aren't legal :think::
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On iPhone, but if someone could link to the Vic roads web site, you can read all the info there
I hate that they sell those booster cushions!
DC I think that info regarding H harness is on racv website
Child restraints : VicRoads
Here is the info in H harness
http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/...yHarnesses.htm
Hey DC, this is a link to NSW RTA FAQ's http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/roadsafety...laws_faqs.html and there are a couple of questions about the accessories child safety harness (the H harness) and using the adult seat belt. Summarising, it basically says that booster seats are designed to be used with either an in-built harness (with the weight restrictions) or the adult seat belt. "The use of an accessory child safety harness is recommended only in a position where the vehicle seat has a lap-only seatbelt. Research has shown that the likelihood of a child safety harness being used incorrectly is very high and the risk of injuries when incorrectly used is much higher compared to a lap-sash seatbelt."
The regulations are suppose to be Australia wide but there does still seem to be some variation state to state :dunno:
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Thanks, that is really interesting. And yes, I am a hater that they are sold as well.
When I asked at Baby Bunting (probably more than 12m ago) she said they were allowed to sell seats not within Victorian Legislation because other states differ.
Ooohhhhhhkaaayyy so what I think I missed along the way is that even with the 5pt harness, once they hit 18kgs they should have the seat belt instead! Ka-ching the penny drops :rofl:
I would like to still possibly use the H harness so would like info on that if there is any - on the RACV site it just mentions you can use one with a booster.
ETA: Found a blog that a lady posted some studies but the links aren't working, will keep searching but here is a summary![URL="http://users.tpg.com.au/users/mpaine/safetips.html#kids"]STUDY[/URL:
The results indicate that the simple addition of a harness system to a lap belt, although reducing excursion of the head and torso, may lead to neck forces that are much higher than those seen in the lap/sash belt configuration. There are therefore grounds for concern on the performance of the lap belt/child harness configuration. The comparatively high readings for head and neck forces and accelerations indicate the need for some attention to design. Unlike the configuration in a forward-facing child seat, the shoulder straps of the child harness when used with a lap belt are anchored directly to the vehicle structure. In a child seat, the harness is attached to the seat and the seat attachments are separate. The lap/harness configuration is therefore much stiffer in its reaction to crash forces, and this may be why the dummy neck loads were higher in these tests. This suggestion is supported by outputs for chest accelerations, which were also highest in the lap/harness configuration.
From another forum.:
Avoid using separate child harness with a booster, unless there is only a 2-point seat belt available.
For children over 6 who are too large for a booster seat, a 3-point adult seat belt in a rear seat.
For children over 6, where no 3-point seat belt is available in the rear seat, a 3-point adult seat belt in a front seat [IF allowed by the new laws]. A passenger airbag will provide extra protection and is not dangerous in Australia (updated URL) - provided the child is restrained by the seat belt and does not lean forward. In any case, adjust the seat as far back as possible but ensure that the sash (upper) portion of the seat belt is against the shoulder and not the neck. Never let a child stand or sit close to the dashboard - airbag or no airbag.
:
http://www.pscwa.org.au/getdoc/c563e...--July-09.aspx
Based on pelvic restraint, head excursion and abdominal injury potential, results from this study suggest that in frontal impact at least, accessory child safety harness systems provide no better protection than lap/shoulder belt systems. When accessory child safety harness systems are misused the level of protection provided is seriously degraded. Given the high frequencies of child safety harness system misuse seen in field observation studies, and the fact that even when correctly used these system provide no improvement over a lap/shoulder belt, it seems likely that the risks of injury outweigh any perceived benefit of a child safety harness system over a lap/shoulder system.
From Kidssafe
http://www.kidsafevic.com.au/images/...restraints.pdf
Harnesses
Recent research by Bilston has demonstrated that almost 100% of harnesses are fitted incorrectly; therefore, Kidsafe only recommends use of a harness in cases where a lap only belt is the only available alternative.
CR 173: Children in Adult Seat Belts and Child Harnesses; Crash Laboratory Comparisons of Dummy Responses (1997)
The results indicate that the simple addition of a harness system to a lap belt, although reducing excursion of the head and torso, may lead to neck forces that are much higher than those seen in the lap/sash belt configuration. There are therefore grounds for concern on the performance of the lap belt/child harness configuration. The comparatively high readings for head and neck forces and accelerations indicate the need for some attention to design. Unlike the configuration in a forward-facing child seat, the shoulder straps of the child harness when used with a lap belt are anchored directly to the vehicle structure. In a child seat, the harness is attached to the seat and the seat attachments are separate. The lap/harness configuration is therefore much stiffer in its reaction to crash forces, and this may be why the dummy neck loads were higher in these tests. This suggestion is supported by outputs for chest accelerations, which were also highest in the lap/harness configuration.
Road Safety Tips Michael Paine does research on Child Restraints
Except in special circumstances, avoid child harnesses that work in conjunction with a seat belt. Even though these are Standards-approved they usually lack a method to stop the lap portion of the seat belt from riding too high on the child's abdomen. Crotch straps serve this purpose with the harness that is built into a Standards-approved child seat. Some modern designs of booster have an "anti-submarining clip" that is designed to work like a crotch strap. If necessary, these can be used in combination with a separate child harness in centre rear seats that only have a lap belt but make sure the anti-submarining clip holds the lap belt in place. All Australian cars should have a top tether anchorage in this position that can be used for attaching the harness.
http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/...rs+(32+kg).htm
The harness must be correctly installed in your vehicle and adjusted properly to fit your child. If it is not, the harness may cause your child injury in a crash.
Harnesses are best used:
* In a seating position where there is a lap belt only
* In the side positions, using the buckle provided, to give extra support for the upper body on long journeys
* When travelling in taxi (harnesses are very portable)
* When transporting extra children and only a lap belt is available.
Photo of Harness where there is a lap belt only:
Tan I'm in this situation at the moment. I and E are both in maxiriders in my car but we won't get the two maxiriders plus a meridian for #3 in my car so I'm giving myself all kinds of guilty because I'm "sacrificing" I's safety by putting her into a SnS hi liner with a lap sash. The alternative which I've suggested to R but he just won't go for is that I only ever go out with two children at one time!!
I spoke to Kidsafe over here about what options we have and they confirmed what your links say - they are safer in the adult belt than in an H harness. My I's about your I's weight and height too, so hope that helps.
The problem with the Maxirider comes from wanting to keep them rearfacing. They are ony rear facing up to 36cm or something. So once their shoulders are too tall you need to turn the seat.
The reason for importing something like the Radian RXT is that you can keep them rearfacing until they are 4 if you wanted to.
DD2 is still RF now at almost 15 months, but she is too big for her seat. There are NO seats in Australia that will allow me to keep her RF now, she is too big for them.
DD1 is in a booster and adult belt. I'm happy with that TBH, as again, there are no other safer alternative for her, she is too tall.
FWIW, the standards are now being looked at and LATCH is being brought into Australia anyway, so soon these seats will be legal. For me, the evidence is clear, and the fact that there is a lag in our standards compared with what they SHOULD be just means I am happy with my choice to import a seat.
Any standard that tells me it is ok to have my child on a giant piece of foam that weighs all of 300gm and just sits on the seat and that is going to protect her in a high speed collision, but a steel framed, properly designed and fitted seat with a 5 point belt and securely attached to the vehicle is not up to standard, doesn't deserve my consideration at all anyway.
They can't void my insurance for having a car seat in it - it has nothing to do with the function of the car, it isn't an alteration to the vehicle. They can not cover replacing the SEAT if it is stolen, or in an accident, but I would seriously question their right to void my insurance altogether for having the seat in the car.
ds1 just doesn't seem to sit right in the maxi rider with the adult seat belt. it doesn't look like it cuts across his shoulder in the right place iykwim?
lime- have you imported a radian?
shanti- are you happy with the radians? I'm seriously considering getting one from nz.
How much does it cost to import. I saw the Radian on US website for ~310.
I unfortunately need to upgrade our family car to fit a Radian though, but the company car (which i should do most of my driving in) should have LATCH.
theres some on ebay for au$440 including delivery.
how do you know if your car has latch?
That's why Im now looking for one that has the little clip thingy so the belt doenst cut too high up as well as the submarine clip between their legs.:
ds1 just doesn't seem to sit right in the maxi rider with the adult seat belt. it doesn't look like it cuts across his shoulder in the right place iykwim?
Must go look up the Radian - why is it so good compared to what we have here????
Ok have had a look - TBH I can't see what is so different about than the ones mentioned earlier??? The weights almost marry up to ours as far as how long you can use them as a forward facing then booster, (20kgs vs 18kgs) but other than that I couldn't really see a difference? Am I missing something?!