At breaking point

[Santosha]

I just need to vent this I think. Not sure if there's any solution except for one foot in front of the other. I'm just utterly shattered. I have not slept for longer than 3 hrs straight (except one freakish 5 hours stint) for 5 months and it's usually more like 1.5 hrs. DS cat-naps through the day, fights almost all sleeps (but will occasionally, like once a fortnight, self-settle and sleep for 2 hours just to remind me that he can do it), won't go to sleep without a 3 hour battle every evening and then wakes 4 - 10 times over night before getting up at 6.

I did get a great deal of solace from my recent thread about cat-napping (so huuuge thanks again to those who replied), and since I have let go of trying to make him nap longer, I have felt slightly saner. But the sheer exhaustion and lack of down-time is breaking me. I am snappy and impatient with DD. She is such a beautiful little soul, and as 2.5 yr olds go, incredibly cooperative and calm. But like most, she can dawdle and defy... and instead of doing what I know is best for her... instead of having the energy and patience to distract, humour, explain, play our way through the hard bits, I have lost my temper with her. Three times in three days I have ended up in a terrible state myself because instead of diffusing a situation, I have escalated it and it's ended with her screaming and crying, and me just crying along with her.

She said to me today... "I make you very sad Mummy?" and I felt sick to my stomach. I tried to explain to her that I'm really really tired and we all get a bit cranky and sad when we're tired. That it's not her. But she sees the worst of my 'crankiness' in response to her behaviour and cannot help but fill in the blanks and surmise that it's her that makes me so angry and sad.

We barely get any time just the two of us as I spend all day holding / entertaining / feeding an increasingly tired DS. She's desperate for a play mate and even when DS is briefly asleep, it's all I can do to read a story. I just don't have dancing and cooking and imaginative adventures in me. I don't have the good humour to have silly glasses put on me and I'm not much into pretending to be a dog.

But I was. I was a fun Mummy. I was patient. I was creative. We went places together and had the most amazing conversations. I don't resent DS. I wouldn't be without him, obviously. But I'm so sad that his arrival has shifted DD's world, and my relationship with her so massively and I want so desperately to be 'that' Mummy for her again.

My anxiety is escalating and I'm finding that I can't sleep even when I have the opportunity to as I'm surviving on adrenalin and it's impossible to switch off.

... AAAARRGGHH... and I FINALLY got DS to sleep 30 mins ago, and he's awake again.

ETA: and to the lovely BBer that visited me yesterday... yep, I know it probably didn't look this bad. And some days, some hours, it isn't. Especially when we have fun and understanding company. But today, well today is just F'ed.

[*TripleJ*]

i so know how u feel im up to 15 months and now they fight each other for my attention it did get better as DD as gotten older still not sleeping but im able to give DS more of my time and attention

[LuluHB]

Just wanted to give you big hugs. It is soooo hard trying to balance two at times, and I've been in your shoes of having my eldest reduce me to tears with her utter honesty at my moods.

I didn't see your thread re napping so don't know if you've answered this, but can you sleep a night or two with your DS so that you at least don't have to get up for him when he wakes?

All I can offer is that it does get better as they get older (and I know you can't see it now but it does seem to happen all too quickly), and you'll get some time back one on one with your gorgeous girl - and you'll even have the energy to enjoy it. I'll now go off and ponder my decision to have a 3rd baby and be looking at walking this road again

[Santosha]

Thanks ladies. Oh J... 15 months?? I may have to hire a body-double if we are to survive this way for that long. This body is about to collapse.

Lulu: Yup, we co-sleep. It's the only way to manage the frequent wakings and get any sleep at all. DH is on the couch as he snores and I can't have the two of them keeping me awake so at least me and the little menace have the whole big bed to ourselves. I live in hope of that 'better when he gets older' and at the very same time, I don't want to wish this time away. Except for the whole anti-sleep thing, he is the most utterly adorable little guy. And probably my last baby. I just want to enjoy it.

Appletree: 5 YEARS?????? How are you coherent in any way?! Can't sleep in as DH leaves for work at 5am and seems to feel that since he gets up so early through the week, he should get to sleep in on the weekends... as in sleep in 'till 7:30ish when DD gets up and leaps on him on the couch! But you're right... it has happened a couple of times - that I've had a good night or managed to grab a couple of extra hours through the day - and the world looks completely different. Manageable. ONCE, DS slept 5 hours straight over night and I felt positively 'high' on sleep the next day!

[RhiChiChi]

Does your DD sleep/rest during the day? Can you all sleep/rest togetherat least during the day? I feel for you hun, and I want to tell you it getsd better but I truly don't know. But know that your DD probably understands more then you know, you'll be amazed in 6 months time that she will bring up why you are cranky, she'll remember it is b/c you are tired not b/c of her.

[*TripleJ*]

you get used to it i know not helpful jazzy is a horrible teether so thats even more unhelpful

[MummyNaomi]

I've had these moments and I currently only have one, I'm sure when this baby arrives I will understand more, but I wanted to give you a massive big supportive hug, make you a delicious coffee and sit down and let you vent and cry so you feel better for getting it all out.

Babe - it just sucks, it shouldn't be this hard, and remember that sleep deprivation IS actually a form of torture so don't beat yourself up for screaming and crying too - sometimes a good old fashioned Adult Tanty is needed (and is somewhat theraputic). My heart breaks for you as you are obviously shattered that DD has felt she's made you sad, and verbalised this to you, she is a very intuitive and clever little lady, and I very much doubt she would judge you as harshly as you might judge yourself.

You WILL be a fun Mummy again, I've heard you say it to me in my own ranting posts "This too shall pass" and it will, it sounds like you are going through a particularly tough patch just at the moment, but soon enough it will get a little easier, then a lot easier ......

In the meantime, hang in there, remind your little Miss how much her Mummy loves and adores her and maybe organise a Mummy and Daughter Date - if only for an hour, I bet it would mean the world to both of you and give you some of your Mummy Zing back (you still have it, its just hidden under complete exhaustion!)

Much love you to and try not to beat yourself up and add to your anxiety. Remind yourself that you are NOT superhuman, you are a Mum of two little people who leave you very little time for yourself, so you need to be kind to yourself cos frankly we both know you are awesome!!

Nay
xx

[Babyluv]

Hugs to you Santosha,
You're doing an amazing job. Is there anyone who can take bub off your hands once a week while you and your DD go out and spend some one on one time together? I've got no advice hun, thinking of you and hope it improves soon.

[appletree]

Sending you some rest and relaxation vibes Santosha. My children have never slept, and DD is now almost 5, so i feel your pain immensely- i know that point you are at cos i have been there on numerous occasions. Is there any way you can get some time to yourself, even just a couple of hours sleep in in the morning? Sleep will really help you, its the starting point for everything to move uphill!

[jackrose]

You need more support. Not negotiable.

I was in exactly your situation this time last year with a 3 year old and an 8 month old and had been having grabs of sleep 2 hour stretches at a time with both of them tag teaming the waking up during the night. I was hating the mother I was becoming but felt utterly powerless to do anything, shattered is a great way to describe it. My DH was terrible, offered no support and left me too it. Unfortunately it got much worse before it got better and I am still mortified about how bad I was with my children.

Sometimes when you are so tired it is not only hard to be the mother you want to be but you are unable to organise anything that will help you solve the sleeplessness so you end in a viscous cycle. It is really difficult to do this on your own and you really need help from your DH and other support services. It does take a village to raise a child and it is during these early years that we really need that village. You deserve help as a mother of little ones so you can be free to be the mum you want to be.

Start with sleep.

Is there any way you can get some time to yourself, even just a couple of hours sleep in in the morning? Sleep will really help you, its the starting point for everything to move uphill!

This is so true!
Others have suggested great things like alternating with your DH some sleep in days. Remind you DH that this will only be the situation for a limited time, then you can go back to 'normal' You both just have to get through this challenging time with your sanity intact and supporting one another. Otherwise, (and also?) Is there anyone else you can call on to mind the kids for a few hours regularly so you can nap? It is so important to get some sleep somewhere.

ETA: just read your reply which I missed as I typed this post while attending to DD2! Great to see you have help from others. For the short term, I's say, let the cleaning and housework go and just sleep. You should have seen my house at my worst time! It just has to wait as you need the catch up. As for listening out for DS, it is hard, I know. Just keep in mind how much more of an awesome mother you will be once you have grabbed some sleep!

I ended up at Tweedle for a day stay to work on DDs sleep and ended up using the time to sleep myself! It did help DDs sleep a bit but the best thing it did was open up some pathways to get help for my emotional state and parenting. It was pointed out to me that after the initial post natal period, the biggest risk factor for developing PND is around the 8 month mark when a parent has been struggling with sleep. Once I heard this, I looked up the symptoms and realised I was defiantly on the scale. From there I chased down support from my MCH, my GP for some psychology sessions and my Chinese Doctor for some general help. It was lifesaving to say the least and it took me a few months to claw back some sense of my old self.

My heart goes out to you as I remember all to well how bad that time was and how soul destroying it was to be so tired and and how heartbreaking it was to be such a crap parent. Good thing is, I did get through it, my DD1 doesn't seem to be completely scarred by the experience and It does keep getting better now. What I learnt (should I ever go through this again) is to get help in place early and prioritise myself a bit more so that I can be there for everyone else.

[wysiwyg]

Someone else mentioned playgroup, and I have to say I love ours (sad is not on in Jan - only term time) - is a structured one - so has a paid leader (find through playgroup Victoria website) and have found it brilliant with two of them. DD loves it, there are craft tables set up (so you don't have to think of the craft activity or clean up) and then lots of play equipment from 9:30 till 11:00, then they all sit and have morning tea (mums natter) and then have stories on the mat followed by outside play till 12:00. Generally we get there at 9:30 and I feed DS while sat at craft table with DD doing craft (always other mums around to help pass things etc to DD) - then I put DS in his pushchair and he watches kids play or sleeps (sometimes I rock the pushchair all depends if I think he will sleep or not) - while DD plays. Because is all different ages (as opposed to mothers group) is great, DD has made a little friend a year older and they play happily with minimal interaction from me (so I can zone out or attend to DS or chat). I get DS out of pushchair for story and songs as he loves that and DD loves singing with him, and then he is back in it for outside time (until he can sit up more on his own and then can go in sandpit). Alot of the mums have older kids at kinder or have two there or are expecting - which gives it quite a different vibe from Mothers Group. I started going because I wanted something I could go to with both of them with minimal effort and has lived up to my expectations. Normally you can go to one as a free trial (it isn't expensive really, you pay a Playgroup Vic annual subscription and then per term (under 1 don't pay) works out about $9 a session maybe) - so might be worth looking into - your DD would love it if there are slightly older girls around.

Oh audiobooks I find help DS sleep in day - when DD goes for her nap (if she is cooperating) I lie down and feed DS on our bed and listen to an audiobook or The Archers (radio soap) on the IPhone, I often drift off and DS nearly always does (regardless of when had last sleep) - sometimes his sleep is still quite short but it does refresh me a bit. I think it helps me relax as I don't think about all the other things can be doing and see it as sort of 'me' time as well, and because I am relaxed so is he (and do pick things with soothing voices too).

Also I don't know if you have read the P.E.T (Parent Effectiveness Training) book, but I am dipping in and out of that at the moment and there is alot of stuff in there (not about getting more sleep) about how is fine to have different levels of acceptance of behaviors e.g. certain behavior you may be less accepting of when you are tired, and about how communicate about being tired to your child in a way so they understand and don't feel your crankiness is a reflection on them (Basically using 'I' statements to explain). Anyway it made me feel alot better about not being the 'perfect, fun parent'.

[onthefly]

Re carriers, you could give the ergo a go on your back if he's holding his head up and more or less sitting now. otherwise no, not enough support yet. To be honest, I didn't find the ergo all that good as a back carrier (very comfy for me on the front). Different things suit different people of course. If you can get your hands on a mei tai, or some other carrier with a longer body (and thus better neck/head support) you could easily carry him on your back at this age. I LOVE back carries. So much more convenient. Ideally you want something that carries high, so he can see over your shoulder - mei tais are good for that. (and look on youtube for instructions if you're not sure about getting him up there)

I think you should have a serious talk with your DH about CPAP. If he had it he'd actually get decent sleep and not be tired all the time.... it's made a huge difference for my DH and he only has quite mild apnoea. Perhaps there's someone else that could talk to him about it who he might respond to better?

[Mrs P]

Awwwww hun sending you huge hugs here. I am sure you are doing your absolute best, don't beat yourself up over this.

[possum magic]

I've been in your position- baby number 2 is 5 mths- and it's really hard. You don't have to suffer thru it without help. Not sure where u live but ask your maternal and child health nurse about help with training baby to sleep. Sometimes the council has someone who'll come to your home 4 free and givr u tips. Or you can stay at an Early Parenting Centre 4 free for 3 -4 days to learn sleep strategies. Eg Melbourne has place called Tweddle. I've used some of these strategies and have friends who have been to 'sleep school' and it's helped a lot. And strategies can b made to fit your parentimg style/ what u feel comfy doing. GL Santosha

Sent from my LG-P500 using Tapatalk

[Ginger]

have you got a good double pram? will ds sleep in the pram out on a walk? i used to put them both in the pram and walk around until ds2 fell asleep and then stop at the playground and get ds1 out and spend some one on one time with him while ds2 slept in the pram under a tree.
i also joined a playgroup so that i could basically sit and breastfeed ds2 and try to settle him while ds1 safely played with some other toddlers and i knew he was safe i.e.. locked in!!
it will get heaps easier, i promise. one day you'll be sitting here on bb like me while the two of them play with each other and you'll think its the best thing ever!

[wysiwyg]

I really don't know how you do it, I feel shattered and I don't have the night wakings - your children are adorable though, and your DD is a smart cookie she will understand more than you think about your explanation. I like to tell myself when I don't do things the way I would like ideally because of tiredness etc is that at least it is 'real' the world is not always perfect people are tired and it is good to be able to understand that. This will pass I am sure and hopefully when DD starts back at childcare you can use that time to rest a little. If you are my way and you want me to sit with DS for a bit, or entertain DD (lots of great parks round here as you know) while you rest or do anything am more than happy to do that, DD would love it and I find that these days is often easier with two toddlers for short periods than one as they entertain each other a bit and there is less of the 'pretending to be a dog' by me required.

Big Hugs

[Kazbah]

I do feel for you. What my DH and I do is the working person gets to sleep without interruption on the nights before they go to work. So Sun - Thursday nights, I get a full night's sleep. DH gets up to any wakenings and I get to be fresh for work. On the nights where I don't work the next day, I get up, so Friday / Saturday nights. When I was at home and DH worked, the same thing. It's the only thing that keeps us sane, and that helps us be better parents.

Can you do any sleep-overs anywhere? EG older nieces / nephews who'd "love" the "adventure" of looking after baby?

[forshelby]

Huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge

I only have the one baby (for now..... *evil laugh*) but DS is and always has been extremely challenging in the sleep department. He, like your DS, still fights every single sleep. It's quite an ordeal. I find myself getting anxious when naptime is approaching because I know what comes next.

I don't have any great advice, although I wish I did. I'm still just riding it out. All I can say is don't beat yourself up too much. You're doing the best you can, on almost no sleep. Sleep deprivation changes us into crying, yelling, crying some more mummies. It's hard. It's ok to feel exhausted.

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