:
i realise that im not an idiot i am i was symply saying as i have said before "some people" symply have no reason just made a choice becuase they wanted to I am in no way dismissing what she has wrote or anything like that im just saying that sometimes there isnt a big thing as towhy some wonen choose what the choose
I think what you have said is valid Mikenzees mum. There are always going to be some people that choose it purely because they have that choice. I totally agree. It's something else to think about for sure. I think all the reasons put forth are valid on some level. And its great to see that we are working towards helping more mothers breastfeed should they choose to.
*hugs*
Cailin
I think thats dead right. In fact I think IK, Mikenzees mum and Kerry are all right, but your just not talking about the same things.:
Yes, some women choose to formula feed, and have access to all the information etc. Thats fantastic, it really is, that they had the opportunity to make that choice for themselves.
Its more the women who forumula feed becuase they didin't think they could breastfeed, were told they couldn't, we told formula was better than breastmilk etc that the discussion is aimed at.
If people don't want to breastfeed, they shouldn't be made or pressured to, but women are entilted to accurate information, if they want to be educated. They are also entiltled to know that this information and education exists if they dont
Whatever choice they make is up to them, its arming them with relvant, accurate information, education, and support mechanisms so that someone who really does want to breastfeed, or who has not made up their mind, can be better equipped to do so.
OK, I think I see now (lightbulb!) - Mikenzees Mum, would you then vote for the availability of ABM?
Can I just do a happy dance! I love it when people can actually see other people POV. Even if it differs from their own. This is the way to constructive discussion. This is a more effective approach. I feel like I'm having a proud mummy moment ROFLMAO! And I don't mean that in any way to be patronising IK, I think you always put forward intelligent comments and are tolerant, its just great to see what I've been trying to instill into practice makes me very happy! *ok back to conversation* LOL!
*hugs*
Cailin
Yes, apologies, MM - I thought (after pondering your post for ages) that you were being facetious :doh: (If I thought you were 'stirring' I would have left it alone!). There wasn't much detail but I think I can see where you were coming from now :)
Cailin - humble pie doens't taste too bad, I've discovered from time to time!
OK cliche time again... You can't have your cake and eat it too... There is no point being dismayed at a society that doesn't accept public (even descreet) BF and yet not be willing to accept some womens choice to FF... it just seems a bit hypercritical.
Not saying that you aren't justified in being p.o'ed about people giving you funny looks or rude remarks,however it feels just as uncomfortable to ff mums to get the negative comments about their choices.
In all honesty I'm 100% if given the choice to bf or ff at birth my DD would have taken the later. She hated bf, and it wasn't through lack of technique on either part, she just didn't like the 'closeness' and once she had her first bottle (at 4 months and after only gaining 300g since birth) there was no way she would ever have gone back to bf.
Ok I said lack of family support... (his not mine) because even while pg I would get.. you aren't going to bf are you, ff is better. I'm intelligent, I research, I was all for BF (just didn't work out) and I just ignored these comments. My X-sil is going to FF... because she doesn't like the idea of her baby sucking on her bbs and she doesn't like anyone touching them... that's her choice, I'm not going to argue with her and yes she has read up on stuff. However she concedes that it is easier to go along with her DH and his family than make a stand also.
While I was bf, even if at home when the x was there, I had to go into a room away from everyone else or there would be huge arguements.
So in my experience and therefore my opinion family support and influence is a big factor.
That's awful Kerry. It must have been so hard for you. Obviously family support is another important factor. And of course it also comes back to education again (not for you, but for XDH's family), and also our culture where many see bfing as abnormal. Really, all the factors are inter-related.
I agree that BF is easier in the long run - my DD is still BF and I can't imagine having to prepare FF in the middle of the night in the early days - but I do still think that FF can be more convenient. Not in terms of preparing the feed, certainly. But when you're out and about, it is much easier to sit down anywhere and just give a bottle instead of having to search around for an appropriate place to BF. And when you're talking to a tearful brand new mother who is having terrible problems establishing BF - FF is certainly easier than going through the pain and anxiety of BF.
Anyway, my point is just that BECAUSE establishing BF can be so very hard and FF can be an 'easy option' it is so important that the education is out there so people understand why it is important to stick at it and HOW to do it.
great submission Kelly. Do you know where I can read any of the other submissions?
I think this is a very good point. I think there are a lot of women that make the decision on how to feed based on what they want not what is best for baby or what the baby wants.:
I wonder what the baby would want if it had a voice.
Hannahfroodo you can view all the submissions here at the government website
http://www.aph.gov.au/house/committe...eding/subs.htm
No offence but I think the baby just wants a full tummy and is in pure survival mode and doesn't really care where it comes from.
I think that to encourage breastfeeding for ALL of the community we need to provide more space to do so discreetly.
Yes, it should be ok if a baby wants to feed in a restaurant (even though boob isn't on thier menu :P) but for women who place a higher premium on modesty there should also be more private spaces. Obviously I'm a Muslim and many Muslim, Jewish, Christian and Hindu women prefer more privacy but also some women may have body issues (weight, stretch marks, scaring etc) and others just view breastfeeding as a private activity. Also some babies are total sticky beaks and find it hard to concentrate on having a good feed in a busy area.
For myself I will use a small cape if I'm fairly sure that there aren't likely to be many men around or a very large scarf ( read waist length) if I think there will be men but many women aren't confident at public breastfeeding without exposure and thier needs should also be considered.
OT but I just remembered when Imran was really young and I was feeding him under my scarf at Darling Harbour. He went to sleep so I left him there - you should have seen the look on the face of the women who were sitting near me when it was time to leave and I pulled a baby out from under my cloths ROFL.
These are my top three
1. Lack of availablility/affordability of support
2. Lack of continuity of care
3. Lack of education
Not enough support for me...I spoke to LC in the hospy...who was so upset that I had called her up specifically to see me. I was dishcharged from hospy with bleeding nipples and they basically said that its all part of it...where everywhere I was reading that it shouldnt hurt.
Then I went to numerous BFing drop in clinics at the baby centre. Feeds were so painfull! I had cracked bleeding nipples for three weeks because no-one told me that bub had to have tounge down...it took 3 weeks for someone to tell me this!!! Life with a newborn is hard enough without having to dread each feed around the clock...the only way to get through the day is to tell yourself....only 2 more feeds until I got to bed then I can rest and BF when she wakes again.
Not being able to BF on demand because it hurt sooo much...hence the baby crying more!
Then I was still having issues with painfull feeds...I even had a LC come to my home which cost $100 (which we couldnt afford) and check attachment...which she said was fine.
If I wasnt so determined to BF I would have just put bub on formula...but bub was my main concern...she was getting enough milk...I just had to deal with the pain. Which I did 10 months on I am still BFing.
I support the idea of bulk billing LCs...that would have been awesome and I am sure it would be a hit with all new mums that have done all they can with what is available to them.
I also support the idea of the government supporting the ABA both financially and with other resources.
Good Luck!
I voted for conflicting advice, I was told I had a low milk supply and there was really nothing I could do, then I was told by another chn that I had enough milk, it was just late to come in but my baby had oral thrush which is why I was having problems.....bub didn't have oral thrush (I later found out from my GP) but just hearing it was enough so I pretty much gave up at that time (I experienced the pain of infected nipples with my first child and was quite upset that I'd have to go through this pain again :(). So, if we ever decide to have a 3rd child maybe I'll just listen to my body and my baby and ignore all the conflicting advice out there! I think some of it on my part was being too head strong to seek more advice or support. I'd just had enough of the bf problems! I found it hard coping with a toddler and newborn as well. I found I couldn't get into any kind of routine with breastfeeding my new baby so my toddler was stuck at home and left to do her own thing! I went to the bottle because I'd done it before, knew what I was doing and felt a huge sense of relief when I decided to fully ff. Maybe 3rd time lucky :lol:
Oh that would be fabulous, I really love that idea of bulk billing lactation consultants, especially IBCLC (international board certified lactation consultants) who are the gold standard.... the lactation consultants at hospital compared to pivate consultants are so different. I've sent Pinky to my clients on several occasions and small adjustments have meant that they happily continue breastfeeding, one telling me something along the lines of 'I can now see what you mean about breastfeeding being enjoyable.' She had mastitis twice after 'help' from hospital sources.
Sorry i wasnt trying to stirr and i dont know facetious means LOL, Im sorry that my post came across like i was sory:
My list would be in order of importance:
1) Lack of education both before & after the birth of a baby, for parents and HCP
2) Marketing of artificial milk & Accessibility of artificial milk I think these two go hand in hand. I personally am tired of going into a large department stores looking for storage bag's to be told that they dont stock "that kind of thing" there but have 2 aisles dedicated to ABM.
3) Lack of availablility/affordability of support I had no idea there was support for mums with breastfeeding issues ( ABA help line local groups & the forum)till my 4th baby was 4 months old.
A friend of mine has just put her baby on the bottle at 7 weeks because her milk dried up, when I asked how she knew her milk had dried she said it was because she no longer felt the full engorged feeling & her bub had started to want to feed every 2-3 hours rather than the 4-5 hours he was going before.
i think that wold be one of the most common reasons for women to stop breastfeeding, I was never told that your supply will settle & you wouldn't feel the fullness as much & at about the same time your bub will go through a growth spurt, but that doesnt mean you have no milk.