Time limits for accessing technology for an 11yo

I'm about ready to pull my hair out, if I have grey hairs I bet it's because of this issue alone!

So DS is 11.5 and Monday - Friday has access to "technology" (Xbox, wii, iPads, iPods, laptop) for an hour, Saturday and Sunday it's 2 hours, an hour before midday and an hour after.

The rules are he's not allowed on when we're still in bed (as in on the weekends), Monday to Friday it's only after chores/homework etc, he has to put a timer on and when the time is up he gets off.

He's free to do what he likes (within reason/age restrictions etc) but the timer starts when he's on, if he's not playing a game it still starts at the start, if that makes sense.

He try's to bend the rules almost every day, he forgets to put a timer on, he asks to stay on longer, he questions and complains about it all...all.the.time!!

He's had bans ranging from losing minutes to days to weeks, it's only getting worse :wall:

Maybe we're not being reasonable and he should be on there more/have more freedom? He and his sister (7) go to bed at 7.30, at the start of the year we were letting him stay up until 8.30 in his room to read or write, draw or do puzzles, but he was getting bored so we've agreed on 8.00.

I honestly don't know another person who had these kids of restrictions so maybe it is too much? Everyone I know their kids go to bed well after 8, some as late as 10.30 and can be on any sort of tech they like.

We're also pretty strict about the types of games/videos etc and again seem to be the only people out of those we know..

So if we're being unreasonable, what's reasonable? If we're doing the right thing how do we get it through to him so we don't have these issues every day?

my 9 year old just got a ipod for her birthday and we have a family Ipad...

in regards to time I don't time her use. TBH if they have done their chores/homework and their room is clean I let time slide on it. Some days i will tell her enough and send her outside to play or into the toy room.

ATM with it being yuck whether and 4 kids (3 bedroom house only one living area), school holidays limited funds and space I am def not strict on time. I would be more strict and worried if I didnt think she was being a active healthy child and the usage was affecting that.

And i cant really talk as my computer/phone iinternet time isnt really monitored either

We started off with a relaxed system and he would spend every minute of every day on there and when he wasnt on there he was constantly asking to go on or talking about it.

sorry we havent encountered that... when I say no she might sigh but hands it over and doesnt ask again for it that same day

I don't have kids that age but was very into technology at that age. I was allowed to self-regulate some days lots of hours some none - the timer thing I can see being seriously annoying, and probably make you keener to get on it if you know are so restricted. I would ask him what he thinks are reasonable limits and accept them or get him to compromise half way with you. 8:00 sounds kind of early to me, I never had a bedtime so would go to bed according to how tired was sometimes early sometimes late - is prob a good skill to learn determining when to go to bed. I read an article recently about technology vs TV and technology was preferable over TV and the impact of technology on activity levels was interesting in that taking away technology didn't increase activity levels.

Our DD is a bit older than your DS (just turned 15) & we are struggling with this more now than in the past. Previously, we only had a playstation & the rule was it could only be played when there was a social element (eg playing with dad or friends or doing singstar or whatever). She also had a DS but we were pretty strict about access & could always physically remove it from her space. Now she has iPod, laptop, phone, it's harder to enforce because she thinks moving from one to the other is a valid shift of activity :rolleyes:. We don't have time limits as such, but she knows that if she doesn't turn it off when I tell her to, it will be confiscated, along with all the other devices too ;). There's nothing like losing access to ALL your screens for a week to smarten up your behaviour. (Usual confiscation is 24 hours, but if there's backtalking, it increases in 24 hour increments). This might seem draconian to some parents, but if staring at a screen is going to alter your brain activity so that you can't control your moody behaviour, then clearly you need to disconnect for a day or two so your brain can cool off. :)

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I don't have kids that age but was very into technology at that age. I was allowed to self-regulate some days lots of hours some none - the timer thing I can see being seriously annoying, and probably make you keener to get on it if you know are so restricted. I would ask him what he thinks are reasonable limits and accept them or get him to compromise half way with you. 8:00 sounds kind of early to me, I never had a bedtime so would go to bed according to how tired was sometimes early sometimes late - is prob a good skill to learn determining when to go to bed. I read an article recently about technology vs TV and technology was preferable over TV and the impact of technology on activity levels was interesting in that taking away technology didn't increase activity levels.

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I think the bedtime works, 95% of the time he's asleep when his head hits the pillow and is awake and alert at a reasonable hour in the morning. Friday and Saturday nights its usually 9.30 bedtime. I don't see a point in him staying up later for the sake of staying up later.

We also limit tv, I would much rather take them to the park, go for a walk or encourage them to do something else.

My mother bought Liebling a wii for Christmas. And he was on it nearly non-stop and playing with us. But given the weather was bad and he was jumping up and down, I let him. No timers. Now, in July, the weather outside is good and we can go for weeks without it going on. However, he does play the DS a bit more, as he is allowed that in the morning before I get out of bed (knowing the games he plays). He is currently learning that he needs to practice and practice at things he finds hard and not give up. OK, so the DS gives an instant reward when he gets something right (opening up a new level or giving a new play piece), but his class teacher says he is putting in more effort at school now. Having said that, he hasn't played on the DS for about 4 months before about 2 weeks ago.

I may be a more lax mother than you, but we only have bedtimes in term-time. During the holidays, we go to bed when tired and get up when awake. We have film nights and "stay up late!". Age 6.5, Liebling currently goes to bed on a school night between 7 and 8 (depending on how tired he is), on a weekend usually 7.30-8.30. He stays with us until bedtime, (nominally 7/7.30) but if he's happy being quiet and reading/playing quietly in his room, he stays up a bit later. During the holidays, as DH goes to bed at 10 due to starting work early in the morning, that's bedtime. Liebling is usually starting to get tired by 8.30-9, so goes to bed then. Sometimes he's up until we go to bed, but then it's because we're all watching a film that doesn't require him to do much. Sometimes he wants to go to bed earlier and read/play, and that's fine too.

Maybe I'm being stricter based on what I've seen going on around me. Every child I know (some nieces and nephews some are friends kids) who have had a "do what you want" up bringing has either dropped out of school, violent, refusing to go to school, and frankly nasty little people who are self centred.

We just don't seem to be able to find a happy medium.

I haven't got time to read the replies, but I just wanted to say my DS is the same age and he goes to be at 7.30 and is allowed awake till 8 to play on his iPod. We are farmers and he is a typical farm boy so timers on these types of things don't applie to him as he out on the farm mot of the time when not at school. But he moans about the bed time saying his friends go to be at 10! He just couldn't handle that.
Maybe if you say to him he can have an extra half an hour over the weekend if he abides by the rules throughout the week?

IKWYM, toomanyshoes. A neglectful upbringing can lead to problems down the line. However, there are rules for Liebs before he can "do as he wants", and rules for when he's playing. For example, we all have to eat meals together and Liebs has some chores (setting table, clearing up, cooking etc). I do restrict electronic toys when he has friends over. We can play all games together - he's good at turn-taking on the DS when he wants me to help him, but we also play board games/lego/making music/reading books as a family so he has more than the electronics in his life. When he's playing, if he uses bad language (eg calling someone/something "stupid") or has a tantrum because he isn't winning, we stop. We have a calm-down time. We have an early bedtime that night. Liebling has also picked a Summer Project this year and we will be doing some of that together, other times he'll be working on his project while I work on mine (so independent but side-by-side working). I think it's a mix of independence and rules: I'm not saying I have the balance right, even for us, but there is a balance.

I think it's all about the balance and obviously we haven't found that yet, but I don't see the point in throwing in the towel and saying do whatever you want!

I'm happy with the bed time and it works for him even though he doesn't like it, so it's staying. We have 4.5 hours between getting home and bedtime, in that time we need to spend time as a family, eat dinner, do chores, reading, and homework.

I've chatted to him and we're going to trial 1.50 hours m-f and 1.5 hours x 2 on both sat and sun. Still with the timer though.

I think it also comes down to personality and having been around game addicts I can certainly see those traits in him. He would play 24/7 if you said "go for it". Where as DD gets bored after 30 mins and will move onto to something else like drawing/reading or playing outside.

I am not sure anyone was advocating a throw in the towel do what you want response. Myself I was suggesting more a what does your DS think is reasonable (not maybe totally what he wants but a reasonable compromise) - IMO ownership e.g of the limit really works. I wasn't that much of a gamer but I used to spend alot of time doing graphics/painting on computer in addition to some games. For me a set time I would have hated as it isn't as simple as just playing for an hour then finishing (or it didn't used to be) so I would happily trade say an extra 20 mins one day and have it taken off the next. Total time is the same but having ownership of when to take it. For me is the same principal of not having set times for any activity but breaking at appropriate points e.g. at end of a show, at end of a game etc. etc.

I also agree that there is no point in staying up for sake of it, just like there is no point in staying up till 8:00 if you are tired at 7:00 - and for me that is what a 'bedtime' encourages, ignoring the signals by focusing on set times.

Of course we are all shaped by those around us but my experiences are the opposite in that those who were allowed less freedom/ownership then went off the rails when they were left to their own devices.

If he's tired before 8 he goes to bed earlier, we've never forced him to stay up to 8 lol

They also have plenty of freedom but there are a few things we limit, and that's mostly based on seeing how they interact with the thing. They are children for such a small part of their lives, he has many years ahead of him to sit up playing computer games until 10-11-midnight.

I think all of what you do is totally reasonable. I also love how you've renegotiated and hope it'll work better now he's had qmore say in the 'rules' (Can you do the same with consequences too? or, maybe attack it from the opposite end and build in a reward for the times he does get off straight away, without nagging?) Can you set the timer to give a 5 or 10 min warning before pack up time, so it's not a total shock when time is up? If he's engrossed, then at least he'll have a bit of warning not to start a new level/game etc

The bed time is great, so glad you're sticking with it. Have seen many a child regularly yawn through their school day, unable to concentrate, or even fall asleep in clad ( I didn't think my teaching was THAT boring!).


FWIW, I already unofficially limit DS's technology and intend to do so until he's waaaaaaay older. Games will be extremely limited (no violence) when he does play (def not old enough yet). TV/movies will be age-appropriate. Bedtime will be before 8:30 until he hits high school, 7:30 until at least grade three....all subject to change of course! Yes, we're strict parents too - there don't seem to be many around, and as DS grows, there'll be even fewer... Won't change our values and beliefs though. ;)

I see this as a 2 part issue. 1) the use of technology and 2) the way he handles not getting what he wants (bending rules, complaining etc)

Does he behave the same way with other things he wants to do? Or is his complaining purely connected to use of technology?

Looking at this a different way. My DH is gamer and has an addictive personality, if he did not have gaming/internet, there would something else he was really focused on. Also my DD1 is a complainer with anything that does not go her way, so watching TV, computer, Wii, food she wants to eat, going home (the list goes on). So living with them, I can see some of what you are going through.

I agree that a timer would frustrating, would be more inclined to be task based. "when you have finished that level/game/etc" then you need to get off and do X". The more he complains, the less time/warning/confiscation etc. The more compliant, then a bit more time, so gets to play another level etc.

Back in the day when tv was technology ;)...

I LOVED tv as a child. My parents had the rule I could only watch 3 shows after school. So I had to pick which ones were important to me. Sometimes I could negotiate an extra, depending on the circumstances.

Then we moved house and had no tv in the interim of our house being finished being built. I never went to bck to watching tv!

I like TFB idea of them having a project to do. I use to make my own up as a child and I had the best time and experiences

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I see this as a 2 part issue. 1) the use of technology and 2) the way he handles not getting what he wants (bending rules, complaining etc)

Does he behave the same way with other things he wants to do? Or is his complaining purely connected to use of technology?

Looking at this a different way. My DH is gamer and has an addictive personality, if he did not have gaming/internet, there would something else he was really focused on. Also my DD1 is a complainer with anything that does not go her way, so watching TV, computer, Wii, food she wants to eat, going home (the list goes on). So living with them, I can see some of what you are going through.

I agree that a timer would frustrating, would be more inclined to be task based. "when you have finished that level/game/etc" then you need to get off and do X". The more he complains, the less time/warning/confiscation etc. The more compliant, then a bit more time, so gets to play another level etc.

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Other than normal kid complaining for time to time, it's only around technology. It's the only real issue we have, which is maybe another reason I'm limiting as I know he's addicted, I wouldn't send an alcoholic into a bottle shop and tell them to do whatever they like lol.

A lot of the games aren't level based so that doesn't work (we had considered it before)

We tell him when there's 10-15 mins to go but that still isn't "enough" when the time is up.

The kids are already responsible for the consequences to their actions, we don't really set punishments. We discuss with them what they feel is appropriate.

So here's another thought, if we were to work on a project should we including searching/looking for ideas/facts/etc on the computer so to include his interest (computers) or would that be fanning the flame?

Not sure if I have missed it, but what is he doing on the computer? One game, lots of different games? Social stuff? I think what knowing he is doing will help with advice. From experience there is a big difference to just wanting to be on the computer and being drawn into MMORPG.

I set myself summer projects so that I wouldn't become too obsessive about computer gaming/reading over the holidays. It was my way of self-regulation (and I still need it).

Liebling's project is beach-based, so we'll be going to the beach, doing some rockpool habitat stuff, building sandcastles, making beach pictures, bringing home some rocks to paint, writing beach-based stories (eg about an adventure the rockpool crab has, or Liebling living in a sandcastle)... although we may research some stuff on the computer, the idea is to keep Liebs busy and not bored and maintain his writing skills. He will also be learning some French songs about the beach to keep his French going.

My projects (note I said this is to STOP me reading too much and being on the computer too much) are: read a novel in French, read a novel in German, try out at least 10 new recipes, learn to play guitar. I'm going off for a book-based guitar sesh in a moment, but the computer does help with you-tube lessons, for example. All these activities are based around books (foreign language, recipe and music books in my case) but it's the application that I see as important. As a plus point, my German is so poor that I'm really struggling and can only read 2-3 pages before needing a break. I hope the French novels, when they arrive, are easier for me.

So, maybe, pick a project. Research it on the computer, but physically do something - artwork, story, building something, making something, applying his learning in another area... to make it show there is a world away from technology?

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Not sure if I have missed it, but what is he doing on the computer? One game, lots of different games? Social stuff? I think what knowing he is doing will help with advice. From experience there is a big difference to just wanting to be on the computer and being drawn into MMORPG.

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There's a few different games, at this stage I've said no to MMORPG (such as wow) because I know they are super addictive. He was playing minecraft, but we said no online servers because he/we have no control over who he's playing with/what's being said to him etc, and he's not happy about that apparently the offline content was too boring. And for the fact every body was "stealing" off each other and didn't feel it was something he needs to be around.

Some games he plays have levels some don't or it takes days to move up a level so doesn't fit what you suggested.

Look, really not sure what advice you are after, we are just trying to help.

With minecraft, you can access private servers, so you can join or setup one where you know the people and no-one else can join randomly. That may enhance his gaming experience, and in turn teach him how to game with others. (DH is setting up a minecraft server for DD1 and a friend). It can be a big, bad world out there with gaming, but they can also learn life skills, like cooperation. At some stage he will be entering that world and will need to how it works.

I totally understand where your coming from. My DS1 is obsessed with anything on the computer. I have limited to one day a week after school, roughly an hour to an hour and a half and 2 hours on Saturday afternoon and sometimes and hour Sunday afternoon. This works well for us as we have sport training two afternoons a week, and after school care one afternoon. We have allocated Wednesday as computer day so they know not to even ask about it on the other days. We have five kids so if you can't find someone to play with then your being too picky :). To be fair he does use the computer to access mathletics, etc after dinner for 20 mins. Another way we have tied in the computer is with DH teaching him some computer programming. He loves that and kind of makes him aware computers are for more than just gaming. Does he play sport or have music commitments. The fact we have commitments three afternoons a week does help I think. Keeps his mind busy. Good luck :)

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Look, really not sure what advice you are after, we are just trying to help.

With minecraft, you can access private servers, so you can join or setup one where you know the people and no-one else can join randomly. That may enhance his gaming experience, and in turn teach him how to game with others. (DH is setting up a minecraft server for DD1 and a friend). It can be a big, bad world out there with gaming, but they can also learn life skills, like cooperation. At some stage he will be entering that world and will need to how it works.

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I don't really understand why you're getting on the defensive? I'm certainly not.

At 11 I don't feel my DS needs to be exposed to the nastier side of the Internet, we have discussed in great length about what is appropriate behaviour online(and offline)

I was asking for ways to deal with the "but my friends/cousins get to do xyz" and was also interested in what other people do in regards to "technology" for that age group because we seem to have a very different approach to most of the people we know.

I have taken some things on board that have been suggested and don't care for other suggestions, I really don't see the problem?

My 11yr old would be on 24/7 if we let him. He keeps telling me that he wants to be a gamer when he grows up. So I say well you better pull your socks up in Maths etc at school and then get into IT. He is addicted to Minecraft and will constantly watch YouTube videos on my tablet about MineCraft. Drives me batty.

He also considers going from the laptop to the tablet is a change of activity. If he has been on all morning then I will usually kick him off for the rest of the afternoon and he may or may not be allowed back on after tea. He has to do chores if he wants computer time after tea. He's pretty active when not sitting on his butt in front of the monitor, so it doesn't concern me greatly. I have told him though to expect glasses at a young age ;) On a school day he definitely is not allowed on until homework is done, so he tries to get his weekly homework done on a Monday.

As for bed time it is 8pm on school nights and no later than 9.30 in holidays or a Fri/Sat night.

The two other boys will ask to get on, but are generally off within an hour of getting on as they get bored. Like Beatrix said, I don't really set too many limitations, when I can't limit myself.

Anyway...thanks for the replies ladies, there have been some great suggestions!

Just wanted to add - we've noticed that a lot of other families have very different standards about what games/movies/amounts of time they are happy for their kids to be viewing/playing with. That's ok & it doesn't mean that there's anything wrong with what you decide is appropriate.

It might help for to think about what are the principles/reasons behind your restrictions/rules. For example, we're motivated by our understanding of the consequences of extended screen time, both direct (ie how your brain function & attention changes, poor posture, etc) and indirect (ie if you're playing electronic games all the time, you have less time to socialise with your friends IRL, play sport, read, do your homework, etc). Your DS is getting to a developmental stage where it's more appropriate to be negotiating some of these aspects rather than having black & white rules (eg, bedtimes might be negotiable on non-school nights). But it's important to work out what you're prepared to negotiate on and what you're not. Getting clear on this will help you to communicate the non-negotiables to your DS. It's also important that your DS knows that you don't just create these arbitrary rules, and that they are open to discussion - but not when you've already told him to switch the device off. :)

My kids (including 11yo DD) don't have regular access to any type of technology, except an android based phone they share. They only ever you tube songs or play apps I've downloaded. Sometimes they'll be on there for an hour a day, sometimes they won't touch it for a week.

My lap top (and soon to be desk top for the kids) is only for homework & educational games. I might let DD2 do some dress ups, or DS plays monkey go happy, but that's as exciting as it gets. Again, sometimes they want it every day, sometimes every 2 - 3 weeks.

I give them very minimal times, because 1, there are fights, so its a no (I have many, many kids!). 2, DS gets so addicted & frusterated with games, its impossible to deal with him.

They all have DS's, & a Wii. Again, rarely use them. There is no limit to DS time, or times to use it, except after homework. But there's no internet access on the DS's...

I personally think you're being extremely fair, if not pretty easy going. A friends DD had no limits & she was getting up through the night to find her 10yo DD checking her FB (another thing not in this house yet!)

We have 2 smart phones, an ipod & the computer. Soon to be 2 computers & a tablet as well. But once the novelty wears off I think mine will get bored with it and be back to just running riot through the house. But I have back up for stuck indoors days too ;)

ETA; all 4 of my kids go to bed, lights out at 8. A bit slack over the holidays some nights, but 98% of the time its 8 & no later. I've thought about allowing DD1 8.30, but she can't handle it & is too tired & grumpy without that extra half hour. Even on weekends I rarely allow them to stay up past 8. It takes too long for DD1 to catch up... (And yes, its really only her that struggles so much)

I agree with Marydean. If the complaint is in regards to what is happening in other houses then I would suggest discussing house rules as a whole and why you have them.

I'm pretty flexible *most* of the time but I expect them to have a certain amount of screen free time per day. Now compared to some houses we are more lenient others we are more strict. We also have screen free weekends.

But I think if you can get him to drop that argument by seeing that isn't really relevant you'll find it a lot easier. And totally stick to your guns.

My son is on the iPad most dayst. He has brain games, Maths games, reading and writing. All suggested by his OT. He uses them as a way to not only improve his motor skills, but as some time alone. Rather than having set times, could he earn time by completing chores/homework etc? That's what we do.

We regularly discuss as a family why we do things the way we do them, I guess that's why I'm starting to find this so frustrating. I would have been more inclined to negotiate more flexible times in regards to the computers/games if he had been following the rules and as a reward been given more time.

This afternoon will be the first of 1.5 hrs and we shall see what happens went the time is up and how the extra 30 mins fits in with everything else that has to get done.

Thanks again everyone!