Tantrums and discipline

I need help. But first I must ask that any replies are non judgemental and helpful. If you think I'm a massive failure you can kindly keep that to yourself, please.

DS has just turned 2. We are struvgling with his temper. He's ALWAYS been a screamy child. I mean always. They say babies are born with a clean slate but it feels like someone has scribbled all over his in bright red chalk. Was it something I did? I don't know. Do I not love him enough?

I can't take the screaming any more. It doesn't matter what strategy I try. DP and I are both at our wits end and feeling really disconnected. it's awful and the guilt is intense. He doesn't just scream tho. He hits. kicks. throws toys. scratches. bangs his head on things.... I feel bad for even thinking it but what the f*** is wrong with my boy?!

every day I try to start over. I'm calm.. loving.. attentive. we play together. I sing songs and dance with him. but the instant I neex to break focus on him.... to go to the toilet... to get a drink of water.... or just to get up off the floor and stretch without him clinging onto me he CRACKS it. and I start to fall apart. I spend so much energy trying to avoid tge tantrum. . I fear I'm teaching him that behaving like a miniature psychopath is the way to control mummy and command her attention. so I tyr the other approach. the tough love approach. I ignore. I tell him no. I explain briefly why and how in simpke terms. I put him in his room for 5mins so I can swear loudly.

I've lost it so many times. I know it doesn't help but im going insane. Ive smacked in certain circumstances. especially wgen he hurts me physically. I get it doesn't work..... but nothing does!! ive yelled. screamed. slammed doors. and I hate myself for it. We have no support from family or friends. It's been 3 years since DP and I went out to dinner or a movie. I'm gettinv so anxious and depressed trying to do this without a village around us. Where the f*** is my village?!

I need practical strategies to get his behavior under control. ones that don't involve giving in to his demands for cobstant 24/7 attention and to be held all the time. but also ones that don't incorporate vile temper explosions of my own. Where is the middle ground? And when do you seek help from medical professionals to rule out possible developmental/sensory problems?

:( Somebody help.

Lots of hugs. Kids are tough little cookies to crack some times!

I think your doing the right things by giving him love and attention.

I would maybe set up a routine - it sounds like he gets overly upset if something (like you moving away) happens... But if he knew you were going to be moving away maybe it wouldn't be such a big deal?!?

Try things like -
- setting up a routine
- giving him warnings before you do something (ie -in ten mins, in five mins in two mins I'm going to get up and do the dishes) count down
- make sure you put "him" time in the routine - so that he learns to have some quiet time by himself

Children are super clingy when you are pregnant. Hang in there, it might get worse before it gets better. My dd sent me insane when I was pg with ds, and I used to have to nurse her on the toilet, and stop child care and other activities because she wouldn't let me go. As soon as I had ds it was instantly better!

As for coping with this stage. You said you tried to avoid the tantrum, but I think you need to have clear boundaries about what you will and won't accept and understand tantrums are a part of ds not getting his way, so you have to have them so he learns mummy needs space. Perhaps try to detach his actions from your own sense of self. His tantrums are no reflection on you or your parenting. They don't need to be fixed. Yes you can manage them, but accepting them as part if life will help you all move through them.

Techniques I use are: 'yes I hear you are frustrated mummy can't carry you now, but mummy has a sore back, I am here for cuddles when you're ready' and walk away, reminding them you are there when they need.
If ds hits me, he gets plonked on the floor and told to show gentle hands. 'Hitting hurts, gentle hands please' and get his hand and make his stroke gently. If he can do it, pick him up, if not walk away and as soon as cries , come back 'oh you want to come up, of course, show me gentle hands etc' and when he can be gentle pick him up.

Children also need safe outlets for emotion, so rope in a friend or Dh or uncle or someone to do wrestling with him. Swimming is another great one for getting rid of energy.

Good luck. 2yr olds need management, not control. It's about working with them. He is entitled to his feelings, but he needs to learn to manage them in a way that doesn't hurt anyone else. Our society is super intolerant of normal 2yr old behaviour I've found, so try to get some reassurance from all of us that it's all normal.

It prob wouldn't hurt to eliminate sugar, preservatives and flavour from his diet too to see if that helps.

From what I've read, you're doing an amazing job and I don't think I would be as patient in your position. I think it's time to seek help now. :hug:

Thanks girls.

Our routine is rock solid. He just goes berserk as part of that routine it seems. :( I do plonk him on tge floor when he hits but tgere is no point where he'll settle down after this happens. its like once the switch is flicked. .. theres no going back. no amount of explaining or soothing cuts it and if I pick him up again he won't let me put him down without the tantrum starting all over again.

Swimming is out for at least a month- he has a cast on after recent foot surgery.

I am seriously concerned not that there are tantrums .... but tge sheer force behind them and the frequency. hes screaming more than hes happy. While on the post op ward everyone stared as I tried to soothe a 90min long screamfest. He wasnt in pain..... it was jyst a change of cast. Babies younger than him were quietly sitting and eating. he was hitting me, throwing his food on the floor and goung mental no matter what we did.

It's hard to explain. I get that certain things will generally set a kid off.... but everything seems to fet him going. This has happened all alobg. since before I was pg. At 3mths old I couldn't walj away for a minute without him screaming.

am I crazy?

Not crazy, just tired and needing help and support.

Do you feel he should be assessed for sensory issues? It sounds like you feel his behaviour is outside the range of normal. I say listen to your instinct.

How can you gather support in the meantime? Do you have any family nearby?

You are not crazy at all. Toddlers with tantrums have a way of making you feel that way at times though!

I'm a softy but with DD I did "the nanny" naughty room thing although instead of her bedroom where the toys are and it's fun I put her in the laundry where all chemicals are out of reach and there's absolutely nothing fun in there! She had 2 mins when 2 y/o etc. I too am finding that her behaviour lately as I'm pg is getting naughtier and more clingy, I keep telling her I'm not working any more and I'm home now so we have more time, and as Catastrophic has said I say 'right, I'll play for 5 mins then do some washing and come back to play.'

If your instinct is that something may be underlying then def seek an opinion from your doc or MCHN, but 2 y/olds are challenging as they are learning who they are and that they have a say. I know it's very hard and like you we have absolutely no 'village' of help either and have done everything ourselves. We also haven't been out since before DD came along, can you and your DP go out seperately for some 'grown up' time?

You're doing a great job, don't doubt yourself and a great saying I was told to think of in tough moments is, 'this too shall pass'. Amazingly it does pass and you wonder how you did it but you do and you will, hope things get better for you soon :hug:

back later to respond to everyone properly when I have more time.

Arcadia- Instinct tells me we need help. We have my sister and DPs brother about half an hr away. Today is tge first time we've seen BIL in 7mths. DS doesn't know him and wont go to him. My sister is always too busy. I've asked for help but they are all too busy all the time. :/ it hurts because im desperate and they dont care.

I agree with the others that you are doing a brilliant job. It sounds tough. I don't know that is be handling it as well as you.

As others have also said, I get the vibe that you feel his behaviours are outside what is classed as 'normal'. If that's the case is definitely get him seen to, that way you can either rule that out or, if there is something to it, get some help.

In the meantime, would any of these things help:
1. Doing 'first' and then 'then' sentences with him, eg, "first we are going to play blocks and then Mummy is going to ....". It could even help to explain these things visually to him (eg have a card that you can Velcro little cards with these activities to - that way he can 'see' what's going to happen.
2. Getting an egg timer (or some other sort) and telling him that when it is finished you'll be back to play (you could slowly increase the time).
3. Pump him up with heaps of praise whenever he does play alone or doesn't have a tantrum ect (DD1 loves hearing how happy Mummy and Daddy are when she displays a behaviour we love).

A question - what's his language like? Is it possible the screaming could be due to not being able to 'use his words' and express himself any other way?

I would go see your gp for a referral to a pead, and a good ot. Early intervention is vital if there is something more going on

Agree with efjay. You need to see your gp and ask for a referral to a paed who specializes in behavioral problems. ASAP.

Having had a child who came out screaming and didn't really stop for about 4 years, I hear your frustration, pain, anger and despair. I would also recommend speaking to as many professionals as you wish to hear some advice.

My DD wasn't physical like your boy but could easily scream - not just cry - for at least 40 mins because her sock felt a little lumpy. Or when something happened out of her control and she would just get overcome by a tsunami of emotions and not be able to express it any other way.

Sometimes the only thing i've been able to do is collapse on the floor in tears for her and for me and wait for the tantrum to finish. Other times I've been driven to being physical as it's too much to bear (i tend to punch my bed in frustration but did smack once which i beat myself up about too). It is JUST EXHAUSTING.

For my child, as language increased, that helped. As did talking about emotions with her. And very repetitively explaining what is and isn't acceptable (as others previously have mentionned).

I just tried to keep in mind that it must be so overwhelming for their little bodies and minds to be experiencing such emotions and tried to keep that thought most in my mind. That helped me calm down and feel more empathetic because it is so full on dealing with a child like this. It can make you feel more wound up and angry than you've ever felt before.

You asked for practical strategies - praising the good behaviours, maintain lots of eye contact and nourish their little minds as much as you can seemed to help. After every screaming tantrum when things had quietened down, explain the emotions and repeat why it's better to use words etc. Can you get any breaks from him (his behaviour)? A day in childcare to help you regroup? Any playgroups you can join so he can see how other children interact?

To be honest, for me it was just after she was 3.5yrs old it started slowly improving. Carefully moderating sugar intake makes a big difference too.

But now I have the most sensitive and creative child who is very generous and loving in spirit.....and i've almost forgotten about the hell that the early years were (she's just turned 5 yrs old).

You are doing a great job and it's fantastic you're on here asking for advice. It can take you emotionally to rock bottom dealing with a child like this but I promise it won't be forever.

I'd take it further. Sounds like you're doing a great job, you've tried everything and need more support. My friend takes her 2.5 yr old to see a developmental psych and that really helps them both with certain strategies regarding emotional meltdowns.

He sounds like a very sensitive child and you are doing a really great job. It can't be easy, though. Do you get much help or time for yourself?
Obviously I don't know your little guy, so can't really say whether there's something 'more' here, but to a certain extent what you describe is quite normal. For kids under 3, it's pretty standard to want mum and to get upset if she's not around. Some kids are much better than others at letting us know about their needs. It's a tough gig, though, if you never get a break. It's only natural that you would find it hard to be perfectly calm all the time :hug: It sounds like you do well to keep it together as much as you do
Screaming and yelling is one thing, but physical violence is much harder to deal with. There's a reason for this. I don't know what it is, but I guess I just want to reassure you that he's not just trying to upset you, and nor is he a horrible kid. And it's not because you're a bad mum.
Seeking more help and advice may be a good idea

I was going to bring up language which I see another person has. Has he much language? Often the frustration of not being able to tell you exactly what he wants is enough for extreme tantrums.
And unfortunately it's time that needs to pass until he is less frustrated.
I agree with others in trying to assess he needs with the help of professionals. Knowledge is power.

My son is just entering the tantrum phase and man can he scream!

It is hard and from the sounds of it you are being very patient!

Oh boy! He sounds like a handful! I too think your doing a great job. I know it may not feel like it but you are.
My oldest is 7 and still has melt downs that can last 30mins before he takes himself off.
In early years we found there was little we could do once he got to a certain level of melt down and when I wasn't pregnant I would cuddle him as he tantrums, when he was about 4 he said it helped but he still hit etc.
the count down system I still do and it helps them later. Once its established, its a safe thing for them. Also the 1st..... Then we'll...... Helps too.
Focusing on the positive things helped me too. Every day I would write 3good moments we had, or things he did.

How has his physical energy been since the cast? can he run in it?
I have found energy build ups (and too much drain) can effect melt downs.
Wondering if he's adjusting to extra movement or less?

Sugar, preservatives and additives, wheat and dairy need to be watched for all my kids. Too much really makes them crazy!

Does he do day sleeps? I find dd won't sleep at home but if we are out about 2pm ish she'll sleep in the Pram or babayseat.

I'm sure you've probably thought through my ideas, just running through them.
I would have a chat with your Dr and maybe you could keep a diary of his tantrums- perhaps there's a pattern and it may help anybody you see about him.
I kept a food/ behaviour diary for 3mths before I could see patterns and I could tweek our routine to suit better.

I would also tell your family, your desparate for help. Cry, scream, both, I hope they can make some time for you.
:comfort:

I can't imagine why anyone would think you're anything other than a mum doing her absolute best :hug:

I have one that came out screaming and who had been highly emotional ever since (and he is 3 months off turning 4).

as language has improved he has got a bit better but he still has tantrums, hits when frustrated etc.

if your gut tells you it's something outside the boundaries of 'normal' then I would seek help. my ds.recently had his 3.5 year old check up with the mchn and even though he passed the 'test' my mchn has given me a referral to a paed because I said I had some concerns. I figure the worst that will happen is that it is all normal but if it isn't, then I want to get help before my little guy is ready for school.

I also like janet lansbury's approach and even though it's tough to always remain as calm etc she suggests but the info on dealing with a child who hits/tantrums I have found really helpful.

good luck :hug:

Sorry if this is a bit all over the place or if I miss something as I'm on my phone.

Firstly Thank you all for some solid advice.

I might just try to answer questions in point form. yes, he does day sleeps. At least one, sometimes two totalling about 3hrs max. he was really goodcwith this until recently. now he fights me every time even when he's exhausted.

his diet is not as varied as I'd like. he refuses to try new things.... and even now things we know he loves. I've noticed a pattern of only accepting crunchy foods... or junk.... I've fallen into the trap of just wanting something- anything in his tummy... so he eats crap. Also if he goes to ved hungry he wakes all night long..... on a good night he's up at least twice anyway. im struggling with that as im so huge and pg and sore.

We have no family support. I have begged my sister to just take him for 2hrs so we can have a civilized dinner date. she always has an excuse. she loves DS tho and is awesome with him when she does see him. but it's never a real break for me. she always helps if I need to go to a hospital appointment and she's available. .... but it seems to me she is ofvtge opinion that watching him while I do something fun, just for me- isn't worth her time. That upsets me. She has no kids yet but I hoped she could empathize on some level. she will ake him overnight when I go into labour. :rolleyes: how enjoyable for us.

his language is very limited. Mummy, Dad, two, ball, car, baby... is about the extent of it. His comprehension is fantastic. ... he can follow complex instructions like "Bring your truck over here so Mummy can play with you" and he will. But he won't verbalize anything beyond those words. he babbles constantly. I'm concerned about this.

He's fully mobile now. has been walking even before surgery to correct his foot. The cast has improved his balance but he's had to adapt to walking normally. .. not the way he'd learned with his bad foot. I'd say overall though he's moving faster than before. slower steps but falling down far less. being in hospital has veen scary for him no doubt as each time he has a GA.

I think that covers most of it. Thanks again. I feel better having sone reassurance and good ideas like the diary, and phrases to try. I'll let you kniw how we go

Forshelby, from your first post you sounded like you were going through what my sister did with her first son. And then when you mentioned in response to others suggestions to look at his diet, that he;s been eating more ;junk', I though I'd put in my 2 cents worth based on my sister's experience. Her boy, now 15, reacts very badly with uncontrollable tantrums to food colourings. it took my sister about 10 years to figure it out, but now, it's a very clear link. That's not his only issue, to be fair, but it was a really big thing for him. SO I suggest you make junk food not available in your house, so that takes away the temptation for you, and offer him only foods that are good for him. I takes my nephew a couple of days to get it out of his system, but all kids are different. And for your DS, it might be sugar, or gluten, or... I don't know. Monitor what he eats and see what happens. Best of luck.

I told my sister a million times that she was a great mum, and that she wouldn't care that much unless she was a great, loving mum, but even a million times isn't enough to really believe it for yourself.

Forshelby, from your first post you sounded like you were going through what my sister did with her first son. And then when you mentioned in response to others suggestions to look at his diet, that he;s been eating more ;junk', I though I'd put in my 2 cents worth based on my sister's experience. Her boy, now 15, reacts very badly with uncontrollable tantrums to food colourings. it took my sister about 10 years to figure it out, but now, it's a very clear link. That's not his only issue, to be fair, but it was a really big thing for him. SO I suggest you make junk food not available in your house, so that takes away the temptation for you, and offer him only foods that are good for him. I takes my nephew a couple of days to get it out of his system, but all kids are different. And for your DS, it might be sugar, or gluten, or... I don't know. Monitor what he eats and see what happens. Best of luck.

I told my sister a million times that she was a great mum, and that she wouldn't care that much unless she was a great, loving mum, but even a million times isn't enough to really believe it for yourself.

today is day 3 of offering only good foods. Today is the first day he's eaten anything ive offered except plain crackers. its hard because hunger makes him uncontrollable also. so far he's had rice bubbles, fruit puree and he played with some grapes. dinner will be baked potato... in the shape of chips ;)

I've been strict. if he won't eat whats offered he gets nothing till the next meal except drinks or a piece of fruit if he'll accept that. so far he's just gone hungry.

we'll see what day 4 brings. There have been 2 major tantrums today. its a good day.

today is day 3 of offering only good foods. Today is the first day he's eaten anything ive offered except plain crackers. its hard because hunger makes him uncontrollable also. so far he's had rice bubbles, fruit puree and he played with some grapes. dinner will be baked potato... in the shape of chips ;)

I've been strict. if he won't eat whats offered he gets nothing till the next meal except drinks or a piece of fruit if he'll accept that. so far he's just gone hungry.

we'll see what day 4 brings. There have been 2 major tantrums today. its a good day.

That sounds positive :)

I know its hard when they are hungry. Its instinct to feed them but his cravings should lessen from tomorrow :)
:hug:

two more massive tanties this afternoon and tonight. The last one reduced me to tears. :( this sucks so much!

Being preggy and having this is extra hard :hug:
hang in there! your doing super!

Posting to subscribe. I could have written your OP.

My daughter has speech delays that have come from a oral motor skills delay she couldn't chew or bite anything and would choke/gag constantly.
She has been referred to speech therapy.
Recently I made my own break through teaching her the word nooooooo or shake head and nodding head (not yes yet) but omg we can communicate!!
I let her "help" me do lots of things, unfolding my folding is annoying but she feels like she is helping putting things in and out of baskets, standing on a stool washing up plastic stuff or watching passing me pegs or taking them out and lining them up.
Give him more "responsibility"?

Fix the food thing, I think it's worth the effort, if the stuff is not in the house them you can show him "none left" and give him a banana. Find healthy things he wants to help you make or buy. My daughter loves rice snacks and cakes its her "bickie"

Good luck, my daughter is two next month and currently only has extreme meltdowns when hungry or over tired.

Oh and watch a bit of super nanny I think she is awesome.

How is it going forshelby? Fwiw my kids always meltdown after grapes (referring to your last post).

Well..... we had a bit of a breakthrough I think. I was talking to my sister about it, and she had a brilliant thought. "He eats like a pregnant woman. ..could his tummy be sore? He refuses almost everything! " Bingo. She asked if I thought it could still be silent reflux. I felt awful thinking how long he's been off his meds for. He did well for a while there, but as he's gotten bigger, and moved from mostly purees to some naughtier treats (like nuggets) it's been a slow downward spiral. So slow I didn't even make the connection between food and behavior initially. he's always been a challenging baby..... and has always cried a lot. I think I was just thinking tgat was how he was. :(

So a trip to the GP got me a speech therapy referral. ... however that will take months to get an appt for. She was unconcerned as he jibbered and laughed the whole appt. She thought he was fine. I also got a new prescription for zantac for reflux to trial him on.

Day 2 on meds and it was pretty clear it was helping. Today is day 6 and he accepted banana for lunch, and ate a whole piece of peanut butter toast for dinner. He's never eaten a whole piece of toast before. :o He still loves his crackers and bickies but I limit tge number and make sure tgeyre rice based, or for sweet biscuits wholegrain (belvitas are a winner at brekky!)

I feel SO bad that he's been unmedicated for so long and seeing the change in him so quickly. He's still a turd at times lol.... but he will communicate with me now instead of screaming. What I thought were tantrums was obviously sometimes pain. :( Guilty mama. He now says yes or no to foods offered.... and even ta. He said bye to me today then went and hid lol.

it makes me sad to think he wasn't talking to me because he was probably miserable and hurting all the time. But im trying not to dwell on what I've done badly, and just focus on whats ahead. Tough gig, this parenting thing. I thought I had it pretty sussed out...... but I think my big boy will always have something new to challenge me with and teach me.

Stay tuned.........

Well..... we had a bit of a breakthrough I think. I was talking to my sister about it, and she had a brilliant thought. "He eats like a pregnant woman. ..could his tummy be sore? He refuses almost everything! " Bingo. She asked if I thought it could still be silent reflux. I felt awful thinking how long he's been off his meds for. He did well for a while there, but as he's gotten bigger, and moved from mostly purees to some naughtier treats (like nuggets) it's been a slow downward spiral. So slow I didn't even make the connection between food and behavior initially. he's always been a challenging baby..... and has always cried a lot. I think I was just thinking tgat was how he was. :(

So a trip to the GP got me a speech therapy referral. ... however that will take months to get an appt for. She was unconcerned as he jibbered and laughed the whole appt. She thought he was fine. I also got a new prescription for zantac for reflux to trial him on.

Day 2 on meds and it was pretty clear it was helping. Today is day 6 and he accepted banana for lunch, and ate a whole piece of peanut butter toast for dinner. He's never eaten a whole piece of toast before. :o He still loves his crackers and bickies but I limit tge number and make sure tgeyre rice based, or for sweet biscuits wholegrain (belvitas are a winner at brekky!)

I feel SO bad that he's been unmedicated for so long and seeing the change in him so quickly. He's still a turd at times lol.... but he will communicate with me now instead of screaming. What I thought were tantrums was obviously sometimes pain. :( Guilty mama. He now says yes or no to foods offered.... and even ta. He said bye to me today then went and hid lol.

it makes me sad to think he wasn't talking to me because he was probably miserable and hurting all the time. But im trying not to dwell on what I've done badly, and just focus on whats ahead. Tough gig, this parenting thing. I thought I had it pretty sussed out...... but I think my big boy will always have something new to challenge me with and teach me.

Stay tuned.........

:hug: honey. You werent to know. Now you do, you can help him. Glad you found a reason for at least some of his behaviour.

Glad you found something that could help. Just a practical tip that works for us is naming emotions before they get out of control, so if I see that DS is starting to struggle then I'll say 'oh that looks frustrating, are you feeling frustrated?' and I"ll ask him to say frustrated back to me, so he has a name for how he feels. Sometimes I'll ask him to yell it or we'll both yell it to each other.

I think its great that you have figured it out! you didn't just label him a naughty kid- your gut said something is wrong and you investigated. I think that makes you an awesome mummy :hug:

Wow that's great news! It is such a guessing game and you've done so well to find a solution.

Fingers crossed his talking starts moving along more quickly now and he can verbalized his frustrations more.