Had it!

This really should be a toddler/pre schooler issue, but its not. And I've absolutely had it!

DS is 5. He poo's himself. All. the. time. Twice today! He also won't wipe when he goes to the toilet.

He won't go to the toilet at school. Will wee, but not poo. By the time he gets home he's busting! This afternoon he didn't make it home. We live across from the school.
Then it happened again at after school activities.

And rather than wipe, he just gets in the shower. So he has multiple showers a day some days, and doesn't always come out clean :/

I'm about to lose my mind. He's fine to go to the toilet at home, just won't wipe.

I've tried rewards. I've tried letting him deal with it himself. I've tried talking to him about going to the toilet away from home & that its fine to do. I've wiped for him & I've thrown a tantrum & refused to wipe! That lasted a week or so... til he decided the shower was the answer.


I think he has a lot of emotional stuff going on with the 'father', so am trying to be understanding. Hoping to hear from a counsellor soon. But I'm really getting over it all. Seriously! He just sat all over my bed with his naked, not so clean backside... :(

Dd 4.5 won't wipe herself and will not poo at kinder, but we haven't had an issue with her having any accidents.

I was hoping she would magically grow out of it before school starts in feb. most of my fiends with 4.5-5yearolds still wipe their bums too.

Do you not want to do it because you feel he should be able to do it himself? I think go back to wiping for him and make it a non-issue and then after two weeks start getting him to do the first one or two wipes and you finish it off and build up from there. That's the stage I'm at with dd and it doesn't work every time, but now she at least tries rather than just refusing.

Good luck.

Have you tried the wet toilet wipes? They have characters or puppy dogs or something on the cover, and are not as scratchy as toilet paper, so might be more appealing.

good luck

DD1 had such issues with poo (took a year for her to stop pooing in her undies, eventually she stopped doing that a month after turning 4) but will NOT wipe her bum.

DD2 is 3.5 and has been wiping her own bum for a few months now. Not very well, there's a lot of streaks in her undies when I wash them, but I have to give her credit for doing it.

DD1 waddles out with her pants around her ankles and asks for us to wipe her bum - which can be embarrassing if you are at someone else's house....

I'm going to try HotI's idea of wet toilet wipes, might make DD2 be a bit more accurate at actually removing all the poo lol

Arcadia - having 2 older kids who were wiping well & truly before they started school, & a not even 3 year old who does it, makes it more irritating. And yeah, they might not've done a perfect job, but they did it. From the start.

I've given him baby wipes. Sometimes works, sometimes not. Not sure about buying toilet wipes when I have baby wipes already in the house, but you really aren't supposed to flush them are you.

I'm just at that point. Over it. A few days & I'll probably be back to having some patience again & being able to handle it. Just exhausted at the moment. Haven't stopped & haven't slept properly in the last 3 - 6 weeks.

Ok, now he's just not bothering to go at all. I've changed my reaction. I'm not losing it. I've promised to take him to the toilet & stay with him the whole time. And he's just given up. He's just going in his pants :/

Oh no that is not good. Poor you. Do you think it's just a protest over the wiping thing or you mentioned with his dad? I know you mentioned a counsellor too...anything new there?

Kids can just do your head in sometimes. What a stress for you.

No ideas just lots and lots of sympathy.

Counsellor is coming out to see me on Friday. While the kids are at school so I can tell her everything that's going on. The school counsellor is also seeing me again this week... I think tomorrow.

Can finish now dd isn't fighting me.
It's happened most of this week. Yesterday we were at sports & I packed an extra pair of pants & wipes coz I knew there was a good chance of it.
We stopped at a road house before hand & he needed to go, but just couldn't, or wouldn't, i don't know.
I decided to not push it & showed him where the toilets are. They were about 5 metres from where we were playing/sitting, but he still went in his pants while off playing with the boys. And didn't tell me, even though I asked.
Last night I sat him down & talked to him about it. He says even at home he's scared to go to the toilet & that even when I take him I always have to go if someone else needs me. I promised that from now on I would tell them to wait & stay with him. Tonight he went, then went back & actually did it. Then wiped.
I made a big deal & told him I was proud etc etc. I hope this isn't a one off... For both our sakes.

Maybe it's to do with moving? We've been in this house about 5 weeks. Maybe he just needs to settle in? But the being scared started when we got home from over east in February... That was after seeing his dad.

This is so hard. I know I've done the right thing, but I feel like its not ATM.

Wow that sounds like a break through. He obviously has anxiety about it and you're doing exactly the right thing by validating and supporting him.

Fingers crossed he feels confident to go on his own again soon (and wipes himself!!)

:hug:

So I saw the school counsellor yesterday. Nothing has changed. He's still doing it & its happening multiple times a day because he just won't let it go.

She referred us to the GP, who we saw today & next step is a paed.

My poor boy is so horrified by the whole thing. He doesn't do other people at all :( The GP was a locum, so not even our usual, which would've been hard enough. He freaked out when the gp wanted to feel his belly... Lost it & was in tears when he wanted us to roll him over & have a look at 'that' area.

We were prescribed laxatives too... but really think they'll just make the problem worse. :dunno:

What did the doctor say? Does ds have compaction or something meaning he has less bowel continence? Is that why he gave laxatives? (I know poo can leak around the compaction meaning the child loses continence and clearing the compaction can help this).
Sending hugs to you and ds. He is obviously struggling with it.

Has he had a chat to the school counsellor himself?

To me it sounds like an emotional issue he might be struggling with if he's scared of going to the toilet, and needs you to be there all the time. Something has scared him.

You probably have already, but have you asked why he is scared? What frightens him? Did something scary happen or did it hurt going to toilet etc?

:hug:

Yeah, I've tried talking to him about it. A few times. But all I get is monsters. He'll go out & play in the dark on the trampoline no worries though. Its day & night he says he is scared & that to me is really odd. He used to go day or night, as long as the light was on, no worries.

The gp didn't really say or explain anything. I think he's just hoping if there is something going on the laxatives will clear it & the problem might sort itself out. But when he does go to the toilet everything looks normal. Nothing loose/hard etc. All seem completely normal.

I think its all psychological as well. I just don't know what or why?

And no, the counsellor hasn't spoken to him. And that's what I've been after from the start. Someone to talk to DS & see how he's going inside. Someone who's not me. But I think she is just trying to figure out exactly where the problem area's are before seeing him.

The other counsellor DCP is sending out might be able to talk to him. :dunno: I see her on Friday afternoon.

:

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What did the doctor say? Does ds have compaction or something meaning he has less bowel continence? Is that why he gave laxatives? (I know poo can leak around the compaction meaning the child loses continence and clearing the compaction can help this).
Sending hugs to you and ds. He is obviously struggling with it.

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^^ this will be why the gp wanted to feel his tummy and has suggested a laxative. His bowel might have stretched out from holding on and when it gets stuck the poo leaks behind it out but can still look normal. It's all a vicious cycle especially if there is something they are worried about. Hopefully today has been a big enough deal to encourage him to go, if not a psychologist may help.

Are you in a position to ask his dad if anything happened while he was there that could have triggered it? That's when you think it's started?

I'd definitely push for him to talk to someone with training.

:hug: keep going strong you're being a good mum

Well he did just go to the toilet. But he did hold on, with out a word, til I offered to take him.
I might have a talk to him. Let him know that the other doctor will need to do the same as the gp did today & see if that changes his mind.

I know he wet the bed (new lounge) at his dads house. What happened there ill never know, & he'll never tell me. And I don't usually bring things like that up with the kids, because I don't want them to remember things that they'd normally forget itms. And I don't like to sound like I'm questioning their fathers care (even though I do, in a huge way!)
He wasn't with the older kids, so can't talk to them either.

It worries me that he is so scared of the doctor to examine him too.

Can you get a reference from this doctor for a pediatric psych?

That's good he went tonight in the toilet.

Also tried to pm you but your inbox is full :)

DS has always been like that. Serious attachment issues. People we spend time with every day he rarely talks to. Maybe one word answers, but will never ask for anything, or start a conversation. My parents he is ok with, but no one else. He's getting there at school & gets involved with group tasks, answering questions, etc, but won't actually interact with adults one on one. Ever.

Even as a young toddler, if a friend picked him up, he'd freeze, & panic. Only myself, ex, my parents & ex's younger sister were allowed that close.

I do worry about ex, but only to a point. Only that he would possibly go over the top with reaction or punishment for wetting the bed, or having an accident. Which may have had a lasting affect. His kids are not a priority & he wouldn't think twice about what his words could do.

The reason I don't ask the kids details etc, is because if dad says the wrong thing IMO, it may be just that, my opinion. It may mean nothing at all to the kids, or it might mean a lot. If it was over their heads & I bring it up, they may start thinking about it & reading more into it, so I tend to leave things alone unless they want to talk to me.

ETA - will clear my inbox :)

So... My boy is constipated & has a blockage in his bowel.

The doctor did know/suspect this, but didn't bother to let me know. Just sent on the referral. Told me it was for a paed, but I'm guessing the hospital may've received the referral & sent it through to the right person? Because it was a continence nurse who called. From the same hospital.

So much relief & guilt at the same time :( I lost it at him so many times. And now I think back, this started to show towards the end of last year... 9/10 months ago :( And I only just realised it might be a problem 2 - 3 months ago.

His bowel is basically stretched & he has pretty much lost the sensation to even know he needs to go! :( Feeling crummy :(

Oh that's both good and bad news: good you have some support and a path to help him but as a mummy knowing your little one is not 100% is the worst.

Try not to beat yourself up. I think your Dr could have mentioned it if he thought it was a possibility. We all have 20/20 vision in hindsight, but life is blurry and we don't have all the information laid before us. Go easy on yourself.

Hey Clover, My friends DS (4, almost 5) has the same condition (from the same cause). They are about 6 months in to a program to try to retrain his bowel and regain some sensation. I have to get the kids to school but will come back later with what I know if you are interested?

That is so good you have an answer now!

Poor little man, hopefully things improve for him and you.

Glad you have something to work with now.