Just seen this Kate.
How is he doing during the day now?
A is not sleeping well either and the day times are more of a worry for me... Yesterday she had only 12 hours for the whole day and night, 1 x 45 min sleep and the rest were naps either when feeding 5-10 min blocks or tiny sleeps after feeds, only to be woken by MJ each time
I remember that sleep creates sleep and the lack of sleep during the day is making worse the night times...
I'm not keen for a sleep school, but I am not sure what to do about the days.
We went to the QEC (though not an overnight stay) when DD was 6 months old. It was fantastic and we have never looked back She has been a perfect sleeper ever since
BellyBelly Life Member - Love all your MCN friends
Jun 2004
The Festival State
3,008
I used Sleep School when my child was 19 months old. The sleep school was part of a public hospital system. No-one told me before i got there, and no-one expressed told me once i was there, but all the sleep school seemed to do (i saw them do it to every other mother there) was
- put every mother on meds immed
- enforce/bully every mother into using CIO, but called it Controlled Comforting (same result).
- bullied women into weaning, as their hospital policy said weaning happened at 3 months (!!!!). and no, none of the midwives had ever heard of the WHO recc. of "feed until two and beyond".
My child was very traumatised by the two days of enforced weaning they put us through. Her screaming for milk and me bullied into not feeding her. That was heartbreaking.
i had a toddler, in an environment that was not babyproofed, there were no baby gates, and plenty of things she could reach, get into that weren't safe. I had complained about a halogen lamp, on a 2ft high desk, not being safe around walking babies. A day later, she touched it and burnt herself. Pretty light, attractive to a toddler, at her height, of course she's going to touch it one day. The midwives thought i was overreacting and refused to move the lamp, or install a babygate. So many things like this happened. Often when i was told i had to go to a group, and we'll look after your baby. I would come back, and no-one would know where she was. the rabbit warren layout of the place meant you could not see the entire place at one glance, i found it so stressful.
After the two weeks was up, it took a long time for my DD to get over the trauma of being in the sleep school.
The midwives were there 24/7, (on different shifts), so no matter what time of day or night it was, i was consistently harassed about my parenting, as my style of parenting was (and is) Attachment Parenting. They didn't recognise that as such, but all the ways i was parenting my child, i was told, were wrong and had to be changed immed. There was no discussion about this, more of a front of "do it our way or else". I really expected there to be a collaboration of "so your baby won't sleep, here are a range of ways to tackle that" but no.
I was bullied to put my child in a nursery at night, where allegedly, the midwives in their office, would monitor her cries, with the baby monitors. After a few nights, i discovered, the VOLUME of the baby monitors was more often than not, turned down to zero. So no-one was actually monitoring her. I was put in a room more than 50metres away from my child, i couldn't hear her.
During our two week stay, my child was experiencing "teething acid poos". They had happened to her before, so i knew what to do, and i was actively stopped from attending to her. So she got burn marks on her bottom, from sitting in the poo too long. Screaming her head off, me outside her door, being stared down by two midwives, who yelled at me when i went against their orders, and went in there to change her, rescue her from the acid poo. Even when i showed them her skin, they still thought i was wrong to have gone in there. According to them, i was stopping the program working, and wasn't co-operating, because i went in there, before 7am the next morning. I broke their routine.
There was zero acknowledgement that i did anything right as a mother, only condemnation of my parenting (using Attachment and Conscious Parenting). I look pretty conservative, but my bf-ing a 19month old, using cloth nappies, no dummy, co-sleeping, comfort sucking instead of Panadol when she fell over - all these things were written up on my file, discussed at meetings, as things they were working on to stop me doing. And the fact i didn't want to take meds (because it would affect my child thru the breastmilk), was another mark against me. I was in a daze, baffled by so much negativity, every day went by, i doubted myself and my parenting more and more.
But i met a women who took her baby to the sleep school (also run by same public hospy) for babies UNDER 12 months. She had a totally different experience. Her parenting style was respected. The staff collaborated with her, to come up with solutions. She was treated respectfully.
I would have loved to have had a similar experience, to her. My experience, felt like a nightmare i could not wake up out of. I kept thinking, it will get better tomorrow, i must give this a chance. But it didn't. I gave up at two weeks. Could not take anymore.
Jakabella
at the four month mark, in retrospect, i wish i had had a baby hammock (for put down sleeps) and a baby sling (for sleeping on me, hands free) to help with my child's sleeping.
have you tried "white noise" in the baby's room? (a radio, on low, not quite on a station)
bath before nap time?
swaddling for naps? (so baby can't biff themselves and wake themselves up)
(i don't know what you HAVE tried, so could be well suggesting things you already do/have done.)
If you have the night sleep sorted (young babies have tiny tums, so will wake for feeds), the suggestion to have a "day session" at a sleep school, sounds a good idea. I did a day session at a MCHN, their suggestions were the white noise, really tight swaddling, tight sheets in cot. I coudln't replicate it at home, as they had a really good practical cot (sides very easy to use), and mine was awkward for me to use, i think i roused my bub each time i tried to raise the sides, and being short, i coudln't just put in her over the sides.
if i had my time over, i would have bought a recliner for the baby's room, cos i spent so much time in there, if i had somewhere comfy to feed her and cuddle, maybe she would have slept on me, i would have slept and we BOTH would have gotten sleep. (i'm talking over one here. For the first year, we used bassinet next to my bed and co-sleeping, then cot in my room, then cot in her room, mixed with co-sleeping.
OMG Gigi, what you experienced was beyond horrendous! I am so sorry you and your DD went through that. Makes my experience look like a literal walk in the park on a sunny day.
Jakabella,
We went to a sleep school in Kooweerup just for a day visit. It was fairly gentle and more about teaching settling techniques than anything else. My dd has silent reflux and because she was held constantly as a newborn, even when she was sleeping because if we laid her down she would wake screaming in pain she struggled to fall asleep on her own in a cot. So we went to sleep school and they first took bubs into a dark room with soft music and did some settling. She went off to sleep with their techniques but only slept for 1/2hr and they had a raised cot so her reflux didn't worry her. We were basically taught however we settle her in our arms do the same in the cot, rock, pat, shhh etc and then gradually decrease it. I was happy with what they taught us but it didn't help her sleep. she could go to sleep but wouldn't stay asleep and wouldn't resettle once she had woken. She sleeps only one sleep cycle during the day even still now. It has pretty much just taken months of patience, consistency and gentle parenting to get her to the point she is at now. She is 7months old and will now put herself to sleep, if she wakes in the night she will usually put herself back to sleep if she's not hungry but she won't sleep longer than 1 sleep cycle during the day. I did the gradual process of slowly decreasing the patting, then would just sit with her with my hand on her chest gently rocking her in the cot. Now I put her in and she goes to sleep. I'm proud that we have never done cry it out, never has bedtime been a distressing time for her except for when she couldn't sleep because of the reflux.
Sorry that was of no help whatsoever because you want bub to sleep more during the day, I don't have any answers for that. And my daughter went through a period around 4 months where she woke hrly through the night, this lasted 6 weeks. Once we started solids she was alot better. She now sleeps through. All i can say is hang in there it will get better and no matter what don't let anyone convince you that you need to do something you're not comfortable doing, health professionals don't know your bub like you do.
Sorry I couldn't help but it will get better
Wow sounds like some awful experiences!
Mine was a good one. We went with Caden when he was just 11 weeks old and it saved our lives (literally I expect, we were both pretty depressed by then). DS#1 just screamed almost constantly when he was awake, and was murder to get to sleep. I suffered this from around 5 weeks, and it didn't stop until we went to sleep school. With doctors prescribing medications that I just wasn't comfortable with, I felt it was the best option.
It was a gentle approach, and maybe easier given that DS was just so unsettled that if he cried in bed versus crying in my arms, what difference? Given I was near exhaustion, and borderline PND, I was willing to take more of their advice.
So we put him in bed, and let him cry for a minute or so. Then I would go in and either pick him up or comfort him in his cot. If he got too out of control (you know that cry) then I would just pick him up. They taught me the difference between a pain cry and an insistent cry as DS would cry as if you were hacking off his arm, but would stop the instant I picked him up. Pain would not switch off so suddenly.
It wasn't easy, and was emotionally draining, but after day three, at home in his cot, he fell asleep by himself WITHOUT CRYING for the first time, and after that was a dream to put down. The kid just wanted space to sleep, and really needed me to back off and give that to him.
So for us the experience was a turning point, and even now DS is an awesome sleeper. I noticed other mums from my mothers group had difficulty later on because they had to go through the same thing with older bubs. It was hard to do it at the start, but easier in the long run.
Make up your own mind of course. I have recommended sleep school to lots of mums with problems. I even went back myself this time as I wanted some tips on letting DS#2 get to sleep. They were very considerate of my desire not to let him cry, and I pretty much did what I did at home, but with him in the cot instead of in my arms (music, rocking the cot, picking him up for a cuddle if things got too intense, etc). So far so good as even that has shown DS that it is ok to fall asleep in the car or pram. That on its own is great because he would shriek like a banshee in the car.
Ok, now I am rambling, but for my two cents, it was a great experience and I thank them for my sanity!
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She has been a perfect sleeper ever since 
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