chiro says c-section, ob says not.

In '96' i had some x-rays on my back and the chiro said to me i'll have to have a c-section cause a baby wouldn't pass through naturally. i didn't think of it at the time nor did i ask any questions....i was only 16.
my mum told me she has the same thing and had 4 c-sections and recently my sister had a emergency c-section and they found the shape of her pelvis to not allow a baby through after 13 hrs of labor.
anyway my dilemma is i went to see my ob at a public hospital a few weeks ago and he basically said to me you can't tell from a x-ray whether you need a c-section or not. i told him how my mum saw a specialist ob, 28yrs ago and he told her, but my ob didn't want a bar of it.
i thought he was really rude and when i told him i'd bring in the x-rays he said to me he didn't want to see them, only the findings. but i've read the findings from the chiro and it doesn't have anything on it about that.
he said a chiro isn't a gynae/ob and i shouldn't pay any attention to it, but to me it's a little more than coincidence.
he said based only on my family history would he write down i may need a c-section, and i have a big decision to make.
i want to start thinking of delivery and i'm worried about it all. i rang the chiro and my timing is right off he's out of the country for 12 months....:wall:
do you think i should go and show the xrays to another chiro and get their opinion or just push for a ceasar and hope it's the right decision.
i personally think some dr's just don't want to be told what to do....
sorry about the long rant, i'm just confused.

I think your OB is doing a good thing not relying on just an xray alone as a reason for you not being able to birth your baby vaginally.
You pelvic ligaments are soft and they stretch to accommodate the baby. It really is an unknown just how much it can open. Also the position you birth in has a lot to do with it ie squatting opens up the pelvis a lot more than being on your back. Ask your mum and your sister what positions they were in.

I can understand why you're worried - it would be hard to get something like that out of your mind once it's been planted there.

But I guess you could also look at it this way ... if it was as easy as looking at an x-ray, then obs would be sending everyone off for one and saving us all a lot of time and trouble.

Honestly, I would think the answer is maybe you can, maybe you can't but the only way of finding out for sure is to give a vaginal birth a go.

But also you need to feel comfortable and confident so I'd be researching your family history more and at the same time reading about positions in labour etc. etc.

I'm sorry that you've been giving this to worry about and I hope once you start finding out more you'll feel better about whatever you ultimately decide to do.

If your really want a c/s becuase thats something you want for you, then push for it or change to another OB.

I wouldnt just go on your mums and your sisters births though, becuase you could have an entirely differnt one. Positioning as mentioned, has a lot to do with it, both yours and the babys.

If you want to, get another opinion for a different OB and/or chiro.
Many OBs may not want to go in to major abdominal surgery if they think its avoidable, but hes not about to put you or your baby at risk either.

I actually think it's pretty irresponsible of your chiro to tell you that! Sorry, but I wouldn't be paying any attention. Your OB is far more qualified to advise you on that and I'm just really sorry that your chiro has given you more reason to doubt your ability to birth your baby vaginally.
As rayray said, if you do WANT a c/s, then get another dr, but if your worry is based on your chiro and your family's experience, then I'd say research some more. Find yourself some fabulous support and do some calmbirthing or grab a pink kit. If you are confident in your ability to birth, that's your best chance to do so.
If you'd like a second opinion from another OB (one who you are confident has listened to and not just rudely dismissed your concerns!) go for it. I'd say that'd be wise. But I personally wouldn't go to a different chiro for an opinion on your capability of birthing a baby! JMO.

another thing to think about, at 16 your body structure wouldn't be fully developed & would appear much smaller then it probably is as adult, especially a pregnant adult.
I would discuss your concerns with your OB & ask him to take them seriously so that you are able to make an informed choice on how to birth your baby, based on any findings from now, not 12 years ago.

I would be taking advice from my OB rather than a chiro. Not dissing chiro's, but they don't have a medical degree, or the birthing experience of your OB.
If you were after a second opinion i'd be getting one from another OB, not another Chiro.

But if you have concerns about it, you need to sort it out either way. The mind is so powerful and if you have in the back of your mind thoughts that you wone be able to birth vaginally, then it will undoubtedly effect your birth. So do your research and what ever you decide, make sure you are comfortable and happy with your decision. Best of luck.

yeh falguni, it is very hard to get something out of your head once it's in there.
i will be happy to try a vaginal birth but it's also so scary when you have a different thought in the back of your mind. anyway i'll def get a opinion from another ob, not a chiro just to be on the safe side.
it wasn't the opinion of the ob that bothered me, it was just the way he spoke to me cause i never said to him i didn't want a vaginal delivery i was just telling him what i'd been told. anyway thanks for all your reply's...much appreciated.

not exactly on topic, but i really feel for you.... i had an active birth of around something ridiculous like 20 hours, which resulted in an emergency c-section... the ob that performed the c-section told my partner (and me but i don't recall) that i would have really slim chances of birthing a baby vaginally due to the shape of my pelvis, he actually put a number on it, gave me 5-10% chance.... i had it in my head that i would definitely go for an elective c-section next time and was happy with that decision... but as time passed and i gained more perspective, i realised i really wanted to avoid a c-section unless it was absolutely necessary, i also realised how ridiculous it was for an ob to make a statement like that, i mean on what basis was he deciding this, did he have some sort of magical tape measure and he did a few calculations before stitching me up.....??

so, i have decided to have an xray just to rule out what the ob has said.... but of course if the xray comes back a little bit grey (haha) and uncertain, then i will be in quite the predicament.... not wanting to go through what i went through last labour/birth, but at the same time not wanting to rely on the opinion of one ob and an xray and have an elective c-section robbing me of the chance to birth my baby the way mother nature intended....

i feel for you, its awful to have that doubt....
my labour was the worst thing that i have ever been through, i had post traumatic stress afterwards and it took me over 12 months to recover emotionally.... however all this time on i still feel, even with an xray saying i can't do it, i still feel like i want to give it a shot.... the thing is you can only try, and if its not going right there is always the option of a c-section, but if you don't try you will never know.... the way i see it there isn't much to lose by trying, they always err well on the side of caution and if there is any sign of distress to the baby they will be encouraging a c-section, you will just have spent a few (!!) hours labouring which you could have avoided, but then at least you know you tried....!

sorry very long winded, its late and i'm tired!!

good luck xx

Yeah Beau, perhaps you should look at a another OB anyway, one who has a little more respect for you and your thoughts and feelings. Nothing worse than being dismissed.

hey emma,
i feel for you that you had to go through a birthing experience like that. it sounds very similar to my sister who after 13 hours of labor that wasn't progressing enough, the baby hadn't even dropped properly (now we know he couldn't) the dr's had to interviene with the midwife (she wanted to keep trying) and give her a emergency c-section, and the ob told her then that she couldn't have given birth naturally. my nephew was born in distress, the mother was distressed and lost a lot of blood resulting in a transfusion and i believe she had traumatic stress too for quite some time afterwards.
but she said she did feel disappointed that she couldn't birth naturally, but will not put her next baby in danger and is opting straight for a caesar.
it is a big decision to have to make especially when it's your child, and i'm with you i don't think there's any harm in trying, i just have a bit of doubt that i'm trying to overcome and make the right decision, but hopefully after a few more opinions from a couple of obs i'll make that decision.

Have a read of this off the main site
https://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth/...nown-and-loved

Can I just say that I would take my chiro's opinion any day. The reason my last birth was so short and easy (but still excruciating) was due to my amazing chiro. Your spine is the key to all your health. I would get more opinions but I wouldn't dismiss your chiro's opinion either.

Webby- i see a chiro and an osteo and they are both awsome, keep me in good shape. I trust them 100% ;) But if one of them were to tell me i couldn't birth naturally, i wouldn't be taking their word as gospel. I would certainly be looking at getting other opinions.
I didn't mean to offend with my comment of Chiro's not being experts on birth. Obviously some have more experience than others in certain areas. But i was making the point that they do not have a mediacal degree, yes they are experts on the skeletal system, but not birthing per se.
It is great to hear that your chiro was so instrumental in your last birth. Hope the next one is the same. ;) Sorry if i offended. :redface:

I may be facing the same decision soon. My body is only small and it has always been a concern that I may not have enough room through my pelvis for a baby to pass through. We spoke to our Obs on our first visit to him and he said we will have a closer look at that later on. Last week we had out third trimester growth scan and it looks like our baby boy is going to be big. He is already measuring 2 weeks ahead of himself. We have our appointment this Thursday with the Obs to discus what he thinks. I have made it clear to him that I am not interested in going through hours of labour only to have a c/s. He is aware of that and said we will see how we go but assured me he wont let it get that far. If he says to me that there is a chance that this will not go well vaginally and could end up being a c/s. I will have to decide if I give it a go or not risk it and book in an elective c/s. Honestly I would love to give birth vaginally but If I don't I am not going to think that I am less of a woman or that my body let me down. My body most certainly didn't let me down. We conceived and grew a healthy baby, I am happy to decide on a c/s if that is what is best to bring my little man into the world!

I just have to say that being small is not really a medical reason to not be able to give birth vaginally.
I am 5 foot nothing and am a tiny frame and I had no trouble birthing my baby, my body knew exactly what it needed to do and it did it!
Women's bodies are designed to give birth this way (with some very rare exceptions).
Also, with the growth scans, I would take that with a grain of salt too, there are many threads around here about how far off the ultrasounds were.
Just my opinion and hope it helps you guys to have confidence in your bodies... you can do it!

Just remember that female pelvises are designed very differently to those of men, purely to enable the passage of a baby during the birth process. Our bodies are designed to give birth. The female pelvis is wider, shallower, lighter and rounder than that of a male. It is built to accommodate a growing baby and it is able to stretch during pregnancy and childbirth. Our body size or shape is not an accurate representation of the size and shape of our pelvis, or its ability to fulfil its function.

FWIW my ob always said the only sure way to find out if a baby was too big was to give labour a go!

Don't worry too much about fundus measurements...this time around at 28 weeks I was measuring 2 weeks ahead of dates but that came back into line as bub moved down.

I would be more worried about having that "seed" of an idea planted in your mind that you won't be able to give birth vaginally. Family history is certainly something to take into account but that combined with you having been told that you will be unable to give birth vaginally is going to take a very powerful mindset to overcome (if that is of course what you want).

I would be doing some research on caesarians vs vaginal birth and deciding what you would like "in a perfect world." If you do decide that you want a vaginal birth I would be looking into Calmbirthing/Hypnobirthing and just generally educating and physically preparing yourself as much as possible because you will need that extra mental strength if you start getting nervous. And by the same token, if you decide you want an elective C-section then push for it. It is your birth, after all. Just do your research first.

beau - i too lost a hell of alot of blood and also had to have a transfusion.... i am DEFINITELY 200% opting for hypnobirthing next time.... i am 5 foot 2, but my mum is barely 5 foot and birthed us three kids with no issues...

just my opinion but i would be very wary of anyone, ob or not, doubting your ability to birth your baby based on how petite you are and a scan... scans are notorious for being wrong, actually in my experience are completely unreliable in that sense... my doctor was the same, doubted my ability to birth what he called my 'big' baby (she ended up being 8 pounds 7, not that big at all really) and i was booked in to have a c-section, just happened to go into labour before the date.... it was HIM who planted the seed of doubt in my mind which was the catalyst in my awful traumatic experience...

just my opinion but if i had of trusted my body more, and listened to my doctor less, i am sure i would have had a much better outcome... the thing about birth is, no two births are alike, there are all sorts of variables that impact on how things go, so i fail to see how anyone can predict the future, no matter how many births they have seen.... its just not something that is black and white like that.

The human body is an amazing thing, and as previous posters have said, we are designed to give birth, and with the right positioning, the pelvis opens right up to let the baby out. Have you considered a doula or your own midwife? They can give you ongoing support and help you with positioning during the birth.

Keep in mind that any amount of spontaneous labour is good for the baby. It assists with their breathing, helps with breastfeeding etc etc.

It's great to hear that your OB is encouraging a vaginal birth, but he still needs to hear you out on your concerns. Change if you're not comfortable with how he listens.

You've already had some great responses here, but i'll toss my 2c in anyway :)

1) The female pelvis is NOT fully formed at 16, it often isn't fully formed until 20 or 21! Even once it is fully formed, unless a woman is in labour and in the best possible birthing position (deep squat or hands and knees) it's impossible to see how much room she has for a baby to pass through. If the x-ray had been taken while you were IN labour and the baby's head was as descended as it could get, i can imagine that one x-ray might be able to reveal if/why you couldn't birth that specific baby in the positions you were both in. But that's it. It can't tell you anything unless you're in labour, and if you are in labour it can only tell you something about THAT labour, not any potential future ones.

2) there ARE pelvises which make birth more drawn-out and posterior presentation of the babe more likely (grab a pink kit for more info on that, it's related to the angle of the front pubic arch) BUT and it's a huge BUT, those women can ABSOLUTELY give birth vaginally. Their labours might not look "textbook" but they are perfectly normal, healthy effective labours and they get the baby out just fine in the end.

3) looking at family history can be helpful, but fear is contagious, more contagious than anything else that will affect your ability to birth. If the women of your family couldn't give birth to their babies you'd have died out about 150 years ago when sections weren't available/safe. It is VERY possible that your family have the shape of pelvis mentioned in the pink kit which can slightly more often mean a longer labour and posterior presentation (and as someone above said, it's not something you can see by looking at your bodyshape), but it is the Ob panicking and prescribing a section which prevented vaginal birth, NOT the pelvis. On the whole 13 hours isn't at all long for a first labour. Up to 24 hours is totally normal.

Obviously i'm not a birth psychic, and some women DO need a section, but less than half of the women who are currently having them ACTUALLY need them. Without knowing about your mum's first and your sis's only labours it's hard to say for sure, but i'd be willing to bet intervention made some difference in those situations. Were they moving freely and upright during labour, or were they made to lie on the bed most of the time? Did they manage to avoid epidural anaesthesia and stay as drug free as possible? Were either of them given induction drugs or was their labour un-augmented and totally natural? There are SO many factors in birthing a baby, and the shape of the bones is realy, truly, very rarely a major one. Look at it rationally - your guts would easily fit through your pelvis, but they don't fall out because your pelvic floor holds them in place, that same pelvic floor holds the weight of your baby as it grows, bounces, wriggles and squirms and then one fine day it doesn't anymore, instead it completely reverses its normal function in order to let your baby out, and right away afterwards it reverts to its normal form and even though a giant baby fit through there, your guts STILL don't fall out! - the female anatomy is a many-wondrous thing hun, the more i learn about it the more astounded i am by it.

If i were you i'd perhaps seek a different opinion from a MIDWIFE. They see every size and shape of woman and they are very in touch with what is normal and possible, and will be able to offer you a realistic viewpoint and give you more confidence in making your decision. You might also want to consider a different Ob if you feel yours doesn't listen to your concerns - however you birth you need to be able to trust your care-givers and putting yourself and your baby into the hands of someone you already find to be ignorant of your concerns and needs.

Best of luck

Bx

Hoobley every time i read one of your birthing posts i feel so reassured and positve about the whole birth body working together....your a champ:D

Some of the smallest women i have ever come across, friends...friends of friends etc have had some of the bigger babies amongst us all, so just because you are smaller framed and a little more petite don't think you can't birth your baby or a bigger baby. As some of the other ladies have said try to stay mobile/active as possible and positions during birthing are real important too. I can vouch for the positions personally as my DS didn't want to budge when i was on my back and it felt really unnatural as well but as soon as i was on all fours, that was it he was out probably in 10-15 minutes without any tearing.

GL with any decision you make.

I agree - gravity really helps. I was watching a tv show on fox about pregnancy and births - an american show - and I can't understand why every doctor has the woman lie down practically flat on her back to give birth, legs high up in the air in stirrups. When I had DS (my first), I had an epidural due to my blood pressure being very high, and when it came time to push (they had to tell me cause I couldn't feel a thing), nothing was happening for ages. Then they started worrying about him being obstructed, so they decided to get forceps ready. To make using the forceps easier, they had me sit up straighter and move my legs further apart - and lo and behold, with the change of position, DS moved down and was born within a few minutes, without the need for the forceps. I can't believe that nobody had suggested before that changing position might help - I almost ended up with another intervention unnecessarily! With my last birth, I did it upright - kneeling on the bed facing away from everyone with the head of the bed for support. I firmly believe that this is what helped me give birth to a 9lb 9oz bubba girl with no complications, or interventions.

What your OB said about not being able to tell from x-ray is true - X-rays don't allow for the movement in your pelvis that is possible towards the end of pregnancy, nor the ability of your baby's skull bones to over ride each other as your baby comes down. Also, if you're in an upright position for birth, this allows you to take advantage of gravity.

28 years ago, the advice was very different, so I can see how your OB was dismissive. If nothing was written on the actual report, there might not be anything significant on the actual X-ray - ie, the chiro might have been talking more from opinion, than observable fact.

The true test is to go into labour and see what happens. If things don't progress, you have your answer. I guess the question is really - do you want to labour, or do you want to have a CS? If you want a CS, that's ok. If you want to have a vaginal birth, there's no reason not to plan for that.

hoobley you bring up some fabulous points which i have also been reading about lots lately.
it's amazing in regard to vaginal births, i've watched a couple of birthing videos of women who remained laying down to give birth, lots of women commented that this was the second worst position to give birth in (besides upside down, ha ha) and yet thats what you see or imagine when you hear of birthing and only since i have been reading about labor and birth have i found out about all these other options available and positions which are apparently more helpful for the mum and baby.
puppies just to let you know my SIL is a very small frame and she gave birth naturally to her dd with no problems.
also i have decided (personal opinion) i am not dissing my chiro's advice but i am def exploring all my options and reading so much about both issues, and i have become quite knowledgable. ha ha, poor DH will probably think he could deliver this baby with all the information i've told to him.

That's awesome, beau. :) If you are feeling more educated about your body and about birth, you are going to be all the more empowered to make the right decisions for you. Good on you.