What would you do ...

So, we've just had our third loss in 12 months. I have only one tube left after the ectopic, which is apparently in bad shape, so we did IVF cycles, ending in a miscarriage. Yet while waiting to resume IVF after that miscarriage, I fell pregnant naturally, which was a big surprise to all. We've now lost that baby.

I am having tests done to see if there is a problem and DH and I also need to decide whether to try naturally for a while, or jump straight back into IVF. The natural conception could have been a chance fluke...or it could be a sign things aren't as bad as they thought. DH and I are thinking we'll try naturally for a few cycles then go to IVF.

The risk with trying naturally, is high risk of ectopic in the bad tube, risk of just wasting time and eggs. Whereas IVF gives us a more solid chance.

The risk of going straight to IVF- it's emotionally and physically and financially draining, and maybe we can conceive again all by ourselves.

Just wondering what you would do, or if you have any insights on this I might not have considered. Thanks.

Oh Emma, I am so sorry, I can't even begin to imagine your and DH's pain. This is just so unfair.

What does your FS say about your previous losses? I would hope that they would be justifiably concerned that there may be something going wrong that is not just chance or bad luck. What further tests have they recommended? Have you had all of the immune tests done?

Like you I would be concerned with the chance of another ectopic, and I guess IVF would overcome this obstacle. I know you feel hopefull of natural conception, and it is wonderful that you know this can happen. But wouldn't IVF and possibly further testing of your embies, like PGD (I don't know if your FS is recommending this) reduce the chances a potential loss down the track. IVF would increase the chance that, if one does take, it is the best possible embie.

These are just my thoughts. I don't really know if this helps any, and perhaps my view is skewed by the fact that I have never had a natural BFP in my life. So I don't have that hope of natural conception. I just feel that IVF is a more controlled process.

Again I am so sorry, and I pray that you will get your forever baby, even almost as much as I pray for my own. Big hugs. xx

Hi Possums
Gosh you and I are so similar it's scarey! I too had a ruptured ectopic and only have one tube which was described by FS as 'dodgy'...but I think I've shared all those details with you before...and I just noticed you have poodles...so do we...not that that has anything to do with TTC...oops but they sure get you through the tough times don't they!? Other than the tube issue are there other reasons for IVF and did you have any support drugs like asprin and progesterone with your last pregnancy? Might be worth investigating? We did IVF for years and always ended in early loss...so when we finally fell naturally after giving up, FS put me on a cartier asprin daily and a progesterone support program...and an early scan to rule out ectopic...only you will know what feels right for you but I encourage you to ask lots of questions and hang in there...I know how hard that is and sometimes others have to have hope for you when you have none yourself...but miracles do happen...just the journey on the way that sux!

Possums , sorry again for your loss sweetie.

You are still at risk of an eptopic with IVF? As our friend Smithy did, I am sure Smithy had an eptopic on the stub of the tube, when there wasnt even a tube there. (hope you dont mind me talking about your loss smithy xx) I will PM you

I know the thought of having an eptopic is scary for you, an early scan could rule that out.

I am in a simular situation, do we try naturally, or go with IVF. For me, its an age issue, for you at 35, its still an age issue, but not AS urgent. Time fly's though, and if I were you, I would want age on my side.

This is what I have done, and perhaps it may help you make a plan.

CONS PROS
First IVF - big bucks Hit safety Net early in the Year
Expensive treatments Can budget as consecutive treatments will be cheaper,
Hearbreak of negatives A greater chance of getting our dream
Month between cycles Try Naturally in between cycles

OUTCOME: A BFP by the end of the year, as we have been tested for every known possible glitch that could have affected a postitive outcome for us all

;)ANGE.. i do not mind at all hun i actually thank you for remembering what happend to me. it actually happened to missy to if i remember
well possums, as ange has already said i did have my second ectopic in the same tube (the stub as they called it) and that was from ivf actually after having 2 embies put back.from my understanding the chances with ectopic and ivf are quite high,though you wouldnt think so as they are actually putting the embies into the uterus BUT oh well it can happen:doh: the clinic will proberbly tell you the chances are low but in fact its very common
i wish you all the luk with what ever you decide to do only you and dh can make the choice..

also my sweet friend im so very sorry for your loss

Thanks so much everyone for your different perspectives.

Smithy- I know I was so sad and frustrated for you when that ectopic happened after IVF, and I do tend to think of IVF reducing the risk by quite a bit, but as you say, it can happen. And I am starting to realise the clinics can put a spin on many things!


to the others, you are right, the controlled aspect of IVF is a big plus for sure.

I need to talk much more to my fertility specialist and also my OB...they have differeng views too! It's just my FS is 3 hours from me and I dont have much to do with them, but will be having the miscarriage testing done through them...not sure yet what tests etc...expect to talk to them this arvo actually.

Thanks again for the support and advice. You ladies are great.

Ellie- and yes, our poodles help me through so much...just their loving little faces and excitement each day whenI come home is enough to lift me up

Hey Possums
Biggest hugs to you i hope you are keeping ok!
Yes the risks are there with both unfortunately, i dprobably go IVF because thats how i had success after my ectopic, but unfortunately it can happen with both! Hopefully the testing thay are doing will give you some answers.
Good luck possums

OK- well just talked to FS- they said to wait the results of the testing on the placental material etc taken in the D&C...if there were any chromosomal abnormalities there, then that indicates a problem like downs syndrome, in which case a miscarriage is the body's natural response. however if all seems normal, then they suggest we have the further tests done...as soon as next week, which is great.
it will then be 3-4 weeks before we get results.
Interestingly, the FS (who is not my normal one, as he is away- and like this lady more!) said she would probably recommend we try naturally for 6 months and see what happens, since my left tube obviously does work. there is of course, a higher ectopic risk, but the chance of natural conception without IVF...so more food for thought.

thanks again lovelies

well, we've had advice from another FS within SIVF, who has said they WOULDN'T just try naturally for six months, but would return more promptly to IVF, since our chances of natural conception remain slim, despite the fact we have proved we can achieve it. She said given my age, and our desire to ultimately have two children, and me only with one damaged tube, the clock is ticking. ...

so another viewpoint!

We are thinking of waiting just 3-4 months and then going to IVF. That will give us a chance to heal and regroup a bit too, and take a holiday etc. I am not ready for IVF right now! I am nowhere near strong enough emotionally.

Hi Possums, it is great to get everyone elses perspectives, but you really have to do what you feel in your heart is best for you and DH. If you need time off, take it and don't feel guilty or like you are wasting time. It will be there waiting for you when you are ready. Wishing you all the best. Hugs,xx

Possums - I don't know the answer as there's no right answer and no wrong answer. You need to be comfortable with your decision and not place unnecessary pressure on yourself. We all also look at things through the prism of our own experience. I am so age-focused that I'd say try naturally for a while...but not too long. I know someone else who was told they'd never get pregnant without IVF because of scar tissue (not ectopic related) ... and she did twice (both with H&H babies) - so I don't think it is pointless for you to spend a few months TTC without IVF. Good luck.

hi Possums,
It breaks my heart to read the sad news of you recent loss. i am so sorry.

i don't know what sort of natural healers eg accup, naturapath's are in your area but i would think of seeing one for a more natural approach. especaially if you are looking at trying naturally for a few months.
my DH and i have just froze our last 2 embies for the next 6 months. i am seeing a naturapath now and he has said my liver is not function at 100% and that i am estrogen dominant and low in progesterone. he didn't find this out with blood tests....but with my eyes as he is also an iridologist as well. he said that it is hard to get pregant with all this technology if your body is not working. i have had 4 Xiui's 1 IVf and 1xFET in in the last 2 years and nothing has worked:wall:.
i have a daughter who was concieved naturally!!!1:pigtail:
so i am taking wild yam and vitex to control and balance my hormones. as well as other natural tablets for my liver.
so give it a go. it can't hurt and it makes you feel great!
it is also much cheaper then IVF!
hope this helps.
michelle

Possums - it just seems so unfair that you are having to go through this decision making process at all! Ultimatly you and your DH need to do what you feel comfortable with - and reading what you have said so far, it sounds like you need a break for a while. IVF will be there for you when you are ready, if that be in 3 or 6 months - or not at all because you fall pg naturally! I know how hard the waiting is, but take the time, have some other tests done and take it from there.

Wishing you all the best, as I know that your time will come :hug:
FG

Possums,

So sorry that you are going through this, can't give any advice but wanted to send you a :hug:. The only thing you can do is go where your heart tells you.

If you ever want to find out more about IVF with PGD please join us in the PGD thread. There are a number of girls who are going through PGD because of repeated losses.
https://www.bellybelly.com.au/forums...f-pgd-2-a.html

Sara

Hi Possums,

I won't go on here about my situation... not only will it use up all of BB's memory capacity :rolleyes:, but this thread is about you not me ;)

My suggestion would be to ask if your FS would consider a lap to investigate further - if nothing comes back from the tests done re the D&C.

After struggling both naturally & with IVF for the past 7yrs, my FS recently just found an enormously large hydrosalpinx which has been there apparently for years, nobody has failed to pick it up despite numerous surgeries beforehand.

I know that these are a common cause for impantation issues... and also an answer to frequent miscarrying - they are also common for ladies who have had issues in the reproductive system.

I just had my right tube removed (due to the hydrosalpinx) - and he wanted to take my left tube as well, because it was heading in the same direction, but couldn't because part of it was attached to my ovary.

He clipped it instead, as he was worried about the risk of ectopic.

This could be another thing they could have a look at too - not that I'm saying there is any issue with your remaining tube ;) but if the FS thinks there is an increased risk of ectopic, clipping it can be an option - and also can increase the chances of implantation with IVF.

Thats another whole issue in itself for you as well, though - because then you don't have the option to fall pregnant naturally.

I went through a bit of an emotional struggle with this just recently, but in my situation, I had too much wrong & didn't have a choice if I ever wanted a chance to have another baby.

You may find that everything with your remaining tube is great, and everything else looks great too - and then you can gain a little confidence in TTC naturally for a while.... or, if they find any issues then you may have some answers & then a plan as to where you want to go from here.

My suggestion would be to ask your FS about an investigative lap to see whats happening inside.... if he says its not necessary, then forget my non doctor advice :p... but its always another path to investigate IYKWIM??! :D

Best of luck, and please let me know if I can help with anything else xxx

Thanks everyone for the support and the advice and insights...I appreciate it very much.

I know, through previous lap during the ectopic, that the left tube is damaged with adhesions, and sort of 'clubbed down' at the end, near the ovary...so it's not in great shape at all...and yet, is has worked at least once...as this last pregnancy proved.

Anyway, you are all right, it's up to DH and I in the end..and we are still thinking 3-4 months TTC naturally, (and also take a short holiday) then resume IVF. I am still really down, but a bit less raw than a week ago, so one step at a time. Thanks again friends.
Emma
xx

p.s. meant to add ..thanks for the advice about natural therapies...am seeing a naturopath and also an acupuncturist..trying all avenues!

Hi everyone...just an update...saw Ob today...nothing abnormal with results after the D&C...so am having further blood tests for recurrent miscarriage this week, through my FS.
OB also recommended giving it a go naturally for 3-4 months, then resuming IVF...so that's our plan.
Meanwhile am working with a smoking pregnant lady...gggrrrr

Hun, I hope those tests eliminate some possible problems for you and give you some answers you are looking for.
Been thinking of you :hug:
xx

((((((((((Possum)))))))))))

I am so sorry to read of your loss. The heartbreak is just unbearable at times - as we all know.

I am a vetern of 3 ruptured ectopics, a hideous nightmare. One of them actually went to somewhere around 3 months with the doc telling me it was a "miracle baby". They thought they could see the egg sack in my womb but it was actually a blood clot... gggrrrrr... this was not in Australia however, I highly doubt that would happen here.

Anyways, I just wanted to add my voice to the rest. Please take care of yourself and do whatever you feel most comfortable with. Dont be afraid to speak up to the FS's and be assertive. I have all my fingers and toes crossed for you and pray that everything goes well.

Sammie

Thanks Dusty and Sammi for the support :)

Had the blood test today- they took 18 tubes of blood for a range of tests!

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Had the blood test today- they took 18 tubes of blood for a range of tests!

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wow! hope you weren't feeling light headed ;)

wow possums, do you have any blood left?, thats a lot of blood to take. ouch .
hope you get some answers soon. my heart breaks for you.

sending you some special cyber hugs xxoo

thanks JBM..thinking of you also.

We go away for a week and a half from weds...looking forward to being away from work and routine and people for a while.

Hi everyone, just wanted to post an update here...
those blood test results are back...I don't know yet what they are, but they have told me that they aren't 'normal' and I am seeing my FS in Newcastle on Friday to find out what the go is. I am a bit nervous to be honest. I hope it's an issue with a relatively simply fix, because that would be a good outcome for me, and give me more hope when I am next pregnant (so hoping that is not going to be toooo far away).
I sure am glad I had the tests and didnt listen to my OB who told me not tests unless THREE recurrent miscarriages (he didn't count the ectopic losses)

I am so glad you pushed for the tests - I almost want to say to your OB, of course they aren't normal - why would a young, healthy girl lose so many babies (I'm so far from a dr, but ectopics although somewhat common, aren't normal either - so I don't know why they don't count them). Anyway, I don't blame you for being nervous, but I'm sure that there will be plenty of bellybelly-ers who will be able to provide you with further insight once you have the results. I do hope that whatever it is, it's easily correctable.

Thanks Julie, me too! I will go check on you in the TWW now... I have everything crossed for you!

The other annoying thing re that ectopic not being counted, is that it was technically also a miscarriage, as there had been a sac in my uterus as well (which at the time led to a very delayed diagnosis of the ectopic at all, they thought I was simply having a miscarriage, I even had a D&C, and it was only AFTER that they they diagnosed the ectopic, when my HCG stayed high etc)