Thanks Butterfly, I knew I'd heard it somewhere and didn't just dream it up. Interesting, does that mean jews, christians, and muslims are following the same God? Confusing.
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Thanks Butterfly, I knew I'd heard it somewhere and didn't just dream it up. Interesting, does that mean jews, christians, and muslims are following the same God? Confusing.
yep sara - it's the same God. Which makes all the insanity and hostility about religion today even more inexplicable :(
BW - the servant's name was Hagar :) unfortunately it always reminds me of a cartoon about a Viking called Hagar the Horrible.
I always find her story really poingant because she was cast out and lost in the desrt with a tiny baby and no water.
One of the things that is obligitary for a Muslim who can do it is to go on Haj (which is visiting Meccca during the month of Haj) and as part of the Haj ritual you have to run (or walk fast) back and forth between 2 hills. This part of the ritual is a re-enactment of what Hagar did when when she found herself stranded in the desert with a baby and no water - eventually the babies' feet kicking in the sand dug down enough to expose some moisture beneath so she realised there was a spring there.
I always think that making people take a run in the desrt in the middle of the day is a great way to make them appreciate fresh water for the rest of thier lives.
That depends, SaraJane, if we're right and there is the one God!! I looked up the religious facts site alluded to and OMG(or Gs) there are so many listed!
Very interesting.
So we could all be right, if there is one God and he's understanding about how we might all get confused and not sure who is right/wrong and how to put it all into practice.
If he isn't understanding, most of us are stuffed!
We had a table of whether it was worth following religion (Christian, in this case) put together by someone noteworthy (I'll find it somewhere) that classified the 'risk' of not following religion against the 'reward' (salvation, possible eternal life, etc) and the 'cost'. He determined that even if you didn't think it was likely there was a God, you were better off behaving as though there was - since if you were wrong the cost was high, whereas if you were right there was not really any downside.
Chlo - my FIL (chauvanist from way back) went back to the Doomsday book when he did their family tree and discovered that their surname was actually from a woman many centuries ago (her husband took her name). I took great pleasure in seeing that and highlighting it since! So I'm very intrigued that the Sunni were led by a woman in battle! Can't wait for an opportunity to use that in a conversation with him. (He thinks 'cause we've only produced a daughter so far the family name and reputation is going to die. But I'm going off the subject!)
Definately, now I just really don't get all the fighting and hostility. We all worship the same God, doesn't matter if someone else does it differently to you. Why can't the rest of the world talk about religion the way we have in this thread, openly and honestly without hostility. I reckon we've done a good job. Well done girls.:
yep sara - it's the same God. Which makes all the insanity and hostility about religion today even more inexplicable
Keep it up, I like hearing about everyone's different views and practices.
That's my view! DH was never religious, his family never taught him anything about it which I think is a shame coz he missed out. He said he doesn't see the point in believing coz his life is fine. I told him what's the harm in believing? Only good can come of it, even if it's just that you think about how you're living your life and how you can do it better!! Anyway we started reading the bible together so we could both at least learn about it before he decides what he believes. And guess what!! He is actually starting to believe which I didn't expect, I am so excited!! Pretty powerful book if it can convince him. Thankyou God!:
He determined that even if you didn't think it was likely there was a God, you were better off behaving as though there was - since if you were wrong the cost was high, whereas if you were right there was not really any downside.
You would be surprised how many catholics (and other christians for that matter) do believe this. Anyway, I only said it because I was putting in the quote that speaks about the loss of eternal salvation (going to heavan), especially in relation to the Jewish laws and practises. Its actually a big thing for Catholics (1 of my issues with the church)... ensuring the eternal salvation. We have the whole purgatory aspect and limbo, confession and forgiveness of sin... there is a big focus on the hereafter within or church.:
I'm not hedging any bets. For me my religion is like an extra conciense. When I lost interest in the church for a while (for vaious reasons) I was not a very nice person. I think just being part of the church again makes me act differently and it is definately for the better.
Dach that is very interesting about the Sunni being led by a woman.
I believe that when Jesus comes (bc I'm christian) we will all be given a second chance to decide what we believe, so if we're in the wrong religion, or denomination, or doing it wrong or whatever everyone gets a second chance and the chance for salvation.
Just what I think, and I like thinking that way, less pressure about am I in the right religion etc.....
I like to think I am in the right religion for me.
Yael is in the right one for her.
Dach is in the right one for her.
Dunno, I'm probably wrong but that's how I like to look at it. Personally I don't even delve into any religion being wrong, unless the religion tells you to commit group suicide as in Jonestown or the Heavens Gate Cult.... if you know what I mean, I think those religions are wrong, or the religions that condone child abuse as part of their beliefs as in CoG.
I agree with that too kerry. For some reason I feel I want to be a christian, and others feel they should be other faiths, there must be some reason for that.
If you get something out of it and it majes you feel good, it can't be wrong.
kerry, I am pretty sure they got rid of limbo in Vatican II.
At least thats what we were taught in VCE RE. then again, my teacher went to jail not long after I graduated...so who knows.
QUOTE: "He said he doesn't see the point in believing coz his life is fine".
My DD (12yo) is trying to take a similar stance and what i'm trying to help her to understand is that, sure, life might be fine today, but what do people do when something terrible happens? What if you are stuck on the 100th floor of a burning skyscraper with no way down? What do most people say? They instinctively say "Oh my God".... even non-believers. I think most of us know that there is something "up there"... but we deny it for various reasons until crunch time. I personally don't want to wait until something tradgic happens... and happen it will... I want to have that sense of 'connectedness' to God now. I don't want to fear death, i don't want to fear anything, and most of all i want to be a good person. I can 'feel' the two forces of the universe (Good and bad) everyday quite accutely and i simply want to allign myself to the right side because it feels better intuitively. For me though, life is a little like "bootcamp for the soul" it's hard and it's meant to be, and just because I try to be a good Christian doesn't mean that God will be kinder to me... infact it's quite the opposite I think. He wants me to be stronger so i will be tested... our souls are like muscles, they grow weak if they have it 'easy' and rest all day. The only way for a soul to grow strong is for it to be tested i guess... that's the scariest aspect of faith for me: knowing that it will only just get harder the closer i get to heaven. I really think we need to pray for our spiritual leaders because of this too: they are truely being put to the test!
Sorry about that little 'thinking out loud' session... I guess i don't know much about religion as taught in church etc... but it is important to me that i learn... in the meantime I really do want to persue a multi-faith approach, and this is why i'm really enjoying this thread :)
Definately, i said this too him too.:
sure, life might be fine today, but what do people do when something terrible happens? What if you are stuck on the 100th floor of a burning skyscraper with no way down? What do most people say? They instinctively say "Oh my God".... even non-believers. I think most of us know that there is something "up there"... but we deny it for various reasons until crunch time. I personally don't want to wait until something tradgic happens... and happen it will... I want to have that sense of 'connectedness' to God now.
And it feels so much better to believe in at least something. Otherwise what is the point of life, you live you die that's it you're gone? That's no fun to me. I'd rather believe there's much much more to this world.
My DH is still fence sitting as well... hasn't committed to either argument. He seems to need more proof i think. One analogy i have found to be helpful with him is to liken our life on earth with a baby in the womb... yes we appear to have everything we need... we are alive, all's good... but we are not able to see the bigger picture, it's impossible for us to even imagine the reality of the situation because we would have to get outside the womb to know what is going on... and when it's time to be born it's pretty scarey! there's lots of pain and blood and change... which is all a bit like dying really... but i think that when we die all will then be revealed... until then we just have to accept that there is no language to describe the reality of God and Heaven... it's impossible, just accept it... now i don't know if this analogy is correct of course, it's just more guesswork and intuition. My DH seems to think there might be something to it though :)
Gotta be quick here, but...
Because when Jesus was alive He hadn't died for our sins and this made the changes of what was good in the eyes of God and what wasn't. Not to invalidate the argument, but that's how I see it.:
if Jesus still did them why don't we??
About women leaders - check out the book of Judges. Deborah (to name the first one who springs to mind) also led men into battle. Also what of Ruth, Esther, Rahab or Mary Magdalene if you want more strong women? These ladies were fantastic and can teach us so much. BTW, wiht Mary it's worth actually reading the Bible, not popular fiction; she's not the same woman as the films would have us believe.
It does state in the Bible that the Qu'arn was given to Mohammed... again, I need to look up where exactly. But I can't believe that God would give His people so many different religions and then expect us to pick which was divine - they all are.
I think god, whatever you percieve God to be, can see into your heart. This means that if you are living your life in love, doing what you truly believe to be correct, and are reverent about others too, you're on the right track.
But if you have badness in your heart, or greed or cruelty, even if you act apparently in god's name, he will know your true motivation and that is a bad path to take.
I also believe a soul is tested before achieving heaven/enlightenment but i believe too in karma. There is no "good" karma - karma is the debt of sins accumulated by your soul as you move through life and you must repay before you can move on up. I think hardship settles karma and teaches us lessons about ourselves, the world, how to be, but if we are poor scholars, engage in self-pity or hate or perpetuate the pain we have suffered and gather more karma, we get another lesson, even harder, until we learn. I am not completely without compassion! But i do think i know many, many people who are so much more in control of their lives and hardships than they are willing to see - and i don't mean abstract "this happened because you were mean to her" scenarios, i mean literal "you made a poor decision and this is the fruit of that" scenarios. It is painful to stop in the middle of hardship and think "why is this really happening? could i have prevented it? if i couldn't have prevented it, what is it teaching me? did i need this lesson?" but the answer to the last question is invariably yes.
As for the major religions, there's an analogy....(wait for it!)..
There's an elephant. The elephant is God. The elephant is surrounded by the scholars of the major religions. They are blind, because none of us can know the true nature of God. The Jewish scholar has his hands on an ear. He calls out to the others "The nature of God is flat and smooth and large!". The Christian scholar holds the trunk. He calls out to the others, "The nature of God is long and flexible!". The Muslim scholars hold tusks, the Sunni calls out "The nature of God curves this way." the Shia responds "The nature of God curves THIS way!". The Buddhist sits at the feet of the elephant, leaning back against the leg and says "The nature of God is a steady support, a solid resting place.". The Hindu scholar holds onto the tail and laughs at the Buddhist's words which are such a poor description.
If humans, or elephants, can be so complex and hard to "know" with our narrow vision of relaities, how much more so must God be? To understand God would be like trying to drink the oceans. I will sip what i can hold in my teeny hands and be satisfied.
Bx
Oh Bec, such wisdom, you're amazing :)
Yes, I believe too that God can see into our hearts. And I also acknowledge that every bad thing that has happened to me has happened for a reason and i don't resent anyone or God for that. I just hope and pray that i don't somehow perpetuate the harm... that is the most important thing.
I've heard that analogy (of the elephant) before and you have restated it very eloquently :)
It's a good one hey?
Well both my boys are asleep early tonight and I think I'd better hit the hay... otherwise i could chat about this all night with such interesting and wise company ;)
nighty nite all!
I'm loving this thread :) I feel like going into a few other parenting forums and pointing out this thread and saying "THIS is how you have a mature discussion about religion"
I do think though that tolerance is something that is coming with age, alot of people our age that are religious tend to be tolerant about others and their choice in religion, its the older generations I've found to be the more certain there's is the only way iykwim?
Here's hoping things can only get better...
*hugs*
Cailin
Hagar was actually a bit mean to Sarai - she bragged a bit that she could have a baby but Sarai couldn't; that's why Sarai was mean to Hagar. Or at least, that's how it's reported in the Bible! The circumcision was for Abraham and Isaac, not Abraham and Ishmael, and Isaac's son Jacob went on to have the twelve sons who then formed the tribes of Israel. Hope that clears it up a bit - I'd love to know the Islam reporting of this history too.
I love Ruth best of all (my name, rebecca, means faithful wife or joined together so maybe that's why....). Her husband dies and her MIL is thrown into poverty. The other daughters in law return to their families. Naomi (MIL) tells them to go because she is too old to have more sons for them to marry. The others go but Ruth refuses.
Ruth 1:16-17
"And Ruth said, Intreat me not to leave thee, or to return from following after thee: for whither thou goest, i will go; and whither thou lodgest, i will lodge; thy people shall be my people, and thy God my God:
Where though diest, will i die, there will i be buried: the Lord do so to me, and more also if ought but death part thee and me.
Such devotion! Devotion is very important to me, and something which makes me feel whole, to be able to place my faith in someone or something and come what may stay there and honour my decision. It's very hard to do, but powerful if one can manage it :)
Bx
Genesis 17:26 - Abraham and Ishmael were circumcised on the same day. I do love to just read Genesis sometimes. I also end up wondering just how history (and life today) would be different if Sarah had been patient and trusting enough to believe that God would fulfill his promise and didn't send Abraham to Hagar...
Another question for Dachlostar... I was told that after God made his covenant with Abraham that the Jews went on to circumcise their male children at 8 days old as per instructions. But because Ishmael was 13, the Muslims adopted the habit of circumcising at 13 years of age. It doesn't seem to sit right with me, and I have always wondered if this were true.
BW
Oh yes, very different I'm sure.:
I also end up wondering just how history (and life today) would be different if Sarah had been patient and trusting enough to believe that God would fulfill his promise and didn't send Abraham to Hagar...
BW, there is no specific age for circumcision in Islam - you need to get it done but it's up to the parents when it's performed. I'm of the opinion that it's best done early. There are some differant cultural traditions - the Turkish people do it when thier sons are 12 or 13. It's a bit of a rite of passage, the boy gets spoilt rotten and dressed up in special clothes and lots of presents and if there is one available he rides around on a white pony then...... *chop*. Personally, the thought of it makes my eyes water but I was discussing it once on another forum and the Turkish guys on there didn't seem particuarly traumatised by the experience - they actually seemed to have fond memories of it as a special day and the start of thier adulthood.
Niass, we believe that after the Zam-Zam spring appeared Hagar (Hajira in arabic which IMO is a much nicer name than Hagar) and Ishmael settled beside and started to trade with passing caravans and as time passed they founded a settlement there (Mecca). Abraham came to visit but they never lived together again and later Abraham and Ishmael worked together to raise the Kaaba.
In Islam we believe that the son that Abraham was called upon to sacrifice was Ishmael not Isaac. There was scholarly debate about this long ago but the concensus of the scholars was that as his oldest son Ishmael was the son referred to in the Holy texts. I could be wrong but I think that traditionally in Christain scholarship it has been assumed to be Isaac because he was the legitimate son whereas Ishmael was the son of a slave-woman. In Islam despite his illegitimacy Ishmael is still recognised as the oldest son. He is also considered a Prophet. In fact he's not really regarded as illegitimate because Hagar is regarded as a second wife.
Whilst we have great respect for Sarah, Hajira and Ishmael are far more central to our history.
I agree that it would make a great blockbuster but however you portrayed it someone would be bound to be offended ;)
Hajira is much nicer than Hagar.
I think it was because God promised Abraham that the messiah would come through his children with Sarah that Christianity focuses on that line, rather than the offspring of Ishmael. Interesting point on the sacrifice of his son, although I think the point of the sacrifice was for Abraham to trust God, rather than which son was more important (really, neither son was less important than the other in the eyes of Abraham, it was just that God happened to promise the Messiah would come from his offspring with Sarah. And this was to prove that even though it looked impossible, because Sarah was beyond childbearing age, God always fulfills his promises).
Chlo, as Hagar/Hajira was considered a second wife, does this mean there are circumstances where polygamy was acceptable in Islam? In the Old Testament, there were quite a few examples of men (who were followers of God) who had more than one wife. And does Islam differentiate between the title of concubine (which is what Hagar/Hajira was classified as) and that of wife?
Sorry to pester you with qns!!
Quickly on the later circumcision front...
In some parts of North Africa which are now Christian, circumcision is still performed at age 12 or 13, as a boy enters manhood. In such places the foreskin is seen as a "female" element (as females have folds of skin and men, in their culture, do not) and it is removed after the end of childhood when the boy becomes a man and no longer needs it. There too it is a major rite of passage and something which the boys look forward to and compete over (who took the pain most like a man!). It actually sits better with me than newborn circumcision as it's done with the foreskin's owner's informed consent, BUT i can see that it would be difficult even for a 13 year old to go against his on culture and also that fulfilling the covenant goes way beyond a consent issue so please no-one feel i am attacking religious practice! :)
Bx
I agree, for christians it is pretty clear in the bible that Issac was the 'child of promise', because of this passage in Genesis::
My interpretation of the passages mentioned from Genesis (though others may read it different) is that Ishmael was greatly loved by his father and until Sarah gave birth to a son, he was the most important child, but he needed to have his first wifes child become the 'sucessor'. But I think he struggled with this and thats why God had to reasure him that Ishmael was still significant and looked after.
So Muslims believe it was actually Ishmael? Can someone tell me how this story is written differently in the Quran (sp?) to portray the different beliefs (i.e. which child was actually the child of promise). Interested to know what it says differently. Thanks guys!:
19And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
20And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation. 21But my covenant will I establish with Isaac, which Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time in the next year.
I must admit, I've never liked the Abraham story. There's the bad blood between Sarah and Hagar (Hajira is sooo much nicer!), there's the whole story of Lot in there too ("Oooh, don't sleep with my male guests, here, have my virgin daughters instead... who will then sleep with me to get pregnant anyway"), there's the sacrifice of Isaac... even though the sacrifice isn't needed, I just find it hard to cope with the thought that Isaac was so long-awaited and then thought his Dad was going to kill him... I know he didn't but it's still the thought of it.
And yes, I know that Jesus had to die for us and that He is the son of God and all that, but God knows His divine plan, we don't. And I just don't like the thought of parents killing their children. God is clearly different as He can see what will happen, but we mortals, well, we shouldn't be encouraged to kill our babies! But that's an emotive Mummy talking.
Maybe that's why I like that story, it's like a soap, lol.
Something interesting about the Sabbath: I read it somewhere the other day but I can not find it anywhere now. I remember reading somewhere about the benefits of observing the Sabbath (from friday sunset to Saturday sunset). Anyway, apparently they've now found that during that time during the week there's something about the way the planets are aligned to give you the best rest and rejuvination. Weird hey. I think it's amazing. Like I've been reading stuff about the food laws and they've only recently found why the 'unclean' animals and blood, etc are bad for you from a scientific perspective. That just convinces me that the bible is true even more, because these laws were written thousands of years ago and now science is able to back them up, crazy!
Also been reading about evolution. Wondering why we were and still are taught it in school now, turns out there's no evidence for it. Apparently all life evolved etc etc so you would expect fossils to show this development, however, there's been no transitional fossils found at all??? Why are they still teaching us this then. Some of the text books still have examples which are now well known to be hoaxes.
Then that got me thinking about global warming, they are giving evidece for global warming from what the earth has been doing millions of years ago, although from a christian perspective the earth has only been around 10000 years or something. Omg too much thinking.
Congratulations if you were able to follow my train of thought here, lol, I have gone completely of the track.
I was just thinking about the whole global warming evidence thing again, they look at tree rings, glaciers, etc and say the world must be really old from that. Well I reckon God would have made all the trees and everything already formed, not a seed in the ground, otherwise all the animals wouldn't have anything to live on until everthing grew. So then things would look older wouldn't they?? Does that make sense?
Also solves the what came first, the chicken or the egg, lol, a chicken god didn't make eggs to hatch, and he didn't make embryo's for adam and eve, haha. Never thought of it that way, problem solved, lol.
I think there's 2 different views, either literally 7 days he made the world in, or 7 'God' days.:
I think christian creation theory/belief is that the earth has been about up to 10,000yrs.
I personally believe the literal 7 days from Genesis. DH I think is more inclined to see it as some kind of metaphor as he finds it hard to believe things he can't absolutly prove, or see! Although he fails to realise evolution hasn't been proven either.
Some interesting stuff I found about the whole evolution thing on a website if anyone's interested, it's a summary of the evidence:
I don't get why if this is the case they are still teaching it in schools, any ideas?:
Evolution Therory: Life came from non-living matter (spontaneous generation)
Scientific Evidence: Never observed or duplicated in a laboratory
Evolution Therory: Random processes create life. The universe has existed for over 30 billion years, during which time all life evolved by random processes.
Scientific Evidence: Creating a simple 100 component non-living organism would take 3 billion billion billion billion billion billion billion years. The simplest protein that can be termed 'living' has 400 components.
Evolution Therory: Sexual reproduction came about by evolution.
Scientific Evidence: 2 humans had to evolve at the same time and place, having complimentary reproductive systems. If one system wasn't complete or compatible the species would become extinct.
Evolution Therory: Species evolve from other species.
Scientific Evidence: There are no fossils of transitional life forms. Organisms have never been found to cross the boundaries between species.
Evolution Therory: Mutations are the primary way that new genetic material is available for evolution.
Scientific Evidence: Greater than 99% of mutations are defects. No mutant has been observed that has become a different species.
Some things I do find interesting:
God created animals in this order: fish, reptiles, birds, mammals, humans.
Evolution states animals evolved first as fish, then reptiles, then birds, then mammals, finally man. It does not explain why monkeys didn't die out as an evolutionary dead-end.
I do think that God could have used evolution, but it would have to be God-driven as mutations these days just seem to cause illnesses, not cool X-Men powers.
Marrying within a family (incest) was not prohibited until the time of Moses. This was because of recessive genetic illnesses. As Adam and Eve were created perfect, therefore with no genetic mutations, their children could intermarry without negative effects (other than a certain ewww factor nowadays!). By the time of Moses, enough mutations had crept in to mean this was a bad idea.
God told the Isrealites not to eat meat that would go off quickly and poison them. He also gave rules to kill animals so they would be safe to eat and not kill His people - they didn't know about bacteria, but they were still looked after.
God also told His people how to kill mildew (knock down the house and do not live there for seven years). Yes, a bit extreme, but I still think that's better for you than using Cillit Bang.
In fact, most of the laws are completely explainable by science nowadays, but would be inexplicable back when they were written.
Amazing hey Ryn. That's enough evidence for me! All of these things could only have been known by God back then, science didn't discover them until 1000s of years later. Enough for me to believe that God is real.
I also find it more believable that God created the universe rather than 'nothing' exploded resulting in everything that we see around us.
SaraJane i'm about to leave for a wedding so i can't talk long but i wanted to tell you that spontaneous generation HAS been observed now, in lab conditions, at the atomic level. This isn't proof of how the universe was formed, it just shows that COULD be what occurred.
I am not convinced by evolution because i don't see enough evidence for it, but i do not believe what genesis says is factually true (though i imagine it has figurative and/or idealistic truth) and i reject intelligent design as a theory outwith Christianity because any theory which says "the proof of the theory is the theory itself" is NOT science.
We can see in our DNA that we are far closer in type to apes than we are to, say, ivy plants, and i think the answer to our genesis lies in our genetics somewhere.
As far as global warming is concerned...my father works in the energy business (generation engineer) and i'm afraid that as far as i can see, global warming is a direct result of our abuses of this plant, whoever made it for us.
I'm a bit of a geek, can you all tell? ;)
Bec
An endangered butterfly (somewhere!) has just been discovered to have mutated to avoid a certain bacteria that was killing all the males of the species. This mutation has come about within 5 years (amazing), rather than the hundreds like first thought.
another nerd in da house!
Sorry - back to religion. I put down the bible in school when it was apparent there was so much baby killing.
Lulu- just found what you were talking about. This has happened before.
Something I found about it, don't know if it's the same, but it seems that way from what I've read about it. More like natural selection than evolution.
I tend to agree with what others have said in that there's just not enough evidence of evolution for me and it's still just a theory. Personally I find creationism more plausible.:
Variation within a species is common, as we see in the many breeds of dogs, cats, cows, etc. A frequent example of "evolution" used in text books is the variation of the peppered moth. Prior to the industrial revolution in England, dark peppered moths were rare, the light colored ones were common. During the industrial revolution, factory soot covered tree trunks where moths landed. The light colored moths were now more visible to predators, thus their population decreased greatly, while the dark moths were now less visible to predators and multiplied.
Textbooks say the light colored moth evolved into the dark colored moth during this time. Is this evolution? No new species resulted, just a variation within the species because of natural selection, or survival of the fittest.
I am wiccan. Was baptised catholic but became wiccan at 19.
My boys will not be baptised any religion as my husband and i dont want to force religion upon them.
i respect everyone's choice of religion.
Just dont like people forcing it down my throat.
Blessed Be
Cruemum i'd love to hear more about your faith.
What Wiccans believe about to where we all came from, evolution, etc? You worship nature, is that correct? I dabbled in white magic as a teen (which i was led to believe was related to wiccan faith, is that correct?) but i stopped when it got a bit to effective for comfort!
What are the tenets of your faith?
Bec
I definitely like to believe there is a higher power, but I don't believe the bible. To me it is like any story. Im sure some of the characters are based on real people, but I say based on.
I am catholic, non practising, and was brought up in a private catholic school. I really didnt mind it and I loved saying prayers before each lesson. LOVE being grateful. I also love some of the traditions, baptism especially. I do pray, and I am very spiritual, but not religious.
I do have my own beliefs, but they are not something I can explain. I am very accepting of others beliefs as long as they're not pushed on me. I think religion should be something of deep value to a person and if you believe, there should be no need to "convince" others. (I say this because my inlaws are born again christians and I have NEVER come across such a pushy religion. I find it astounding).
Each to their own, it all comes down to faith. Faith is an amazing thing, but I think you can have faith in anything you choose and shouldn't be made to feel like you'll suffer if your faith isn't in God.
xoxo
What I find fascinating is that nearly all religions and faith have a set of rules (which I guess simply map out "common decency") very similar to the 10 commandments:
1. You shall have no other Gods but me.
2. You shall not make for yourself any idol, nor bow down to it or worship it.
3. You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God.
4. You shall remember and keep the Sabbath day holy.
5. Respect your father and mother.
6. You must not kill.
7. You must not commit adultery.
8. You must not steal.
9. You must not give false evidence against your neighbour.
10. You must not be envious of your neighbour's goods. You shall not be envious of his house nor his wife, nor anything that belongs to your neighbour.
Does anyone really struggle with any of these?
One of the reasons why I kinda reluctantly conceded that there must be a higher power is that no man could have come up with a set of rules like this... or could we?
Politics is a power.....
Hoobley, yes wiccans believe in the power of mother earth and are governed by nature.
if you watch "charmed" half of it isnt true.
Lots of people think that ther is black and white magic, that isnt true. there is only magic and it is the witch who decides it's direction.
Most people who dont understand or know what it is about assume wiccan has links to Satan, which it doesnt.
If you have any other questions contact me privately.
have no problems with questions.
Blessed be!
Can I just ask Catherine... does the Wiccan faith have a set of guidelines like the 10 commandments that kinda helps people get along?