Anovulatory cycles - Do you get PMS???

[nothing2lose]

Trying to work out if I did ovulate this cycle. Thought I did but cd46 and no AF.

Does anyone know if you can get PMS before bleeding on an anovulatory cycle (seeing as technically it's not a period).

Thanks!

[Marley&Me]

I researched the same thing N2L. I suspect that may have been the case with me most of my life! And since I went off the pill 2 years ago I never had PMS symptoms. No sore boobs, no cramps, nothing. And it was always a light flow for a few days, that's it.

There really isn't much info on annovulaory cycles, but the info I did find was that there is no PMS symptoms. Since I stopped clomid though I have started getting PMS again, but not much. Sorry this post hasn't been more help!

[Liviam]

I wasn't sure if I did so I asked DH. He says he wasn't sure if it was PMS but I certainly would have different moods and mood swings every few weeks.

[nothing2lose]

Thanks guys! Very helpful

Liviam, did you get sore boobs and cramps/backpain??

[Liviam]

Yep - unfortunately I would get them every few weeks. My Gyn said that it was body "trying" to do the right thing. When it failed it would try again in a few weeks so I would get it all over again. Poor little body trying so hard but couldn't quite get there.

[Keta]

This is what was happening to me a while back. I didn't get AF after coming off the pill for 6 months (it was then induced) but around the time I would suspected it should have been arriving I would get PMS symptoms. My first doctor also said it was a 'good sign' but my body never did work it out . Now I have VERY long cycles but still get the pms at 'the right time'. I plan to ask about it at my fs appointment on Wednesday so if get an answer will let you know.

Forgot to add that my blood tests have always suggested regular ovulation even though no af??? So perhaps it is a good sign. I hope so!

[Just Me]

My answer is going to make it clear as mud for you

I think that fewer PMS symptoms can be a sign that a cycle is Anovulatory but it is still possible to be anovulatory and have PMS.

Isn't that the wonderfully conclusive answer that you were looking for? Much like everything to do with the female productive system really ... nothing is conclusive and I know how crazy making that can be when all you want is a direct and decisive answer

[RhiChiChi]

Yes, I do.

I start with backache, achy legs, sore bbies then lower abdo cramping & I probably do get cranky, athough DH hasn't said anything (he is probably used to it)

[Marley&Me]

Yes, I do.

I start with backache, achy legs, sore bbies then lower abdo cramping & I probably do get cranky, athough DH hasn't said anything (he is probably used to it)

RhiChiChi, how do you know if it is an annovulatory cycle if you get PMS? I have read temping can confirm no ovulation. I'm guessing because no AF comes, but you had a positive OPK, right???

[nothing2lose]

Thanks everyone

I feel quite period-y today so I guess I am about to bleed. Just still not sure if it is AF or not

[Pholi]

I certainly have anovulatory cycles (confirmed by temping) with a fair dose of PMS (confirmed by poor DP!) In my pre-ttc life, when I was on depo provera, I didn't have a period for about 15 years, and at least one of the Exes was sure there was a monthly cycle to my moods. I never noticed, though.

[Just Me]

N2L - That sucks that you are feeling that way I hope if it is AF, she is gentle on you.

RhiChiChi, how do you know if it is an annovulatory cycle if you get PMS? I have read temping can confirm no ovulation. I'm guessing because no AF comes, but you had a positive OPK, right???

Tasha, you still have AF with anovulation cycles. A cycle is only finished when you start to bleed. If you haven't ovulated and you aren't bleeding, then the cycle is still current as there is still a chance that you will ovulate.

Temping confirms that no ovulation took place superficially because everything is as it would be if you did ovulate and there are only very subtle ways to tell that you didn't ovulate - like temping.

While OPKs can be good for identifying ovulation at times, they are not always accurate and because both lines have to be the same darkness or the test line darker than the control line, it can be interpreted wrong too. Also I do think it is possible to have a surge of hormones around the time that you should ovulate but there is not a mature egg to release. As anovulatory cycles happen to most women at some stage during their fertile years, and there are a number of reasons for this, the hormone levels will be different for different people during different cycles. So there is no one size fits all answer to why some women will have a positive OPK but no AF or a positive OPK but no ovulation. There also hasn't been lots of research done into this issue and the medical world seems to have very little understanding which makes it more difficult to get answers.

Since the only thing that is really different about an anovulation cycle to an ovulation cycle - besides not releasing an egg (which can be confirmed using ultrasound), temping is the only other real difference and the easiest way to tell at home. OPKs are good to tell you when you are having a hormone surge that results in releasing an egg, but temping is necessary if you want to confirm that the hormone surge was actually ovulation. If you have a positive OPK but no temp rise, I would keep temping and testing (if you can get OPKs cheap enough) until either AF arrived or another surge was detected followed by a temp rise as the cycle is not complete until AF arrives.

[Marley&Me]

Thanks Just Me

Is it likely that you will still bleed 14 days after a positive OPK with an anovulatory cycle? How do you caculate LP with no ovulation? Sorry for all the questions!

[Pholi]

Tasha, as far as I understand, you might or might not start AF 14 days after +opk. Basically you uterus will wait for the implantation of the fertilised egg until it decides it's not coming, then starts to shed it's lining.

My anovulatory cycles have been a little shorter than my usual, but for many women the anovulatory cycles are a little longer. I've see charts showing fertile cm and positive opk for a few days, temps stay low, then opk is negative and cm infertile for a few days; that pattern is then repeated several times until temps finally rise after the fertile period. (I think of it as a car revving at the lights - it revs... but doesn't take off, and revs and doesn't take off, then revs, the light goes green, and zoom! Off it goes! If you just keep revving, but the light never changes, well, you're still going to run out of fuel )

There is no 'luteal phase' as it is defined as the days after ovulation. In terms of ttc, not ovulating is a bigger issue than luteal phase length!

I see you've been on clomid for 6 cycles (and 2 years ttc - I feel bad for you, it's so hard!)- are you under a FS? Or your GP? Do you temp? Have you had tests to look for ovulation (US, BTs)? It concerns me that you're still not sure whether or not you're ovulating... whoever is prescribing should be monitoring more closely.

[Marley&Me]

Thanks Pholi!

I was seeing a GYN, he prescribed clomid for me. I ovulated every month, but no luck I don't temp because I work by a roster so getting a temp at the same time every day is impossible! But I do use OPK's.
Since coming off the pill 2 years ago my cycles were about 50-90 days long. So I saw my GP and that's when I was sent to the GYN. I had BT's and US and most all came back normal. I meant to go back to the GYN, but on my second natural cycle after stopping clomid I conceived. Sadly I M/C at about 5 weeks, but I feel that my body is slowly starting to sort itself out. This is my first cycle since the M/C so I have my fingers crossed If Idon't have any luck I am going to try a Naturopath.

I was curious about the anovulatory cycles because I'm sure that what I was having when I stopped the pill 2 years ago.

[Lillypilly]

Not that I need to chime in after all the excellent and thorough answers already, but yes, you can have PMS and AF with anovulatory cycles. With anovulatory cycles I guess you kinda get all the negatives of menstruation without the positive (ovulation) - oh joy!