[ADVICE] DH is soooo bad with money :(

[Marley&Me]

As the title says, DH is so bad with money that I fear for our future He has always been bad with money, he just spends anything that goes into his bank. Just before Christmas he took one weeks annual leave to spend for presents etc. He has since managed to spend $800 in the space of 7 days. Allowing about $300 MAX for presents and alcohol for xmas, that still leaves $500 of just spending on crap. We don't have a lot of savings so it is really important.
I am at my wits end with him. We have no children yet, but we are hoping 2012 will bring us a baby, but I am constantly worried about not working when I have the baby. I have a separate account which is set up in my name and I transfer about 2/3 of his wage into it for savings/rent, but he just spends the rest. My own account has a little bit of savings which I use for shopping/bills. It works because he cant touch any money I transfer, but i shouldn't have to take all his hard earned money away from him.

We fight, cry and argue about it ALL THE TIME, but he just can't save. I have threatened to leave and it still doesn't work. It's a serious problem and I don't know what to do

[Gigi]

conflict re money is the biggest problem for couples, you are not alone hon.

it broke up my relationship, although i hung in for many more years than i should have, hoping i could "fix" it, and then in the last half, staying, as i had no way of getting my own place, due to the financial strain i was under.

the longer it went on, the more ex expected ME to pay for a long list of family expenses that he TOLD me i had to pay, didn't care if i had the capacity to pay or not.

plus, his non-lodgement of tax returns, meant i got in huge strife with Family Assistance Office (cos family tax a and b was paid to me).

my ex refused to go to a financial counsellor with me, said budgets were only for well off people
i went to financial counsellors by myself, who said "we;ve only got half of the picture here, without your partner and his details, we can't work out a family budget". So i applied the things i learnt from them, to my portion, and tried the best i could to pay things. I was set up to fail, so was miserable all the time, and worrying about money, whilst ex was merrily spending money like water, on non-essential things.

i commiserate with you, that kind of financial dishonesty, one person sticking their head in the sand, it kills love.

The lack of any goals to save towards, as a family, killed our love too. Always being broke.

I made sure we never got cut off utilities, i thought i was doing the right thing, but all it did, was help him keep going on his merry way. His haircuts never stopped, mine did. I knew (on my limited income) i put the household and the baby's needs first. His chiro visits happened when his back went out, i just had to put up with the pain.

it wears you down.

he didn't take my threats to leave seriously either. in the end, i left without saying anything. but i stayed much longer than was healthy for me and my DD. it takes alot to leave. much harder to leave with a small child i found.

early in the r'ship, my ex "gave" me most of his wage, for me to put into a "pot", for me to do the combined budget. I thought this was good in the beginning, but later i realised, he had no responsibility. It was like a kid handing over money to mum, and saying "make sure i don't spend this". No self control on his part. Then i watched for years, any windfall he might have, totally blasting it, then having no money when the car needed big repairs etc. No money to spend when his DD came to stay. No money saved up for when car needed replacing. Never a rainy day fund. No thought of topping up super. No "save for a holiday" fund. Just, live for today.

He resented me for being able to budget. Once baby came, i had a rough labour, was unable to budget for first year of her life, so i THOUGHT he had taken the reins, i found out, no that didn't happen. And from then on, he started making the demands, YOU are going to be paying X Y and Z. no discussion. no "can you actually pay this". Just YOU ARE paying this.

it's so hard. You don't think about financial compatibility, when you start falling in love with someone do you? But it becomes so important, to whether you can stay together. it's so hard.

[Beautiful Disaster]

It's one thing that DH and I always fight about but it's me that's bad not him and I openly admit it

[Epacris]

Is there any reason why you can’t just take complete control over all the money and give him a small allowance. You are in a relationship, it’s not “his hard earned money”, that money belongs to the relationship. If he can’t responsibly look after the money then I can’t see any reason why you shouldn’t take on that job. That’s what I’d do.

[Enchanted]

A family member has a DH who is terrible with money too. So she controls all of the money, every single cent. He doesn't even have a bank card as he will go and spend a fortune on lunch everyday & it doesn't fit into their budget. So she gives him $50 spending money a week. That has to get him petrol and whatever he has left over he can spend on whatever he wants. Which isn't much. It helps keep the lines of communication open for them about what he wants to buy etc and if it fits into their budget. Some may think it's controlling etc but when it's a matter of money or no money, I think it's the way to go. Obviously every situation is different but it's something worth looking into.

[Me+him+bub]

join the club hun, like the others have said I would offer to take full control of finances, I do! my DF doesn't even know his own westpac password!, I do it all because if I didn't we would be bankrupt, I started it a few years back when he didn't even have the $4 for my train ticket back from the city coz he had spent his whole pay on clothes and I had to even buy my own lunch! ask him if you could just give it a go to see if it helps the relationship.

[jacklicky]

I sat down with all the bills for the past year...put them in a spreadsheet and presented it to DH saying this is your half of the bills.
DH is a spender so I had to ensure we pay our bills before he spends. I am the only one with savings (out of my wage) and I do resent that all the big purchases we make come out of money I saved where he spends....but once I did the bill spreadsheet and get him to direct debit the money each fortnight we are better off. I wont say I don't get peeved still but at least I know the bills will be paid....when I go on maternity leave I have told him he needs to pay all the bills (I will still pay the whole mortgage while on mat leave as I have been saving for that).

We dont combine finances and I try not to control his spending as long as he gives me the fortnightly money. He just wanted a new car so I told him he had to pay off all his debts and then save to pay cash for the car and he just bought it.....I dont know the state of his finances and I dont even know how much he gets paid (well roughly I do) but for me it was the only way I could cope with his level of 'irresponsibility' with money.

[Cherished]

Hi there, bad money management is one thing both dh and I could not cope with so thankfully we are both good with it. We have great budget which includes spending money for each of us so that neither of feels like we can't buy thing or that our hard earned money goes on nothing but bills! This let's s spend guilt free as we know everything else is being taken care of and we still feel some freedom. This probably works for us due to our attitude on money and spending yet others still can't control themselves? Maybe it could work for you guys, if he knows what he can spend then he might manage it better?

[Marley&Me]

Gigi, sorry you went through all of that DH does have good intentions to save, he has goals, he works hard, he's paying things off (neighbours car he is buying and our personal loan) but every other cent is being spent. I know exactly what you mean when you say "it's like handing over money to mum so he won't spend it" I often use this phrase in arguments. And as for a rainy day fund, I worry constantly about that. Our savings are minimal and only because I budget accordingly to save that money!
He knows he has a problem, but he just can't help himself. If I ask him for money, he will give it to me (provided he hasn't spent it already) He will give me the last $5 in his wallet, but I need him to stand on his own two feet and save for himself instead of asking me for money out of our savings.
I really hope things don't get worse. I know a couple that live like this, she takes all but a tiny percentage of his wage (enough for a slab of beer and petrol for the week) and the rest goes to mortgage/bills/food etc. They are very happy too, he doesn't mind at all and she is content with living like that. I can only hope that if we have to live like that then we can be happy doing things that way.

Thanks for your input



And Kylz, stop spending!!

[peanutter]

This is the long way of answering your question ... it gets there at the bottom, but there's a lot that you can do first, to increase the chances of success with your DH ... hear me out!

Ok, I suggest:-

1. start a budget - a full, warts and all budget. use your receipts or credit card statements of whatever for all the different things you spend over the course of a year. And I mean everything - make sure you don't forget annual things or odd things, like car rego or mail redirection services, etc. Categories to get you started:

Rent/mortgage, bills (all utilities, rates, body corporate, agents fees, whatever), petrol, insurance (all of them - house, car, life, health, whatever), car stuff (services, mechanics, oil, cleaning, tyres, rego), train tickets, food, clothes, uni or other educational stuff, books, presents (Christmas, birthdays, weddings, housewarming - these add up too!), alcohol, cigarettes, magizines, gym or other memberships, going out (movies, meals, takeout, renting DVDs, going to the pool, whatever), cleaning products, gardening stuff, clothes and shoes, daycare or babysitting, stuff for your dog (food, vet, shots, collars, toys, clipping, registration, everything...), mobile credit, medical (doctors fees, medicine, vitamins, physio, bandaids - again, EVERYTHING). Also put in an allowance for general savings (I suggest 10-20% of your after tax income) and a further "baby savings" amount to get a bit of a nest egg together for when you need to buy things for your upcoming bundle of joy.

Open up ING or similar accounts, so the two savings amounts get deducted from your income straight away, so there can be no temptation to see those funds as being "available" in any way shape or form.

Be brutal, and err on the side of caution - if last year you spent $700 keeping the car up but the year before it was $1000, budget for $1000.

And have a think about all the other little things which crop up but aren't intended - how often do you get fines (whether a $3 library or video store fine, or a $500 parking/speeding fine, overlimit fees, interest charges on your credit card) because all those add up really quickly on a tight budget. What realistically gets spent over the year?

2. using all your hard work from above, make a budget for how much you need to set aside every pay day (whether it's weekly, fortnightly or monthly) to make sure over 12 months you have enough for everything - putting aside extra for any annual amounts which you need to get to quicker (eg: if your car insurance is due in Feb, you obviously can't set up your budget so that it's all there at the end of December 2012 ... you need to have it by Feb, and *then* you can go back to just the amount you'll need per annum.

3. once you've got your budget set up, look at it critically, with a fine tooth comb ... what really should you not be spending that much on? Are there lots of late fees or overlimit fees? can you orgnaise things better, so that you can avoid those? Even if you're getting just one overlimit fee every 4 months, that's $100 a year! Personally, I'd rather get a new dress with matching shoes ... you? and are you spending more on takeout than you reaslised? or does pay tv end up being not really worth it, if you're struggling with the more essential elements? what can you shop around for? we found that if we bought our dogs' worming etc pills from our local stockist, it was about 45% the cost of it from the vet ... are there little areas where you can tighten up your belt? When you go to Costco, do you end up buying the 12 things you needed (at niftily reduced prices) but also end up with your loving DH having snuck in 4 books you didn't need, and a throwrug? Or do you find that food goes off in your fridge, and maybe you need to buy less? Do you end up spending more on presents than you intend to? If you mean to spend $50 but then buy something for $60 and wrapping paper for $4 and a gift bag for $5 and a card for $5, and $4.50 for parking, and you bought a frappachino and bagel while you were out for $10, you've spent almost $100 ... again, this might seem really stupid and obvious, but it can be really surprising (for your DH more than you, probably!) to see where it all goes ...

I did this with DH years ago (we were 18 and had just started living together, and as far as he was concerned budget was the 4 letter word straight from the pit of despair - but I lived by one, and I got all his receipts and showed him how he'd spent $191 on MacDonalds in the past month ... I kid you not. And that's even worse when you consider he was earning something like $8.50 an hour less tax at the time, and only got Maccas on his way to or from work or Tafe - when he could have got a free staff meal or taken food from home ...!

4. make sure that in the budget there is an allowance for each of you to have a little pocketmoney. and I mean a little - DH and I used to get $5 each a week, and that has crept up to $10 a week. It is for things like buying lunch (as there is no excuse not to pre make it and take it from home, in our house!) or a magazine (me) or a scratchie (DH) or anything else not essential. And an awful lot of incidental spending is not essential ... but you can't have a realistic budget without a little slush money - we are grown ups, and we do need to know that we can go and buy a coffee or a newspaper if we want to ... or we can save it up for a few weeks, and buy a CD ... a friend of mine spends all his pocket money on cigarettes - he's usuing it as an incentive to quit ... as there's no way on God's great earth that his smokes money is coming out of their household budget!

5. once you've got your no holds barred budget drawn up, and you've had a think about where you (as a family - not just you personally!) can pull the purse strings a little tighter, sit down with your DH, and go through it with him. Show him where the money is going, and where you can be in 3 months/6 months/12 months if you stick to the realistic budget you've figured out.

ask him where else he thinks you guys can shave a bit off, together. and what you both would like to do with the savings ... eg: if we save $x by [date] then we'll have enough to go away to [wherever] for x nights, and will still have $x saved! yay us! or you'll have enough money for a new bigger bed, or couch, or TV, or gym membership, or laptop, or whatever takes your fancy ...

or the savings themselves, if it's for a baby or a home deposit or something might be enough of a reward on its own, without needing a payoff alongside it.

6. agree with your DH that you both will stick to the budget, and that you both will only ever spend what you already have.

7. every cent you spend must be recorded. seriously. you make a 50c phone call from the station? or get a potato cake on the way home? write it down, so it can get included on the budget. This is really important for the first 1-3 months, to see where the $$ goes when you're not both paying attention ... because realistically, if you both keep your receipts and write down anything you spend, then your salary minus your receipts should equal your bank balance plus your wallets. If not, something has slipped, and you need to know what it is ...

But it also makes you think twice about purchases. If you DH is intending to buy x, and he knows that is going to come out of the budget category y, there's a little bit of accountability. Eg: he sees some nice carseat covers, and he wants to buy them. He can - but they are either going to come out of the "car" budget (leaving less money for repairs, etc), or his "Christmas/birthday present" budget, or he needs to have enough pocket money to pay for it (in advance - this isn't a mortgage!! again - only ever spend what you already have). so he thinks twice about it ... maybe he buys it, maybe he doesn't ... but it makes him think.

realistically, you are likely going to need (and want) to do all the entries for a while ... do it every day, so you can get the receipts from him every day, so you can see early on in the piece whether your budget is realistic, and whether you and your DH are both coping with it.

and also because your DH is (hopefully) having an enormous mind shift in terms of his attitudes towards money - when he starts to understand the benefit of having a decent budget that you stick to, hopefully he will do an equal share of the work to maintain it!! But until then, you doing it is the only realistic way to get it to be in place, up to date, as an accurate reflection of your households income and expenses ...


It's not easy, but it's worth the effort - and hopefully if your DH starts getting it, participating, and you're both gettnig the benefit from it, you won't actually need to do it long term ...

[peanutter]

sorry ... I think I killed your thread!

[Marley&Me]

sorry ... I think I killed your thread!

LOL, no you didn't. All very helpful Sometimes I think I've killed someones thread too, it's like as soon as I post no one else wants to

[Saffy]

everyone's advice was worth reading, I enjoyed all the tips and so glad to hear there are other DH's like mine!

[Gigi]

Peanutter, i think your advice was sterling. Thank you so much, for taking the time to type that all out, i found it very useful.

[LionsandBears]

I am the one who is bad with money in our relationship. I've improved but that took years & I even had hypnotherapy. I'm still crap but not as bad. Paying off my eternally refinanced personal loan & getting rid of my credit card was a big step for me.

Peanutter's advice was brilliant. In addition, I recommend you reading either the Barefoot Investor or the Richest Man in Babylon. The advice in the latter is to work out your income. Either reduce your expenses to 70% of your income or increase your income. Save 10%. Pay yourself first. This means taking 10% as soon as you get paid & putting into savings. The other 20% is there to pay off debts, if you have them. It goes on to explain how to work out which debts to pay off first.

A programme I've used is called Simply Budgets. They also have a Debt Busting program which works out the debt repayment for you. The budget program is good, in that you learn to budget for both long term & short term goals. So if you need a new fridge or car in 5 years, you'll have the money accrued. I'm still working on that part.

Btw, the idea of one person in control of the money isn't new. My grandfather used to come home from work & hand his entire pay packet over to grandma. She'd give him his spends & then split the rest between jars. One jar was for electricity, one for gas etc.

[sahbear]

sorry ... I think I killed your thread!

I think your advice was spot on!



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[Astrid]

DH is horrid with money and I am ok with it (I admit I could be better). We basically work with me taking it all and then giving him pocket money and petrol. We both agree it is our money, we have had different times over the years where only one of us was earning, or one was earning way more than the other.

I have struggled over the years working out what method works for us, looking like plotting out the cashflow week by week for a whole year is working so far. It does not help though that every second sentence from DH is about money he needs to do something. Wish he would take more interest in the cashflow budget, it would make it easier for him to understand the constant telling me of how much he needs for whatever project is just plain not helpful and it adds a huge amount of stress to me. He is getting there, but it is taking some time and a few dummy spits from me (screaming at him down the phone when he has called me for the 5th time that day to tell me about yet another $$ project).

From what I have seen most of my friends do the same thing. One partner handles all the money and the other is allocated an allowance. Just makes sense from managing where the money needs to go, there is no double up on bill payments, or bills getting missed.

Best of luck - it sucks, it really does.

[*LittleMissSummer*]

I could have written this post, actually im sure i did a few years ago before DD came along. My DP spent all his money every week on crap. He got a $20,000 loan and had nothing to show for it plus over $10,000 in credit cards. It got to the point we had to scab off his family, my family and would have to sell our belongings just to eat. We fought CONSTANTLY until eventually... those on my FB will remember me ranting on about him spending $800 in one night at his best mates bucks, he left us with no money for food we had no money to get DD her things she needed... she was 8 weeks old. It almost ended our relationship, i lost all trust in him and it was then i put my foot down and turned into a naggy controlling wife.

We now have a joint account so i can see what he spends and if its excessive he has to explain to me why and if its not good enough i punish him by not letting him buy anything next pay. It does feel like i am parenting him but its what he needs. Its even so bad he will call me to ask if he can buy a magazine but its the way it has to be.

I do allow him to buy things he wants but i have to know the cost what benefit we'll both have and he has to save for it, no more loans or credit cards.

It really works for us. We are now out of debt which is great we have money every week and even have savings which we have never had.

If he ever has a go that i control him i remind him about the bucks and how he really let me down.