Trying to get my head round school system in Victoria

[wysiwyg]

So I am from the UK, have read various things on the web but overall a little confused about how primary school works here. DD was born 31st May 2009 - now it seems to me due to the cut off being 30 April in Victoria that means than she will not start school (Prep) until Jan 2015 (so she will be 5 years 7 months) and 4 year old kinder Jan 2014 (4 years 7 months).

(I was quite shocked when I found this out as I was 4 years 2 months when I started school (full time 9-3:30 5 days a week) and adored school so this seems so old to me).

So is the questions-

Do these dates look correct?
Is 4 year old kinder full time? If not how does it fit in with childcare etc e.g. if I need to back at work full time 9:00 till say 16:00 every day?
So there is also 3 year old kinder which is optional is that correct?
It seems that childcare centers also run kinder programs are there disadvantages to these?
If I have to be back at work full time from when DD is four for example - what is the best way to manage it (no family here to look after DD)?
Are there other options to consider (e.g. do any schools take children early for full days - if DD was ready)


I have ages to think about it - but my plan was for the four of us (bump due arrive in July) to stay in this little 2 bed flat until DD started school - but have just found out school starts much later than I anticipated!!

[Olive]

Do these dates look correct? yep they are correct, DD2 is feb 09 baby and although she can go to 3 yr old kinder next year she will go the year after and start school in 2015 at 5
Is 4 year old kinder full time? If not how does it fit in with childcare etc e.g. if I need to back at work full time 9:00 till say 16:00 every day? DD1 is in 4yr old kinder this year and its around 12.75 hours but is increasing to 15 hours by 2014 (i think) CC do kinder programs as well

So there is also 3 year old kinder which is optional is that correct? yep its optional and not ferderally funded so it can be exxy, it cost us $1000 for DD last year to gfo 2x2hr sessions
It seems that childcare centers also run kinder programs are there disadvantages to these? i personally think 4yr kinder should be in kinder not CC but if thats the only option then thats jsut the way it it

If I have to be back at work full time from when DD is four for example - what is the best way to manage it (no family here to look after DD)?

Are there other options to consider (e.g. do any schools take children early for full days - if DD was ready) its very hard to get her approved for school early

[shellbell3]

Yes your dates are correct so she may be one of the eldest kids there but I have found alot these days that parents with kids born between Feb and April are keeping them back til the next year so its not uncommon for them to be turning 6 earlyish in the school year.

Council run kinders are usually 12- 15hrs a week broken up into smaller sessions, 3yrold varies I;ve seen some offer 5hrs week and some only 2.5hrs.

Childcare centres do offer kinder programs which if you need full day care you have that option there as council kinders are usually roughly 3hr days.

[Astrid]

There are some kinders that have an after kinder program, or the other option is finding a local family day carer who can do pick ups and drop offs.

Some childcare centers that have a kinder program run it in a seperate room and take outside enrolments. So the Kinder teacher will come across and take the kinder kids across to the room for the kinder session, rather than kinder that is blended with the childcare (if that makes sense).

[*TripleJ*]

well im moving but here in town the kinder is separate but in the same building and they are in day care for the rest of the day that they arent at kinder for those whose parents work etc i remember my kindy being separate but we were taken there by the day care centre it would totally depend on the centre to wat options u have

[wysiwyg]

Thanks for all the responses - a bit to think about. My favorite idea at the moment though is just to not worry about 4 year old kinder and for us all to take a 9 month break and go on a mega trip back to the UK and round Europe - I think that would prob be a great education.

[BeautifulMadness]

confusing huh? lol...Ashy went to daycare form 3 yrs old....and it has helped to go into the kinder system....he is now 4 years old and off to kinder tomrrow....he does a 12 hr session...broken down into 4 days of 3 hrs.


andrew will be the same as ur DD....i have no problems with him being older when he goes to school....

its all just to help them get ready for school

[Snacks]

Not sure if the CC centres down there are like ours, but Natalie is attending a LDC centre and is in the Pre-school room where they run a government-regulated pre-school syllabus. It isn't mandatory yet but will be here as of next year. Even still, they have always run a kindergarten program, even for the 2-3yos (Natalie was taught numeracy, colours, shapes etc from the get-go!). So I consider Nat to be attending pre-school, even though the hours are longer than regular pre-schools. Phoebe by comparison is in the 'creche' room, where the focus is on creating as 'homey' an atmosphere as possible, even though they do already introduce the babies and toddlers to literacy and numeracy... the same way you would at home I guess.
Nat will have just turned 5 when she starts school (next year! EEEEEEEK!) but good ole Phoebs will be 5 and a half, just like CJ (to the date ).
If your CC is like mine, there's no reason to take her out of it. If she is happy and settled there and you are working and need the extra hours' care then why fix it when it ain't really broke?

[BeautifulMadness]

i agree

[wysiwyg]

I am sure will all be fine but was more that I hadn't really realized how long I will be paying for her to attend childcare! In my head once she hit 2 in May was only a couple more years still school started which would be five days a week 9-15:30(as it would be in the UK,(my mum thinks we should go back to UK for a year and then she can get at least a year of school in over there before coming back to school over here!! - she is assuming CJ will be like me and absolutely desperate to go to school, but maybe she will be more like DH)). Is partly because I want her to go to the school down the road which has a catchment area which we are in, but we are in a two bed, first floor flat with no garden and is highly unlikely we will be able to move within this area so I had figured we stay here till she starts school, and once she is in can move to the suburb along and she can still go to school there (the catchment area is pretty small would still be able to walk to school) and as she is already there Number 2 would get in there too. Hence the plan then to go round Europe for 8 months because we then escape the tiny flat for a while but is a good incentive to stay in it till then (will rent very easily while away).

I really had not appreciated how complicated it is working and sorting school in the beginning - I had never been to daycare or kinder or anything and went straight into full days at school everyone did - but it seems even when school starts it is a gradual start even though CJ might have been going to full days of daycare for ages. I will have number 2 about so might not be back full time when CJ starts school which will make it easier. I suppose this is where family support often helps with having someone else about who can help with pick up and drop offs etc.

[wysiwyg]

Amy - is the cut off also 30th April in NSW then? I was under the impression that was 31st July so CJ would get in earlier in NSW?

[HotI]

A friend's little girl is starting school this year in Vic. She is doing 9-3.30 Mon, tues, thurs, fri up until Labour Day (March?) and then starts at 5 days a week 9 - 3.30.

[Traveller]

I am also from the UK and took a while to get to grips with the school system here. My middle child has just started prep at the hours described by HotI above, and my twins will be going full time into the kinder room at CC from next week. I did try my middle child in kinder but the hours were difficult with my eldest in school, and he really did not benefit from the structure (ie no schooling, all play) which was so unlike Nursery in Scotland so I kept him at home until he started school last Friday. It may have just been the kinder I chose, but I do not see the benefit of kinder over home educating for 4yo's here unless there is a specific concern over your child having time with their peers.

[Rivlas]

Thinking a bit further along. Once they start school full time, many schools have broken days for the first month or so for preps, alot of schools have after school care which usually finishes at 6pm to help working parents. Some also have before school care but that is usually on a supply & demand basis.

The cut off date in Victoria up til a few years ago was the 30th June. Not sure of the reasoning behind the change.

[Snacks]

Amy - is the cut off also 30th April in NSW then? I was under the impression that was 31st July so CJ would get in earlier in NSW?

Yes, as far as I'm aware our cutoff is 31 July. But I was one of the youngest in my school year with a birthday in April. It was ok I guess, but posed a few social problems in high school - they were all able to see 15+ movies before me. When we wanted to go out into the city my mum would always be concerned about whether to let me go just yet. My closest friend in the early years was 11 months older than me after all.
My decision to not send P to school at 4 is largely based on my experience of school. I really didn't enjoy it for the most part. I would like her to have the extra year under her belt to feel more confident both socially and academically.
I think the trend now is to hold kids back a bit. It certainly is with our MG - one of the boys wasn't going to start until he was 6! (They legally have to be enrolled in school by their 6th birthday.)
Yep, CC is expensive, but with the CCR it's really not that different to regular pre-school.

[wysiwyg]

I think you have hit the nail on the head Snacks - my concern about how late it is arises from my love of school so in my mind she is missing out, but am sure that won't really be the case. I am just getting my head around the idea that the cut off is not aligned with school year and therefore depending on birthday you can have a choice on when to start meaning larger age ranges in yer groups. In uk school year is sep to aug so if you are 4 in end of jun for example you can start in sep, there can be people in year group who are 5 on 1st sep and people who are 4 on 31st of August but all in same year so you can still have big diff in age but don't remember it ever being an issue but maybe because was no choice so just accepted would be driving later, later age for certain movies etc.

Am sure system works well here anyway, certainly the children I know all seem great.

There is evidence apparently that if you want your child to excel in the sporting arena is better if they are in he older part of their age group, as physically will tend to be more advanced. And I do know teachers in uk who were desperate to hang on and give birth in sep rather than august.

If anyone knows anywhere on web where it explains why cut off does not align with school year could you pm me the link, several people in uk have asked me the question.

[Snacks]

Hmmm, I don't know! Am trying to get my head around what the difference is. I think the possible age range is still vast wherever they put the cut-off. I guess NSW are specifying the youngest age to start is 4.5, and the oldest is 6. Whereas if the cut-off was in line with school year the youngest would be 4 and perhaps they just think that's too young. Certainly I know Natalie is nowhere near ready to start school. It is only in the last couple of months that she has built the confidence to speak up in a group situation (like sharing news) and break into a peer-group play situation. I am pretty confident that she'd be able to locate her own bag and recognise her name (she can't spell/write it yet though), and she could open her own lunchbox but I seriously doubt she'd know what to eat at recess and what to save for lunch. I doubt she'd remember to put her lunchbox in her bag rather than just leave it in the playground. I doubt she'd be able to be responsible for her belongings and she'd ALWAYS want to take her shoes off as soon as she sits down, LOL. Just little things like that that would be helpful to be able to do when you start school.
Either that or the youngest you could start would be 5 and that would be too long to wait for some kids who are just socially ready earlier.
I'm still trying to get my head around it too...

[shellbell3]

I always thought it was based on social readiness. I know Vic used to be from 1st july-30th june so kids starting school would be anywhere from 4.5-5.5 when they started but cut it back 2 months because younger ones were struggling. I have also heard it more becomes an issue around grade 2 when you notice problems and at that stage you don't want to hold kids back.
Back when I went to school you just went where your birthday fell unless special circumstances but now it seems alot parents are making the choice themselves for kids born Feb to April, keeping them back at kinder extra year so they'd be just about turning 6 when prep starts. I find this more with boys than girls.