Do you have expectations for your children?

[Epacris]

I'm putting this in here because I think this is the right place for it (and I feel like I'm a bit weird).

Just from reading people's threads around here, over the time that I've been here, I have been gradually becoming aware of the expectations that people have for their children. Things like activities they will be involved with and milestones in their life. For example, sending them to ballet/karate class, going to their wedding, becoming a grandparent.

Slowly I have realised that I have absolutely no expectations for my children. I really feel like I can't assume anything about them, I have no idea who they are and what they will want to do with their lives. They might hate ballet/karate, they might not want to get married or they might be gay (and live in a place where gay marriage is not supported), they might not want to have children of their own.

Sometimes I even find it hard to wish things for my children. Like I feel like I can't even wish they were happy. Because happiness is theirs to find for themselves, not for me to cast upon them, bestowed happiness is not real anyway, it has to come from within.

Do I sound completely, utterly bizarre? I feel like I do.

Don't get me wrong, I love and cherish my children with all my heart and soul and of course I personally wish for them a successful, productive and happy life, and I will do everything I possily can to give them the skills to achieve that. But that's where it ends for me.... the rest is up to them?

I am also thoroughly enjoying the ride, gradually finding out about them and who they are. I'm already in love with them but it's like falling in love with them over and over again as they grow and change. I feel like any undue imposition from me will stifle that. I just wouldn't dare assume anything about them. How could I know?

Any comments?

[~Kaz~]

I don't think you're strange. I feel pretty much exactly the same way. I feel very excited about getting to know DS as he grows and develops. I wonder what he will be like at 1yr, 5yrs, 7yrs, 13yrs, 18 yrs old. I don't think I have many expectations of him at all in the sense you are talking about. I do kind of expect that he will be a 'good' person according to my definition of good (care about himself and others, not intentionally hurt people, be generous etc etc) but that's because I plan to try and instill those qualities and values in him. My expectations of him I guess are all intangible things - inner qualities that have nothing to do with personality or things like introversion/extroversion.

I actually get a bit annoyed when I hear others express their expectations of him - that he'll be good at sport or intelligent or become a doctor and I have always responded that as long as he is following his heart and he is happy without harming others I don't care what he does.

You're not strange (or at least, if you are, there's two of us ).

ETA - I don't think I "expect" him to be happy - I do hope that he finds in life and in himself reasons to be happy though.

[fionas]

Oooooooh, this is an interesting one.

Because I always felt like I had nothing in common with my family because I was a bit of a brainiac, I have always sought out 'smart' people and used to think that if someone wasn't smart, witty and/or academic that I wouldn't spend time with them. Really, it was because I was lonely as a kid and that was the key quality that I was seeking.

That's an attitude I didn't really kick until my mid-thirties so if you'd asked me any earlier than that I would have said that I'd hoped my kid would be smart.

Luckily I had DD late in life!

I guess now I have a much different view of life and what qualities are meaningful/important. Education/qualifications mean much less to me than they once did and I'm more interested in warmth, kindness and deriving enjoyment out of life.

Being a fairly shy person, however, I can't help but think that being outgoing makes life somewhat smoother and DD has that in bucket loads. She's also a little girl who gets great enjoyment out of life. I guess I would love her to carry on being like that and those are my expectations.

To a certain extent, I am trying to live my life through DD. She seems to have qualities that are sorely lacking in me which I think have made my life less fulfilled than it would otherwise be. But I am very conscious of this and am aiming to work on my 'issues' so that I don't put pressure on DD to have the life I could have had.

Hope that makes sense!

[Lolli]

Interetsting thread rach

I ahve expectations of myself, more than ofmy kids. I hope I can teach them to be good people, to be kind, to think of others, to stand up for themsleves and know themselves well. If i can show them those things, and they take them, I will be happy.

But I don't have expectations of them. If they choose to do all or none of those things, then that is theri choice. it's been an impotant thing for me to realise that my children are completley seperate entities to me, as much as they feel like an extension of myself. If I can be proud of myself as a parent, then that is my victory, but the choices my children make, the things they believe, the way they lead their life, is their own choice and experience.

Does that make sense? i know what I mean, but i'm having trouble getting it out.

[Ca Plane Pour Moi]

I am looking forward to grandchildren... but I don't want to impose children on DS. I want to either have more children or just steal grandchildren from families near me with no family nearby to rely on.

I do want things for DS. I want him to enjoy his life, be comfortable with himself and like himself. I enjoy his company and hope he enjoys mine - and he will do when he's older. DS loves playing hair and make-up or cooking as much as with trains... he's happy so I'm happy. He can be a hairdresser when he grows up or a stationmaster (his top two career choices atm). So long as he is content and enjoying life, how can you want more for your child?

I suppose it would be nice for him to be really clever and handsome and kind... but maximising the intelligence is fostered by the parents, good looks come more from good deeds and kindness, and manners and consideration are taught from a young age... so I suppose I'll geet my wish just by being a part of DS's life. Can't change that. The only thing I wouldn't change is DS.

[blackduckies]

I hope I can be a good enough mummy to help them achieve their goals and wants in life, it is really difficult and I have come to realize that a lot of the things you would hope for your children may not eventuate....so now i hope they are happy and kind people, we personally do things to encourage these behaviours (keeping them socially active, playgroup, mums group and as they start school sports etc, we won't be forcing them to do anything but we would like them to try things at least a couple of times??).

It all depends on your childs personality/nature I reckon. I have 2 girls who are reserved and shy, they would like a really close friend, they don't want a group of friends...thats hard because they get hurt a lot !!!! i constantly worry that they will struggle to be happy because of how easily they are affected by everyday things. Also a boy and another baby girl who are very sociable...my son will play happily with a group of people he is funny and well liked, which makes me happy. the baby will have to wait and see, at this point she seems funny and happy and plays well with others.

So basically a long way from where I started..I had a long list of things, not so much expected but aimed for!!!!but it's all good because it means I have grown.

[Gigi]

new lives ARE a mystery.

i think people are so drawn to nbs and kids BECAUSE they are "a blank slate" (tabula rasa? is that the right phrase?), brimming with possibilities.

when people say stuff "X will be a doctor when X grows up", sometimes i think, that is just adults waffling on, nothing to do with the child, just adults wanting something to say. So i take that with a pinch of salt.

i'm more worried about writing on t-shirt "it's all about me" pigeonholing expectations of children.

it would be nice to give bilby the opportunity to try out ballet and other hobbies, i doubt that will happen ($$$), but even if we had the money, there's no guarantee she would like ballet or any other hobby. but i would still love her to TRY these things out for herself.

How we are, as adults, does affect our children. i have no family, so bilby will have very lonely xmases for example (god, do i have the guilts about that big time let me tell you).

bilby just turned 3, and last week, at a public pool, about 6 metres from me, i caught her collecting a ball and returning it to a one year old bub (unknown to us), who had lost his ball. that warmed my heart, a random act of kindness, unprompted by me.

i worry most about her financial future, how much uni will cost by the time she's at that age. Assuming she gets the marks to get into uni, and wants to go.

but you're right, it's all such an "unknown". bilby has just really started to "show herself" with wilfulness and being very determined about certain things - turning three will do that i suppose. So i feel like i'm getting to know her all over again in some ways. As she starts saying more words, i get more of an insight into her world.

i don't think your sentiments are weird at all Ecapris.

[Roryrory]

To quote Kahill Gibran

Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.

You are the bows from which your children
as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
and He bends you with His might
that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let your bending in the archer's hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
so He loves also the bow that is stable.

It wasn't until reading this the other day that I realise how much of it I have taken on in my parenting. Call me hands-off, call me lazy, call me uniterested - I dunno. But I see them as separate from me and always have, from the time they were newborns. I never had that "we are one" feeling - they were always apart from me. I was relaying a story about how cute they are at the moment and a woman I work with asked me if I felt I miss out on them by working so much. I answered "no" - they are still living their lives, whether I am there or not. I will not always be there. They exist, and this mere fact gives me joy. I don't need to share their every moment to be their mother and to love them.

I think it is actually a good thing to hold the views you do. You are allowing your children to find out who they are, are there as a sounding board and a "soft place to land" when they need you. Personally, I think the best way to let someone have an full life is to also have your own.

[Epacris]

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts with me.

Yes Gigi, it particularly irks me when people say "Oh yes, he will be a _____ (inset: doctor/lawyer/footy star) when he grows up". It drives me nuts. I used to say, "Grrrr.... he'll be what ever he wants to be". But yes you are right, it's about them (the person making the comment), not the child.

Rory, so much of what you said rings true for me too.

Call me hands-off, call me lazy, call me uninterested - I dunno.

I have often thought that about you (and me)

I think it is actually a good thing to hold the views you do. You are allowing your children to find out who they are, are there as a sounding board and a "soft place to land" when they need you. Personally, I think the best way to let someone have an full life is to also have your own.

Aww, thank you and yes, I am certainly modeling that behavior (having a life) myself too.

[suse]

Rachel & Rory, I'm happy to think of myself as also being a hands-off, lazy and disinterested parent if it means I am in company with you two LOL.

I don't think sentiments such as these are strange at all. My son (and any future child/ren that may come after) is his own person. I have hopes that his life will be fulfilling and happy, but I wouldn't presume to have an expectation of what those values will mean to him. I will support him in his endeavours, whatever they may be, but I don't think that doing this to the extent that my own existence is subjugated is likely to be of any help to him.

I come from a small, close knit family which is intensely family oriented. To the extent that I suspect that a large part of my mum's intrinsic happiness is derived from doing things for the family, sometimes to the detriment of her own well-being. And whilst I love them dearly, and enjoy having a close relationship with them, I am somewhat of the anomaly in this tight family group in that I can also quite comfortably and happily live independently of them.

My mum always encouraged me in a way that she believed was unconditional, but her own perception of responsibility to family coloured this somewhat, and influenced by my knowledge of how it would affect my family (albeit by my own choice) I live less independently that what I would probably like. I would hope that even if his life choices result in him living independently of me and we do not have the type of relationship I would enjoy, I can still be genuinely and unconditionally supportive.

[thepixie]

Rach I've been pondering this but my thoughts are still unformed so I'll come back to it.... after the weekend
One thing that drives me nuts though is that living in Sydney people have been putting their babies on school waiting lists from birth. FROM BIRTH!!! How the hell is that about the child? It's only about what the parents think about themselves and how they want people to see them. anyway that's my quick rant, I'll come back with something sensible later :O

[Fleur]

Argh I should be going to bed but this is so interesting...

When you talk about expectations, do you mean your wants for them, or what you see of them & what direction you think they might take?

We have no expectations (in the sense of wanting) for our kids - other than, I will be overjoyed if they manage to have somewhat happy, fulfilled lives. DH has told DS1 that if he wants to be a garbo, or a doctor, or a lawnmower guy, or a footy player....it's all the same to us - as long as he is happy.
Don't care if they are gay or straight, get married or not, have children or don't (although I do have a secret longing for grandkids & if I don't get any of my own I will have to beg, borrow or steal some as per Lady Zaidie ).
Anything goes if they are happy...it's will be enough for me if we produce happy, semi-well-adjusted adults I don't care about the rest.

Expectations based on what we see...well, yes.
I don't expect them to hold, you know, I also expect that they might change as they grow, and I realise they change & develop, but IMO one of the most fascinating things is to see their individual personalities growing & developing & I love to imagine what they might be like when they are older.
For example DD1 is quite creative & ATM enjoying photography, she loves fashion but in a very creative way, music, design etc. We have often said we wouldn't be surprised if she ends up doing something with a creative/ design bent. I can see her spreading her wings a bit too & travelling.
The kids do it too...DD1 often wonders what her brothers will look like & be like when they grow up.
But this is all based on what we see rather than what we want ITMS...because I don't want anything for them other than happiness.
It's been hard enough for me to be happy in my life.. if they can do it that'll be enough for me

[~Gee_Whizzy~]

Call me hands-off, call me lazy, call me uniterested - I dunno. But I see them as separate from me and always have, from the time they were newborns.

Rory i actually cried when i saw this - this is exactly how i feel and my DD is only 10 months - my darling sister who has 4 kids of her own and seems to have to know every single little facet of their lives thinks that there is something wrong with me for feeling the way i do - she thinks i have pnd which i KNOW i don't - I love and adore my DD and i love seeing how she grows, but i don't feel the need to be with her 24/7 and i enjoy the time that i do have to myself

Epacris - thank you for starting this thread - it really has made me breath a sigh of relief

[Traveller]

My husband had a lot of expectations for our kids when they were born (and even before that). He thought they would all ride moto-x, love cars, etc. My eldest does love moto-x, but my DS2 is so not interested, he prefers dancing and singing. One of my twins is showing an interest in bikes but the other is not. I am secretly pleased as I hoped one would be interested in theatre but I am trying hard not to guide him too much. I guess he is just a show off like his mum!

It all came to a head last Christmas when DH wanted to buy motorbike gear for DS2 and we had to sit down and have a long chat about the fact he would not want that. I think this has actually helped us learn to find the interests our kids have, rather than forcing the ones we like on them. I suppose it's best to learn these lessons whilst they are young though!

[Amaunet]

hmmm...I don't have expectations in regards to skills, talents, career etc (Tho I often joke we could do with a plumber or electrician in the family LOL)

But I am going to go against the tide here and say I DO have expectations with regards to values and morals etc For example I expect him to be truthful, respectful (to those deserving of respect), well behaved at school, caring towards his family and friends etc. I fully intend to model/teach these values but don't think its a bad thing to want or expect these things from and for my child (or any future children)

[Epacris]

Thank you, thank you, thank you again for more thought provoking and insightful comments.

When you talk about expectations, do you mean your wants for them, or what you see of them & what direction you think they might take?

Yes, I guess I would like them to be happy, nice, responsible people - that is a want. DH and I will do our very best to give them skills and experience to help them be like that and model the behaviour we want to encourage, but I truly have no expectation that they will actually be like that (so far, so good though ). In the end they could be miserable dole-bludging tortured artists, or worse, developers clearing endangered ecological communities to build shopping centers . I hope that they will grow into people I like and have things in common with, but I have no expectation that that will actually happen. ITMS.

[Jennifer13]

I certainly have some expectations for my DD. I do expect her to consider others in her journey and I am doing my damndest to teach her how. I expect her to have morals and values. I am imparting those that I feel are important, but then, I also expect her to make up her own mind as she gets older.

I have enrolled her in 'activities' (swimming, ballet, next year piano), but that's more to give her a start in a few different things (and swimming is obviously for her safety since we have a pool) to see what/if she'd like to continue with as she gets older. I don't really care if she comes home from school and asks to take up karate or tie-dyeing or chess club though. I expect DD to finish school and I do have a preference for her to go to university/tertiary education (although I have absolutely no preference as to what she does there, if she'd like to do art/music/science/hospitality/philosophy/whatever she can go for it). I know she's only three, but she has a keen mind and a love of learning that I will do my best to foster as she grows.

I think there's a difference between an expectation that is narrow and controlling and a more general attitude as to what you'd like to see. I can't say I wouldn't be disappointed if my child grew up to be an unemployed, dope-smoking, school drop-out with little enthusiasm for life and no plans for the future, because that would be lying. Or, as Epacris pointed out, if she decided to pollute the earth, destroy the forests, or run an arms dealership, I'd be even more horrified!

In saying that, I also expect my child to grow up as her own person and probably blow all of my theories on parenthood out of the water!

[Fleur]

I am going to go against the tide here and say I DO have expectations with regards to values and morals etc For example I expect him to be truthful, respectful (to those deserving of respect), well behaved at school, caring towards his family and friends etc. I fully intend to model/teach these values but don't think its a bad thing to want or expect these things from and for my child (or any future children)

Good point & I totally agree

I think there's a difference between an expectation that is narrow and controlling and a more general attitude as to what you'd like to see. I can't say I wouldn't be disappointed if my child grew up to be an unemployed, dope-smoking, school drop-out with little enthusiasm for life and no plans for the future, because that would be lying. Or, as Epacris pointed out, if she decided to pollute the earth, destroy the forests, or run an arms dealership, I'd be even more horrified!

...and yeah to that too

WRT activities such as swimming , dancing etc - I don't think there is anythign wrong with giving them an opportunity to develop interests or talents. DD1 has danced for four years now, and is very good, grand finaled at Nationals last year but this year is likely her last - she's 'over it'. So I have to go, ok, you don't want to do it anymore - no worries, is there something else you'd like to do?
So, I gve them an opportunity to try things but I don't expect that they will stick with it, no matter how good they are... does that make sense?

I hope that they will grow into people I like and have things in common with, but I have no expectation that that will actually happen. ITMS.

yep, that makes perfect sense. I have hopes for our children but try not toimpose those as expectations.