Alish - I really dislike expressing personally. I really hated doing it. It didn't help me feeling yuck and stressed - just another job to do ITMS. Expressing for an hour seems like such a lot of work for you.
If you want to feed 4 hourly, and you are finding it helps you feel more in control, then do that. My DS1 was jaundiced and i was told to feed him three hourly in the day and 4 hourly at night. That way i got a bit more normal sleep, and I felt more like he was getting enough. I started comp feeding when he was 6 weeks (due to unforseen admission to hospt for me). We managed slowly to wean him off the formula after about two weeks of slowly giving him less and less each feed. It was a relief for me, as i finally could stop with breast feeding THEN bottle feeding too, then expressing as well! It was like full time feeding, and i was a bit of a stressed out mess.
I'm not sure why your MCHN made you feel like crap. I didn't get on well with my first MCHN. You are allowed to change. You certainly wouldn't be the first! Or you could just look for advice elsewhere? If you felt you gelled with the nurse at the hospital, maybe they have a feeding clinic that helps mums too. My local hospital does.
alish - i don't think anyone was judging - just sharing our experiences my point was that if what you're doing is working for you, then feel confident & happy to continue with it. the other thing i was trying to say wasn't that you should wake your baby to feed, just that once some babies hit a few weeks old, it's almost like they become more alert & not as sleepy (that's why i called it 'waking up') & once they do, their feeding requirements may change. some babies stay the same.
but at the moment the most important thing is that your LO is happy & healthy. that means you must be doing just fine.
pz - na she isnt quiet but hungry - on the rare occasions she does squark its about half an hour or so before she is due for a feed so i know its not that. she squarks if she has wind too but i know the difference..
we didnt have an easy birth - she was stuck, i was cut open.. of course im emotional.
i find when someone tells me that 4 hourly feeds is too long and that im not feeding enough is judgement.
im a mother of a 11 day old ffs - i dont need that.
i just spoke to my nurse and she told me to change the feeds to 15 mins, so she just pretty much confirmed what dh and i discussed.
thankyou to everyone who said im doing a good job though, even if you dont agree with what im doing, it means alot, and i have taken your advice on board..
im just trying to figure out whats best for my baby girl.
my way of thinking is that if she is putting on a good amount of weight i must be doing the right thing and she put on 81grams at her last weigh in and i got told that was good so i must be doing something right..
My sisters boy fed four hourly from day dot and went 8 hrs overnight as well. She didn't enforce this routine it's what he seemed to 'demand'. It worked for her and she fed him until 12 mnths when she weaned. My DS was different and was fed much more often. There are all kinds of normal and I also found once I had a routine DS would change
If she is gaining weight and has plenty of wet and dirty nappies everything is going well. As others have said breastfeeding works on a supply and demand basis so if you want to stop the comp feeding the best way is to bf more/longer. Often it only takes a few days of extra feeding to boost supply. Please know expressing is not a good indication of supply because the pump isn't as effecient as a bub's suck.
Alish, I don't think anyone is judging, you asked for advice and people are just offering what they know from their experience and all babies and situations are different
If she is bright eyed, good output etc then I wouldn't wake her for feeds. Is she putting on weight? If she is then she must be feeding enough, if she isn't then you might want to try adding extra feeds.
Everything is so fluid when they are so little, you think you have a nice routine going and then they hit the next growth spurt/wonder week etc and everything changes again. You will probably find she will be more awake after the three week growth spurt that is coming up - don't be surprised if she is suddenly wanting to feed, feed, feed for a day or so, then she will sleep heaps for a day or two.
Alish - if a routine is for you then go for it. As I said earlier other mums I know life by their routine and not just for feeding. I'm glad you can discuss feeding with your DH and make decisions together.
I'm here for you if you need anything.
My head was all over the place in the early days with my first. The hormones, the uncertainty, the constant self doubt, it's all horrid. And for you to have had an emergency c-section on top of everything is very hard to deal with.
lilima - I reckon your post was a little out of line. When you are the mum of a newborn things that might not seem judgemental when written are taken as such. I know I forgot very quickly my state of mind when I brought my first bub home. It's all now very new to me again and I completely understand where Alish is at.
Sorry you are feeling judged. I think some people just find it hard to advocate going so long between feeds for a newborn because the majority of babies do require more frequent feeds (8-12 in a 24hr period) and it could be dangerous advice to suggest otherwise (especially as other new mums or mums to be could be reading also so it is important to point out the norm, I think) but of course, there are exceptions and only you know whether this applys to your DD. It is true that not all babies do wake for feeds, my DD was a sleepy baby who never really demanded feeds and the advice I was given was to not let her go longer than 2hrs during the day and 3hrs overnight, the recommendations seem to vary from hospital to hospital and health professional to health professional. We never comp fed though as that wasn't something I wanted to do so that might be why the above was suggested, she eventually did 'wake up' at about 2 weeks old (and hasn't slept since ).
It does sound like your DD is doing okay; she's gaining weight and having adequate output. If you don't want to move to demand feeding but would like to increase your supply (and remove the comp feeding aspect), you could also try a more 3hrly routine (even just during the day).
Alish, only you are there with your daughter and only you can know if she's doing ok.
Likewise, you are the one raising her, so only you have to be ok with what you're doing.
General advice about what is typically normal for newborns is not judgmental, it's just information for people's reference. It may or may not apply to you personally, only you can determine that.
From what I can read between the lines about what the nurse said, she has given you advice assuming you want to exclusively breast feed. And if that is what you want to do then I would say it is pretty reasonable advice. However you may not want to exclusively breast feed (which is totally OK) at which point her advice isn't really necessarily the right advice FOR YOU. She should have got a better feel for what you are doing and adjusted her advice based on that, not just given you the blanket statement for BFers.
It is really tricky because different babies work so differently and have such different preferences!
Personally I had a 'non routine baby' who if I tried to put onto a routine, it would have ended in war! If it came to a time where I thought it was time for a feed and tried to feed her she would just refuse to open her mouth, then 'demand' to be fed 1/2 an hour later when she was ready. However a lot of my friends had babies that either a) put themselves into a 4 hourly routine in the first few weeks, or b) were easy going enough that no matter what methods their parents used (routine or demand feeding) the baby was happy to go along with it and got what they needed out of it.
From what you are saying it sounds like your girl is one of the easy going ones who is happy to take the lead from you and fall into what ever pattern emerges. I say lucky you - there are days I would have begged for that! I say keep doing what you are doing, keep an eye on her mood, temperament, nappies, energy levels and weight gain and review your plan IF any of these aren't looking good.
One thing to keep in the back of your mind though is that babies do go through growth spurts and wonder weeks where they may just want to feed more than normal. So while she may be happy to go 4 hourly now, there may be a week here and there where she is looking for milk 1 or 2 or 3 hourly. But it's cool, you can adjust your plan at those times, just go with the flow for that week or try to come up with a new routine or something that works for the 2 of you. And then she will probably find her 4 hourly groove again and you can pick up where you left off. It is still early days yet so still lots of time to work out how to adjust to those peaks and troughs.
congratulations on the arrival of your little one!!!
I'm thrilled to hear she seems to be doing so well - and it sounds like you're checking all the right things, nappies, weight, etc.
My DS came out of the womb on a 4 hourly routine - he would wake to be fed around 3am, 7am, 11am, 3pm, 7pm and 11pm. He wasn't hungry between then, he didn't need any more feeding between then, he'd still do the right number of wet and pooey nappies, gained weight, slept beautifully, and was just a perfect healthy little thing.
Some babies are just like that! No issues.
As some others have said, your expressing is *awesome*!! 60ml is great, and (as you're probably already doing) you can start just supplementing her feeds after he's had boob with a bit of EBM.
Expressing is hard work (as you'll know) but it's great to keep your milk supply up, on top of your bf, and it's great to be able to give her your milk when she needs more food, rather than formula. If you can keep it up, then you're doing wonderfully.
At the start, I expressed a fair bit, after each feed. The midwives told me I could keep the milk out on the bench for 4 hours, in the fridge for 4 days, or in the freezer for 3 months. So I never had to throw any out - DS would always have it as a supplement sooner or later!
And DS never rejected the boob or the bottle, until he weaned around 10 months old - and I was working full time, with him being fed EBM for most of that time. He managed fine.
And if you have concerns about "nipple confusion" or whatever, you can feed her with a cup instead, if you like. I found it messier and unnecessary, but know others who found it much better for them and their babies - which is the important thing!
With the 10 minutes / 15 minutes / 20 minutes, the Lactation Consultant I saw said that DS would get 80-90% of his feed in the first 10 minutes, and so I didn't need to feed him for more than that ... but at the end of the day, he took 45 minutes to get his fill. Yes that's a really long time, and I would have to do all sorts of things to stop him from nodding off while feeding (so warm and comfy and comforting being nuzzled up in there, he'd just doze and feed and doze and feed!!) so I'd put him on, and progressively unwrap him, tickle his toes, blow on his face, change his nappy half way through, etc, until he'd finished feeding. That way, he didn't need a top up - and I could still express a little afterwards.
I watched a lot of telly in those first few weeks, until he got quicker with his feeds!!!
Some people aren't happy to do it that way, and would prefer to do 10-15 minutes (or 10-15 each side) and then top up with EBM or formula.
It depends on what works for you and for her.
If she gets frustrated at the boob, or stops feeding after a shorter space of time, or if after her birth etc you're too sore for extended feeding sessions, you just need to do what is best for the two of you ...
Just letting you know what worked for us, in case it's of any assistance.
But can I repeat: over all, it sounds like you're doing a really, really good job.
Get some sleep, and some chocolate, and give yourself a pat on the back.
Last edited by peanutter; September 21st, 2011 at 12:27 PM.
: correcting ...
i feel abit better now, i had to put the computer down and walk away for a while .. lol..
the last 2 feeds i fed her for 15 mins each side, made a formula bottle and she spat it out. i dont actually think she drank any. i then expressed and had hardly anything left in my boobs, so at least i know she drained them.
she hasnt woken up hungry either - still getting woken up at feeding time so again, at least i know shes not hungry.
i am doing the right thing for my daughter, i need to believe in myself a bit more.
Alish. You are doing the right thing for your DD. You are doing a great job!
That's great about your last feed. Sounds like your body and your baby are doing really well.
I think the expressing at the end of a feed is not always necessarily about EBM, but the more you express, the more milk you will make as it is a supply/demand thing. I mean not actually expressing any milk but the action of it stimulates your body to think it needs to make more.
The whole thing can be so confusing in the early days. You are doing really well and arming yourself with information is a great thing too. At least if things change, you will know what to look for and it might save a whole heap of stress down the track too. It took me three babies to work out the whole feeding thing and feel comfortable with what I was doing.
Good luck with everything. I hope things continue to go really smoothly for you
Alish your last comment was awesome.. You DO need to believe in yourself more!! You are doing a FANTASTIC job and the fact you posted this threas shows that you just want the best for your bubba!
And YAY! She drained your boobs and didnt need the formula, that is awesome work!! I struggled SO much in the first month because i was getting so much conflicting advice that no matter what i did it always was wrong to someone. So i just ignored it all and followed my heart and my baby. If she is hungry she will let you know, if she is full she will let you know... Just keep doing what you are doing because it sounds like she is getting exactly what she needs.
And i will say it again. You are doing a fabulous job. Having a newborn is NOT easy!! Big hugs!!!!!
Sent from my iPhone so sorry for the spelling and punctuation!!
i wish my DD would go 4 hours between feeds especially at that age lol if it works for u do it
i found it easier not to have a routine because ds already had his routine and i found it hard to fit a routine around him and i was lost because i only had a FF baby who was on a routine big change to a fully BFed baby who feeds whenever she feels like it lol
Alish, that is so awesome! YOU ARE doing an AWESOME job being Miss H's mummy! And yes, too right you need to back yourself - you know what Miss H needs, you are her mum after all! xx
Reply With Quotemy point was that if what you're doing is working for you, then feel confident & happy to continue with it. the other thing i was trying to say wasn't that you should wake your baby to feed, just that once some babies hit a few weeks old, it's almost like they become more alert & not as sleepy (that's why i called it 'waking up') & once they do, their feeding requirements may change. some babies stay the same.
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