Breastfeeding and immunity - how does it work?

[Beautitude]

I know that breastfeeding gives baby important immunity but i was wondering if anyone knows how this works? For example DS1 has currently got hand foot and mouth (again ) and i was wondering whether i have to contract it to give DS2 the antibodies through my bm or is it just enough that i have been exposed to it from DS1 having it.

Also DS1 has been having a terrible time with illness of late, its literally one thing after another. Would it be of any benefit to him if i expressed a bottle of ebm for him a day? Not sure if i can manage it with everything else but am willing to try if it would be of some benefit to him.

DH and and i currently taking garlic tablets and probiotics in a bid to also build up our own immunity (very sickly household here lol) and i was wondering if this is enough so that i can pass on immunity to DS2. DS2 and i had alot of antibiotics after his birth and i feel that the antibiotics i had have depleted my good bacteria and that may be why i have been getting so sick so often and i worry that this may be also the case for him. I would really like to protect him as much as possible with DS1 bringing home all these bugs.

Lots of questions i know but i thought someone may know a bit about it. TIA

[MantaRay]

Sorry for the late reply. Breastfeeding helps the baby's immunity in a number of ways actually. In the case you are talking about, just by you being exposed to the illness you would produce specific antibodies to protect against it and these would go into your milk. The system is really amazing. Even if your DS2 is exposed to something, your body can tell when he feeds and you'll produce antibodies in that case also.

In terms of EBM for your older DS, any EBM he gets will be beneficial for him. I think it would be unclear how much EBM he would need to have "enough" protection but certainly any amount he gets would help. Usually when a baby is down to just one feed a day, the milk becomes more concentrated in immunological factors to help boost the baby's immune system before fully weaning. However in the case of your DS1, he would be getting milk of the same composition as his brother so it wouldn't have the added boost. As I say though, it still has immunological factors in it so would do some good.

It sounds to me like you are doing everything you can to protect your DS. Great work - I hope the illnesses end soon

[Beautitude]

Thanks for the reply MR. It is interesting that even by him feeding i will start producing antibodies. Its amazing. We think that DS2 may have gotten the hand foot and mouth off his brother but to a much lesser extent. If we didn't know that DS1 had it i dont think that we would have noticed anything on DS2. Hopefully this is the end of the illness!

[Jennifer13]

Bfing definitely helps immunity, even though I'm not up on the science! My DD bf until she was four (only once a day for almost the last year) and she never missed a day of preschool for 2 1/2 years. I don't think it was a fluke that only a few weeks after completely weaning she needed her first sick day. She's only needed antibiotics for the first time last month with an ear infection. I was a sickly kid too, constantly having tonsilitis and ear infections. The GP has pointed out she has enormous tonsils too, so I think bfing has prevented that rollercoaster ride for us.

[Olive]

just wonderinghow all this works with me being exposed on monday to chicken pox and DD2 not immunised?? shes still feeding 3x a day, will she get some antibodies from the exposure this week? or some immunity from me having immunity all along.. make sense?

[kelebek]

I'm not sure how it relates to chicken pox but I know that this winter I seem to have a cold every other week and more often then not DS would catch it off me but would always be better before me so was in effect he was sicker for less time then me

[~ Mylitta ~]

Olive, in your case it will depend on whether you have had chickenpox before, or if you have had the chickenpox vaccine. I guess the easiest way to explain it is to explain how your immune system works. When you are exposed to a disease (like chickenpox) your body's immune system identifies the disease and creates antibodies to attack that disease. This is the same as what happens when you are given a vaccine as the vaccines are made to be so similar to the disease itself that the same antibodies that are produced in response to the vaccine would work to kill the actual disease. Once this process has occurred, your immune system has a "memory" so that if you are exposed to that disease again, your immune system will recognise the disease straight away and produce those antibodies in bulk to fight off the disease. It's a bit more tricky when it comes to some diseases like colds and flus that modify pretty quickly and create different strains. In that case you immune system doesn't recognise it as the same disease and has to basically create new antibodies from scratch.

Ok, so that's what is happening in you when you are exposed. When it comes to breastmilk and feeding, basically, the antibodies that have been created by your immune system over your lifetime are present in your breastmilk. These are transferred to your baby, and then if they are exposed to a disease that you have antibodies for, your baby will also have some of those antibodies and their immune system will recognise the disease and start fighting it straight away (the same way your own body would).

In your case with the chickenpox, if you have antibodies against it, then you have probably passed some of those antibodies on to your DD2. If you have not had chickenpox before (or the vaccine), you will have no antibodies against it and your immune system will have to respond to it from scratch if you have actually caught the disease. For chickenpox, the incubation period is anywhere from 10 to 21 days after exposure to the virus. That means that it can take up to 21 days for the spots and rash to appear. The infectious period is from 2 days before the rash appears (so you can be contagious and not know you even have chickenpox) until all the spots are dry.

The good news is that if you have been infected with the virus, then your body will start producing antibodies and these will get passed onto your DD2. This means that her immune system will be getting a head start to fight chickenpox if she catches it.

Hope that helps

[Olive]

awesome post mylitta!! thanks darl, i had chicken pox at around 2 years i think ive also had the vaccine (due to my previous work..) is it worth taking her and getting the vaccine today ifi can?? ive only delayed it due to previous ill health and the fact that i delayed the 12 month ones

[~ Mylitta ~]

Because of the long incubation period, the vaccine may help prevent her getting it if it turns out you have caught it. It's highly unlikely you'll get it though because if you have caught chickenpox naturally it gives close to lifelong immunity. The immunity caused by the vaccine on the other hand can start to diminish after 7 or so years so you can actually catch chickenpox later on if you've only had the vaccine.

I know vaccinating is a really controversial issue, but for us personally we have decided not to vaccinate DS for chickenpox at this stage. I'd actually prefer for him to catch it while he's young and still breastfeeding in the hopes that it will be a milder case of chickenpox (due to my antibodies helping out), and also so he get the "lifelong" immunity. Once boys hit puberty it starts getting more dangerous for them to get chicken pox (it can cause sterility), so if he hasn't caught it when he's young we'll probably look at getting it done a bit later on. I'd hate for him to get the vaccine now and for the immunity to wear off just as he hits puberty and for him to catch it then. I've also heard that it's much less bearable to have chickenpox as an adult (we're big babies, hehe).

Good luck with your decision! I certainly know it's often a hard one to make

[Miss E]

Ok, so that's what is happening in you when you are exposed. When it comes to breastmilk and feeding, basically, the antibodies that have been created by your immune system over your lifetime are present in your breastmilk. These are transferred to your baby, and then if they are exposed to a disease that you have antibodies for, your baby will also have some of those antibodies and their immune system will recognise the disease and start fighting it straight away (the same way your own body would).

In your case with the chickenpox, if you have antibodies against it, then you have probably passed some of those antibodies on to your DD2. If you have not had chickenpox before (or the vaccine), you will have no antibodies against it and your immune system will have to respond to it from scratch if you have actually caught the disease. For chickenpox, the incubation period is anywhere from 10 to 21 days after exposure to the virus. That means that it can take up to 21 days for the spots and rash to appear. The infectious period is from 2 days before the rash appears (so you can be contagious and not know you even have chickenpox) until all the spots are dry.

The good news is that if you have been infected with the virus, then your body will start producing antibodies and these will get passed onto your DD2. This means that her immune system will be getting a head start to fight chickenpox if she catches it.

This is a really interesting discussion. There was recently an outbreak of chicken pox at DS's CC, not in his room, but siblings of the children is his room had it. Sure enough about three weeks after the centre notified us DS came down with a cough and runny nose and then started to break out in spots. I took him to the GP at the very beginning to determine if it was chicken pox. At this stage there were only about 3 or 4 that had blistered, but these were on his face, hands and feet. He also had spots appearing all over his body.

Because it was early on the GP considered both hand, foot and mouth and chicken pox, but ultimately diagnosed chicken pox because there had been an outbreak in the centre and HFM can cause spots on the trunk but rarely on the limbs. I was expecting the next week to be hell. But it really fizzled out. The only spots that actually blistered were on his hands, feet and face, leaving me thinking that it was probably HFM rather than chicken pox. However, I don't know of anyone he's been around having had it.

The other part of me wonders if it was in fact chicken pox, but just a very mild case, most likely because he is still BF and I am immune to it. At the time the GP said she would be happy to write a letter to get us out of having the chicken pox vaccine, but now I can't help but wonder if he should have it, given I'm not sure that it was actually chicken pox.

Sorry, I've rambled a bit. Just interested to get your take on it ladies. TIA

[~ Mylitta ~]

Hi Miss E. I guess without having a blood test to specific blood test to look at his antibody titre level, you may never know for sure whether your DS had chicken pox or HFM. It certainly sounds plausible that it would be chicken pox though with the outbreak at CC, and with him still breastfeeding and you having antibodies it seems reasonable that it would have been a mild case for him. Even without knowing for sure though I guess you are still in the same sort of situation when deciding whether to get the chicken pox vaccine for him or not. I'm almost certain that there is no added risk to giving the vaccine if your child has already caught it before, and I also don't think it would effect the length of his immunity either. For me personally I would probably still not give the vaccine until he's closer to puberty if you decide to give it. But that of course has a lot to do with my personal stand with vaccines due to certain risk factors for my DS. I find the vaccine debate a really hard one because I really can see both sides of the argument and actually agree with a lot of the points on both sides