Trying to conceive after loss or miscarriage ~ July '08 #2

My day is starting out a lot better than yesterday--I can't even tell you how discouraging it is to not be able to log on! At least last time I was still able to get on and leave PM's, but this time I couldn't even log on! Stupid "database error"! When it finally went through after like 8 hours of trying, I thought I was going to scream and start doing cartwheels! Then we had to get to the drive-in an hour early (good thing we did, it was packed!) and I didn't even bring the laptop! Just sat there for an hour--ok, I'll be honest, I sat there stuffing my face for an hour, waiting for the movie to start--kicking myself in the a$$ for not bringing my laptop! Why am I paying for a wireless card if I'm not going to use it?? No worries, on Thursday we're going to LA for 2 days to stay with DF's g-ma, and I'm bringing it with me for sure! At least I know I won't have to climb up on the roof looking for service! :rofl:

Ooooh, Tutmae, you are awake at this obscene hour as well?! I guess it's still 4 hours earlier for you though yeah?

I wish I could sing :( Well, actually, unfortunately for others I DO sing. So I guess what I meant to say is... I wish I could sing GOOD....

Jen - We are probably flying to Cali at the end of the year(ish) to take the boys to disneyland, and I am sooooo coming to your house to post on BB on your laptop! Already I am thinking ahead and worrying how I will get my BB fix while on holiday!

Hmmm, I'm picturing you doing cartwheels in frustration... Is that really the kind of behaviour that a mother with a 14 year old child displays?! Yes? Oh, ok then :D

tutmae--I love to sing, although I don't think my family enjoys my singing as much as I enjoy doing it! :lol: I was in choir in high school, and really enjoyed it! And when we play Rock Band, I've gotta be the singer! I actually got 100% on the second song I ever sang (hey, ho, let's go, hey, ho, let's go!)! Although we've come to realize that you don't even really have to sing good to get a good score, you can pretty much just say aahhhhhhhhhhhh or even hum, and as long as you're in tune, you'll get a good score! :rofl:

No, no... was doing cartwheels when it finally started working again!! See, I'm promoting healthy activities when excited!! Ooh, you should go to Magic Mountain instead--I think we've got some free passes!! (We have season passes and got some free tickets in a coupon book) I'm going to try to bribe you for a visit with free passes! Then I'll meet you there with the laptop and we can post from the top of the rollercoaster! Now that would be true addiction! Hey, maybe we'll both be UTD then and we can hang out while everyone else goes on the rides! See, I have your vacation all planned out--you won't go without BB, but more importantly, you won't go without me!! :lol: How's that for being prepared?

Easha - I'm really interested to see what your temp does tomorrow. Hopefully there is a nice big temp increase for you so that you can know where you are at in your cycle. The "unknown" is sooooo annoying! I really really hope that your LP is longer than 10 days for you. Hopefully in 14 or so days you will be having some more emotional days, but for a really GOOD reason :D

Angel Babies - OMG, imagine if everyone stated their TTC status on their regos! :ROFL: I wonder if we would have to change our regos to "PAML" when we fall pregnant...?

Tina - Bring on 9 months of boobie-soreness! Well, longer than 9 months I guess, lol. My breast can get really tender, but I don't care because I know it's because they are bigger and I won't say no to a little extra boobie-fat ;)

Niadla - I'm so sorry you had a rough night the other night. It must have been devastating :( I'm really glad that you are taking on a postive attitude towards everything. It's inspirational :hug:

Joey - You are going to make me wet my pants!! Your descriptions of people were a crack up!
I haven;t seen Han**** yet, but I'll have to get DH to come with me. We don't go out the the cinemas much, but we both want to see Han**** and the new Batman movie so we might have to have a couple of date nights together.
Last night I was watching "The Other Boleyn Girl". Have you seen it? On the whole I thought it was a pretty good movie. The baby stuff just rubs me a little raw though (understadable I guess...).
Enjoy your sleep nana!

Plc - If you could put a blankie and a nice pair of slippers next to my warm spot in the PAML thread that would be SUPER!!! :D

AFM - I sooooo don't want to get obsessed with "symptoms" that may or may not be associated with a possible pregnancy... but well, I'm having an odd sensation that is very similar to when I was pregnant with my angel. I kind of thought it was almost like a heavy feeling in my uterus. Similar to AF pains... but at the same time different. I'm only just going on 7 DPO though, so surely bubba wouldn't have implanted yet. But maybe... Arghhhh. Stop analysing! Now I just have to convince myself not to test yet...

Krystie: It's midnight here, I have to work in the morning so probably go to bed soon, but I'm a night owl.... I just can't get to sleep before midnight. Or have afternoon naps.

Jen: I've never played Rock Band. I'd be too nervous. I can play gigs in front of people, but games like that freak me out. So does karaoke.

Still having twinges down there. Sigh. Still have to wait almost two weeks to go to the doctors. Boo!

Krystie: I am totally with you on the analysing train! 100% and then some! Every single feeling sets my brain off!!

OMG Jen, imagine if we WERE both preggers when I come to Cali! DH has even said that I'd have to look after the bags while he and the DSS's go on the rides, lol, so a bag-minding buddy would be great! I wonder if fairy-floss is bad for babies? I love fairy-floss and a theme park is not a them park without fairy-floss! I've heard of magic mountain before. Is it better that DisneyLand?

Tutmae, I am a nightowl too. Except when I was pregnant. Then I found that I got tired early and woke up during the middle of the night. And then would wake up early in the morning wide awake, which trust me, is totally not in my character. I'd prefer to believe that mornings don't exist!

I wonder how many of my friends get "pregnancy" symptoms even when they are on the pill, LOL!

tutmae--You can sing in front of people, but not in front of the tv??? I don't do karaoke, either... at least with Rock Band, only my family has to suffer! What kind of music do you play? DF would love if our family were the Partridge family (you may be too young to know who they are!) we've got drums, guitars (acoustic, bass, electric), pretty much everything you'd need for a band--but none of us really know how to play! :lol: I think DF just likes to "have" things--he gets bored very easily once he masters something--and he's never had any type of music lessons, so he tends to get a little frustrated when he can't pick something up quickly!

Please let me know if you would like me to remove you from the list, or let me know if I have your details incorrect :D

Angel Babies - CD9
Jen - CD10
megsmum - CD12
Vanaithi - CD13
Kittens - CD13
Acria - CD14
Tutmae - CD17
Easha - CD18
Jodsan - CD19
Issy - CD22 (maybe)
pbstar - CD23
Toccara - CD25
Abbey - CD27

Teen - 2DPO
Joey - 4DPO
KrystieLove - 7DPO
Tina - 8DPO
Mollycat - 9DPO
Smilanatu - 10DPO
Chappas - 11DPO
Sandygirl - 15DPO Any knews yet sweetness?
Ruthie - Testing Friday!

Bettyboop - 4w5d
WTH - 6w
SaraJane 7w6d
Jenushska - 8w1d
Laura - 8w5d
AJC - 11w
Mel A - 10w5d
mmteacher- 12w2d
Canary - 12w5d
plc - 13w2d
Katiegirl - 22+wks
Nickster - 24+wks

Tempus moriendi - Not sure where you're at sorry!
Candice - Not sure where you are in your cycle either.

LizJessie - How's things hun? You ok? :hug:


Wow, it looks like no one is in there 1st week of a cycle at the moment. We must all be just about to get our BFP's! :hug:

:wtf: is fairy floss? I've never heard of that one... :confused: Disneyland is great for younger kids and people that don't like scary rollercoasters. Magic Mountain is the place to go for the scary rides with all the flips and upside down turns! My family prefers scary rides, except that I pretty much hang out with Noah the whole time, so I don't have to deal with the scary ones!

It's the same for me--I slept fine until I got pg last time. Then I would wake up constantly during the night, and up early every morning, usually because I was starving. Unfortunately for me, it's never stopped (except for being hungry, now I'm back to no breakfast).

Hey, I'm serious about the tickets to M.M.! I'll see what I have just in case, but I didn't get to go to the Melbourne meet-up, so we need a Cali meet-up!

No!!! You don't know what fairy-floss is?! You must call it something else over there. It looks like this!

MM sounds great! I bet the kids would love that more because they are going to be 9 and 11 when we go. We waited until DSS2 is old enough and tall enough to get on most of the rides.

A Cali meet-up definitely sounds like a good plan! I will keep you updated when we start to book stuff!

Now I'm about to drop! DH's snores are calling me to bed :ROFL: Plus I have a friend coming over tomorrow. He's an old friend from Uni. DH reckons he's going to come home for lunch to keep an eye on us. He's so cute when he's jealous! :D

Nighty night girlies!!! :hug:

Ok Krystie, here's what I have: 1 free adult pass which expires Dec. 31, good for any day of the week. 6 free Sunday passes good for 9/28, 11/30 or 12/28. And 6- $25 friend day passes (usual ticket prices are $60) good Sept.-Dec. The only thing is I can't tear the coupons out of my book, they have to do it, which means I would have to be there with you!

OH--cotton candy!! Yummy--of course they have cotton candy!! Sweet dreams despite the snoring!!




You still hanging out tutmae?

Tutmae - Hmmm. Not sure about that. Was there much? I'm not sure, but I just thought it might be spotting from the egg break through. :hug: Try to keep positive.

How exciting - you're in a band!! Can I have your autograph?? :dance: What's the band's name?

When you figure out how to make your brain obsessing, can you please let me know?

Jen - You're so lucky. Our closest drive in is about 50 mins away, then the next closest one is 2000km away. They have closed them all down in Bris, and QLD I think. One is in Yatla (on the way to the gold coast) and the other is in Mareeba (near Cairns)!

You haven't heard of Fairy Floss ... hang on ... you would prolly call it cotton candy. :doh:

KL - DH & I are going to see batman too. We're going to go Gold Class. We got tickets for christmas last year, and haven't used them yet. That movie is supposed to go for about 3 hours, so we figured if we're going to go in luxury, we may as well do it for as long as possible! I haven't heard of The Other Boleyn Girl. Should I rent it?

I love Fairy Floss too! I don't think it is bad for your bub. All it is is sugar. I suppose sugar is not too good for bub, but it's not detremental. So, post me some please!! :lol:

PLC - Keep me a spot in PAML too please. I'll be there in 5 days! Nothing like positive thinking. I AM pregnant. :angry: (Sorry don't get excited - I haven't POAS, I'm just talking my body into being pregnant.)

Mollycat, Smilanatu, Chappas, Sandygirl, Ruthie - Where are you? Any news??? :pray:

AFM - I am freeeezing cold! And counting down ... 5 days till POAS. I know I'm pregnant though - there's that positive thinking again.

Take care
:grouphug:

Hi Joey123

Now 4 days until can test, checking for symptoms all the time.
Strange cramps and have broke out in bit of a rash nothing else though.

Think i need some of your positivity :pray: you get BFP soon.

Off to sleep now nearly midnight here in uk.
:hug: to all

Hey jen...it is proounced smilin' at you! :D
I finally have one to add to the addicted list...you know I normally post from work as I am soooo kid busy on weekends well...I "scorched" dinner reading and posting :lol: Sooo you know you're addicted when you burn dinner catching up.

joey...hey gurlie...trying to decide if I wanna test tomorrow or try to wait till AF time..

Krystie...Fairy floss = COTTON CANDY...YUMMY!!!

AFM...I was so sick yesterday I almost vomitted at the movies...then I was fine...got a little yucky today for a minute...:pray: it's morning sickness (who ever thought we'd pray for sickness)

:pink-babydust::bluedust:
:stickyvibesgirl::stickyvibesboy:

Hi there girls. Ahh.. so many posts! LOL

I will be online lots today, so will try and keep up from now on.
CD5 today, and I forgot to temp this morning. Doh! LOL I think I am enjoying not having to worry about it, but I hate not being able to see a line on my graph. LOL

Hi all. Not a long one from me today as I'm about to go to work. Just thought I'd let you know that af has reared her ugly head for me today. I guess that explains the spotting. Oh well. My cycles are whacko! Bit down, but I'm back at CD 1 and hopefully this month is my month for a BFP.

tutmae, sorry to hear AF has arrived:( Good luck this cycle!

Just thought I would pop in and see what's happening:)

Please please please let my temp dip be implantation!!!

Smilanatu - I can't beleive you haven't tested yet. You're even sick!! Well done! :D

Tutmae - THAT SUCKS. :( Sorry to hear. She is such a b!tch. Why can't she just leave us all alone!

KL - 7DPO. Ohhhhhhh may be an implantation dip :hooray: I wanna be at 7DPO!! :crying: I'm only at 5DPO.

Your chart is looking perfect. BD on the day of ovulation and a few days leading up to it. I am feeling a BFP coming your way!! :clap:

Hey, what the green block in FF mean, in the stats row??

Tina, Molly & Easha - You haven't got your BDing on your chart?? Sorry, don't want to sound like I'm stalking your chart - Isn't that Jen's job? :ROFL:I just want to compare mine to others.

WTH - Check out the implantation dip on your chart! That's text book stuff. How excitment!!!!

AFM - I'm a bit peeved at my mum. We get on really really good, but lately she's been giving me a little case of the *****s. I told her today that I was at 5DPO, and she started going on about it'll happen when it's meant to ... blah, blah, blah. I just want her to say,"Yeah, 5 days to go. Woo hoo!!" Grrr :angry:

My 2 days away from 10 year old DD is currently in the kitchen making her own birthday cake, from scratch. She's a clever bever. I got out all the ingredients for her, she borrowed a cooking book from the school library, and I have left her to it. I've come to BB for both of our sakes. I'm way too much of a control freik and I'm very anal, and I don't want to upset her by telling her she's not doing it the right way (that would be my way). So I'm hiding in here, and if she stuffs it up, she can make another one. She won't learn from her mistakes if I don't allow her to make any. So thanks for existing girls.

Not long for a few of us now, so this stuff is very important and valuable...
:pink-babydust: - would have been more, but i ran out of smilies

Chat soon
xx

Hiya everyone.......

Have seen a bit of talk in here lately about implantation dips. I had one the month we conceived this bub. 1e7f25 Ovulation Charts

Krystielove - you do so well to keep track of everyone. GL to those in tww and GL to those about to catch the eggie. :pink-babydust::bluedust::pink-babydust::bluedust:

joey - love the positive thinking. Good on you!!!

Am always thinking of you all :hug:

ok, so DH is out at a meeting, so ive got time to catch up!!

joey: sorry to hear that your mum is not being supportive. Ive learnt that its not always the people we are the closest to that are the most supportive. Ive become VERY selective who i discuss TTC with. I dont talk about it with my mum either. When i miscarried, the first thing she said to me was "what did you do?". that really broke my heart. I know that she just doesnt understand, and she didnt mean to be mean, but it still really hurt.
your right, there are a few of us who are close to testing.....ill probably test on Sunday...what about everyone else????

krystie: im hoping that your dip is implantation too...and also mine!!!!!

tutmae: so sorry AF has arrived sweets...think of it as a new opportunity to start fresh...?

smilinatu: ooohhh sickness...thats a teriffic sign!!! what day are you up to? is it too early to test? (your right, who would have ever thought wed be praying for MS!!!)

chappas: 4 days to test..ooohhhh, :crossfingers: for you!!

As for me: well, im just waiting...need the weekend to come!!!!!!!NOW!!!!!!!

Tina - I can't beleive your mum said that. :hug: That would have hurt like hell. I think that's a very good idea about choosing who to discuss TTC with. I'm very excited about it and want to tell the world, but seems that's not a very wise idea.

KL - That dip is on 7DPO. Seems to be in the right spot. :pray:

AFM - Told DC today that by BB's are sore and that could mean a BFP soon. He's excited too. It's so lovely that he's getting excited with me. :loveshower: Have any of you breastfed before? I did about 9 years ago. You know that pain/feeling you get when your milk is coming down? That's the sort of feeling I'm getting. Not heavy throbbing like my last preg (when I MCed). I wonder??? I am only 5DPO though (according to FF).

Went to the Relaxation Centre of Queensland tonight for a 'deep relaxation' session. Lasts 35 minutes, and was really good. My head was about to fall off my shoulders I was so relaxed! I am hoping that calming myself and de-stressing will help with the growth and health of my little bubba (who I know is in there, just waiting for him to rear his head!)

Have a good night chatter boxes :hello:

:bluedust: :bluedust: :bluedust: :bluedust:

hey girls!

Joey: Sorry about you're mum. I'm sure she doesn't mean to come across as being unsupportive. Some people just don't quite understand I think. And I hope the cake turned out and the kitchen wasn't a shambles I've watched my little sister make cakes when she was younger and had to hold back from meddling!!)

AFM: Well, I'm utterly confused. When I woke up this morning I could've sworn af had started, but the next time I went to the bathroom I was back to the light brown, and haven't even gone through half a pad yet (sorry, TMI). This morning was really really dark like old blood. Hmmm.... I dunno what it could be!

Hey girls,

Seems like there is more action on here when I'm asleep than awake.... you night owls

Smilanatu - I :pray: the sickness is MS.... I hope you puck up everywhere if this is the case

Jen - I have not tried the B6 yet... I only heard about it 10 days ago so thought I would try another cycle first. I WILL get prg this time so I wont have to worry now will I ?

Tutmae - sorry about the silly AF... mine did crazy things last cycle as well. I am usually clockwork but it took an extra 2-3 days to kick in properly. Fingers crossed it is something else

Joey - keep going with the positive thinking, can't hurt now. I have also updated my setting so you can see the :bd: - Voyeur away... how weird hey !

To all the girls close to testing here is some :pink-babydust::bluedust::bluedust::pink-babydust: I hope to here your :bellygrowing: soon

AFM... still confused. I had a temp drop this morning back to 36.0!!!!. I still have watery CM however this is drying up... TMI I just want to be predictable rather than complicated. Cant wait to see the temp in the morning. What do you ladies think of my chart??

Jen - The tickets sound great! I just have to convince DH that it's still a good idea to go THIS year and not to wait! He did love the sound of MM though :) I even told him that you and me would be pregnant bag-minding buddies :ROFL:
Oh and of course! It's cotton candy to you! Isn't it so great! I have a fairy floss machine, but it doesn't always work very well.

Joey - I had no idea that the new batman movie was going to be that long! It's getting some good reviews so hopefully it doesn't feel that long when you are watching it.
The Other Boleyn Girl was a pretty good movie. It has Scarlett Johansson, Natalie Portman and Eric Bana in it. It's a story about when England broke from Rome and started the Church of England. Well, that's the background anyway, it's more about the relationships between the characters :)
I hope you're right about a BFP coming my way! In fact I know you are right (in the spirit of your positivity!!!) :D
Hmmmm, I wonder if birthday cake would travel well from brisbane to melbourne...

Chappas - Do you usually cave and test early? I always test early. I'm 7DPO and had to fight myself not to test this morning. Actually, I think the main reason I didn't test this morning was because I was busting and didn't get time to get out a test :ROFL:

Smilanatu - Your "morning sickness" sounds delightful! Lol. Isn't it funny how we are all looking forward to feeling sick? It's amazing what we looking forward to if it means we get our beautiful bubbas!

Niadla - I hate it if there are any breaks in my chart too. I even hate it that my chart has two temps that it's not counting because I had a fever for two days, hehehehe.

Tutmae - I think it's time you had a good stern chat to your body about it's cycles. I won't go so far as to say your ovaries need a good smacking, but perhaps a good talking to and the promise of not having to work for at least 9 months will convince them to get their act together and the rest of your cycle will follow suit! ;)

AJC - Awww you're so sweet! :hug: I've just noticed that on 8DPO of my pregnancy cycle I had an implantation dip too! Hopefully this bubba is a quick little one and implanted a day faster on 7DPO. She must be a strong sticky bubba... ;)

Tina - That's a great looking 8DPO dip for you there!!!

Easha - I wish I could help you with your chart, but your temps have me stumped! I thought it was going to keep going up after CD17 but it fooled me. I'm going to cross my fingers that it skyrockets from tomorrow!!!


AFM - When I went to bed last night I told DH that I was having a strange feeling in my belly. Sort of a heavy feeling that was similar to when I was pregnant. Then I had my temp dip this morning and I'm really hoping that what I felt yesterday was implantation. Actually, I can still kind of feel something different down there... I'm letting a little hope and excitement in, but not too much just in case.


Ok girls, lets start peeing on some sticks and emptying out this thread. It's about time we all got our BFP's because we ALL deserve our babies!!!

Good morning girls! Just reading through all the posts from last night (tonight for most of you girls) and will be back soon for personals... anyone still awake?

Hi gurlies...Monday morning grr...

joey...LOL I am at work for at least 9 hours didn't test before leaving and didn't bring any with me...trying to be strong! I just don't want a BFN...I NEED this to be my month...
I am sorry for what your mother said to you...it just goes through me when anyone says it'll happen when it's time...they just do not understand! :hug:

tina_k...praying the sickness is a positive sign...I am still yucky today so I am either PG or I have a bug...today is 10 DPO for me...time will tell I suppose...

Easha...I appreciate your prayers! Thank you

AFM...still "off" today as far as how I'm feeling. No other symptoms though...

:pink-babydust::bluedust:
:stickyvibesgirl::stickyvibesboy:

C'mon :bfp:

Jen: When am I not up?! heehee.... trying to relax....

KL: I like your idea. I think my ovaries should be expecting that stern talking to very soon.

Still not convinced it's af, but I'm going to assume it is and chat with my doc next week about maybe taking something to regulate my cycles. Do you gals know if there is anything that can do that?

Morning tutmae! So what's going on with your cycle, hun? One post I think AF has arrived, and the next, maybe not... :pray: so hard it's implantation!!!

This morning it was dark (but only on my first trip to the loo) then back to light brown dischargy stuff.... Does implantation sometimes be a tiny bit clotty? Ok. Now I'm grossing myself out with TMI. Sorry girls!!

joey--I'll say it for your mum: "Yay, 5 days to go until testing!" :woot: I can't understand how those that are closest to us can't see that the simplest thing they can do to comfort us is just to keep their mouths shut and be supportive! We just need to hear and know that we're being supported--we don't need to hear that it will happen in time... don't stress out about it... blah, blah, blah! We need our families to be our cheerleaders!

Um, I looked at my chart, and I have a green block on the day I'm supposed to O--but I noticed that Krystie has a whole row of green blocks, so now I'm confused! :confused:

Ooh, your deep relaxation session sounds wonderful! It must be helping, because you've got the positive thinking down pat!



Chappas--Good luck with POAS in 3 days! :crossfingers: you get your BFP!!


Smilanatu--Ooh, sounds really promising for you, girl! Bring on the m/s!!! I'm :pray: this is YOUR month!! Thanks for the addition to the Addicted list--will add it in a few, so I don't lose my post!


AJC--Thanks for the link to your BFP chart! I'm hopeless, I'm only CD11 and haven't even O'ed yet, and I'm already overlaying my chart with yours! :lol: Thanks for still hanging out with us!


tina--Chart is looking good! I'm crossing fingers, toes, and eyes for you for your BFP in 4 days!!!


Easha--I knew we had discussed the B6 before, but couldn't remember when and what was decided. You're right--you won't need the B6 next month, cos you'll already be pg!! :crossfingers: for you!


Krystie--:pray: so hard for you that it's implantation!!!! It's lookin' really good!! Ooh, keep after DH about M.M! I already told DF that I offered you the tix. Remember, I have 1 free adult ticket, and at the very least you would only have to pay $25 each for 3 of you--that's SUPER cheap considering it's $60 for a day pass, and I think Disneyland is a little more expensive. I can't even tell you how much I'm hoping it all works out--how cool would it be to meet someone you chat with that lives in a different country! :excited:

I so suck at temping...

Tell me something pleaseeeeeee ..... does it really have to be the same time every day that you take your temp....... I just cant bring myself to set my alarm to wake myself up early in the morning on my day off. I m so sleep deprived at the moment that i just cant do it. I ve looked at my chart... ohhh its allllllll over the place, so many ups and downs it may as well be at dream world or some other theme park as a rollercoaster or somethin.... so now I m at the stage of not bothering with my temp. I still fill in my little computer programe chart, which tells me everything I need to know all the time but I just dont take temps anymore..... so when your talking about implantation dips... i m like...hmmmm no worries... mine dips more than the tango.

Oh well add it to the list I suppose ;)

tutmae--I'm not really sure about implantation spotting since I've never experienced it before, but it's your boyd getting rid of old blood, so I would assume it's possible that it could be a little clotty. I'm :pray: for you, girl!

Angel B--I think as long as it's close to the same time each day, the software will sort itself out with the details. I noticed on the 2 days that I was sleep deprived, it gave me open circles--it takes all the info you add into account, and it will change things as it sees fit. And if it's just 1 or 2 days a week that are different due to them being your days off, I'm sure it can give a close estimate to what's going on with your cycle. Don't give up, love! :bluedust: :pink-babydust:

The way I figure it Jen...... I can stuff up the temping... I can stuff up POAS with times and all.... as long as I dont stuff up the BD... and DH certainly can contest to that ;)..... then alls good...... I ve just got to remember to allow his little swimmers some time to get to the starting line up before the main event..... instead of always opening the gates ahead of time. :dance: