Does this seem unreasonable?

I am looking for an objective approach as I am feeling rather tender about it and I don't know what to think.

DS 5y (Preppie) was sent home from school today for being "naughty". My 5 year old, got an immediate suspension from school... :/

When I was called I was told he "ran out onto the road with another child", and has "just been really naughty today and not listening" and "the principal has decided he has to go home". When DH collected they fobbed him off and said they had already spoken to me which I think is appalling as I was on the way to a lecture and had to get off the phone quickly, it was only luck he was home and able to collect.

DS has fessed up that he was running around in his arts class today instead of listening. I would think this is normal I'm having a rough day behaviour and still expected at this age? At lunch time it was apparently his turn to do "Yard Duty" with the teacher. We have not heard of this before, but apparently two children 'do' yard duty with the teacher each day. For each child it's obviously every so often but I still find this odd. He is a child, is he not entitled to his lunch time? So he didn't want to do yard duty and honestly I can't blame him. Then the road thing which DS was very offended by and says "No Mum I was NOT on the road, I want to come home and I went on the footpath. I came back because I decided I wanted to go to After School Care". From what he has said he took maybe a couple of steps out the gate.

Obviously I'm not necessarily impressed with his actions but they are completely understandable as well. When DH arrived to collected (5 mins after the call), DS was at the office. The attitudes of the teachers was all very much just that they were talking down to him and angry with him. Not one single person that DH interacted with on collection made any effort to educate him at all. It appears nobody bothered to speak to him. Since when is this okay? Would you not expect someone to sit down with the child and talk about road safety, strangers, etc ... I think for every teacher to just greet him with contempt is deplorable...

We are in Victoria - I am well versed with early childhood regulations but have no clue about Primary.

As an aside. The general communication from the school has been shameful. We recieved in his 4th week, a newsletter for Preppie parents meant to go home in the first few days. Talking about readers and, packing lunches; information that would have been useful four weeks beforehand. In this time, sight words came home in his reader, but there was not instruction, just happens we knew what was going on. Last week we received a letter home (in his reader) asking for permission for him to see speech pathologists as the teacher had concerns that has already been discussed with us. We had heard nothing. We sent back the letter back (in reader) with a please explain, open to communication. the reader was changed that day and nothing was heard, letter was just sent back. It is only today that DH approached the teacher and had to ask about it, that anything has been mentioned.

Im also personally not impressed with the concept of a "naughty corner" and would be interested to know how commonplace this is in other schools. In early childhood we encourage positive words and encouragement as using negative like NAUGHTY is believed to lead to self-fulfilling prophecy - you tell a child they are naughty and naughty they will become. Not only that but is it not name-calling? DS has never used the "n-bomb" before and in the last few weeks tells me all about the other naughty children.

Im really feeling left with no confidence in his school. It has been building since the first day where I was surprised we were not invited to the classroom and things have just escalated from then.

Thoughts Appreciated...

AI! I'd be very upset about this, too.
Are you able to get to the school to talk to the teacher and principal/deputy? I know our school has an early-learning deputy as well, who we can talk to as well as DS' teacher. Communication is soooo important. It helps the teacher to know where you're at at home - I've had chats with our teachers about DS' learning style and behaviour. He got very tied up about the time out corner (!!!) as we'd never done this. He felt left out that he never got to go there :wall:

I totally agree about labelling kids. The "naughty" ones never get a chance :( At this age I would expect a fair amount of latitude with the kids. I think it really comes down to teacher style, too. Some are really good with the kids, and some are .... not so much. DS critiqued his teachers last year: Miss C doesn't know how to make the kids pay attention. They just have to go in time out all the time. Mrs H knows how to make the kids pay attention. She never uses time out.
It seems to be used a lot at DS' school. Kids get discouraged very quickly when treated like this, though.

It seems very heavy handed to suspend a 5 yo. Yes, he probably gave them a scare going near the road, and yes, it was a bad decision, but how does removing him from school address the problem? (And I have no idea what yard duty is about?!)


If you can, I would try really hard to make an appointment to talk with his teacher, and other staff as well. It will help your teachers if they have a better understanding of your son, and will help you if you have a better understanding of where they're coming from. Ideally you'd have a meeting with your son present as well so he can participate in the discussion. You do sound quite uncertain about the school. Are there other options you can explore?

I think the suspension re the road thing is touch and go - I can see both sides. Maybe they've talked about not going outside the gates in class time and didn't feel the need to reiterate it after the fact. Plus, you've only got his word for it that he was on the footpath. So, for me, that one's a maybe.

HOWEVER, the overall lack of communication re readers and speech pathology sends alarm bells ringing for me.

I'd make an appointment with the principal and/or class teacher to discuss your concerns.

That - all of it - it beyond appalling to me! Seriously atrocious.

For me, this would require myself writing out a full list of issues to be discussed and making and urgent - and long - appointment with the Principal and the class teacher so that all of this can be addressed fully and openly and without the opportunity for back-pedaling or stalling.

Sending a 5 year old home form school in their first term for being 'naughty' is disgusting. If his behaviour was so egregious that it required immediate expulsion from school, then it most certainly required immediate and in depth discussion with the parent at the time he was collected from school.

My DD1 - also a new preppie in Vic this year - is in a Steiner stream at a regular state primary school, so I can't comment too much on non-Steiner ways (they aren't taught to read in prep, for example) but I would be horrified if an educator were instituting a "Naughty Corner" or "Yard Duty" at her school or in her classroom.

I am sorry that you are going through this, I have several friends who are young primary teachers, and I cannot imagine any of them thinking this is ok. If you want me to put you in touch with them, FB me and you can speak with them directly and find out some more specific information. xx

My understanding is it is quite common for children to be suspended for leaving the school grounds. I have heard of it happening quite a few times at several schools.

I agree with the other posters about communication. I would make an urgent appointment with the principal and express all of your concerns. If you are not happy with the responses, perhaps a change of school may be needed??

I would definitely be meeting with the teacher involved and the principal to straighten the matter out, as well as their expectations of children who have only been attending formal school for 4 weeks. All of that sounds so out of control and the reactions or the teachers sound like it was over the top. Maybe ask to see/discuss their behavior management policies/procedures. It sounds like way too much to expect of a small child who has been going to school for such a short time!
I must say though that early childhood and school/primary teachers are VERY different and things are dealt with really differently. Worlds apart!
I would be furious too. They have dealt with it all terribly.

I have zero experience with school here, but I think suspension sounds completely unreasonable for his age, even if he went on the road. (What happened to the other child who "went on the road" - if the road bit is what is worthy of suspension (it isn't in my opinion) were they suspended too?) (My brother and another girl attempted to walk home when in first year of school in the UK so about 4.5 - instead of getting on the bus - they got quite a way about 1km (5km home) - there was never any disciplining of them at all only talking about road safety etc. - I will never forget the incident as I thought I was going to have to get off the bus a 9 years old and tell mum he was missing)

Apart from anything else what you want children to know is that it is dangerous to run into the road - not that it is 'naughty'.

The Yard Duty - is hard to know what to think as it obviously hasn't been explained at all - maybe they have a very good idea behind it but who knows if you are never told about it they can't expect you to just welcome it without understanding what it is about - and they obviously haven't done a good job of explaining the concept to the children if your son and the other child decided they wanted to get out of doing it that much.

This might help...

DISCIPLINARY PROCEDURES

Far out, the school's communication practices leave a heck of a lot to be desired! From what you've said, to me it's an over reaction ... unless "something" your DS did was significantly more serious than has been explained. For my money's worth, I'd be having it out with the principal and teacher and ensure you get full details about what exactly brought on the suspension, and you can put forward your DS's explanation also. And yard duty ... OMG. I cannot imagine my 5 year old giving up his run around/play time for a mundane task such as yard duty. And why on earth would the school expect it? Can they justify their reasons? It may be acceptable if there is a proven theory behind it. Personally it sounds lunatic to me to put a preppie on yard duty. At the very least this should have been communicated to parents so YOU understood it, and you could help your child understand what it's all about.

And I'd be taking the school's poor communication practices further. If the principal or teacher aren't receptive, then your school likely has a P&F committee you could approach. You may not want to stick your neck out (so to speak) but you could approach the P&F to raise it with the principal. The school's slack approach to communication with parents is appalling. By comparison, my preppie son has a plastic folder that comes home, and goes back to school daily. Anything we think the teacher needs to know, we write in the book that's kept in the folder, and we get a response back later that day (of course, we can always approach the teacher direct too). All notes, newsletters, kids' drawings etc come home pronto each day in the folder.

Personally, I'd be getting uncomfortable about your son's school. I'd want to be confident that, while he is part of a larger cohort, they still have his best interests at heart and - if behaviour really is an issue (and I'm not saying it is) - then they have a strategy or agreed-to approach on how to deal with it, in collaboration with you. Being "naughty" just seems like a trite excuse. I mean c'mon ... I'm being naughty when I nick one too many cookies from the cookie jar. You deserve a much better explanation for what led to the suspension.

Wow. On my phone but just wanted to say I think your feelings about all if this are spot on and completely reasonable. I would be very upset and disappointed :hug:

That sounds horrible, we are in Victoria I would appreciate you Pm'ing me which school, or the area it us in as I have a four year old going to school next year and I would not like to send her to a school like this.

I would be really upset if this happened to my DD!!

on my phone, but FAR OUT! i'd be very unhappy with that school.

a list of complaints will help you start a very stern appt with the principle and teacher? I would be discussing a few things with them- this is prep- not year 3.
we have done this a few times and you might find a more parents think the same. have a chat to the other parents if you can

If a letter got sent home to me about my child and speech issues I wouldn't send the letter back, id get down there and talk to the teachers. I think both parties there haven't been great, sorry.
we work closely with our children's teachers. try get to know them and their teaching style and find how to back each other.
some schools arent run well but Im not going to let my kids suffer because of it iykwim.

Honestly, I would be beyond 'not impressed'. The kinds of things you mention would be setting off all kinds of alarm bells in my head and I would likely be looking into changing schools ASAP. I find it all appalling. Particularly the fact that they already appear to have labelled your son in a negative manner. :/

If he were sent to the principals office and you were called in for a meeting I would find that appropriate, and that is the process at our school. Immediate suspension seems out of line and unduly harsh at his age/ year level. I would be unimpressed as well.

I also think the way the school has acted is totally unacceptable. He is 5 for crying out loud. My son is also five (going on six) and if that had happened to him I would be cutting my losses and moving him straight to another school. I think it is absolutely unreasonable and certainly having a whole group of adults all berating a child is terrible! Your child has to be able to trust his teachers, to talk to them, and understand them, and to confide in them when he needs to. I think move him now before he gets really settled into the school.

The only thing I can say 'maybe ok' too is the naughty corner. In early child care you have a child/carer ratio of 5:1. In primary school that drops to a teacher, maybe a helper & possibly 15/20 kids. Maybe talk to them & suggest other idea's they could try & reasons why. They really probably have no other idea's.

I'm not sure about the whole suspension thing. Was it just the day he was sent home, or for a day or two in addition to being sent home? I've not had a child leave school grounds, or go on the road (weather or not this happened), but if he did go on the road, its a risk to his life. And when there are so many other kids around to watch, they need to really be tough on this rule. They are responsible for the childrens lives while they are at school.

Yard duty. I'd be fine with this. Its teaching chores & responsibility. Its not every day. DS's class have little jobs they share as well.

As for the communication & attitude, I wouldn't be happy with it. Have you gone up to see his teacher face to face? Maybe suggest they double check DS has everything in his homework folder because you seem to be missing out on things that you're supposed to attend. Talk to them about all of it. One thing I've found in primary schools is that you need to be the proactive one in your childs education. If you have concerns, raise them, face to face. I've found that if you aren't there, physically, your child will usually be left behind as the parents don't seem interested, so the teachers don't show too much interest either. You really need to work together with them to get the best results.

If you don't get anywhere with the teacher, try the principle, but honestly if his teacher isn't interested, there's not much point keeping him there. Not much the principle can do about a teacher who just isn't into teaching. But you might find that once they see you involved things could change.

DD2's teacher is great for her, because I won't let her issues drop. I'm always there, always checking on her progress, not letting it go, making sure everything is ok. Another friend wasn't approached by this same teacher about her DD lashing out, & didn't find out til the report card mentioned it. She was quite disgusted that they put it in there without discussing it with her. All teachers are different. Some are great, some aren't. You can usually manage with the crappy ones for a year, but the whole schools attitude is off, there's no point sticking around.

I am a teacher and I am appalled. So many things wrong here. It all doesn't add up. You and your husband need to book a meeting ASAP with the principal, the head of prep and the classroom teacher.

Go into the meeting with a list of things you want discussed and write down all the details. Write down what they are saying as well or ask for someone to come in as a recorder.

So sorry your family and DS have gone through what you have so far in his education.,it s not a great example of what the system has to offer. :hug:

Where is the school's responsibility in all this? How the hell did a preppie even get to the road? Where was the supervision? I would be furious beyond words if the school I had left my child in the care of supervised him so inadequately that he was able to run on the road. They are preps for goodness sake, they need to be watched, particularly in first term when the are still figuring out the rules and the boundaries. And to then label the child 'naughty' and send him home is appalling. Actually, I wouldn't be beyond words - I would have an awful lot to say to the principal of that school! I expect my child to be safe at school both physically and emotionally, and this school is failing on both counts. I really am just horrified on so many levels by this incident and the way the school has responded.

The yard duty is neither here nor there for me, although I would ask for clarification. The lack of communication is completely unacceptable.

I would be making an immediate appointment with the principal, but honestly... I don't know that I could send my kid back to that school. I would investigate other options, there has to be something better in your area.

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Where is the school's responsibility in all this? How the hell did a preppie even get to the road? Where was the supervision? I would be furious beyond words if the school I had left my child in the care of supervised him so inadequately that he was able to run on the road. They are preps for goodness sake, they need to be watched, particularly in first term when the are still figuring out the rules and the boundaries. And to then label the child 'naughty' and send him home is appalling. Actually, I wouldn't be beyond words - I would have an awful lot to say to the principal of that school! I expect my child to be safe at school both physically and emotionally, and this school is failing on both counts. I really am just horrified on so many levels by this incident and the way the school has responded.

The yard duty is neither here nor there for me, although I would ask for clarification. The lack of communication is completely unacceptable.

I would be making an immediate appointment with the principal, but honestly... I don't know that I could send my kid back to that school.

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this has my main question- how did a prep get near a road during school time?
there seems to be a twist here. its NOT parents or child's fault, its teachers job to supervise and stop a child from running onto the road.

I would imagine it would be very easy for any student to get out of the school grounds. The gates aren't locked and every child cannot be supervised at all times. I think the schools rely on self regulation and the good old dobbing system.

At my DD's school there four teachers on yard duty at break time and four "peace makers" who are grade six students.

As a teacher these are my thoughts.

1. The suspension - it direct sound right to me, especially if its his first 'offence'. I'd be asking for a re-entry meeting when he returns to school to find out what exactly happened. If it really was just a one-off bad day I find it strange he was sent home. I also think it is strange no one talked it through with your DH when he picked him up. The lack of communication there is terrible.

2. The lack of communication regarding notes - before complaining about this I'd just double check they weren't sent sooner and your son forgot to bring them home before complaining. Maybe check the dates on the notes? I've sometimes found students' notes stuffed in their trays when they'd been told to put them straight in their bags. They could very well have been sent home late, but is check first.

3. The naughty corner - I think having a space for kids to sit to re-think their actions is useful, but I don't think it should be named a 'naughty corner'. We have a 'safety corner', where students sit if they are being unsafe to have a re-think about following the class expectations.

4. The yard duty - it sounds strange to me. Like others have said, there might be a really good reason behind it (you'd hope so!). I'd be asking about it to see what the aim of it is.

Oh, and regarding how a student gets on the road (or even out of school grounds), I'm not sure about this particular school, but we don't even have a fence around most of the school, let alone gates. Depending on where the allowed area is at playtime, it is impossible for all kids to be in the vie of a teacher at all times (for instance, at our school the kids can be around the buildings, so while I'd do laps as quickly as possible, I can't possibly see all sides at the same time). We do rely on kids knowing the boundaries and staying within them.