Repeating prep

Hi all,
DS is 5, won't be 6 til the end of December and is in prep.
The thing is, he still seems emotionally and socially immature (compared to his big sis, but also compared to other preppies). He doesn't cope well if things don't happen the way he expects (although this can be prevented if you tell him before the change), is suddenly very emotional (but I'm putting that down to the testosterone hit they get around now since it's new). He hasn't really connected with other kids (although he apparently plays happily enough), has not been invited to any parties or play dates this year and is not confident enough to stand up for himself.
Add to that, his teacher is concerned that he is falling behind with things like cutting and other skills that the others are picking up. We brought in an OT to try to address some of this, but I don't think it's going to happen fast enough to get him where he needs to be for grade 1 next year.
The upshot is that I'm thinking about repeating him next year, but I'm unsure of any negative implications.
Can anyone give me any insight? Did you repeat your preppie? Was it a good thing or do you regret it?
Any feedback would be so welcome; I'm tying myself in knots and so very worried.

No personal experience, but hugs.

What does the teacher recommend? Are others besides the class teacher involved (eg learning support), and what do they think? Do you need their support, or to meet certain guidelines before he can repeat? What about the OT? Sounds like he doesn't have a heap of friends he'd be leaving behind, so that's a positive. An extra year might give him confidence and social skills as well as the opportunity to develop those fine motor skills.

GL with your decision.

I think prep is the best year to repeat. Two of DS1's cohort repeated prep. It's much easier as they can be told something along the lines of "you've been chosen to help the new preppies". They also don't get the notion of being held back yet. When they get to grade 1, they do have that notion.

I'd go for it. He is already one of the young ones in his year. Go with your gut. If he needs the extra time, he needs it and will thrive.

Best wishes.

I have a really good article on repeating somewhere. I can email it to you if you PM me your email address ;)

It might be online somewhere if you google

To repeat or not to repeat
Helen McGrath

I agree with Div, that first year would be the favourite to repeat. At our school that's what they prefer.
It would certainly give him time to develop at his own pace rather than being rushed so that he is up to speed.

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I have a really good article on repeating somewhere. I can email it to you if you PM me your email address ;)

It might be online somewhere if you google

To repeat or not to repeat
Helen McGrath

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Thanks for highlighting that article, in the UK there was no concept of repeating so isn't something I really understand, but that article is very interesting and also links to some others of interest, on same subject.

Glad it was helpful ;)

Thank you so much for replying, i really appreciate it.
So that article says there is no benefit. Other stuff I've found has said if the issues are maturity or social it can be beneficial.
I was kind of hoping to find someone who had done it, though, so I could know their experience.

I'm not sure how helpful this would be but my brother repeated prep approx 25 years ago. He was a handful bubba right from the start and never settled into his first year of school. I'm not too sure of what else was behind it academically/social-emotional or how he feels it effected him or if he even remembers doing it.

But on the other hand I repeated in grade 3 (I was an April baby and turned 5 the year I started school) I tended to struggle all the way and i'm sure it was the right decision for me but it was a lot to deal with socially and emotionally. I don't think it was the wrong decision but i wish it didn't have to happen.

For these reasons and more specific reasons to my children i have held all 3 of mine back to start kinder later rather than earlier.

I also have a SIL & BIL struggling with this right now. Their situation is a little more complicated as it involves moving interstate and then moving back again and trying to find where their son best fits in. It looks as though he may be repeating yr 3, at any age this is a difficult decision, my nephew is a couple of weeks off turning 10 so similar age to me and i really feel for him and his parents in trying to figure out what is best for him.

I realise that these examples don't relate a whole lot to your situation but as has been said and i passionately agree if it's necessary do it sooner rather than later.

Big hugs and good luck in making a decision.

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Thank you so much for replying, i really appreciate it.
So that article says there is no benefit. Other stuff I've found has said if the issues are maturity or social it can be beneficial.
I was kind of hoping to find someone who had done it, though, so I could know their experience.

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If you are going to do it, do it at kinder preferably, and prep at the very latest. As you said the research generally shows it may have shirt term gains, but few long term benefits and in fact there are negatives whicH outweigh the positiveS that might be there. Most of the parents and schools I have worked with who HAVE made the choice have been happy if it is prep - but every child or young person I have worked with you has done it at an older age has had pretty poor self esteem - the reality is, that most of them had learning difficulties and so academically they were behind whether or not they repeated, so repeating just reinforced their negative feelings towards themselves. It makes a big difference how it is introduced to the child as well.... "Being a helper for the new preps" tends to work better than "you are doing pep again" or repeating.

I personally and professionally probably am not a big fan of repeating - but having said that DSD was held back from starting school for the exact issues you are talking about and she is just fine... She repeated 4 y/o kinder though.

You you may like to also think about the other end.... Do you want your child to be 18 when in year 12 and 19 when finishing school? I know it seems a long way away, but it is a factor to consider. Essentially he will turn 18 at he end if year 11.

If he repeats and there is nothing new offered by the teachers to help with his areas of weakness, then it might make no difference as well. I wonder if it is worth organising for a psychological assessment to see where his learning is actually 'at' - comparing to the other preppies at his school may confuse the issue if there is a large cohort if quite capable kids, in which case he can look like he is struggling more than he is. Maybe the school can access a psychologist to do that assessment perhaps?? Or some of the universities have low cost assessment services as they use provisional psychologists to do the assessment. Just a thought...

it it is hard to make this decision - and whichever way you decide it will be okay - there will be pros and cons either way and there is no perfect decision. So feel okay with deciding what feels right for you and him. :hug:

Does the school have mixed level classes? If so if ask for him to be in a prep/1 class and kind of see how things go next year. Actual year levels aren't really referred to too much within the classroom situation in younger grades as you shouldn't be grouping based on year level but rather ability. You could ask the school to have on official record that he's a year 1 if you want, but maybe ask the teacher to refer to him as prep if needed to differentiate between the year levels. Anyway, at the end of the year you could decide if he's caught up enough or not and then decide what to do then. If you think he will be ok in year 2 the following year you could tell him he's going straight there because he's so clever and worked so hard. If you think year 1 would be best them he wouldn't know the difference if he'd been referred to as a prep all year....

Most frustrating is that I had doubts at the end of last year and asked his kindy teachers. They said no, he'll get through ok; maybe because it's harder to organise a second year of kinder?
I have filled out the forms so that a psych can evaluate him, give an IQ test, whatever they need to do. I don't really think he has learning difficulties as such, I just think he needs more time. He's coming along with reading, numbers etc, but his co-ordination and cutting and writing are not there yet.
If we do this I think we are just going to tell him we want him to get more practice in before grade 1?
Myturn, why is being 18 in year 12 a cause for concern?

If it's any help at all I remember quite a few kids in my (3 different!) high schools that had been held back and done a second year of prep. It was never a big deal, just oh I'm older because I repeated prep. No one ever teased them or bothered them and it was not shameful or anything, even in Year 7. Hope that helps!

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Myturn, why is being 18 in year 12 a cause for concern?

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It might not be for you. And I am not suggesting it is. But some people might be concerned about access to alcohol and driving and essentially being an adult in an environment designed for children.

The issue that can be a problem is for children with disabilities who finish at the special school the year they turn 18, so if they repeat sometime they miss a year of schooling in the special school which has caused some parents angst - it's an issue for kids whose birthday is at the end of a year - rather than the start - plus I am specifically talking about kids with an intellectual disability or physical disability that makes them eligible for funding through the department of education in Victoria and attending specific schools - rather than those in a mainstream school.

But there are of course positives about being older in a particular grade as well. Reality is there is no perfect answer and whatever decision you make you need to ensure that the teachers are going to help build up his areas of weakness as best they can.

Ah, I see.
I repeated year 11, so I turned 18 in year 12. I wasn't sure what the concern would be.
I think it's what is going to happen, but I worry. Mostly I think he's just immature, but what if I'm wrong?
What if his resilience doesn't increase and he never figures out how to connect socially or protect himself?
What if, what if, hey? It's ok. I know there are no answers and I just need to go with my gut. I just don't want to get it wrong and break him.

Can I pls hijack for a second here?
Myturn, I gather you work in child psychology?
I read the article that you posted about earlier in this thread, and there is a question that doesn't seem to be answered.
If it has been shown that repeating makes no difference to the eventual out come to the child's academic performance, it's it then proven or accepted that keeping with their peers is BETTER from an academic point of view?
Or do you just accept that if your prep child is struggling, then they will continue to struggle throughout their school career, because delaying school entry or repeating them is pointless?

I am currently trying to decide weather to delay entry (next year) for my ds. (He will turn 5 in April next year)
He does not seem to be on a par with his current kindly peers either academically or socially (he prefers to play with the kid in the room below him)

The school special needs teacher is assessing him today at kindy, so hopefully she can shed some light.

Everyone keeps telling me to send hi, and if he doesn't cope, they will keep him back.
But I don't want to send him if he is not ready, it feels to me like I am setting him up to fail.
:(

I am speaking on behalf of my husband here. He was sent to school at 4 and a half. A anemic ally he was fine, but he was an anxious child (still suffers with anxiety as an adult). he repeated grade 5 at his school, and it was a small country school so wasn't due to large class size. He has said that it was the best thing that ever happened to him. That being said he was very strong on the opinion that if we had a child close to the cut off they would bet starting older rather than younger.

As a kindergarten teacher I always encourage families to give children more time and I can clearly see the children in my class who are older get SO much more out of kinder. I think go with your gut. I recon giving him more time now and the chance to grow some more and be the big kid in the class instead of one of the younger children would be a great advantage.

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Ah, I see.
I repeated year 11, so I turned 18 in year 12. I wasn't sure what the concern would be.
I think it's what is going to happen, but I worry. Mostly I think he's just immature, but what if I'm wrong?
What if his resilience doesn't increase and he never figures out how to connect socially or protect himself?
What if, what if, hey? It's ok. I know there are no answers and I just need to go with my gut. I just don't want to get it wrong and break him.

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Whichever way you go, the will be positives, and negatives,and neither way is terrible.... Just because the research doesn't really support repeating doesn't mean EVERY will have a poor outcome- research is just research... I posted that article caused think its a good summary of the issues. If you are gong to do it, absolutely prep is the best year to do so. Even if he is not immature and there is more going on, as long as it is introduced as a positive thing for him it will turn out okay.

Being a parent is hard work :hug:

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Can I pls hijack for a second here?
Myturn, I gather you work in child psychology?
I read the article that you posted about earlier in this thread, and there is a question that doesn't seem to be answered.
If it has been shown that repeating makes no difference to the eventual out come to the child's academic performance, it's it then proven or accepted that keeping with their peers is BETTER from an academic point of view?
Or do you just accept that if your prep child is struggling, then they will continue to struggle throughout their school career, because delaying school entry or repeating them is pointless?

I am currently trying to decide weather to delay entry (next year) for my ds. (He will turn 5 in April next year)
He does not seem to be on a par with his current kindly peers either academically or socially (he prefers to play with the kid in the room below him)

The school special needs teacher is assessing him today at kindy, so hopefully she can shed some light.

Everyone keeps telling me to send hi, and if he doesn't cope, they will keep him back.
But I don't want to send him if he is not ready, it feels to me like I am setting him up to fail.
:(

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I guess there are different questions here -

A direct link to staying with your peers being better can't be made.... Of course children still improve and you can't say that they will always struggle, having said that, if your child has a diagnosed disability then the trajectory of improvement/learning will be different to a typically developing child. Personally I think if you are not sure, holding him back a year would be better than repeating once he gets there. I have not been able to find good research about whether holding a child back is a good idea or not, there is mixed research as far as I can see - and i have looked!!! Its a question I face a lot!

There are always going to be some kids who do well and some kids that struggle, I would love to say that every child has the capacity to achieve to a certain level, but the reality is, some kids struggle more than others, and always do.

We need to name sure as parents we are advocating for their needs, rather than pushing for them to achieve more. I think it sounds like you are doing exactly that. :hug: sorry to hear you are finding the decision difficult . See what the special ed teacher finds and that may help you make a decision. :hug:

Thanks for that, the special ed teacher said to defiantly hold him back, he is nowhere near ready.
I am happy with the outcome, but I will be seeking further intervention for him as I feel that he may need a little more help than just time to mature.
Thanks :)

Well, it's official. After meeting with the psych, teacher and vp today we are keeping ds in prep for another year. I get it, I know it's right, I'm just so very sad.
In the last couple of days he has got his first party invitation for the year and started talking about who he wants to invite to his birthday, so he's definitely moving forward, I just don't think it's enough. He's also still struggling with fine and gross motor skills.
But he has also started talking about going int grade 1 next year, and now we have to tell him he isn't.
We're going to go with 'there are some things we want you to get more practice with before you start grade 1', but I still can't predict how he will take it. I think we'll hold off til Friday so he has the weekend to process it.
I don't want to hurt his feelings

Lara, I am sorry you feel sad, but you are doing the right thing.
Come 2 weeks into the new term next year, it is likely your DS will have forgotten about grade one anyway.
He will have new friends.

As for telling him he is staying in prep, can you come at it from the angle that he is needed to help show the new kids about how prep works?
Maybe you could talk to his teacher about making him her special helper with the new kids.
Just an option.
Good luck.

Thanks, LTD, I thought about that, but I don't want him to feel like it's his job or responsibility. It's something he would take very seriously. We will list it as a perk, though, that he can help them get settled.

Thanks for the update. Sorry that you are sad about the decision. How did the school and psych suggest you frame the news? Is there a prep/1 composite class he can go into? Would that ease the transition?

They didn't really give me much, but no, there are no composites.
We've decided to hold off til Friday to tell him so he will have the weekend to process.
Deep breaths

Good on you. A wise decision... You've given your son a great gift. The opportunity to grow more and the gift of time.

:hug: Our eldest repeated kinder and it was by far the best thing we could have done for him. He's pretty switched on academically, but socially/emotionally he desperately needed that extra year. (And I'm slightly excited at the prospect of him doing the school run occasionally in year 12. I hope it'll be allowed!)
Can the teacher help you with breaking the news? They might have some experience with others who've had to repeat prep and might have some thoughts on the best way to explain it? Is it the type of school where kids from different year levels play together? If it's a smallish school, he'll still see his old friends in the schoolyard.

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Can the teacher help you with breaking the news? They might have some experience with others who've had to repeat prep and might have some thoughts on the best way to explain it? Is it the type of school where kids from different year levels play together? If it's a smallish school, he'll still see his old friends in the schoolyard.

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I hadn't thought of that, but it's a good idea. Thanks

Well, we told him yesterday morning, snuggled up in bed before his sister had woken up.
His first reaction was no, he didn't want to, but didn't get upset really. He had a few questions, but not as much as I expected.
I actually thought we would get more once he'd gone to bed because that's where he does his processing, but nothing as yet. He's either forgotten all about it or he's turning it over in his head still.