FF is not a crime

I agree that we all receive judgmental looks or comments for just about anything. I know when I change DS in public I brace myself for comments about using cloth. It's silly that I'm sensitive about it.. I haven't really had many comments.. I mainly got comments when I was 'planning' to use cloth.

I still find myself a bit nervous b/fing in public, and sit there with a mindset of daring them to say something about me b/fing my toddler while I'm pg. So I think if it's something you are sensitive to, sometimes your back can be up before anyone even says or does anything, and if the subject is even mentioned in passing it can be taken to heart more than need be.

Perhaps this is why I stopped visiting the MCHN so early on.. I always went in there ready to defend my ways of doing things LOL. Everything will be water off a ducks back this time around I can tell you! Definitely learn to shrug off comments that annoy. I've learnt not to be easily offended, and it makes life a lot more pleasant :)

Salsa: I agree, i personally wouldn't say anything. But she is wrong and unless she has surgery her breasts will end up sagging as she grows older anyhow. So a baby has missed out on an optimal start to life because of a woman's vanity. IRL I would keep my mouth shut. But here, in this hypothetical discussion i freely admit that i feel sad for the baby.

I agree salsa, I don't think anything needs to be said. Not unless that woman has specifically asked for your opinion or invited you to express it. She has made that choice and if she is happy with that choice, then who are we to say anything? Each to their own. If a woman said to me, 'I don't want to BF because it will make my boobs sag', I would probably tell her that is unlikely and in my experience your boobs tend to sag anyway with pregnancy and age, but honestly, do you really think she would care what I thought? If she wants to FF she wants to FF and in most cases when you have made the decision to bottle feed, for whatever reason, the last thing you want is someone else putting their two cents in.

And I think that in Australia there are really very few women who actually think that formula milk is superior to breast milk. Even if a woman thought that before having her baby, by the time she gives birth she would have been better informed by her midwife/doctor/child health nurse.

ETA: Bath I understand what you mean about feeling sad for the baby, but in all honesty it could be worse. The baby is lucky to be born to parents who will love and provide, in a prosperous country such as ours, even if the mother is a bit vain.

Personally I think that women that use the excuse of saggy bbs have heard horror stories about bf attempts and dont want to risk having difficulties, but they don't want to share this fear because they feel they will b judged, but thats just my opinion, and it's probably wrong but i like to think it. It would be lovely in a generation or 2 time to be able to say to our kids n grandkids that the generations b4 had a disadvantage in that FF was looked upon as the best thing by the general public and BF was not tolerated but in their time both are accepted as a way to feed your baby and that the only reason formula is used is medical intervention for those who can't bf.
When I was at school, my biology teacher made sure he told us that BF does not cause sagginess and I think it is being taught in schools now because of the FF history. I can't believe how many ppl are so passionate about this!

"clearing up a misconception is deemed to be judging, whereas most times it is not done to be so." (Shannon)

Precisely :) And unfortunately i have read several times here in BB where women have been convinced that artificial milk is better than what their own bodies could make. They have said right here in BB that there "are more ingredients in formula" so that's why they use it. How incredible is that??? With all the information in here!

I'm sorry I have stood too long on my soap box but I guess it's because I have spent so much time in here and read so many misconceptions that I have just decided to have a shot at sorting it out. I really don't want to make anyone feel inadequate. However remaining silent and allowing women to continue beleiving things that are not true is not doing them any favours. I have never and will never say anything to a woman IRL unless she asks for it... but it's different in here... it is easier to try to tactfully say what is on your mind, doesn't mean I'm going to start taking my message to the streets :)

My sister was told by my mum - who FF all of us - that she had 'blind' nipples and therefore couldn't BF. My sister FFed all her three children for this reason. It wasn't until I visited her after her last child was born that I noticed that she'd leaked all over her T-shirt. I told her then that she couldn't possibly have blind nipples if she was leaking, but no one ever encouraged her to try to BF even (her first two kids were born in Singapore) She always assumed she couldn't BF, and she got no support from those closest to her nor was she made to feel like BFing was an option or desired even. In fact my mother has made numerous comments to me that my milk wasn't sufficient to nourish Charlie, and my own father told me it was time to 'put Charlie on the bottle' when he was 6 months as he was 'getting to old to feed from the breast'. It's stuff like that that makes me feel like we need pro-BFing information out there all the time. I agree that esp in Australia, most women are pro-BFing, FF when they cannot BF and know that BM is best for baby, but that only came about from education. But it's not only mums who need the correct information, it's the general public that needs it too.

Ali - I think you do have a point there. I know women who chose to FF just because they did not want to breastfeed (thats fine with me) but they still feel like they need to make an excuse for it, because it is not very socially acceptable for a woman to say she did/does not want to breast feed. For myself, I don't feel the need anymore to justify myself to anyone. I FF my babies, for various reasons, but I don't feel the need to reiterate those reasons all the time to people.

Bon, You've reminded me of another situation that may cause a woman to not want to BF when she could technically do it... and I raise the issue very gently as it is very sensitive but maybe should be discussed. I have heard of women who have been sexually abused who do not wish to BF because it brings back too many memories. This is extremely tragic and my heart goes out to these poor women who deserve all the support in the world and definitely no judgment. Given that 1 in 3 women have been sexually abused the chances of this occurring is probably high. I agree that in this situation the woman needs to seek counseling and they should not have to explain themselves to anyone. However they do owe it to themselves and their babies to start walking the path of healing. I could imagine that seeing BF posters and hearing women talking about BF would be highly confronting for these women but what should we do? Just leave them to suffer? What do we do if we think someone is avoiding BF for this reason? :dunno: There are so many sensitivities... but to my mind it's just as cruel to ignore this type of suffering by refraining from speaking about it than it is to try to help...

ETA: Bon I am not implying this is your reason btw! sorry, when I re read my post it may have seems that way :redface:
ETA: sorry too Sushee, I missed your post, I agree, that's a perfect example of someone in need of help.

I think the difference is, if someone doesn't want to breastfeed then they should own it. And say I tried it but I didn't like it, it wasn't for me. Or like in my case, I did want to breastfeed but I was ill informed, and I take NO shame in that. I did the best I could with what I had at the time. I thought I knew what I was doing and I didn't. But my baby girl got nourished so I don't regret a thing. I have owned my choices and I don't ever feel the need to explain myself for those choices but if I do share my story people never judge me for it. The only time people judged me was when I was sprouting stuff that I thought was right that was wrong, and it wasn't even them judging me it was them trying to help me and it wasn't until I got over my own guilt that I realised that. Now please don't think I am accusing anyone of anything I am just talking about my own experience. Don't feel guilty for you choices or the need to justify yourself we are all different and just because breastfeeds and one doesn't that doesn't make them any less of a mother. I have a lot of respect for friends of mine who have admitted openly they hate breastfeeding so they used formula. But I will always try and help those who have been misinformed about breastfeeding because I wish there had been people around like myself when I first breastfed my daughter.

I'd love it if everyone could read this article below, its about the whole ff vs bf arguments.

Artificial Feeding - Nothing To Do With Breastfeeding

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In this thought provoking article, Yvette O'Dowd asks why there such a divide between women who breastfeed and those who resort to artificial baby milk. What led to the divide and who is to blame? A must read for all mothers, no matter how you feed your baby.

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I would consider myself passionate about bfing but I would NEVER make any mother feel bad about not bfing, and as so many of you have said, there are numerous reasons a mum might be ffing. How on earth can ppl judge without knowing you or your situation? (or even knowing if it is formula in the bottle, btw, there were a couple of times when I had EBM in a bottle)

Altho, I will warn you, it doesn't stop with being judged for the way you feed your baby... Wait until your very active toddler is tearing around exploring their environment or chucking a tantrum at a really opportune moment! Or pinching another child's food. Or another child (not that mine has done that yet, but give it time!). I think I must just ignore what everyone is doing with their 'looks' as I'm far too busy worrying about my own child to notice them!

I found this thread really interesting!! I'm bf'ing my son who is 15 wks old, and I wouldn't dream of criticizing another mother's feeding choice - bf or ff!!! I am only interested in making sure that people know the truth about both bf and ff and their options with regard to both - so I'd correct misconceptions about both bf and ff if I heard them. But I wouldn't then harp on about pushing one or the other - it's a personal thing and I can only imagine how devastating it must be to want to bf and not be able to. I went through a bad patch with my son not gaining weight for 4 weeks but with the support of a great gp we made it through. So I've got a bit of an idea about the thoughts and grief and guilt when you might be facing the fact that bf isn't working for you and bubs.

Anyway, just wanted to say that I wouldn't dream of criticizing any of you for your choices or for having to switch to ff. It's your family, your business. And I can't believe people wouldn't give up their seat to a mother feeding her baby via any means in a feeding room - how appalling!!!

Hi,
I'm a mother of 4 children, and every day work with mothers - either in my paid capacity as a lactation consultant or my volunteer role as a breasteeding counsellor. Every day I meet the most amazing women (many of them here on Belly Belly) Women who figh for their children, who educate themselves about issues they and their families face, and when the chips are down, they make the best decision they can. That may sometimes mean that they formula feed. But they do so with love and thought, and because of their committment their children grow and thrive. My eldest is now 14 years old, and every day I learn new things and very often I look back and wish I'd known then what I did now. Maybe with that information I would have made different decisions - maybe not. I sometimes regret decisions, but I don't feel guilty about them. Because I know in my heart I did the best I could. Whether you are breastfeeding or formula feeding you are not immune to the uninformed and unthinking comments. There's a saying "No-one can make you feel guilty without your consent" I believe it. When you look into the face of your beautiful baby, surely that tells you that you did the right thing - who cares what others say? And if you feel you didn't get the right information, help and support to do what you needed to do - take it up with those who were responsible for your care and education - not guilty.
Warm Regards
Barb

It's funny, when people ask if i BF or FF DD i say BF, even though i FF for almost half of the first year, at which point i switched her to cows milk. I stopped for many reasons, too long-winded and boring to go into here. Yes, there have been many times i wished i'd gone on BFing, but i know it wasn't possible.

I know a fair few sexually abused people, and was one myself. For me there is no association, i didn't have breasts when i was 5, and was only just starting to get them when i was 12 and he stopped. So for me BFing was only ever about nourishing my baby and having that closeness, and, i must admit, making life cheaper and easier. I loved my BFing days of popping out with only the baby and a muslin cloth, when compared to the FF days of having to take a bottle and a sterile cap/teat and the formula seperate because i didn't know when i'd need it and blah blah blah - i hated that aspect!

To me desire is the most important thing. At booking or at school even, before pregnancy, a girl should be asked "do you WANT to breastfeed?" and if she does she should be educated in every possible way to do so. If the answer is no then why force the issue? In that case educate the woman about Formula, al the facts about it. The baby WILL be fine on formula, and if she is still deciding, after knowing all the facts, to go with formula she must have her reasons.

My SIL didn't BF to avoid saggy boobs. She has less saggy boobs than me now but then she still has all her babyweight as she's not lost any of it and a lot of why my boobs have sagged is because i'm 18kg lighter than before PG. But i don't feel sorry for her babies because they missed her milk, i feel sorry for her because her opinion of herself is so low it is totally critical that her boobs stay pert, as if that was one of the main things she can offer the world - pert breasts. She is battling time, a battle she can never win.

Everyone has their foibles too. I personally wouldn't feed my baby much past the age of 1. This might be because i haven't made it past 7 months with DD and thus can't imagine it, but even before she was born i intended to wean her around then. Extended BFing isn't for me. I don't want to have to feed a toddler. I think it is a wonderful thing if a woman wants to and can and does, but i don't want to. Likewise i probably would quit if biting became a real issue before then. Yeah, kids can be discouraged from biting, but to be honest the associations for me are crazy and i don't want to encounter it. Having my nipples bitten is a very sexual thing for me, and one i enjoy, i don't WANT to feel my baby doing it. It is overtly sexual to me, not like birth is, like sex is.

Christy is right (gotta spread the love hun but will come back to you!) no matter WHAT you do there will always be someone, informed or misinformed thinking it is the wrong thing.

Bec

Hoobley, my mum was born in Glasgow and recently went back to see where it all happened. I too miss being able to take a smaller nappy bag out with me. seriously I use a baby weekender for day to day use!

Bec, I agree with so many of the things you have said, I won't even list them all ;) (gotta spread the love around too LOL!).

I have a family member with a three day old baby who is currently learning to BF. She has received very little support, so I am trying to lend her a hand where I can. I feel very strongly that if she wants to be able to BF, then she should receive help to that end. Personally, I don't give two hoots how her baby is fed - but I don't want her to feel that she can't do it without support, wean her bub, and then wish down the track that she hadn't. That's the only reason I'm helping her. As far as I'm concerned it is totally her choice how she feeds her bub, and I KNOW her bub would do just fine on formula. It hasn't hurt my DS yet!

As for the looks, I think I imagine them more than I actually see them :rolleyes: I HATE having to bottle feed in public, and I love BFing in public. Yet, I don't even notice how others feed their bubs, and I really don't care (how harsh does that read??). My guilt is my own, I really need to get over it. I'm sure that no one is bothered how I feed my baby, so I'm not sure why I'm so hung up on it.

I'm sorry for those who have been judged for their feeding decisions. But as others have said, it happens in every aspect of life, people can't help but have an opinion!

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As for the looks, I think I imagine them more than I actually see them

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You know, I often think this is the case. I honestly don't see people judging me in any way as a parent. But I am quite confident in myself now, don't get me wrong it has taken ages to get there and a lot of therapy. One element of cognitive behavioural therapy I worked on was called "mind reading" which basically means I don't worry about what other people think because I don't know what they think.

In the early days after stopping breastfeeding I was worried people would say something when I was out and about but no-one did. I know that I did the right thing for us. I made an informed decision based on my health and the only decision I could. I don't explain (other than in here) why we don't breastfeed and I am rarely asked about feeding. If someone felt the need to see if my ff was based on misinformation etc I would probably not go into it with them as my circumstances are quite personal and not something I would want to share with just anyone. I think online is easier as no-one know who I am.

I agree, some times there's just no other option. To keep your baby happy, healthy and growing - you what you gotta do! Shame on those who bag you for ff /bottle feeding. The looks I get when I have a screaming baby from the same ppl who gave me a different look five mins ago when he was sleeping! The other day I had to feed Jensen in the food court (bf), and the looks I got were disgusting. He just plain wouldn't feed anywhere else. So be it. My friend had to ff her son at 16wks due to falling pg. Ppl just never know the reasons. Persevere, you're doing the best for your baby!

Best wishes!
(ps: if this sounds negative, it wasn't meant to be!)