Babies Born June 1st - 15th 2008

Haaaaa yes you can tell a story well can't you MummyPig!! You are full of advice which is great!!:dance:

I will try to eliminate what it is over the next week. I have stopped bannana all together and will go back to just 1 fruit and 1 vegie per day for a few days and then I'm sure I will work out what it is. Also I am giving farax the flick for awhile to see if it is that!!

OOOOOOOOhhhh boy this solids thing is hard work..:wall: I much prefer my little booby juice drinking boy! :bfchild: It was much easier!! But I guess they have to grow up sometime!!!

WELCOME RHIANNON!!! Hope you feel at home here, we are always asking each other questions and comparing babie stories!!! Fill us in on Aiden's little life story!! :welcome:

xoxoxoxo

hey everyone,

we finally have a tooth comimg throu its just breaking the skin,and cammi has been a nightmare!!!the other morning she ate a hole jar of food and wanted more so i got her some banana and she ate half of it she must of been very hungry..
how is everyone else and there bubs going?miranda has zeke got his second tooth yet?
leesha did you find what was upsetting taj's tummy?
was just a quick one today...

Hi all!

It's been a while since my last post but it seems I'm no longer getting the email notifications (?) Here I was thinking you were all on holidays :-) So I spent an hr writing an update and my internet went down....arrgghh! So it's taken me a couple of days to work up the energy to re-write it :-)

Gracie is doing well. She started on solids at about 6.5months and is going pretty well with them. She's definitely a fruit not vege girl like her mum :-) I've had to come up with some pretty creative ways of getting her to take her vegies...cheeky little thing. Rice cereal and banana constipated her so I've elimated them and replaced rice cereal with brown rice pureed. This goes well with fruit for brekkie. Prune juice from boiling prunes also helped with her constipation.

She's commando crawling ATM and so I'm discovering the world of having to move things out of reach! She finally learnt how to roll from her tummy back onto her back about 4 weeks ago and now does it with ease. She's also really into books now which is great because we read one before her sleep time.

Anyway...MummaPig...I'm going to give you a detailed answer to your questions about sleeping :-) You probably didn't want it but I don't want to miss anything that could potentially be helpful to you :-)

Gracie is a good sleeper - she probably does around 15hrs in 24. She does about 3hrs in the day and 11-12 at night. She doesn't have a feed at all at night anymore. I cut her dream feed when I introduced solids. From when she was born I've done a stack of reading about sleeping. I was determined to develop good habits early. So I've read all about the different methods, styles, theories etc From Ferber to Sears to Pinky Mackay and all the various Baby Whisperers. I also went to 2 Day Stays to see how they taught mums to settle their bubs. I've tried to find the common threads and picked the things I think are important. So here goes...

The common thread amongst all the authors (or most of them) is the concept of self-settling. I'm sure you're well familiar with this! Making sure you put your baby down awake and allowing them to fall asleep without your help, or the help of something like a bottle/feed, rocking, dummy etc. This is probably the single most important thing I've done. It's not been easy at times! Last week it took her 1.5hrs to settle for one of her day sleeps! I don't subscribe to CC in it's purest form - however I have allowed Gracie to cry if I've felt it's more a behavioural cry as opposed to an emotional cry. I know her behavioural cry because she stops crying when I go into her room and starts up again when I leave. If she gets really worked up in the settling process, I go in and reassure her with key words, singing, "shhing" etc If she wakes in the night, I leave her for up to 10mins to see if she will re-settle. If she doesn't I go in and check her. Normally she only night wakes if she's too hot or cold so it makes it fairly easy to work out the problem. She can take anywhere from 40mins-1.5hrs to resettle if she night wakes with me going in every now and then to reassure her.

It sounds like you're doing a similar thing with Freja which is great. My only suggestion might be to try and not get her up if she only does 30min sleeps. Gracie will often cat-nap and it usually takes up to 15mins for her to re-settle but she'll then do another sleep cycle (40mins). If she doesn't resettle I get her up after 20mins and pop her to bed earlier the next time. I think our LOs are at an age where they can start to work out if they do certain things, mum will come. But you're the best judge of this :-) I just try to be consistent in how I settle / re-settle, day and night (it can be hard at night!).

If you're working on dropping a night feed, then you need to just be patient and persist in settling without feeding. I know it's hard! My SIL recently went from feeding her 16mo 4 times in the night to no night feeding. It took 1 night of on-and-off crying for 2 hrs with her going in a various points to reassure, and he hasn't woken for it since! Now not all bubs are that easy to convert, but I think as parents we're often more frightened of the change than they are :-)

The best person I can recommend for sleeping is Sheyne Rowley - The Australian Baby Whisperer. She has a book coming out beg of March. She has a very good, holistic approach to managing babies. She looks at 5 key areas including environment, communication, routine, independence and managing change. Anyway, I could say heaps about how she's helped me but go on her website and check it out. I found listening to her radio interviews (media section) very helpful in practical strategies and tips. I can't say enough good things about her!!!

In answering your question about whether Gracie goes through NW phases - yes! Recently she went through an early waking phase (between 5am & 5.40am). I installed dark shades and that seems to have cured it. If she wakes at various stages throughout the night I can pretty much pinpoint now the reason. For example, 40mins after she first settles is usually because she's either hot or over-tired. Between 10&11pm, around 2am, and 5-6am are sleep cycle windows (enters light sleep). If she wakes at these times it's usually a few minutes of crying and then she re-settles on her own. If Freya can't self-settle at these times, it's usually an association problem such as needing a feed to go back to sleep for example. These are the times you need extra patience in attempting to settle without whatever the aid is. Eventually she won't wake anymore as she's taught herself to re-settle. Waking around midnight is usually a hunger issue and so I try and look at Gracie's daily intake and include more protein for example. Anyway, there's stacks more to say here but I think I've raved on enough.

What you need to know the most is that you're doing an amazing job!! Good parents only do what they think is best for their bub. Sometimes it can lead to hard habits but that's not from lack of love (usually the opposite) :-) I hope you can get something out of Sheyne's website. Out of all the books I've read, I rate her the highest!!! But I'm only telling you what's worked for me and Gracie. I don't want to come across as 'this is the only way!!' Sometimes it takes one person to say something that makes sense to you...if I'm that person then great, if not, then that's ok too!!! :-)

Anyway, happy Australia Day everyone :-) Hope it's a relaxing day for all...

Hi all how is everyone???

I worked out it was the farax constipating Taj!!
He is loving soilds and started on meat now!!!
I have also just made the switch to cloth nappies and are loving it!! They are so cute! They feel devine to touch so I'm sure his bottom is loving it!!!

Just a quick one as I have to get Dinner organised....Hope those of you in Vic are handling the heat ok cos I know I'm over it!!!!

Xoxoxoxox

Hello!

Maya was born on June 6th, she'll be 8 months soon! :> I was wondering if I could join this thread so I can learn from other mums who are in the same stage as I am :D

Welcome! The more the merrier...looking forward to sharing stuff with you!

Welcome Fledgeling,

Join us all on our unknown journey thru parenthood......Ask ask away.....

We love hearing new stories and appreciate the new advice!!!!!:lol:

xoxoxxoxoooxxx

Wow Amy! That was great :D

I wish I had been as prepared as you. I only started to read books about parenting techniques etc when she was 5 months old - by which point I'd already accidentally parented her to bits... ah well, at least I got lots of extra hugs out of it!

11-12 at night?! You lucky thing! I can't believe she does it without night feeds too - you're right, Grace is a good sleeper!

I'm impressed that you seem to have worked out what's wrong at each stage of Grace's night wakings - I hope I manage to get the hang of that with Freyja. :pray:

I think Freyja was only managing 8 hours overnight until recently, because she would take ages to go to sleep, then wake erratically because she was hungry and then be grumpy in the morning (development point - no matter how well / badly she slept during the day, night time was bad!). The grumpy period was over come last Monday, so we got her routine back on track and she's been napping well, but still waking at night. On Friday everything suddenly changed and she napped well then slept through! Woke a few times Saturday night, but self settled quickly, bumped her head Sunday night and last night (she's longer than the cot is wide and keeps jamming herself!) and woke up at 4.30ish, but on Sunday she resettled easily. This morning I didn't notice she was pretty wet, so it took until 6am to resettle her :redface:

We seem to have had a few changes coincide. She went through a development point so we've had two weeks of bad sleep at night, but she has gone from saying 'p, p, p... t, t, t....b, b, b...' all day long to saying 'mama' and 'bow mow wow wow'. I asked her last night if she wanted blueberry and banana, or mango and banana and she went 'bananananaaaaaa'! Also, she is now rolling properly everywhere and commando crawling (backwards!), so is a lot more active.

Plus, the extra hot weather and our lack of aircon meant it was between 38c and 42c IN THE HOUSE all last week, so we were giving her lots of water between meals in her sippy cup. She likes to drink from that because it flows easily (I've had letdown problems since she was 4 months - we were both ill), so I think she's just made the decision to have a big girl cup now. I've decided to wean her properly, so she's had ebm in her cup/bottle, moving slowly to formula as my milk reduces (and my nipples get wrecked - no idea how you've done it so long Leesha!).

Freyja has also started to feed herself, so we give her some finger foods first, then her solids (to make sure she doesn't starve!) and then her milk. Oh, and we'd started potty training her a month ago, before she hit her last grumpy patch, so now she has started to go pee pee or poo in her potty (albeit inconsistently!).

I still haven't read any Ferber or Sears stuff, but Pinky McKay is great and I also just read a few books about bf, Jo Frost's Confident Baby Care (SuperNanny!), The Wonder Weeks, The Baby Whisperer Solves All Your Problems and am about to read Sleep Right, Sleep Tight, which is the Tweddle Child & Family Health Services one. Thanks for the tip on Sheyne Rowley, will definitely have a look through her website and get her book.

You're right that the main area of consistency between everyone is to teach your child to self-settle and it's been interesting reading about the different methods suggested. We've pretty much adopted the 'pick up/put down' method, but only because we were doing it anyway before I'd even realised it was a suggested tactic! I find it works fairly well for Freyja, but if she's overtired then she's fairly resistant so sometimes it takes much longer than others. Her main thing when she is like this is to insist that you stay with her with your hand on her shoulder (she would prefer to grasp your hand and hold it across her eyes, but them you've got to try and escape without waking her!), but just as she's about to fall asleep to turn over and complain. You end up having to sit with her for a long time, as she will push away and wriggle if you try pu/pd.

The other thing that I like is the advice to respect your child as an individual and to tell them what you're doing, rather than just doing it. Freyja responds well to this. I also never grab anything off of her or take anything from her without asking for it first and explaining why I want it or why she can't have it. Last night she had one of her daddy's stereo cables that he'd left laying and he grabbed it off of her - poor Freyja was startled and cried a little, with her daddy apologising profusely. I also give her choices on things like which of her coloured spoons she wants to use, which of her smocks she would like, what out of a couple of items of clothing would she prefer etc and allow her to do things for herself, like feeding herself (messy!), brushing her teeth (pretty ineffective), wiping her face after eating (ditto) and mine (ie she smacks me in the face with the cloth).

I've rambled on again I know, but now I have some questions for you seeing as you are now my unofficial sleep guru! :D

How did you drop the dream feed and how much solids was Grace having? How much of everything (milk and solids) do you give her every day (there's so much info on this and I'm finding it a little confusing!)? What time do you normally put her down at and does she settle quickly? During nap times, if she wakes and is calm do you go to her and try to encourage her back to sleep or leave her? That one gets me - I never know whether it's worth it to leave her and see if she'll go back to sleep or not when she's only got a short while to go!

In fact, question for everyone: would you all mind sharing your 'routines' here if I go first? I'm interested in seeing how similar or how different they are.

6.45 Mummy gets up and gets brekkie ready
7.00 Wake up, potty, finger foods (fruit & toast), porridge, milk (takes around 45 mins total!)
7.45 Potty (if she looks like she needs it) or plays (15 mins) then potty, gets dressed, quiet time with mummy (folding clothes or reading a book)
8.30 Brush teeth, check/change nappy, into cot where she might play or go straight to sleep
11.00 Wake up, potty, snack (milk)
11.15 Play time / go for a walk into town
12.00 Lunch (cheese/breadsticks/egg yolk/meat/veggie pieces then a veg & fruit puree)
12.30 Play time/shopping, check/change nappy
13.00 Nap time (might not nap if in her buggy)
15.00 Wake up, potty (nappy check/change if out), snack (milk & often something yummy in her self-feeder)
15.15 Play time / walk home from town
16.00 Shower/bath/play with daddy
17.00 Cat nap for one sleep cycle
18.00 Wake up, potty, dinner (meat/pasta with veg then a dessert, usually given by daddy whilst mummy makes dinner)
18.30 Quiet playtime (ie a couple of non-noisy toys!)
19.00 Milk, wash, brush teeth, nappy changed, PJs on, story, bed (timing all depends on her tired signs, but ALWAYS in bed by 8pm)

• Nappy is checked/changed at potty time and before naps/bed
• Finger foods are a few smalls chunks / sticks (say 8 bits in total)
• Main meals are approx 3-4 dessert spoons, except dinner which has additional 2-3 of dessert (may be offered at other meals if seems hungry)
• Milk is 200mls, but rarely drinks more than 120-150mls

Hey Leesha - glad Taj is loving his solids and that it was just the Farax. Stupid stuff is the culprit almost every time I think! I wanted to switch to cloth nappies too (bum genius), but we can't spare the initial outlay at the moment due to having to send money to the UK to cover the mortgage as well as pay rent here. Pity though because we did buy one to try it and they're great - so much better at keeping the wetness away from their skin and no nasty chemicals. Plus you're right, they do look cute!

As for the heat, we have no aircon... :(

Hi Fledgling!!! Welcome to the thread - hope you find it as helpful as I have!

PS Amy - the other thing that all the writers agree on is consistency. Unfortunately, that's easier to say than be!

Wow MummyPig..potty training already!!! That's impressive!!!

I am nearly at the end of my expressing days..It's sad but time to stop and get back a bit of normal life...I am slowly switching him over to formula and so far so good!!! He is being given 200ml bottles but only drinks 100-150ml. We are a bit behind everyone else with the solids as we only started about a month ago..

Routine is usually this:

0700 awake, bottle, breakfast and change nappy
Playtime and read stories
0930 Morning Sleep which can be usually 1-2 hours
1130 Bottle, change nappy and play or go for a walk
1230 Lunch and more playing and fruit snacks or rusk
1400 Afternoon sleep which again can be 1-2 hours
1600 Take the dog for a walk with daddy
1700 Dinner
1730 Bathtime
1800-1830 Bottle and then playtime or straight to bed (if tired) or in bed by 7pm if not grumpy

He is having lots of water and fruit snacks throughout the day (watermelon, grapes, apple)

He is having nights where he sleeps right thru but then he can sometimes wake around 2am for a small bottle and nappy change and goes straight back to bed..I never know what he will do.....

Last night he was asleep by 8.30(took a few times to settle him) then he slept till 8 am this morning...wowwww i was in shock!! Yet tonight could be completley different!!!

I need some suggestions on what to give him for lunch? I run out of ideas.
He had his first lamb chop last night and loved it!! Tonight will be spaghetti bog I think!!!

Hi Kerry! It's great to hear from you. Freja seems to be doing so well!! I can't believe you're potty training - that's fantastic. You'll be able to share all your tips with us when the time comes :-) Does this mean she doesn't wear nappies or am I totally misunderstanding you?? Wow - you're great :D

I hear you about the expressing thing. Gracie has decided in the last week to refuse all feeds from me (bar the first feed of the day because my milk is good). My let-down is so slow that I'm expressing all her feeds ATM. She would just pull off and get frustrated so this is how it is for now :-( I'm holding on to BF...not sure why...hard to explain the strange attachment that's formed isn't it?! Anyway, I'm hoping I don't lose my milk completely.

Sleeping is such a hard topic! I hope I didn't come across like Gracie is the perfect angel. Let me assure you she has her 'trying' days! Yesterday she had 3 x 40min sleeps...she keeps waking with a poo and won't re-settle. She's also teething and I'm not so sure how that's affecting her ATM. She's started commando crawling and just this week is pretty much up on her knees. They say that when they learn a new skill it often affects their sleep.

Anyway, I hope I can answer your questions.

Something I noticed with your post (and I may be wrong here)...IS Freja often waking up from thrashing around in the cot? I only ask because I recently solved this problem with a Safe T Sleep. Have you heard of these? It's basically a velcro band that goes around their waist to keep them in one position in the cot. I was finding Gracie couldn't handle the new-found freedom when I weaned the wrap and was taking ages to settle and then waking from the thrashing around. Anyway, check out their website if you're interested. Does she sleep in a Grobag? If she's a thrasher, she may be kicking off her covers and getting cold (not in this weather I know!!!) But maybe something to think about for winter.

The other thing you mentioned was her insisting on staying with you (hand on shoulder). I know it's hard but I think she would really benefit from learning to go to sleep by herself. She WILL definitely protest when you try this but just keep going in and reassuring her. Go in and reassure her as often as you're comfortable with. But the going to sleep on her own thing is a big skill and when they learn it, it's a major breakthrough to the whole 'sleeping through' etc because when they naturally rouse in the night, they don't need you to help them back to sleep.

Sounds like you've got the communication thing down pat! Sheyne Rowley has quite alot of good info on this subject on her website. I'm really looking forward to her book!

With dropping the dreamfeed, we just went cold turkey after we introduced solids for 3 weeks. I think she was probably really ready so it was pretty smooth. Gracie will have around 700-800mls per day and 3-4cubes of fruit with brown rice cereal for b'fast, 3-4cubes of vegies/savoury for lunch plus 3-4cubes of fruit and about 4 cubes of savoury for dinner, sometimes I offer a bit of fruit as well. I would say she's a std eater. She's on track with her weight so she's not a big girl.

Your routine looks good to me! I'm not hugely consistent with routines. Mainly because I'm not a morning person and depending on when she first wakes, dictates the rest of the day. I'll give you the current 2 patterns.

6.30am/7am - wake and milk (doesn't return to sleep)
8am - solids
8.30am - top up milk, then playtime in her room before bed
9am to 10.30am - sleep
11.30am/12pm - solids
12.30pm - milk, then playtime in her room before bed
1pm to 2.30pm - sleep
3.30pm/4pm - milk
4.15pm - sometimes she will take this nap, sometimes not (I only give her 40mins MAX)
5.30pm - solids
6pm - bath
6.15pm/6.30pm - milk, book (in room), bed by 7pm

OR

6.15am-6.30am - wake and milk, return to sleep, usually 'til around 8.30am
8.30am/8.45am - solids
9.30am - top up milk, the play in her room
10am to 11.30am - sleep
12.30pm - solids
1.30pm - milk
2pm to 3.30pm - sleep
Then the rest is the same as above except not arvo nap

So as you can see, I'm not particularly anal about routine (although I probably should be but I like a sleep in :-)

When Gracie goes to sleep I make sure she knows in advance it's nearly sleep time. Then we read a book in her room, she goes into her Grobag and Safe T Sleep and I give her her comforter. I've found that if she's had too much awake time, she takes a long time to settle and then cuts her sleep short. Her max awake time ATM seems to be 2.5hrs, any longer and I've missed the boat. If she's not over-tired, she'll settle in about 10mins - chats then goes quiet.

If she cuts her sleep short, I usually wait 15mins and then just get her up. Even though she hasn't had enough, it's been enough just to take the edge off and these days she doesn't re-settle (she used to). Then I give her less awake time and pop her to bed earlier. I've learnt not to stress about her day sleeps anymore - as long as her night are good! The past week her day sleeps have been pretty ordinary, but good nights so I can't complain.

With night waking, it's usually because she's too hot or cold. I just go in when her cries get emotional, otherwise I let her protest 'til she re-settles. The longest she's taken to resettle at night is 1.5hrs. I've noticed any waking before say midnight, she re-settles within 10mins max (maybe because she hasn't had a big chunk of sleep yet). The 1.5hrs was when she woke once around 4.30am. So she'd already slept for quite a long time so it was harder for her to re-settle. I don't subscribe to CC but I do let her protest if it's behavioural i.e. when I leave the room she starts up...that sort of thing.

Anyway, I hope I've answered your questions. You seem to really be onto it - there's always a new challenge and we can never totally predict their behaviour or patterns. I think I just try and maintain consistency through it all. I don't really know what else to do :rolleyes:

All the best! Love hearing from everyone about routines...I think I need to get this together a bit more :redface:

Sorry I just re-read the potty training bit and I see that you're still using nappies :redface: Does this mean you offer the potty but if she doesn't go, then the nappy is there as back-up?? Sorry, I can be a little slow-on-the-uptake somtimes!!!

Hey where has mirandabelle gone? She hasn't been around here for awhile!! hope she is ok....

Miranda hasn't posted in here since the 7th Jan. I don't think Zeke's surgery was due until Feb/Mar time, but he did have some tests coming up. I'm sure she's just run ragged chasing after his commando crawling!

It's interesting to see that Freyja, Taj and Grace all wake roughly at the same time and have their naps at the same time too. You guys don't seem to offer any more food than I do, so I guess I'm just bad at working on getting her to sleep through. It's never really mattered that she doesn't, but it would be nice!!

Leesha - I feel really sad about not bf anymore too, but I'm ready to stop now. I couldn't go through the persuading Freyja to latch on thing yet again and because we want to try for another baby, now is the time to switch her to formula. Besides, they've both had a good 8 months of booby so better than a lot of bubs and you're boobs must be desperate for a break!

Sounds like Taj is hungry occasionally and that's why his nighttime wakings are erratic. Or perhaps he's at an awake stage and hears something outside or whatever. Try doing what Amy does when Grace wakes at the time and increasing the protein in his diet to see if it makes a difference.

As for lunch ideas - I've loads but won't write too much (yeah right!). Try things like tapioca or rice pudding for filling milky goodness. You can add some fruit to them too. Or for veggie ideas, try combining a veg with a fruit (avocado & banana, avocado & pear [avocado or banana will need to be pureed with a little citrus juice if you want to make a batch to freeze. Pear can be steamed in the microwave for 4 mins], butternut squash & pear, butternut squash & red pepper, red pepper & sweet potato, sweet potato & mango [steam the squash, red pepper or sweet potato in the microwave for 6 mins]) or simple veggie things (pea & carrot, sweet potato, leek & pea). How about making a lentil puree?

Oh, if you haven't tried fish yet, it makes a good lunch food. You can give the babies tinned tuna or salmon, just check that they're only in spring water and not with chilli or something else! Salmon mixed with some philly and red pepper or sweet potato works well, the tuna with a little yoghurt and sweet corn.

The fish things make good dips for them to stick their breadsticks/rusks in when you first try finger foods. Or try tiny fingers of carrot, red pepper, sweet potato etc steamed, or peas, skinned and chopped pieces of grape or other fruits, small cubes of cheese or chicken.

Hope that helped you with some ideas. Let me know if you need any baby friendly recipes :D

Amy - it's so easy to get attached to bf because we're meant too - all those hormones! It's one of the reasons why I've never minded feeding Freyja overnight - holding my sleepy baby in my arms whilst everything is quiet around me is wonderful.

How do you find managing to express with a slow let down? I get wound up and then it makes it worse!

I guess I wasn't clear enough about what I do with her (sorry!). Basically I put her down to bed after her routine (milk, wash, teeth, nappy, PJs, story) and leave her too it. She's had the ame routine since she was a few weeks old - bar the teeth which we added in November! She may babble away to her Iggle Piggle for a while before she goes to sleep, or if she wakes up, but on most nights is asleep within 20 mins. If she protests I leave her unless her level of crying escalates because I know that it can then take hours to get her to sleep. At first I will just nip in and out checking on her (did this for 3 hours one night last week) to give her reassurance, but if this doesn't work and she gets worse I will try to calm her in her cot with my hand on her shoulder.

If she's really worked up this won't work though and I need to do the pu/pd thing (pick her up and the minute she is calm put her back down again. If she cries on the way back down, tough, she still goes back in the cot, but then I pick her right back up again. Often she will struggle and want back in her cot, so I put her in and try settling in her cot again... before I give up and go have a glass of wine!).

From what I've read about self settling, you need to teach your baby how to do this by providing them with reassurance when they're upset so that they can learn it's okay and relax, enabling them to go to sleep themselves. This is what the pu/pd thing is supposed to do and it does work with Freyja, except on the odd occassion where I've let her get too worked up and overtired. The Baby Whisperer etc say never to leave your baby to cry - they mean a proper cry, not one of those 'uh...uh.... (pause to listen for someone coming)...uh uh....' ones that Freyja often does before settling :rollseyes:

Thing is, from what I've read you're meant to stay with the baby whilst you're learning them how to go to sleep. Initially with physical contact, then in the room where they can see you, then a bit further away where you're not in their line of vision. My problem is that I'm generally so desperate for time to relax or spend with my hubby, that I don't want to stay there and do the 'Mary Poppins' thing for hours instead of just commiting 30 mins or so to helping her.

It's not so much that she wakes from thrashing around, it's just that she's very active and likes to explore her cot when she is awake. It's good because she can entertain herself and find her own dummy, but bad in that she wedges herself in places! Not sure the safetsleep would help now, but I wish I'd known about it when she first started rolling onto her tum!

Our routine is just a simple wake, eat, play, sleep format, but I try to stick roughly to the timings of things during the week because I've learnt when to expect Freyja to want specific things. I just adjust timings of things through the day like you do if we go off, unless Freyja is in a grumpy period in which case we go way off! It all goes to pot at the weekend when daddy's home :)

As for the potty training, we started her as soon as she was able to sit up on her own. She's not old enough to control her bowels and won't be until she's around 12 months old, but she is old enough to learn why we use the toilet/potty and how we do it. It's more about creating associations than training her. I started by taking her to the loo with me when I went and letting her sit on the bedroom floor and watch me, telling her what mummy was doing 'mummy's having a pee, psssss' that type of thing! Sad I know, but she got it. Then we started putting her on her potty after feeds when we could see she was going to poo, holding her little hands and copying her poo faces and noises whilst squeezing her hands to show her what to do.

Now we're learning to associate the potty with peeing as well, so when she wakes up and after her meals or drinks (straight away if she makes a poo face, after 10 mins if she doesn't) we go to the loo together. Freyja goes on her potty and I go on the 'big girl potty' and we pee together! Then we get wiped, flush everything down the loo (Freyja likes pressing the handle) then we wash our hands.

It's working really, really well and beats having to change toddler poo nappies!! :dance:

http://i705.photobucket.com/albums/w...DSCF4760-1.jpg

Wow - you're amazing with your potty training!!! You'll be streaks ahead when the time comes for her to fully train. Awesome.

You sound like you're doing everything you can for Freja to learn how to sleep by herself. That's fantastic. What else can you do really!? I know what you mean about resorting to things to just get time to yourself. I can tell you know, I'm not perfect in this department either. Sometimes it's more about me than her. You do what you have to do to get them to settle, even if it means breaking the 'rules'.

Sometimes I get sick of all the 'do's' and 'don'ts', all the opinions and theories. In the end, I've decided to choose a way and stick to it. A while ago I kept reading stuff and felt confused so I had to make the call just to stick to one way. I've tried to weed out all the junk and focus on the key things and not beat myself up about it if things don't go to plan.

I was following Tizzie's Halls routines for a while but was finding I was more stressed on them! I tend to believe that all babies are individuals - some with more sleep req and some with less for example. So now I just apply the principles I think are good, and let the rest of it be.

Anyway, you sound completely devoted to Freja and that's what really matters in the end. Thanks for sharing your bits n pieces!!! I love knowing what others are up too:-)

You're completely right Amy - all babies are individuals with different needs and thats why I'm so interested in hearing what other babies do. I don't think there is a one size fits all method of child care, which is why I started to read everything I could. I've basically done the same as you and took the bits I liked and thought would work for us and ignored the rest!

I find it funny when mums say, why isn't my baby doing this when whatsherface's is - and it's 3 weeks younger!... mental development is based around the nervous system so works on an approximate timeline from conception, not birth, so talking etc can happen at different stages and physical development is based on a baby not only having the right level of mental development, but also all their limbs, muscles etc being the exactly right proportions... as babies are naturally going to be of different sizes and have different growth patterns, it's almost impossible to compare them!

There was a baby girl in the mothers group I went to for a couple of weeks, who was younger than Freyja and at 4 months was rolling and commando crawling everywhere. She crawled at 5 months. Freyja's almost 4 months older now and has only started the rolling!

Wow I had no idea about all that development stuff! How interesting. Where did you get all that info? I'd love to read more about development (mental, physical, emotional etc)

You're right about stressing out about them reaching particular milestones. That's why I've never really loved going to Mother's Group! Sometimes it feels like one big competition about who's baby's doing what. Sometimes you end up feeling inadequate as a mother :redface: But I'm going for the social aspect and that's been great.

Thanks again for sharing...

It's a scientific fact :)

We tend to think of development being from birth and yes, certain aspects of development can be influenced by our experiences and environment (eg a baby can be at the stage where they are able to process language, but if they've been rarely exposed to it then they still won't be able to talk), so most people don't realise it is more than that.

My best friend was carrying twin girls and was 2 weeks less pregnant than me. Her babies were delivered by c-section at 37 weeks, when I was 39 weeks pregnant, and Freyja was a week late. Even though they are by birth older than Freyja by a whole month, developmentally they are still 2 weeks younger than her. It shows in that Freyja hits mental and emotional milestones before they do (the ability to reach for things, smile, laugh, understand words, babble etc), but she doesn't necessarily hit physical ones first (they cut teeth before Freyja and were able to roll before her, although she can sit, stand and take steps but they can't). She may have the mental capacity to understand and know how to crawl or roll etc, but she's smaller and has shorter limbs so physically can't.

Watching the 3 girls over the first few months and seeing how they developed at different rates is what got me so fascinated (some may say obsessed!) with comparing how individual babies are.

The best book to read (as in one that's designed for parents rather than academics!), is The Wonder Weeks. You've probably heard people going on about it on BellyBelly because it was difficult to get hold of, but it was republished in 2008 so is now readily available.

If you go to thewonderweeks website (google it) there's a good preview of the contents, as well as links to some other stuff you might find interesting. It obviously doesn't go into too much detail because they want you to buy the book, but I can send you a summary of the development points for 8 months on if you are interested?

Now, it's potty time! :D

Wow - you've certainly done some reading by the looks of it! :clap: It's interesting about the mental and emotional being dicatated by age, but physical not necessarily. Makes sense now that I think about Grace compared to my friend's bubs.

I'd love any info you have - my email address is amy.hunziker@bigpond.com

I'll certainly look into the Wonder Weeks - sounds great! The collection is growing :D

Thanks again!

No problem Amy - will drop you an email later on today once I've done my housework! :)

And me and me!!! (Puts her hand up) I would love to have a read too!!!

leisha12@hotmail.com is my email addy!!!!

xoxoxo

No probs Leesha (or should that be Leisha?!) - I've sent you both two emails, but you might want to grab a cuppa before you read them :D

Just your email mummypig...have taken a quick break from hanging out washing!! I will make a cuppa and sit down and read.......

Thanks heaps for emailing it..I am looking forward to having a read!!!
I've been busy steaming food and cleaning up the kitchen most of the day! Soo much housework..so little time!!!
uhhohhh I can hear him stirring from his nap..I might get around to the cuppa and reading a bit later!!

xoxoxoxoxoxo

Hey Ladies!!!
Thanks for the email Kerry......it was great to read and explains alot of what Taj is doing!!!
On tuesday 24th after a week of no sleep and lots of tears we got our first tooth and he is crawling (backwards not forwards) So it has been a busy fortnight for me!!!

Just wondering how everyone is going and hope you and bubs are all ok!!!:)

Has anyone heard if mirandabelle had Ds' surgery yet... Hope they are ok!!

Oh my goodness, I've been away for so long!

Zeke is doing great... he's now 8.14kg and 67cms tall. He can crawl (although he prefers to frog-kick his legs or crawl on his toes rather than his knees) and his latest trick is standing up holding hands and walking. He hasn't got cruising along the furniture just yet, but you can see him thinking about it!

He can also say "Mama" and "Dada" but not to the right person... he calls me Dada a lot! He also makes "Buh" sounds, and he's said "blah, blah, blah!" to me once when I was talking!

He got his two bottom teeth just at the beginning of January, but seems to have stopped there. I don't mind that at all... two at a time is tolerable!

His operation is scheduled for the 14th of April, so we're just waiting on that now... no more appointments for a few weeks - yay!

So how is everyone else doing? What have I missed?

I think we're all getting a bit slack Miranda. I guess it's a sign of how mobile our babies are all getting!! :p

Glad you're doing okay and it sounds like Zeke is growing fast. Absolutely bizarre, but Freya seems to be developing at the same pace. She has the same two teeth, which I think started to come through in Jan. Last Sunday morning she decided that she now knew how to commando crawl (frogs-legs!) and get into a sitting position on her own, which means that this past week we've had the aaargggghhh mummmmeeeeeeeee! I was alsleep but somehow I'm now sitting up, heeeeeeeelppppp! screams at odd times of the night. Thankfully she's starting to work that one out fairly quickly, because the rolling over problem took weeks!

Also, a couple of days after the commando crawling started, Freyja suddenly realised she would get around even faster if she instead crawled on one knee and used her other foot to push herself along. We can't get her to put that other knee down.

Freyja also started to pull herself right up onto furniture, whereas before when she tried she never quite got it. It means we've had quite a lot of head bumps with her trying it in unsuitable places or falling over and hitting her head on the floor, but it doesn't seem to put her off any. She's also started to stand in her cot and of course gets stuck and needs rescuing, so we're trying to teach her to sit down again, but will she bend those knees? She has also started to try and get into a standing position herself, but generally falls over. It's quite cool though!

Like Zeke, she has also started to walk of her own accord when holding your hand, which means lots of excitement as she walks between mummy and daddy. She has once tried cruising along a sofa, but only got a couple of steps in before the inevitable fall.

Still no proper words, other than knowing to say hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii when she first sees one of us after a sleep or whatever. She does go mum mum mum mummmeeeeeee, but it's just part of her everyday babbling. Very resistant to the whole dadadadada thing though unfortunately.

Leesha - the crawling backwards thing is pretty funny huh? Freyja commando crawled backwards for weeks before she worked it out. She would roll around the floor, pivot herself to the direction she wanted to go in and then try to commando crawl towards an object, only to find herself further away and then she'd get frustrated and started yelling. OKay, so perhaps not so funny for her!

Anyway, gotta go and make up her day's bottles before she wakes from her nap and demands lunch :D

Take care all!

Zeke does the knee-locking thing too... tickling their ribs sometimes works... but they tend to all out collapse rather than do a controlled sit. :D

Some babies never crawl properly at all. Out of my 2 brothers and I, only one of us crawled properly, and even he preferred the commando crawl most of the time.

Oh, and backwards crawling is only amusing when you're watching them. I can't imagine how frustrating it must be for the babies.

Zeke is currently destroying an empty wipes packet, he loves the crinkly noise. He has all these wonderful toys, and yet his favourite things to play with are newspapers, plastic bowls, an empty formula tin and my keys... save your money give them a newspaper!

Good to hear Frejya is doing so well... this mobility thing is both a blessing and a curse!

Hi everyone,

Wow - it's really interesting hearing what everyone's up to! Gracie seems to be about the same. She's been commando crawling since early Jan and is only just now using her knees. But it never lasts long and she's back to the commando thing. She's pretty quick though! The things I've caught her doing :-) Yesterday it was concrete pebbles in the mouth (whoops...mum wasn't watching too hard). Anyway, now she's babbling quite a lot. 'Mumma' 'Dadda' 'Nannan' and more recently 'Dakar' - whatever that means!

Feeding has been interesting lately. I've been expressing 3 out of 4 feeds because my let-down is slow and she's refusing to go on. I'm still sneaking in the 7am(ish) feed though. Annoying but I'm persisting because I know its good stuff for her. Since giving her the bottle, I've been able to track her intake. I reckon she'd only be taking 500mls in 24hrs, sometimes less. This doesn't seem like much to me. What are your LOs taking?

Solids have been interesting too. She's almost flat-out refusing vegies/protein. She has a definite sweet tooth! I always offer vegies first but no luck! Anyway, persisting with this.

How is everyone's sleeping going? Gracie's had a cold and her sleeps have been really hit and miss. Days are worse funnily enough. Nights have been sometimes bad but at the moment, her days seem to be more short sleeps which means one grumpy little sick girl :-( I've tried a humidifier, Tixylix and Panadol but there's really no cure for the common cold is there!?

Great to hear from everyone! Happy sleeping…

Helllloooo :)

Freyja has now cracked the sitting down thing Miranda. She has spent a lot of time practising in her cot, where she likes to bounce up and down on the mattress, and the past couple of days she was managing to get up and down on the sofa etc. Still no repeat of the first cruising incident though and also still doing the combination of a very fast, frog-leap like commando crawl and the weird one knee and a foot version. The cats are getting chased everywhere!

I know what you both mean about the preference for non-toy playthings and for getting into stuff you don't want her too. Freyja is still addicted to anything dangly, so electric cables attract her back over and over again. She also likes to open drawers (only 2 incidents of pulling them all the way out onto herself so far), doors (several running over of her own toes and shut her entire body in the door today.. :S ) and remove every book and magazine from the shelves and leave them scattered everywhere. Must take after her dad! ;)

Still saying mum, mummy, da, dad, daddy, hi, bye and now Ton (as in Tonka our male cat). So far Tonka and Hi are the only ones we can be sure she actually means as mum and dad are interchangeable.

Amy - 500mls is on the lowside, but some babies only take around 100mls four times a day at this stage. I only recently found out that the milk intake reduces as the food intake increases, because I was convinced Freyja wasn't getting enough. She's now on only 3 bottles a day and will take anywhere between 100-250mls depending on how hungry she feels.

Don't worry too much as Grace would soon let you know if she was hungry. :D

Oh, and our sleep is pretty shot again. Seems to have been a bit hit n miss for a while, but I know it's because she at the point where there's two development points close together, so I think the grumpy periods have merged!! :rolleyes:

Hi all,

Can I but in and join??

My name is Mich, and it took me forever to find this thread!!

I'm married from vic with 2 kids, DS born 4th September 06 and DD born 11 June 08.

I don't get on much, but thought it'd be nice to chat to other mums with bubs similar ages.

Welcome Mich! The more the merrier. Looking forward to sharing with you :-)

Welcome Mich!!!!:welcome:

Our bubba's share the same birthday!!!!

Join in...the more the merrier!!!!

We now have 2 teeth and is crawling forwards...yay!! Is anyone else in here using cloth nappies atm?
I need someone to give me an idea on which night nappy to buy!! Too many out there!!
Got a good supply of different brand day nappies but need a good night one as Taj is sleeping through the night (12 hours) without being changed and is a heavy wetter!!!:rolleyes:

Thanks Amyhunz. You have such a cutie in your pic!

Hi Leesha, love the name Taj! He is such a little cutie! Love the hat!

11th June, Great date isn't it! I was 3 days overdue, was due on the 8th. But DD had other plans, fashionably late! lol

My DD has 2 teeth now too, they have only come through in the past few days, now she has her front bottom two and is drooling continually all over again and all that other jazz that goes with teething, so I think there will be more around soon!

She crawled at 7 months, follows her big brother around all day long! She now pulls herself up on furniture and well anything in sight, today shuffled her feet while I had hold of her hands to get to her Nana, was adorable. We don't think it will be long until she takes some steps!

I have not written about her before, so trying to think of the things she does to say in here...

she can say mum, dad, bub bub, tay (almost her brothers name - tate) nana, ta,

I don't know what else to write...

Oh, I use disposable nappies, so can't help you there, but a lady I know loves bum genius in mcn if that helps?? She swears by them, but don't know about night time.

I love the aldi dispoable nappies, they work much better than huggies for us. DS was always in huggies until about 18months old, then i discovered Aldi! Saves us a small fortune!

:wall:Ok I'm just not sure what's going on?

Taj loves food, have had no problems until about a month ago when he went off everything and just wasn't interested.....a few weeks later there was the 2 bottom teeth...so I put it down to teething issues!!!

Now the last two days he just does not want anything I offer him.....even using the BLS he just chews on a few things for a few minutes then cracks it BIG time....i thought maybe he doesn't want to be fed by me so I tried just laying food on his tray and he can feed himself but he is just not interested..........He has done about 4 RUNNY poos today and has developed nappy rash which he has never had before.....Is this teething again do you think???

He started crawling forwards on tuesday and is into everything.....so is it another development point?:doh:

I'm just at my wits end as he is so grumpy and not interested in food (bottles are fine) and the nappy rash just looks really uncomfortable!! I have put on some Bepanthen and a disposable nappy to try and help him feel more comfortable!!!:rolleyes:

Leesha, sounds like it might be another tooth coming through for Taj. Try to let him have some nappy-free time each day while he has the rash, as the air helps it heal better. Although, nappy off time is much harder to manage once they're mobile... you can't just pop them on a towel and expect them to stay there!

I never used cloth overnight, Zeke woke too often. I use Babylove disposables now, and they seem to go about 10 hours if they need to w/out leaking, but get VERY full. There's also a new brand called Sorbies, they apparently make specific nighttime only nappies... they're supposed to last 12 hours you may find them useful.

Welcome Mich! Sounds like your DD is charging along in the development milestones. Zeke is an active one too... he doesn't stay still till he's ready for bed! He makes a lot of different noises, but no confirmed words yet... I am still Dada sometimes and SO is can be Mama if the mood suits Zeke.

We put in an offer on a house today... we find out tomorrow. Just keeping my fingers crossed and trying not to stress too much until then!

hi everyone,

its been so long since ive been on!i havent had the net for the past month or two...
all the little ones are learning so fast its scary.
cammi has just learnt how to stand up by her self unsupported all she needs to do is start taking steps and she will be walking..
leesha-cammi has had her bottom teeth for bit over a month now and bout 4 days ago she had a fever had rosey cheeks and had the runs and nappy rash and her top tooth has just broke the skin thankfully she has been a nightmare but its the ones next to her front teeth that have srated to come throu she has had trouble sleeping the other day she was awake from 11am till 10pm she was awake a whole 11hrs,so hopefully taj's come throu soon cause cammi is much better now it has broke throu..
cammi says mum and dad but thats it for now..she loves to chase our cats around and pull on them lucky we have friendly cats.lol
well there is so much to write and catch up on but have to go cammi is wanting a sleep

p.s welcome mich its great to have more ppl join..

Nice to see you again Skye! I'm glad Cammi is settling down now that her teeth are through. Those few days just as the tooth is breaking the skin is miserable. Your poor baby hurts and cries, and there's not always heaps you can do.

I found the best trick (other than Bonjela) was cold banana in a mesh feeder. Zeke loves banana anyway and the cold really seemed to help soothe the pain.

Fortunately the teeth are here, and we are sleeping and eating almost normally again.

miranda-you feel so helpless im dreading the next one that comes throu.surprisingly cammi ate more in those 5days than normal she hasnt been a big eater she only had brekky and sometimes would eat her dinner now she is eating brekky lunch and dinner and eats it all...i hope the surgery goes well!!

i was just wondering how many times is everyone breastfeeding a day???cammi has bout 8 times in 24hrs sometimes more she likes to have it for comfort most the time and ive tried stopping them but she wont stop crying till i give it to her..sometimes she has days she will have it 6times but thats it..

Hi everyone,

Sounds like everyone is busy, busy!

Leesha - I've heard periods of food refusal is quite normal, especially in toddlers. As they become more willful it often occurs. But if you think it's medically (teething) related then hopefully it passes with the arrival of the impending (or should I say offending) tooth! Friends of mine have told me that their LOs refused for sometimes a few weeks and then just snapped out of it. One friend said feeding her LO from a metal spoon rather than plastic made a huge difference (who would have thought!). Glad to hear his bottles are fine. Hopefully he's making up for the food with milk. Anyway, maybe it's improved since you posted (??)

Skye - Gracie is down to 4 milk feeds in 24hrs. Occasionally 5 but rare these days. She has them roughly at 7am, 9.30am (sometimes - usually only a top up feed), 1pm, 4pm & 6.30pm. I've been BF the 7am feed but she's refusing all others from me so I'm expressing and also supp with formula. I don't know that there's any right or wrong, but I have read that by 6months(ish) babies can go up to 12hrs without a feed overnight. Gracie dropped her last nightfeed (the 10pm one) at about 6 months. But everybody's different so whatever you're comfortable with is perfect! I would hazard a guess that the only way you're probably going to help her reduce her feeds is to try and encourage full feeds when you want them, and then allow her to protest when you know she's just wanting a comfort feed. The older our LOs get, the more demanding they become!!!


Hope everyone else is going well. Miranda, I didn't realise Zeke was having surgery. All the best!!

Goodbye for now..

Wow.. Zeke refused to eat pretty much anything while his teeth hurt. It sounds like Cammi is doing great with the food though, I can't get Zeke to eat 3 meals a day, he'd rather snack every couple of hours, like me!

We're not BFing anymore... Zeke decided to self wean a few weeks ago. He was down to 3-4 per day just before he decided to stop though.

If it's a comfort thing, maybe you can try giving Cammi a small snuggly toy while she's nursing to stroke, and let her get used to that being there, she might associate that with comfort instead of the boob, and be content to stroke the toy instead. I've heard a few people say that's worked for them. Hopefully it might work for Cammi too.

The best 'snugglies' I've found are the ones made like face washers with a head and paws on them. We have a duck one and that's been Zeke's favourite toy since he was 3 months old. You can get them in really cute animals, or cartoon characters too, I know a couple of babies with Eeyore and Piglet ones!