AF question

[ktgirl]

Hi ladies. Is it possible to get AF even if you haven't O?

I was on FSH injections and due to my ovaries going spastic and producing way too many follies to do a cycle on natural conception we had to cancel the cycle(would have been good for an IVF cycle but I wasn't ready for that at the time) . When I had my last scan there was around 12 or 13 follies there but they weren't really fully mature. I stopped all drugs immediately and then had a blood test a few days later which showed that the estrogen had dropped and my prog level was fairly low as well and my Gyn said that there was no sign of O in the blood test and the follies that we there would have just fizzled out to nothing when we stopped using the injections. My chart shows no signs of O either. But this morning I have started bleeding and it is oh so painful worse than I have ever felt before . Would this be like a normal AF I thought that you had to O to get AF???. Sorry to have rambled

[butterfly_warrior]

You don't have to O to get AF. You can get AF from a drop in eostrogen as well as a drop in progesterone. Eostrogen withdrawl bleeds tend to be painful, heavy an clotty.

BW

[Cherie]

You sure can!

I don't ovulate at all (due to PCOS) and I still get AF - although it's very irregular, loooong cycles, and AF is usually very light and only lasts 1-2 days.

[butterfly_warrior]

Cherie, I'm so jealous! I have the stupidly long cycles but when I do get AF it's very, heavy and painful... the longer it's been, the worse it gets.

BW

[ktgirl]

Ok so that was really strange. I had a small amount of bleeding (just before I posted here) and then nothing else. Thanks for your replies. I don't think I would even count that as AF it really was nothing at all. I guess I just keep counting the days but not go back to day1 what do you girls think? I know what you mean about the long cycles, before starting clomid my cycles were very long too and that is what I am expecting to happen now we are having this break and I am not taking any drugs. My longest cycle was 80 days and that only stopped because I took provera. Argh the joys of PCOS hey girls

[Cherie]

I had a small amount of bleeding (just before I posted here) and then nothing else.

Annoying itsn't it! My cycles were so light that it was difficult to even tell if AF had arrived or not sometimes. (Sorry BW - I'm not gloating hun)

[butterfly_warrior]

It's fine, Cherie. At least when I get AF, I damned well know AF is here!

BW

[Rach13]

You don't have to O to get AF. You can get AF from a drop in eostrogen as well as a drop in progesterone. Eostrogen withdrawl bleeds tend to be painful, heavy an clotty.

BW

Hi Butterfly warrior, I was just wondering what you mean by oestrogen withdrawl tends to be painful, heavy and clotty. My periods are v painful, heavy and v clotty every month. I don't have PCOS or other prob as far as I know, and my AF is very regular. What does 'oestrogen withdrawl' mean in terms of hormones and cycles? Also, do you know if it's possible to ovulate at different times each cycle, eg, early some cycles, late in others?

Cheers,
Rachel

[butterfly_warrior]

I'm trying to remember in which particular one of my books I read this!

Just because you have painful, heavy and clotty periods it does not necessarily indicate that you have PCOS nor anything else wrong - it could just be normal for the way your body works.

Eostrogen withdrawal just refers to a drop in eostrogen levels, normally it is a drop in the levels of progesterone that results in AF.

If your cycle is regular then chances are good that you are ovulating around the same time each cycle. While cycles may be different lengths, the one thing that is generally consistent is the length of the luteal phase. If cycles are going to vary in length, then it will be the follicular phase (when ovarian follicles are developin in order to release an egg) that varies, and the luteal phase (time between ovulation and AF) will be consistent from cycle to cycle.

Sorry for the confusion. I'll have a search around and see if I can find the passage I'm thinking of... there's one of three or four books it could be, so it may take a while!

BW

[Cricket]

Yes, you can definitely ovulate at different times during your cycle - and as the PP mentioned, your luteal phase will generally be the same length. It would be the follicular phase that fluctuates. If your cycle is the same length every time, then you are probably ovulating at the same time every month. If your cycle changes, most likely, you ovulated earlier or later, but the time from O to AF will be the same.
My cycle is anywhere from 28-45 days long, but my LP is always 12 days. As far as the estrogen withdrawal bleeding, I can't help you out. As far as I know, estrogen surges right before ovulation, and causes the EWCM that we all look for, and then it drops again, and progesterone takes over. (Maybe that's where mid-cycle spotting comes in for some women????) Progesterone causes the elevated temps that those who chart note as a sign of ovulation. When the progesterone drops, your temp goes down, and AF arrives. (Or, if you conceive, the progesterone continues to climb, and tells your body you are pregnant.)
That is sort of how it goes to the best of my knowledge. If I've got this wrong, someone please feel free to correct me!
HTH!

[Rach13]

Thanks girls, sounds like I'm going to have to do some serious reading about cycles and luteal phases to get up to speed with the topic. I've not charted ovulation or anything like that before, so it's all new to me. Lots to learn!! I guess I'm partly looking for answers after a missed m/c as to what my hormones could be doing. But I'll probably never know.
Cheers,
Rach

[Cricket]

Have you tried fertility friend Rachel? They've got lots of information about what your body does during your cycle, and they can get you started on charting if you are interested. (I have found it pretty helpful - we didn't conceive faster, but I like to know what my body is doing, especially because I have an irregular cycle.)
All the best!