High hcg and NT scan.

So, more dramas for me. Why can't everything just be easy??
Anyway, my Dr has just referred me to a hospital and on the referral she put my BT results. The hcg was 175000 at 8wks and 195000 at 8wks 3days. Anyway, so the hospital writes back and says to get follow-up tests including the NT scan and the blood tests to go with it. Why are they stressing me out. The Dr showed me a graph that showed I was at the higher end of normal for hcg but not out of the normal range and still 1 in 10 people would have the same hcg results as me. So now I'm expecting that the NT scan results won't be very good and I'll have to decide if I want further testing or not :( I'm not sure I would actually have an amnio b/c of the risk of m/c but still I'll be worrying for the rest of my pregnancy if something is wrong with the baby. I don't feel like anything is wrong if that counts for anything, I think that everything will be fine. It just makes me angry the stupid hospital has to make such a big deal. They even said at the 18wk scan to check the placenta to make sure it's ok and that after birth the placenta will be sent off for testing. Hello!! It was one blood test!! That's a bit extreme isn't it?? And anyway, it's my placenta, how about ask me if you want to do something with it!!

Sorry, just had to get that off my chest. Has anyone else been told the same thing after high hcg results?? I had a scan at 9 1/2 weeks and everything looked fine so far. Next time I won't even bother with a blood test, then they have nothing to complain about!

Oh SJ - :hug: Just what you didn't need.

I'm sorry to hear they are stressing you out, they are probably just trying to be thorough. My Ob does an NT for ALL of his patients regardless of age, medical history, family background etc. The NT scan goes for a little while so at least it will be a good opportunity to get a good look at bubs. If you feel like everything is good then it will be and there will be no need for CVS cause your NT tests will be fine.

:hug::hug::hug: Sounds like you need to spoil yourself and do something nice this weekend.

ah the wonders of modern medicine

oh SJ, I am sorry this isnt easy for you this time, yet again!

Look - until they have a reason to say anything is wrong they should just let you relax and enjoy!

And with the CVS - I was terrified, absolutely terrified to have it done. Until the doctor who was performing it sat em down and said "look, so that you understand the level of medicine that i practice at, to me thsi is just a needle. I actaully perform open heart foetal surgery. Remember, all your ob and i want for you is a happy healthy baby - and i wouldnt put you or your child at risk if i beleived there was any. In all honesty i believe that if there is a miscarriage then it was more than likely going to occur, with or without the CVS".

Well i couldnt argue with that, and having the reassurance after the CVS was done was just soooo much better than stressing the whole pregnancy.

So, we paid extra to have the CVS done at Sydney ultra sound for women - with 24 hour results. But even though we paid more up front, the cost pushed us over the saftey net amount and we got 80% of the total cost back.

Try to relax bella and let your little bean nuture in your belly :)

Thankyou AJC and Kitten.
It's just so annoying, I wasn't even going to have the scan in the first place and now I have to worry about it for what seems like a stupid reason because my levels weren't even abnormal!!
Ahh...I think I'm really going to be sick of hospitals and drs by the end of this, lol, I hope I get into the birth centre!

sara id have the NT scan done and the serum bloodtests to make sure all is ok at that 12 week mark. i guess you have to make the decision that if there is anything wrong would you be happy to continue the pregnancy, what if something major was wrong at teh 20 weeks scan, what would happen. obviously the desicion is solely yours and your partners to make.
id take it one step at a time, get these less invasive test done and go from there :hug: it cant be easy and must be very stressfull, i know your doing waht best for you and bubs :hug:

They are probably just trying to be thorough so try not to stress. They do this whenever something comes up out of the ordinary. Due to an abnormal NT scan I had to have a scan to check on growth at 32 weeks and that then lead to another one to check the blood flow through the cord as that had come up as being on the high end of normal. In total I had 8 scans. Each time they suggested a problem i would worry myself sick and there was never ever a reason to do so.

When I had my NT scan I came in with a 1/37 chance of downs due to age and a 4.2 NT measurement. Amnio was suggested (as it's thought that it has 1/2 the m/c risk of CVS) and I did not hesitate in having one done. It was painless and I didn't get any cramping either. The lead up to the test and waiting for the results was the hard bit, not the procedure itself.

Like Kitt3n said the medical profession isn't even sure that CVS or amnio does increase the m/c risk. It could be that when women m/c after a procedure that they were going to miscarry anyway. There's no way of telling.

Try not to stress about it, more than likely all will be well when you get the NT test done.

Whats the problem with high(er) HCG anyway?

Did they tell you?

Thankyou AJP and satya. I am going to go ahead with the scan. Hopefully it'll just be good results then I won't even have to worry.

Lulu- apparently higher hcg can indicate chromosomal problems or DS. But it's not actually the level of hcg, it's that it doesn't go down later in pregnancy which is common in DS pregnancies. So who knows why they think a BT at 8 wks is relevant.

hi Sara Jane

Sorry you are having to go through this, these medical professionals sometimes make mountains out of molehills and worry the poor mums to death, do they not undersatnd stress they put people under!!!
My HCG results were similar to yours and although my doctor resquested an early scan to check the dates, nothing has been mentioned about any other problems relating to the HCG results, if I hadn't read about the issues you are facing I would be completely oblivious.
I am having the NT scan on the 6th August, my risk of problems will be higher than average due to age (at 37 I am classed as an older mum, according to the way some of the doctors talk, practically geriatric, should be using a walking frame and getting my pension by now I think, lol), looking forward to seeing bubs, and trying not to worry about the results.
Hope all goes well, and try not to worry, these medical people are all jobs worth!!!
Take care,

Hi Sara Jane,

Sorry this has been stressful for you. I can't offer a lot of advice which has not already been said.

In my case I had the NT scan which showed to be ok but when I had the bloods done I had soft markers for downs and was given a 1:113. Due to the risk of m/c we decided against CVS/Amino but to wait till my 18wk scan as to see whether there were any physical defects that would indicate downs (eg no nasal nose, extra digit, heart problems etc). Fortunately everything was fine and I have a perfectly healthy 2yo. I have been told by a few obs that there is a high chance of "false positive" readings when it comes to the blood work. I would say have the NT and if the measurement is in the normal bracket and if bubs is looking fine than just relax.

Take care

Oh just wanted to add - when I fell pregnant the third time we decided not to even had the blood work done (which you have done with the NT scan) as I didn't want to go through the stress like last time. My Ob just did a normal scan for me in his room, measured the thickness (which was normal) and I left it at that.

SJ, I'm sure everything is fine for you, especially given that your levels are still within the normal range. But high HCG levels can occasionally be indicative that something's not quite right. I know you feel annoyed with the hospital, but they are only doing what they're there for. It would be terrible if you needed something, but they didn't do it, just so as not to stress you out!

I personally would have all the 12 week testing done and see where that lands you......you might find that you have excellent results and can then go on to have a happy and stress-free pg! Of course, it's a decision that only you and your partner can make, and you need to feel comfortable with it.

Good luck :hug:

Big hugs it is always scary when we are thrown a curve ball... :hug:

Higher than average Free BHCG levels between 11 weeks and approx 5 days and 13 weeks and approx 5 days occur sometimes in babies with chromososmal challenges. Coupled usually with low PAPP-A levels. That is a fact. However, they also occur when there is not a problem.

Please please remember that these are all SCREENING tests. They are not definitive and cannot be wrong or right. They can indicate a possible issue but do not by any means conculsively decide it.

When you enter into a screening test you should be made aware that it is just that -screening. Yes, there is a risk of a "false ?positive" but then you can decide wheather to continue on with more invasive testing or to wait. It can be very traumatic - and I feel so very much for you.

It is universally accepted that CVS and amniocentesis carry a risk of miscarriage - a needle is invading the gestational space... However, these risks are lower with some clinicians than with others. Ask for their stats and then make your decision if you decide on invasive testing.

It must be remembered that a high free hcg and low papp-A can occur with an otherwise "normal" nt u/s. This will increase your risk ratio. Many clinicians will conuduct a very thorough u/s including facial bones, etc - the heart is impossible to u/s fully at this gestation.

My advice is to take it a step at a time. Yes, that hcg is a little high but in the absence of anything else it can just be a quirk.

Sending you a big squishy understanding hug my love... :hug:

Tracey- Thankyou, I was hoping you would come in here because I knew you had similar results to me. It's good to know they didn't say anything to you about it. The letter they sent back said something like they recieved the referral and asked a consultant what to do and he said do these tests. Sounds like they just said we have someone with high hcg levels what should we do and he said oh well may as well do these other tests. Meanwhile it makes it look to me like they think something is wrong. Very annoying.

Diamond- Thankyou for your advice, that is a good idea about waiting till the 18wk scan to see if there are any other markers, depending on the NT results. I will think about that if the results come back high risk just coz of the blood tests.

Janie- Thankyou, yes I'm definately having the NT scan, lets just hope all is good and I don't even have to worry about making a decision about further testing :crossfingers:

Flowerchild- Thankyou for all your information and advice. Hopefully it's just a normal hcg for me and nothing to even worry about.

So, as I said, I definately am having the scan done but I'm just dissapointed :( I feel like I can't be too excited about it now because something might be wrong and I can't tell anyone until I know everything is alright. I'm supposed to be all excited and happy now and it's not fair!!
Thanks for listening guys!! :hug:

OK - this is NOT meant to add to your stress but in response to the reason for the placental assessment after the delivery of your baby. Elevated HCG levels can also be an indication of a molar pregnancy where there is an abnormal proliferation of cells. If this is the case, additional treatment may be required. Usually a normally progressing pregnancy is a really good sign but it is still something they would monitor throughout and after delivery to ensure the HCG levels fall back to normal.

That's what was on my mind Michelle ;)

Given that you've already had a successful ultrasound SJ, I'm sure that everything will be okay. Pg after loss is always stressful, make sure you lean on your friends who understand :hug:

:hug: SJ. You're bubba isn't making this easy for you!!

I can't offer more advice as the other lovely ladies have said everything I would. Just wanted to give you a :hug: I'm sure everything will be fine sweet.

SJ - Ohh hun, I am so sorry you are feeling as tho you cant enjoy this pgcy atm. I know exactly what you mean. It took me up until 24weeks into this pgcy to feel as tho I can start to relax and enjoy. I hope all comes back well with your NT scan. I too had the cvs with this one as I figured if I didnt find out a result, then I would be so stressed out this whole pgcy and that wasnt any good for bubs either. Have to say it was the longest 24weeks of my life. I hope you dont have to wait that long for you to start enjoying this pgcy hun. Take Care hun, we are all here praying and thinking of you. :hug:

Thankyou everyone for all your responses and support :)

Michelle- Yep, my GP said that was probably what they were on about with the placenta but said this is very rare and I've already had a scan showing the baby was ok. If it was a molar pregnancy it is very very unlikely I would have made it this far, there wouldn't even be a baby. And if it was a partial molar it's unlikely I would have made it this far either and extremely unlikely I would make it to the end!! I find it a bit weird they start thinking about all this from a blood test at 8 weeks that was still in the normal range. Maybe they like stressing people out, lol. At least they're thourough!!

The higher end of normal always makes the medical profession think worst case scenario - not good for us but yes, at least they are thorough ;) An elevated HCG makes us consider multiple pregnancy and molar pregnancy (we routinely test HCG levels in hyperemesis due to these risks) so it is *normal* for us to consider it - even though it is rare. The consequences are nasty so it is better to be over vigilant than not vigilant enough.

Make sure you use us to keep you sane (although I can't vouch for the sanity of those of us supporting you :rofl:) It is a tough road to walk after you have experienced a loss and some days will be more stressful than others. Unfortunately, there are many of us who have BTDT and we are more than happy to help you through :hug:

Hi SJ, sorry to hear about this stressful time.

My Hcg was actually higher than yours at 8w1d. I had to go to emergency due to bleeding, and they did bloods and my level came back as 234,000! They asked if there was only one in there. I had had a scan the previous week which showed everything was fine and there was only one. They then asked if I was over 12 weeks! They ended up doing a scan the next day, which measured at 8w2d.

Nothing was ever mentioned to me about any problems there might be. I was given a referral for the 12w scan, which I had last week. The scan went well and everything looked fine. I had the bloods done as well, and i'm just waiting for the results to that, which I should hopefully get tomorrow.

I don't know why my levels are/were soo high. At 4w5d, my level was 11800, and the doc said I was 6-7 weeks, which I knew I wasn't.

Now I'm a little concerned!! The only thing I keep telling myself is that i've had a previous miscarriage, so maybe my body is making more than enough Hcg to make this one stick!

I hope everything goes ok with your scan and tests. If you feel that everything is ok, then i'm sure it will be. :hug:

D :pray:

Oh Deevine, I'm sorry to make you worry now!! Thankyou for sharing your experience tho, it's good to know there are others out there the same and I'm not just weird!! lol. Glad the scan went well! Let me know how you go with the results!!

Michelle- Thankyou :hug:

Nup Sara! All will be just perfect with your NT scan at 12 weeks :) you have nothing to worry about.... now is the time for you to enjoy your pregnancy as you are nearly 12weeks!!! woohoo!! Don't let them stress you out for no reason.... you have every reason to believe your baby is just fine!!! chances are he/she will be!! Most babies are born perfectly healthy remember that.

Thankyou Ren!! I keep thinking positively. I really don't feel like anything is wrong. But you know, there's always that bit of doubt after the m.c coz I tried to be positive then and things went wrong. But I have to remember this pregnancy has been so different from the start so hopefully that means everything will be perfect this time!

Hi Sara,

I got my results back. Now remember, my Hcg levels were much higher than yours.

I was told my risk for Down's, with regards to maternal age, would be 1:3000. My risk came back as 1:15000!! And for Trisomy 13 and 18, came back as 1:29000! (I'm thinking this is pretty good right?)

So, please do not stress yourself out. I know exactly how you are feeling after a m/c. But I feel like I can finally breathe now. It actually feels like i'm going to have this baby. You WILL enjoy this pregnancy, you deserve to.

I have everything crossed for you, but you will not need any luck because everything WILL be fine. :D

D :dance:

They are great odds Deevine. Congratulations! :hug:

You have made my day Deevine!!!! Thankyou.
That's great news, congrats!! You must be feeling so good right now!

ETA- when are you supposed to have the 12wk scan. I'm having mine at 13 wks, that's ok isn't it??

SJ, my 12 week scan isn't til 13.5 weeks! Apparently its fine :D

Thanks Flowerchild. :hug:

Sara, glad I could brighten the day for you! I think you can have the scan anywhere up to 13w6d. You'll get to see a fair bit at the scan... it will take your breath away! Soo amazing :D

D xoxo

Thought I would update you all.
I had my NT scan today. I was so nervous!! But everything was fine!! Little bubba is 7.5cm from head to bum and was jumping around everywhere!!
Got great results, am very low risk. Risk for DS was 1: 20,500 and for Trisomy 18 & 13 was 1:39,000!!!!!! So happy!! Stupid hospital making me worry for no good reason!!
Placenta was looking good too!

Thats great news SJ!!! :hooray:

fantastic!!! thats a major woo hoo!!!!:dance:

Congratulations SJ, so glad all went well for you. Wonderful news. :hug:

That is a fantastic result after so much stress! Hope you are able to relax and enjoy it a bit more now... :hug:

Great result. I hope that's an end to the worries with this pregnancy.

thats great news

Thanks guys :) Very excited still. I couldn't sleep last night coz I was still so excited that there's actually a baby in there and trying to get my head around the fact that I will actually have a baby in February. Have been too scared to let myself think too far ahead yet.

Thats fantastic news SJ!!!!!! I'm so happy for you.

Now sit back & relax... enjoy the rest of your pregnancy hun!!

WOOHOO!!!! I am so glad your results came back perfect! Time to enjoy your pregnancy :D :hug: