taking progesterone after 3 miscarriages?

hello,
This is my first post although i have been lurking for a while and have been following many of your ttc journies :goodluck:

I have had 3 miscarriages since feb 08.

I have been told to start the progesterone (cyclogest pessaries) cd 10 until cd 25. I am a little confused! I thought that cyclogest should be started after ovulation, not before? I ahve contacted my gyne but he is always busy and i cannot see him again until jan 09!! :wall:

Does anyone have any advice on this? i dont want to ruin my chances of conceiving again. Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated. Sorry again for going on about me me me! i wont do it again, i promise ;)

HI Don,

Welcome to BB. So sorry to hear of your losses, its such a sad situation :hug:

I do not know all that much about progesterone levels, but there is another BB member who had troubles with this (and has just recently given birth to her baby girl :) ).

Try searching through some of the threads here, I am sure you will find some info ..... hopefuly the other member will be able to come along and give you some more info.....

Hi Don,

First of all, I am so very sorry for your losses, big :hug: Don't worry about going on about yourself, that is what we are here for! :)

I have been taking progesterone pessaries as part of my fertility treatment not for miscarriage (even though I have had 2, maybe 3 :() but I would imagine that things are the same regardless of why you are taking it. My clinic start me on it 1 day post ovulation, they said that if you start it before O that it can make the endometrial lining less receptive to an embryo if there is one. So yes you are right. I have cycle tracking (bloods and ultrasound) to monitor when O occurs so I know when to start the prog. I don't really know what I would do in your situation, maybe BBT so you know when O has occurred and start them once you see a temp rise? Or test with OPKs and start the prog a couple of days after you see a pos?? Sorry I can't really be much more helpful that that, but I hope some of this helps you. Can you at least talk to your ob on the phone about it all? My FS is available by phone whenever I need him.

All the very best xx

thank you both for your help :p
It makes me so mad that my gyno would give me the wrong info. He is supposed to be the expert :wall: I have tried several times to speak to him but i am always told he is busy/in a meeting! All i need is 20 seconds of his time. Very frustrating. It took 4 weeks for his secretary to ask him when i should be taking the progesterone :angry:

I have never BBT or used OPKs but i think i will try the OPKs as at least they will give me a better idea of when i ovulate. My cycles before the miscarriages were always 27 days but are now 24-25 days so im not really sure when ovulation occurs. Do you know which brand is best?

xxx

thank you both for your help ;)

It makes me so mad that the gyno has given me the wrong istructions!! He is supposed to be the expert :wall: I have tried to speak to him several times, all i get is 'he is too busy seeing patients' or 'he is in a meeting'. It took 4 weeks for him to answer my question of when should i take the progesterone! :angry:

I have never BBT or used OPKs but i think i may try the OPKs for a couple of cycles to give me a better idea of when i ovulate as at the moment it is pure guess work (i always check cm but it is not always very clear). Before the miscarriages my cycles were always 27 days but now they are 22-24 days which confuses me even more. Do you know which brand of OPKs are best?

xxxx

I can't answer your question but just wanted to drop by & offer some encouragement. I too had 3 m/c's before my successful birth. I'd had a lot of testing done over the years because of infertility & nothing was ever found to be wrong. I was never given a reason for my losses as they were all early ones. For me it was a case of 4th time lucky without any medical assistance. I hope it's 4th time lucky for you too.

Satya - thank u for your words of encouragement :) I often feel like i am never going to be able to carry a pregnancy to term (especially when doctors etc are unwilling to help/support me) but hearing success stories like yours gives me hope. :pray:

Congratulations on your successful birth. I hope all is going well :)

xxx

I will cut a long story short. This is not advice. This is just my story.

I fell pregnant after 9 months of trying. I was 36. At 11 1/2 week I lost the baby. After another 9 months I fell pregnant again. This was eptopic and again I lost the baby. I went to a fertility doctor. Clomid - nothing. Injected hormones into my stomach - nothing. I then started assisted conception. I was still injecting hormones into my stomach, being scanned and my eggs measured, then receiving an injection to release the eggs and then I was getting assisted conception (you've heard the story's of the turkey baster). Anyway I fell pregnant the first time. Lasted for 7 weeks. Left it a month, repeated the whole process, fell pregnant again. Lasted 8 weeks. By this time when I got a positive pregnancy test instead of being over the moon like most people, my husband and I would think "how long's this going to last".

My girlfriend told me about asprin. She to had my miscarriages (now got three kids). I told my fertility doctor about it. He said "There is no scientific proof that asprin works and in fact could be dangerous". I was desperate so I went on Astrix which is 100mg of asprin (asprin is 300mg). Went through the whole process again in January, fell pregnant, waited for 7 weeks. No miscarriage. I had a beautiful, healthy baby boy. I told my gyno I was on Astrix. He said to stop taking it at 38 weeks. He didn't seem surprised or anxious about it. When my son was six months I started to try again naturally (thinking if nothing worked I would go back to my fertility doctor). I started Folic Acid and Astrix. Fell pregnant straight away and had a beautiful healthy daughter. My friend on IVF also took Astrix after many failed attempts and had twins.

I I took 1 Astrix tablet every day I was pregnant and quite after 38 weeks. My gyno knew I was on it. I am not giving your advice. I am just telling you my story.

Good luck with it all.

SanBlair - thank you for sharing your story.

Wow you went through an awful lot :hug: Congratulations on your successful pregnancies.

I only take a low dose of aspirin (75mg) every other day. This did not help me as i was taking it when i suffered the thrid miscarriage. I have never heard of Astrix so thank you for sharing your info. It definitly gives me something to think about.

xx

HI don23....I've just had my second miscarriage (about 2 weeks ago now) and when I asked my OB about progesterone injections etc he's a non believer, basically he told me that the progesterone is only prolonging the inevitable, if its a non viable pregnancy from conception then it will eventually not progress, which I believe has been the case for me. I do believe that ladies who are on IVF are prescribed it, my friend whom I work with is going through this right now, this is her 4th attempt and she has miscarried before. Satya - my OB recommended 100mg of aspirin too and that I can safetly take it up to 34 weeks, however he does want to moniter me as soon as I fall again, I was told to leave it a month and then try again and thats because of my age, he said usually he recommends 3 months wait after a miscarriage but because Im 37 we can't really leave it too long. I'm hoping the aspirin works, chast tree supplement is a natural type of aspirin it does the same thing (thins the blood) and my chinese herbalist had recommended it when I first started going to her but I ceased taking it because I kept getting nose bleeds...now I think about it I should've kept taking it because that was before I fell pg the first time!

Anyway Don23 if your not happy with your current gyno look for another one or contact a fertility centre, they may also be able to assist you.

Hope this has helped in some way....goodluck ttcing :stickyvibesgirl:

Mannie - so sorry to hear of you loses :hug: :pray: that the asprin helps you.
I think my gyno has prescribed the progesterone with the hope that it may help with implantation, which could be the reason i have had such early loses. I guess its like a stab in the dark but I was eager to try 'something'. I feel so helpless. My concerns are that if i start taking the progesterone too early (he says cd 10-25 and then i have to stop - BFP or not) that i will stop ovulation altogether. I cant find much info. on the net about this. I have now started looking into private clinics, hoping that they will be a little more pro-active. :crossfingers:

:goodluck: with your ttc journey :stickyvibesgirl:

Hi again Don,

Sorry its a bit late, but the brand of OPK that I had the most luck with was Confirm. All the others (and I tried quite a few! LOL) I had mixed success with, they worked some months and not others. But that may also be due to my weird cycles too....although the last cycle I fell pg I never got a pos OPK :rolleyes: and I wasn't doing IVF back then.

Good luck with the private clinic, hopefully they will be able to help you more than the ob. BTW, my clinic check your prog when you get a BFP and only get you to stop if the levels are looking good. Otherwise they keep you on it until about 12 weeks I think, but don't quote me on that!

Good luck! x

Hi megsmum, thank you, il try and get some of those ready for my next cycle....i dont think this one is going to amount to anything but AF!! :cry: (will be due in 4-6 days) When i do get a bfp i will definitly insist that my levels are checked st. away...whether they will actually test them is another matter :rolleyes:

:goodluck: on thurs....:pray: that you get your BFP!! :stickyvibesgirl:

xxx

Hi Don

Sweeting I am so sorry about your losses - it casts a small shadow on your heart each time and is always challenging to accept and work out how the feeling can become a healthy part of your emotional landscape. My m/c was at 9 weeks in Sept but I am blessed to have a little daughter 3 who was conceived naturally at 35 and homebirthed at 36.

But to the progesterone - I have done and am doing a huge amount of personal (I am not a doctor, natural therapist or fertility specialist - just someone trying to be safe and rational in my approach) research constantly on hormones (I am 39) as it is an immensely relevant part of my preconception prep and I tend to find, as you have, that there is a lot of contradiction out there.

The one thing that medical and natural practitioners seem to agree on with the use of progesterone (in my case - I am using a transdermal natural progesterone cream - not the 'wild yam' (scam) creams and fairly high potency - but the choice is always an individual one) - is that progesterone appears to be of most use in terms of defective luteal phases in women as a support tool in conception rather than as a maintainer of pregnancy (so there is some argument about how effective it really is in maintaining a pregnancy that may not be viable). There seems to be some argument against the synthetic forms in terms of adverse side effects. Aspirin is not an option for me as I am intolerant of it!!

The general consensus of what people have said here about trying to take it post-ovulation seems supported by a lot of the readings I've done - the advice I've had is to start at day 12 and go to day 26 of cycle - day 12 seems to be favoured because it does take a little while for the fat absorbant properties of the progesterone to take effect and the egg needs to meet a good uterine environment so it seems you may need to lay a little progesterone groundwork before the egg sets up residence. I have teamed a uterine tonic (my naturapath puts this together for me) to support a healthy egg and good ovulatory state to start with (taken just before period rocks up and during the period) and then I use the progesterone to support the luteal phase as I have a short one (I ovulate at the right time but my period kicks in at 24-26 days - a little too short). I used this approach with my first pregnancy and we had just started trying again this year when this second pregnancy took but did not remain with us.

One interesting point that did appear in several sources was the need to take care with high dose saturation with progesterone (particularly if the site of application was constantly the same or unvaried) as some medical and natural therapies sources seem to suggest that this saturation might actually interfere with the body's own progesterone receptors and could adversely influence them i.e. they could 'turn' off or produce less instead of being stimulated . I have to constantly alter the site every time I apply my transdermal cream and I have to target areas of high circulation rather than obvious fatty tissue given the progesterone's tendency to saturate fatty tissue (you can see why many medical practitioners might target pessaries for high circulation!!!)

Where I'm going next at the moment is to try a saliva test for hormones to ascertain where I have come back to after the m/c. I have also since then given up 1 1/2 jobs as I was totally overstressing my adrenals and exhausted adrenals do not support progesterone production (I still teach 0.6 for a crust) - and I must admit I feel much better in myself and a lot less tired (sleep allergic three year old, very active was making the mix too interesting I think!;))

So - I am no expert - but like many people trying to create good health and support their fertility to the best of their ability I keep seeking out information and research from both medical and natural therapies arenas with an open mind and a lot of hope and this is what I have found at this point. I am not sure if anything here is of help but there may be some leads of use for you to investigate more if they seem useful.

Sticky vibes to you!
BFN
Karen
:D

Progesterone does work!! Read the stories on lowprogesteroneinpregnancy.com. Many doctors don't even consider it a problem. Women have had to change their doctors to get someone to listen to them. Progesterone is not harmful. It will not harm you or the baby and many women believe it works. Read the stories yourself. I am going to insist on taking progesterone suppositories whether my doctor likes it or not.

Don - i so wish i had of found this thread earlier!
i think im the one that Kitt3n was talking about!
i had progesterone problems which was found out after 2 miscarriages, and due to progesterone pessaries and injections i have not long given birth to a healthy baby girl!

Im under the belief that the pessaries are meant to be started after ovualtion! As that is what happened for me!
If u have ANY questions - feel free to PM me or email me - tho i really do hope that u get a chrissy baby!

hello, thank you all for your replies, it really does mean a lot!! :D

Well, i used opks my last cycle and got a positve on cd 11. I began using the progesterone on cd 13 and i got a nice BFP on cd 25 :dance: I have been advised to carry on with the progesterone by my local EPU which i am very happy about as i feel that at least i am trying something!

I am terrified and look forward to each day ending, knowing that every day that ends, i am an extra day pregnant. I have had NO symptoms which i am very worried about.(I am worried that the progesterone is stopping any bleeding from occuring) I had some nausea for a few days last week and slightly sore boobs but i know this is caused by the progesterone. So i am keeping everything crossed and :pray: that this is the one! My EPU have told me to go in when/if i reach 7 weeks for a scan (i am 5w3d today).

It is actually my second angels due date tomorrow (xmas day) so am having mixed emotions at the moment but trying to stay calm and stressfree!

Good luck to all of you that are TTC, i hope you all get your forever babies very soon!!

Merry Christmas

xxx

Congratulations Don!
The progesterone wont stop u from miscarrying if there is something wrong!
But i know how u feel waiting for each day to end!
Keep positive and hopefully things will be okay!
The progesterone worked for me - so im sure it will for you!
Merry Christmas!

Don! Congratulations on your BFP! Like you, and many other wonderful ladies here, I have had a series of miscarriages, and it is always so wonderful to hear of someone like you falling pregnant again. Please be sure to keep us updated on how you're going. For better of for worse, in sickness and in health...you know the drill. We're close here ;)

xx

Hi Don,

First of all congratulations on your pregnancy, and I hope all goes well. I am so sorry for your other losses though..
I don't know much and have not had any experience with progesterone, but wanted to say please look for another doctor as the one you've been initially seeing seems like a useless piece of you know what. It's unacceptable for a doctor to take so long to return your calls. I have a fantastic gynie and he's available 24/7. It's so imporrtannt to have a good doctor who is there for you all the time no matter what. TTC is alrady so strssful, you don't need any more stess hun.

All the best.

Beata xxx

Oh Don!!!!!

How wonderful!!!! May this little tacker burrow deep and hang on tight - my morning (hah!!) sickness first time round did not kick in until about 8 weeks (I remember I didn't throw up until after Christmas) and stopped at around 14 weeks - so you know the drill - how much we all differ from the 'average' symptoms and situations given - so it may not be an issue that you haven't wanted to worship at the porcelain altar as of yet! I wish you every sticky little vibe that is out there and look forward to seeing you move into other threads and forums as time goes on!!!

Much love and laughter to you
Karen

Thank you all for your well wishes ladies ;)

hj1981 - i am :pray: that the progesterone will help...it has done so far as with my past two pregnancies i didnt get past 5 weeks. :crossfingers:

beata70 - he is useless!! i am due to see him on the 8th january so i will see how that goes, but if i am not happy i will ask to be referred to a different gyno.

karen van- thank you, its so nice to know that there are so many supportive ladies on this board. I have started to pee a bit more frequently so i think i am getting there slowly!! :dance: but i guess i wont know anything for sure until my first scan, it feels like a lifetime away!

I hope you all had a great xmas and that it wasnt too painful (iykwim)

P.S do any of you know how i get my ticker up (not sure if im ready to display it yet :redface:) but would be nice to have a look at them. thanks

xxx

acria - i will be keeping my fingers crossed that you get your BFP. Good luck xx

Don - do u know how long u will be on the progesterone for? and are u just staying on the pessaries?
I was on the pessaries after ovualtion up till i a few days after i think (i have a thread on here somewhere about my journey) than i found out i was pregnant and than i went on injections up until 6mths preg until my placenta was doing its stuff and my levels were good!

Hi Don

When I did mine - I just grabbed one of the one's off BellyBelly from the bannerhead above and then you can add your own graphics from your own files a little to personalise it - it allows you to browse and attach. Then I just took the code of the ticker which came up and copy and pasted it into my user profile from above as part of the signature.

Hope that helps - it did take me a couple of goes to work it out!

Have a wonderful New Year!
Karen van

Hello ladies, happy new year to you all!!

Karen van - thanks for the help...i will try it out when i am feeling a little braver :doh:

hj1981 - I am not sure how long i will be on progesterone for...i am presuming that i carry on taking it until i reach 12 weeks. I use the cyclogest pessaries 200 mg 1 x daily. There is no evidence that i have low progesterone levels (more of a ...cant do any harm so...) so i dont think il be changed to the injections. Do you think i should ask for my levels to be checked before stopping the pessaries? or will it not matter seeing as the placenta will have taken over?

AFM: Well, so far so good :pray: I had my first scan today (was worried about some shoulder pain and have been cramping for hours on end the past few days) and my little bubba has a strong heartbeat :leap: I was very worried and it was such a relief to see that flickering on the screen. Bubs is measuring 6w6d which is a couple of days ahead of my dates (i have short cycles) so all is on track at the mo. Am keeping everything crossed over the next few weeks as my first angels heartbeat stopped at 8 weeks (missed miscarriage) so please :pray: for my little one :)

xx

Don - honestly i would get your levels checked before stoping the pessaries - my plancenta was meant to take over at around 12wks and it didnt - hence i had to continue on progesterone injections - it is much better to be safe than sorry - and its only a blood test so easy done - i would even than get it checked again a wk after stopping the pessaries!
That is great news that u got to see the little heartbeat! its beautiful isnt it!
i will pray that all goes well for u - keep us updated!

Hi Don

My thoughts bounce around to your little one and they are always positive - be kind to your adrenals - although the 'minimise stress' stuff always seems a bit of a cruel irony in these situations... I always find it amazing how much I just took the continual progress of my first pregnancy for granted - I think that's what I hate the most about m/cs is the loss of innocence. It is the year of the Golden Ox - a good one for family matters - enjoy every moment!

Much love
Karen van

hello ladies...quick update from me!!

I had my scheduled apt with my gyno today. I told him i was pregnant and that i'd had an ultrasound last week. I also told him id been experiencing a lot of cramping the past week (seems like its 24/7) and so i was quite worried. He disappeared out of the door only to return with an ultrasound machine!!!! it looked about 60 years old but i wasnt about to complain. So he casually tells me to lay down on the bed, squeezed the jelly stuff onto my stomache and scanned me! very unexpected...i didnt think anything would show up on that type of scan yet, but there was my little bean with a healthy heartbeat still :dance: he couldnt take any measurements as the machine is not that accurate but he seems to think everything is fine and that this one will be a keeper :pray:

so..... still got a few weeks of worrying but he did say i could pop in anytime if i am worried (so he does have his uses after all!!)

Awww thats great news! :hug:

Heya Don

Such wonderful news - and nice to know that your erstwhile 'professional' has done something towards restoring a little bit of faith!! Good score on the ticker - it is lovely!!! Enjoy the Chinese New Year - we have it earlier this year on Australia Day of all things - I think we'll be fair blinded by the fireworks...

I seem to be eternally fluffing around at the moment trying to get my 'house' metaphorically and physically in order - bloody huge sigh - good luck with everything!!!

Much love and laughter
Karen van

Hi Acria

Just a quick congratulations on the weight loss - you have done brilliantly to lose it at this time of year!

BFN
Karen van

Karen van - HUGE CONGRATULATIONS on your BFP!!!! I am so happy for you! Here's to a happy and healthy 9 months :p

AFM: Had another ultrasound with my gyne on thursday! It seemed as though as soon as i hit 8 weeks my symptoms started to slowly disappear :rolleyes: I really started panicking when my boobs were not sore anymore. Luckily heartbeat was still strong and gyne said bubs had definitly grown since the last ultrasound (same old machine as last time so no measurements could be taken). So i am really trying to stop worrying and just enjoy it!! very hard as iv had cramps again the past two days and i cant help but over analyse EVERYTHING :redface:

Gyne has said i can go back again next week if i am worried but i am going to try my hardest not to. I get so worried before each ultrasound and that cant be good for bubs!! so here's to 'NO worrying'!!! :o

Don - u go to ur gyne as many times as u want - if thats what it is going to take for you to relax and enjoy ur pregnancy!!!! - dont do what i did and stress the whole time as u wont enjoy it as much as u shld and than u might end up regretting it - It goes all too fast! but i do understand over anylising everything!
Do what ever u have to do to put ur mind at ease! but meanwhile have some fun and try and relax! xoxo

Hello Don

Many thanks for the celebratory reaction - I appreciate the thought!!!!

You are so wonderfully close to 12 weeks - it will not be long. It is wonderful that you are consciously managing your reactions to this current pregnancy in light of what has happened in the past. I understand that none of us want to stress - particularly when we are pg - but not acknowledging HOW we are feeling might be more likely to drive it underground where it becomes physical rather than mental.

Do you feel there is a point at which you can say to yourself - 'having reached this point I feel confident and positive about this pregnancy?" - if you can create a use by date for your fears and doubts associated with past losses perhaps you can allow yourself to be able to enjoy the pregnancy the way you would like to.

It sounds a little flaky - but I actually undertook a little exercise this year that I haven't done previously that I found in a newspaper (of all things :rolleyes:) - you had to write a Ciao for Now 2008 list, a Gratitude to 2008 list and an Intentions 2009 list - you get to destroy the first list which is really, really satisfying. It was really worthwhile for me to physically do this in all three cases because somehow the creation of each list crystallised my thinking and the destruction of the first list (I burnt it and then lifted the ashes to the breeze to be scattered - never to darken my doorstep again) seemed to be a release.

May the good news keep on coming!!
Karen van