would your stance on vaccination differ in a different society?

[Roryrory]

I am under the impression from my general reading on this topic that many non-vaccinating parents choose not to vaccinate against, say, measles, because the disease has largely been eliminated in our (Western) society. The same tends to be said for diptheria, polio or whooping cough.

Arguably, if this is the reason behind non-vaccination, the non-vaxer is reliying on "herd immunity" which may eventually be reduced if great enough members of the "herd" were to also stop vaccinating.

Bear in mind that I am aware that this does not apply to all vaccinations - for example we have no herd immunity from hepatits, and I know that many people have entirely different reasons for refusing the Hep-B vaccine. Likewise, vaccines like gardisill or swine flu fall under a different category of vaccine, IMO.

So my question (which is one which was posed to me a while ago by my science-nut DH) is this : If you have chosen to non-vaccinate for these reasons, would you do the same if you lived in a country where those diseases are not eliminated or greatly reduced? Or are you in effect knowingly taking advantage of the "herd immunity" when you decide to not vaccinate?

Mods, I am not starting this thread as an attack on non-vaccinators, I am geniunely interested in hearing thoughts on this.

[Heaven]

I would decide to vax under those circumstances, yes. For me it's about assessing risk. The risk of my DD catching polio in australia is basically zero so there's more chance of her being harmed by the vaccine than the disease. It would be the other way around if I lived somewhere where polio is common.

[LimeSlice]

I think the basic answer to your question for me is, based on indivdual immunisations.

For example, if we lived in India, Charlotte would, without a shadow of a doubt, have the polio vaccination.
If we lived in South East Asia, Charlotte would have had, almost without a doubt (I say this due to other risk factors for her given family history with getting the vaccine itself which still weigh heavily), have the Hep B vaccine.

I don't not vaccinate because I rely on "herd immunity" I don't vaccinate as I rely on HER immunity - from coming in contact with the illness (in spite of vaccinations) and developing her own NATURAL immunity to illnesses where it is possible for the body to create antibodies. Whilst I understand the concept of herd immunity, I cannot say I am a full believer in it as I deny that vaccinations cause blanket immunity. Generally, the largest proportion of the population to get an illness are the ones vaccinated against it. Many illnesses are in steep decline without vaccinations in Western countries (ie Whooping Cough) so the notion of herd immunity does not really apply.

I'm rambling! lol

Short answer, yes - it would change as and when the risk assessment changes.

[Lulu]

Herd immunity doesn't come into it for me.

[Trillian]

I think it's a bit iffy to suggest that non-vaxers rely on herd immunity, and I know you weren't meaning to be offensive or to get people offside, but I think that you would be very, very hard pressed to find anyone who is against vaccinations/doesn't vax that has made that decision based on herd immunity, so to suggest it in the first place is kinda pointless.

For us, I honestly don't know. Like someone else said, it is about risk assessment. If I lived in another country, even one where measles was still the 'norm' I would probably still not vaccinate for that, preferring instead that they got a natural immunity from having had it. That would be so long as my current situation was still the same - access to clean drinking water, food etc and overall general health was as great as it is now and the outcome from having it would be the same or similar if they were to contract it while in this country. Just to point out though that your hypothetical vaccinated child in a different country can still contract it as well, just as they can in this country. The only one I would do would be hep B.

[Lulu]

What Lime and Trill said. Has any of your reading material come from BB? I've never met anybody who non vaccs for herd immunity and I've never read it here.

There are about 8000 better reasons not to than that, did you come across any of them in your reading?