My husband and I are at the moment tackling the dreaded to vaccinate or not to vaccinate. I feel that my child should be vaccinated against a few diseases but not all.
What are other peoples views? How do you feel about having your new bundle of joy jabbed with a liquid you know nothing about? What are the pros and cons for people in regard to this issue?
All views are welcome, but please dont label me as a bad parent.
There are just too many reasons not to do it for us.
My best advice though is to do your research!! ther is so much information out there that isnt publicised, both for and against.
You need to be informed as much as possible - ask as many questions as you can of your health providers and let them know you wont take the stock standard responses and want EVIDENTIARY support on anything they tell you, good or bad.
Talk to other parents about reactions to the vax, most of tham are now combined, it is amazingly difficult to get seperate vaccines for individual illnesses, making it virtually impossible to 'partially' immunis now.
So READ RESEARCH and QUESTION EVERYTHING you find.
You will need to know your family history pretty well too, and do some thinking about the types of environments you and you bubs and family is exposed to and ascertain your own risk factors for the illnesses, each on their own merits. This is really helpful when looking at things like side effects, and other medical issues arising immediately adn later on down the track, of the vaccines themselves.
There have been a few other threads about this recently where I have posted some links to some sites...will go and find them for you.
Have a lok through all the threads in the Vax section - there are many of them that are really good discussions about whether or not to vax and why people have done so or not. Great for perspective and there are really helpful links posted both for and against in them too. It may take a while, but you will need to look further into things than what they give you in those nice trifolded pamphlets with pictures of smiling babies and scary statistics.
Good luck! If you need anything else or want some more specialised info, PM, I have a ton of the stuff! (pro and con) lol
Last edited by LimeSlice; September 4th, 2009 at 01:29 AM.
Its a hard one isnt it? Its a topic close to my heart. Of course I wouldn't think you were a bad parent for trying to work out what is best for your bub!
Did you see the 7.30 Report the other night?
I will give you our story (short version). Our son is 5 and was born with congenital heart disease - his heart didnt form properly in my womb. This has meant that DS was born early (36wks) small (1.5kg) and had to have many heart surgeries (four open heart surgeries so far with transplant likely).
This has meant that my son is highly susceptible to infection and disease - he is not auto-imune compromised but the IMPACT of disease is very significant for him. Ie gastro means at least a week in hospital for us. This is meant that our son has had all vaccinations and some additional ones to assist him ie Flu shots each year and when he was a baby RSV (broncioloitis) vac shots every month during flue season.
We live in Southern Adel where there is a largish population of anit-vax families. This puts our son at greater risk of getting seriously ill. While vaccinations reduce the likelihood and often severity of getting a disease it is not a 100% guarantee SO that means that our DS playing with and mixing with non-vax children increases his risk of getting seriously ill.
I am also about to have baby #2 and right now there is a whooping cough epidemic in our area. This should not be happening. If parents chose to vax against whooping cough I wouldn't have to be terrified of my son getting it or for the safety of my about to be born baby!
I am sure I am going to **** some people off by my comments but you try being in NICU and PICU with your child. Try being terrified of every cold and tummy bug because it could mean your child doesn't make it. Yes I do get emotional about this. It scares me to tears.
We are trying to decide about vax for this baby and think we will delay the Hep B until 2 months and maybe not have the chickenpox one but as we are in and out of hospt with our son this baby will be in a higher risk group too as it will be exposed to sick kids a lot more than normal.
I probably sound quite rabid! And I know that my situation is not the average one but others choosing to not vax affects my family significantly and so it presses my buttons.
Good luck in your decision but please talk with a pediatrician too and not just the anti-vax group. Ask those that care for children with these diseases and get their perspective on it too.
Hi Lisaandshaun! I think it is great that you are proactively considering what will be best for your baby and questioning the merits of the different 'standard' procedures that exist when it comes to having a baby. I however tend to agree with RommysMummy. For me choosing not to vaccinate isn't just about your child, it is about the community that you live in and its most vulnerable members. If older children aren't vaccinated against measles or whooping cough it sneaks back into our community which puts the younger members (like our babies who are too young to be vaccinated) at risk. While some of these illnesses aren't life threatening for a ten year old or probably even a five year old, they are for a two month old. I can't begin to imagine how I would feel if my DS caught one of these illnesses while at the doctors or the supermarket because another parent hadn't vaccinated their child. IMO mass vaccination is designed to protect all members of the community, not just the individual being vaccinated iykwim.
Touchy topic indeed.
Like Limeslice, we too have chosen not to vaccinate the conventional way and our son has received none. However I am a very strong advocate for natural medicine, I work in this area and we have done/are doing homeopathic 'vaccination', which like conventional vaccination, increases a childs immunity to the pathogen in question (whooping cough, rubella etc), encourages antibody production against the pathogen, but does not guarantee 100% immunity. Unfortunately nothing can offer this.
If you go to the WAVE website (World Association for Vaccine Education), they provide extensive information on the risks of vaccines, including lists of ingredients for specific vaccines according to pathogen type and manufacturer. Its quite disturbing, to say the least. Thimerosol (50% mercury by weight) has been taken out of various early childhood vaccines due to its link with autism and public campaign against this ingredient, but it is still present in the flu vaccine, which is routinely administered to pregnant women and those with compromised immune systems. Interestingly, pregnant women are advised to avoid consuming various types of fish (ie tuna) during pregnancy due to their high mercury content and the toxic effects this heavy metal can have on the unborn.
From a natural medical perspective, the most important way to protect your child/increase their immunity is to limit their exposure to toxins - via food, water, air, personal care products, and medicines. This is the primary reason why we are against mainstream vaccination, as I do not agree with a child being injected with hazardous chemicals such as thimerosol, formaldehyde and many of the other synthetic adjuvants that are added to the product to increase shelf life/preserve the product but are listed as toxic substances by government departments and the chemicals own MSDS (material safety data sheet). Homeopathic vaccination offers increased immunity to various pathogens, without increasing consumption of toxic chemicals. Homeopathic vaccination is also administered orally, which is the natural or standard route of administration for these pathogens (via the mucous membranes).
Below is a copy of info I have cut and pasted from a previous post. It may explain our perspective a little better:
We normally contact bacteria/viruses via our mucous membranes - which line our nose, throat, etc. These mucous membranes play an important role in literally 'registering' and forewarning the immune system of the newly invaded pathogen, and set up a 'blue-print response' if you like, for the immune system to get its army ready to fight the pathogen before it proliferates its way throughout the body.
The problem with vaccines is, they inject the pathogen (virus) as well as many other not so pleasant ingredients directly into the blood stream. This catches the immune system completely off guard, and the traditional immune response to the pathogen does not ensue. This helps to explain why some individuals have such a sudden and violent reaction to the vaccines - from the topical skin rashes and blisters to seizures and even death. The body is literally saying "what the hell are YOU doing here and how on earth did you get past me without me knowing?! I am not prepared for this!"
I remember reading a study not that long ago that looked at antibody count of vaccine viruses in vaccinated children. There was a substantial number who were found to have either no or very minimal antibody count for the viruses they had been vaccinated for- indicating that they were actually not immune from these viruses. It was suggested that this was due to poor immune system response, in response to the 'unatural' exposure of the viruses via the blood stream rather the usual route of the mucous membranes. Whilst it is important to note that sufficient antibody count was present in most children in the study, this study clearly displays the fact that no two children's immune systems are the same, and the medical field's approach to vaccinating all infants and children with the exact same doses at the exact same times is incredibly flawed, treats people as though they are merely numbers, and is in desperate need of review.
As for the 'no evidence' factor regarding autism and vaccines, it may be worth remembering that not all that long ago, the medical profession claimed that there was no link between smoking and cancer. All sorts of weird and wonderful potential culprits where suggested to explain the high prevelence of cancer amoungst smokers as opposed to non-smokers. Doctors even recommended women to smoke during pregnancy as it would help them to 'relax.'..... and look where we are today.
Truth exists regardless of white coats and degrees. Peer-reviewed medical journals aside, there is no greater evidence in one persons life than personal experience.
At the end of the day, we only have ourselves and the ability to do our own research, trust our gut instincts, and perhaps listen to those out there who are fighting to tell their stories against a sea of animosity and opposition.
Last edited by JellyBean; September 5th, 2009 at 06:04 PM.
: added info
By the way - it doesn't have to be a black or white argument either - many parents choose to delay vaccination until the child's immune system is more developed, and many pick and choose the vaccines which are associated with less risk (for example, many avoid the 12 month MMR combined vaccine). Some even choose to do homeopathic vaccination, with a few conventional vaccines later on.
Try not to stress about the decision - simply empower yourself with knowledge, and know that IT IS a parents right (and arguably their responsibility!) to know each and every ingredient which may be potentially injected into their child- what these ingredients are, where they come from, how they are cultured, what their potential short-term, long term and accumulative effects are in the human body.
I'm a pro-vaccine mum-to-be, but I have nothing against the homeopathic method of vaccination (my aunt and Uncle are homeopathic/naturopathic people), as long as parents vaccinate one way or the other!
I was a sick kiddie (very bad asthma), and had my immunisations (as did bro and sis) as getting something like whooping cough would most probaby have meant the end for little old me.
I don't mean to be inflammatory, but I think it's selfish for parents to not vaccinate at all (either conventionally or homepathically), because there could well be a child living next door to you who IS immunocompromised, or has a chronic medical condition that means getting ill = a trip to hospital every time.
I agree that parents have the right to information about vaccination, but the decision you make might not end up being just about your kid, especially when they start interacting closely with other children. One of my friends has a toddler who hasn't been vaccinated at all and I'm sure as heck not going to feel guilty about not wanting him around my baby. I don't want to have the same experience my parents had with a child spending almost as much time in hospital as out.
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