She Wont Sleep!!

Ok, I will try to keep this brief.

DD is 2 months old. 11pm - 2am is her 'awake' time. Not happy awake either. Cranky, crying, irritable awake.

I have tried everything. Keeping her awake during the day doesn't work and just tires me out more.
Once she's asleep at night she stays that way until she needs a feed, then goes back off to sleep, but it's the getting her off to sleep before 2am that I just can't seem to do!
She feeds 2hrly during the day and 2-3hrly overnight.

DF has said numerous times to just let her 'cry it out', but I don't understand this, as we decided NOT to do this?!?!?! I guess because he can just go to bed he doesn't have to deal with it. :wall:

Anyway, is anyone else in the same boat, and if yes, HOW can I get this baby to sleep? :pray:

Im losing my mind here, I am sooooooo tired. She is such a high needs baby....have I done this by not letting her soothe herself? She is never alone and is rarely not being held or worn......have I made a mistake? I am really doubting myself right now...:cry:

Have you got a night time routine?? Ours is very loose but DS likes it. He has a bum change, his dinner, a nice bath and a swaddle with kisses. We pop in his dummy and he's asleep within minutes and sleeps through.
HTH

We had this sort of problem - between midnight and 4am was time-to-scream-lots. He did grow out of the screaming in month 3! And then it took another month to bring bedtime back to midnight rather than 4am...We now have a champion sleeper - there is hope.
Can you do split shifts with your DH, so that you go to bed really early (like when Caleb does), and he has bub and wakes you when he wants to go to bed - that way you'll be better able to cope with the night shift.

A bath, sleepy music, lots of BF (every hour in the evenings), much rocking, massaging out the farts all helped. We had a 2 hour rule as well, and would swap after 2 hours, which was the limit of the amount of being yelled at either of us could take.

And have something for you to do, so that you're not bored as well as being screamed at - jigsaw puzzles, the late night cricket broadcast, reading online books, anything at all!

We didn't seriously try "crying it out" - we learnt that if he didn't settle with a few minutes of wingeing then he was only going to get more upset and irate if left.

Maybe try more day sleeping rather than less - you might at least have a happy awake baby rather than a surly one. Do you co-sleep all the time (ie are her day-sleeps in a different place, with different smells and people than her night sleeps??) Any chance that not co-sleeping might be worth a try?

Another thought - have you tried wrapping much more loosely (maybe even with arms free)? We found that he needed to be able to really wriggle to sleep happily.
big hugs
Kate

Kell :hug: HUGE hugs to you!

Can I say firstly that you are doing a fantastic mummy job. It's hard to not doubt the techniques though, I know, especially when people around you are quck to judge and offer 'advice' like 'cry it out' sleep training. Jazz went through a funny bit where 2am was wake up and cry time, and as soon as I put her down... ANYWHERE... she's scream like I laid her on a bed of nails. I think I remember you read "Science of Parenting"? Its hard but in the times when you're rocking DD and shes screaming her head off that you're doing the best thing for her :hug: Its enough to want to rip out your hair one strand at a time when bubs are screaming the neighbourhood down at 1am, but don't doubt yourself and your mummy instincts.

I don't know if this is something that would work, and to be honest I don't know if its the reason Jazz sleeps, but I think that the EBM bottle I give her at bedtime helps to tide her over from 8-9pm until about 4am. I don't know what it is, maybe that she gets more from the bottle, or that it comes out quicker than the boob (not much quicker though, they're very slow teats) so she doesn't fall asleep before she has it all, but I do think that it helps her to sleep.

A LC also suggested giving Jazz 20-30mL of cooled and VERY weak chamomile tea (no sugar, hooney, milk obviously). I haven't tried it though, but I probably would if she got all funny again. I have heard though that it shouldn't be used before 6 months, though the LC told me last week to try it if Jazz was unsettled.

I know you've tried pretty much everything else so I don't have much more to suggest, I don't know if you've tried this, but if youhaven't I hope that it helps. If you have :hug: and I hope you find something that works and helps get Seven off to sleep.

:hug::hug:
Kell its so tough when you have a baby that likes to party in the wee hours! Your doing a fantastic job! You have made no mistake in loving your baby and choosing not to let her "cry it out". I thik our DH dont really understand sometimes. My DH would say just let hime cry because he didnt understand the consequnces, he now knows after me nagging him to read the science of paretning lol
I am sure this will pass but its hard when you have no sleep and a crying baby! Have you tried co sleeping? This may help for the time being? Also she may have only just realised she is alive! so she may have become sensitve to everything?
DS did go through this but settled after we began co sleeping, he is just loves to be near me like most babies. But this doesnt always work for everyone! there is a light at then end of the tunnel!

Please folow your instincts and do what you think is right for your and bubs! Good luck xxx

I second the idea of more daytime sleeps. Babies are wierd, the more they sleep, the MORE they sleep. Keeping them up just gets them overtired, oversensitive and over EVERYTHING!

Kates tag team approach is great - we did that too as there is only a certain amount of yelling anyone can take. I'm sure it wont last too long, stick with a routine even if its loose, she's pretty young to be in a routine yet but she will pick up on dark time quiet = nigh nighs after awhile.
Why don't you see if you can pick up a copy of Dunstan Baby Language? It came out when my kids were older but I saw it on Oprah and I was pretty impressed.

Please, please don't second guess yourself about holding bubs alot - its what she needs. She may respond to patting and ssshhh sssh ssshhhing when she is in her bassinette too. Being held MAY overload her, its hard to say. But keep close to her.

It made it easier on me when I thought in longer terms (hard during the still of the night, I know!), ie I will try this for 2 weeks or a month and if it gets better within that time woo hoo, if not I will try something else.

Hang in there mumma xoxoxoxo

Kel first of all big hugs honey :hug: I know you're having such a hard run at the moment
When she's crying at night do you get the feeling its because something's wrong (eg she's in pain?) or is it more like she's overtired?
How does she sleep during the day? does she sleep in the same place that you sleep at night? does she need to be held or rocked or in the sling to sleep during the day?
Are there any baby sleep books you've read that didn't work so we don't suggest things you've already tried?

Oh, Kell, one more thing I just thought of. When you put her down at night do you use background noise like radio/TV? I am like you and during the day Jazz sleeps near me 99% of the time, so has lerant to sleep throuhg the noise I make, but then at night she'd go crazy in the silence.

Again, you've probably already thought of it, but just thought I'd mention it.

I second about getting more day sleep, it should hopefully help things. My DD2 went through similar stage, just a bit earlier in the evening. Baths helped her, she really enjoyed them and would stop screaming. Her problem was that she does not burp easily, active burping would not work I would have to hold her upright and just walk normally around the house, not too much jiggling etc it would just over stimulate her. Brauers Colic Relief helped a lot, often a burp would come up after the first dose and she would seem happier. Also when times were desperate white noise worked wonders, I would just switch on the dust buster and she would just drop to sleep in my arms. The type of hold used made a big difference. I would lay her tummy down, across my arm, with my hand between her legs and gently pat her back. She would often drift off to sleep.

:hug: it is hard, but they do get through it.

Rhyb ~ Unfortunately I have been slack and haven't started a routine. Am going to start one tonight - which will require involvement from DF! Seven won't take a dummy, so we will see how we go. I am planning on: Bath, Massage, Dim Lights, Feed, Swaddle, Bed. Wish me luck!

Kmm ~ During the day, Seven sleeps in her pram, on the couch, in her bouncer, in the car. We don't sleep together during the day. And, lately, I have been trying to get her to sleep in her basinnet at night. This is mainly due to pressure from DF. He seems to think that we will both sleep better if she is in her own bed. Seven actually sleeps better in bed with me. Have tried the more sleep during the day trick too, and it still doesn't work. She just wants to be up and is not happy unless I am holding her. As for DF letting me go to bed early and having Seven for a while...NOT going to work. He's tired you see - he works! Pfft, what does he think I do? He can handle Seven for about 5-15mins before getting frustrated. He's not much help in these situations, but great when she is happy!

Leash ~ Seven wont take a bottle! So that idea is out! But thanks! LOL. I might try drinking chamomile tea myself, to see if that helps her. And no, I haven't thought to put background noise on for the night sleep. She does go to sleep with lots of noise around, so maybe I will try sleeping with the radio on tonight.

Boomba ~ Thanks for that. I have read the Baby Sleep Book and Seven and I do co-sleep. It works so much better than not for us.

Lulu ~ We have the Dunstan DVD. Brilliant isn't it? Tag team? Whats that - DF got up at 1am because Seven was screaming, suggested I take her to the Dr and went back to bed. Tag team at its best I would say!

Astrid ~ Brauers would have made a fortune out of me by now! I love the stuff!

Thankyou all for your support and ideas. I will keep you posted on how tonight goes!
I will also try and let her sleep during the day when she wants to...I am scared about that, but will try it anyway.

I had the impression that before 11 she was reasonably happy - is there a time when she is happy when you can put Dad to work and have a bit of a break yourself??

Try the Sounds for Silence CD! You can google it and listen to some of it! It is noises made by a peadiatrician that babies respond well too like wooshing and swhooshing noises! It also has some mozart music on there to use while you are feeding to help settle! Babies are used to loud noises from being in your belly so they respond well to this!
It worked well for me when my bubs wouldn't sleep at night!!! Put a cd player in his room and played it up loud if he was crying then turned it down softer once he fell asleep...it even put me to sleep a few times..lol!!!!

Ok, so after a bit of an 'off' day, I told DF that tonight we were starting a 'bedtime routine' and he had to be involved.

So at 9.30 this is what we did:
Very dim lights, nice calm, quiet house.
Nice deep warm bath.
Massage.
Wrap.
Nice snuggly feed.
Burp.
Snuggles and rocking with Daddy.
She settle in DF's arms, but didn't go to sleep, so I put her in her sling, and that is where she now is, asleep. I will leave her in there a little longer and try and put her in her bassinet.

DF came to the party tonight, and I voiced to him that I can't do this alone. He did bring up the fact that he works and is tired, but we didn't argue about it.
I said we were going to do this routine every night to get Seven used to it.
Cross your fingers!!!

Hey Kell

Sounds like things are going a bit better! Well done!!!

One thing that worked for us was 'cluster feeding'.

Between the hours of 5-7pm, I used to offer DS as many feeds as possible! Sometimes it was a feed every 30+ minutes. Might only be little feeds...

Found this helped him to settle with a nice full tummy and sleep a little longer.

Might be worthwhile giving it a try...

Good luck!

Thanks Monnie ~ I might try that tomorrow night as well as the nighttime routine!

Well I thought last night was going to be a shocker.

I bathed Seven with Lavender oil in her bath, gave her a nice massage, and then went to bed to feed her. She didn?t want that. So, at 10.30 she fell asleep in my arms. I thought she would be due for a feed as her last one was at 8.20pm. I stayed up for a while, thinking that if I tried to go to bed she would wake up and it would be all over red rover, and we would start our nightly 11pm scream session.
Well, guess what? Seven slept with me (once I plucked up the courage to go to bed!) until 1.15am! That?s almost 5 hrs! Then, just to prove that she is a good girl after all, she waited until 4.55am before her next feed! :clap:

I was ready to call an ambulance she?s NEVER gone that long between feeds!!!! LOL :lol:

I also noticed today, that she is happy with the dummy instead of jumping straight on the breast at 2hrs after a feed, so this is AWESOME! :clap:

She is still a Velcro baby most of the day, but one thing at a time.

Hopefully tonight is a repeat performance of last night, even if she doesn?t go 5 hrs, as long as she goes to sleep earlyish and stays that way between feeds!

Wish us luck!!!!:pray:

Congratulations with the new routine, how is it going? One thing I did with my girls was during the day I sometimes put the bassinet in the lounge where they could see/hear me.

Hey Rivlas,

Well, we had a couple of ****ty nights where Seven did not go to sleep until 2am, no screaming, but still, she was wide awake, and then the last 2 nights have been brilliant. The 2 nights that were sucky were ones that we didn't use 'The Routine' so it's obviuos that she has come to rely on it for sleep time, which is fine by me. I went to CYH yesterday and we are going to try moving 'The Routine' up a few hours instead of later at night when we have been doing it.
Seven has a cold at the moment so she is not a happy little baby.
Most of the time when she is awake she in in arms during the day, because she likes to be with me.

Great to hear that things are settling down. Don't try much while she has a cold as she is out of sorts already. Maybe bring her bed time forward 30 minutes at a time and ease her into it. I know that when my kids were sick routine went out the window for a night or two then we were back to normal. Keep using the carrier if she settles that way as she will soon enjoy being on the floor looking at everything.