Fussing and Tugging

[Kmn]

I'm glad the shields are helping! Have you in the last week done something that might change how your nipples (as opposed to your milk) taste?? like new soap or lansinoh or a change in washing powder from a week ago??
And that picture is just very special...

[Kristin27]

Thats great she had a couple of BF's. Lets hope it continues today - small steps!

[snowchickie79]

Kmn - No i haven't changed soaps or anything. Not that I can think of anyway. I have noticed that Chloe's wee is smellier than it has been to the point I thought she has done #2 a couple of times and gone to change her and found just wet nappy. Could that be indicating something??

I tried to give her a BF around lunch as we were out and she was fussing and would only feed for 5 minutes or so each side. I came home, put the shields on and away she went.

If my nipples taste different to her then I'm not sure what could be causing it. Only difference this last week has been I'm taking aktavite but otherwise no changes. I'm also taking motilium but I've been taking that on/off since around week 2.

[MumInTheVines]

Hi snowchickie,

Just wanted to say a huge well done to you on persevering when it seemed in the early parts of your post you were really considering giving it all up. Breastfeeding is often very difficult to establish in those early days, your hormones are all over the place and you're both brand new to this thing! It's hard to know how much they are getting? are you producing enough? These things you can only answer in time when your confidence grows, which will happen as your bub grows and before you know it 6 months will have passed and you are a pro!

Just wanted to add ... did you know that expressing is not an accurate measure of how much milk you can produce? Your bub is WAY more efficient at extracting milk from your breast. The pump really is no indication. I can only express 10mls, but have managed to breastfeed my DD for almost 15 months.

It definately sounds as though your DD has nipple confusion. She is confused between the bottle and the nipple and is obviously preferring the bottle as she can extract the milk easier from that. Well done for using shields. We used these in the early days as well and gradually she will let you take them away, one feed at a time. So don't be afraid of using them, but still try and give her a couple of feeds without them so your supply isn't affected.

Brewers yeast is also very good for your supply and can be baked into yummy cookies that you can snack on through the day. Do a google search for the recipe if you are interested!

I hope things continue to improve for you. Remember that there are ABA councellors available 24/7 if you ever need help or someone to talk to.

[Marlene]

I have noticed that Chloe's wee is smellier than it has been to the point I thought she has done #2 a couple of times and gone to change her and found just wet nappy. Could that be indicating something??

I would be getting your DD checked for a Urinary Tract Infection, just to be on the safe side. We had the same smelly wee situation (I also thought he had done poos) with our DS when he was only 10 weeks old, I got fobbed off by 3 doctors when I asked about it being a UTI, they said he was too young to get one, especially as he was a boy. It ended up that he did have a UTI. I'm not saying that your DD has one, but, I would definently get smelly wee checked out and do not let the doctors fob you off, demand a urine test.
I don't know if this would have any relation to your breast/bottle problem, but the hospital (where he eventually ended up) was asking me if he was fussy or not eating.

ETA: I didn't mean to panic you about this, but, it is such an easy/painless test to do you might as well get her checked out just to be safe. She probably is too young to get a UTI, but it's always good to be sure, as there are always exceptions. (like my DS)

[snowchickie79]

So this morning we have our weight check and Chloe has gained 200g in 1 week so the clinic nurse was very happy and impressed with the effort. I can wait 2 weeks now till my next weight check and I have an appointment with my LC this coming Friday so see how things go.

Hi snowchickie,

Just wanted to say a huge well done to you on persevering when it seemed in the early parts of your post you were really considering giving it all up. Breastfeeding is often very difficult to establish in those early days, your hormones are all over the place and you're both brand new to this thing! It's hard to know how much they are getting? are you producing enough? These things you can only answer in time when your confidence grows, which will happen as your bub grows and before you know it 6 months will have passed and you are a pro!

Just wanted to add ... did you know that expressing is not an accurate measure of how much milk you can produce? Your bub is WAY more efficient at extracting milk from your breast. The pump really is no indication. I can only express 10mls, but have managed to breastfeed my DD for almost 15 months.

It definately sounds as though your DD has nipple confusion. She is confused between the bottle and the nipple and is obviously preferring the bottle as she can extract the milk easier from that. Well done for using shields. We used these in the early days as well and gradually she will let you take them away, one feed at a time. So don't be afraid of using them, but still try and give her a couple of feeds without them so your supply isn't affected.

Brewers yeast is also very good for your supply and can be baked into yummy cookies that you can snack on through the day. Do a google search for the recipe if you are interested!

I hope things continue to improve for you. Remember that there are ABA councellors available 24/7 if you ever need help or someone to talk to.

MumInTheVines - Thanks for the encouragement and tips. I have spoken with an ABA councellor and they said that until I can sort out the attachment issue then not much can assist. She provided some ideas but hadn't heard of a baby wanting the shields over nipple before, hence why I called my LC from the hospital I gave birth at. I was aware about the whole EBM not equalling what Chloe can extract but always good to hear it again to increase confidence. I know I have milk but just a baby who couldn't be bothered getting it out. I admit my tolerance in low at the moment as the fussing is driving me nuts. Her 4am feed she isnt having any shields and isn't fussing for it so I've left that feed alone.

I would be getting your DD checked for a Urinary Tract Infection, just to be on the safe side. We had the same smelly wee situation (I also thought he had done poos) with our DS when he was only 10 weeks old, I got fobbed off by 3 doctors when I asked about it being a UTI, they said he was too young to get one, especially as he was a boy. It ended up that he did have a UTI. I'm not saying that your DD has one, but, I would definently get smelly wee checked out and do not let the doctors fob you off, demand a urine test.
I don't know if this would have any relation to your breast/bottle problem, but the hospital (where he eventually ended up) was asking me if he was fussy or not eating.

ETA: I didn't mean to panic you about this, but, it is such an easy/painless test to do you might as well get her checked out just to be safe. She probably is too young to get a UTI, but it's always good to be sure, as there are always exceptions. (like my DS)

Marlene - I did mention it to the clinic nurse today and she said it could be something I'm eating passing through to Chloe and affecting the smell. Wasn't too concerned and said to keep an eye on it. If it continues then I'll go and see my GP.

[Barb Glare]

Hi,
You really are doing a great job. Re the nipple shield, nipple shields are often a good tool that can be used in the short term to assist your baby to latch. Babies are designed to breastfeed, and if they can't that means that something is preventing them, not that they just don't want to. Often the nipple shield will hit a spot on their palate that stimulates them to suck. It is fine to use if it helps. Your story is a good illustration of why we are so reluctant to use bottles in the early weeks at least. Rather than the bottle being easier, I think it's more realistic to say that the two forms of feeding are different - like driving a manual car or an automatic car. You can do both, but it might just seem a bit easier at the start with an automatic.
A 200g weight gain is fabulous - well done for sticking with it and solving the problems that were thrown in your way

[snowchickie79]

Quick update:

Still having issues.. I think my supply is now suffering because Chloe is not feeding properly with or without the shields. I have an appt with LC on Wednesday (was today but they had to change it). We had a shocker day on Wednesday after I had a chicken stir fry for dinner Tues night. She was up most of Wednesday with belly pains and no poo followed. I ended up sleeping on the lounge with her Wed night as she wouldn't lay flat on her back for more than 30 seconds without screaming in pain, and a blood curdling scream I might add. So yesterday we were much better. Then last night my supply was low so I had a 90ml EBM in the fridge and gave it to her. About an hour later she started screaming again and that was when I realised that half the EBM I'd expressed on Wed Night and half the Thurs morning so she'd gotten half a feed from the stir fry incident. Not happy jan and I felt so bad for her. I ended up giving her a full FF at 9pm to try and flush her out and voila!!!!! Mind you it resulted in her 2nd bath for the day and with mummy in with her.

This morning at 4am she fussed with BF and I had another 90ml EBM (from last night) so i gave her that and then she slept with me till 8.45am. I gave her 35 min BF at 9am but then she was fussing afterwards still even though she went to sleep on me so i gave her a 60ml comp FF and she finished it in record time, gave her another FF and she took another 30ml so I'm really not sure how much she is getting from the BF'ing at this stage.

I'm wondering if I'd be better of just expressing and giving her EBM and then a FF afterwards depending on what I've been able to express. At least I'd know what she was getting and would be less fussing with making up FF's etc.. So not sure what to do!

[snowchickie79]

Ok so I've been giving EBM for almost a week and was supposed to see LC last Wednesday which got postponed. I go tomorrow to see her and hopefully might be able to sort out this attachment issue although after this long on EBM I'm thinking this is the path we'll be on now..

So today I went and had Chloe weighed at the clinic and she put on 400g in 10 days!! Nurse was impressed and said that it was fine. Considering 200g is a good gain for a week and she was only 4 days off a fortnight then 400g is on the good side of it. Nurse said she is possibly making up for the fortnight she only gainde 50g in total and also might be having a growth spurt. She said her feeding schedule (which I've written down) was fine as she was having small feed, then a big feed, then small etc. She said if Chloe wants food to give it to her as she obviously needs it so that made me feel much better.

When i total up her feeds she is getting between 500ml and 700ml per day. Clinic nurse said that I don't have to wake her every 3 hours to feed anymore and just go back to demand feeding with EBM and FF. I finally have an appointment tomorrow with my LC (another thread) so see if can sort out BF'ing issues or if I stay with EBM/FF situation which is obviously agreeing with Chloe.

See what my LC says tomorrow and I'm also considering upgrading my pump to a full blown electric pump. At the moment I have the medela mini electric but if i'm pumping full time I'm not sure it'll keep up.

[Shanti]

Hi Snowchickie,

I've been reading through your read.... just wondering how you ended up? Did you persist with the BF'ing or did you end up expressing and giving EBM with FF feeds?
Just curious as your story and issues you've had are similar to what i've been experiencing at the moment.....

(I have a BF thread in this area too as to whats been happening with me)

I hope you worked through the problems and was able to BF even if only half the time. Be great to hear from you.

With the pump, I have a Medela Mini Electric also but my LC says they burn out after 48hrs (total usage) so they are only for only the occasional expresser. I ended up getting a Medela Swing it's great.....