My first little girl had her weigh in today and she had lost 11% of her birthweight which makes it a medical issue as it is more than the accepted 10%. My milk has not fully come in yet- I think I'm transitioning as it looks like creamy milk, not colostrum but there is not much of it! I'm still in hospy and on a breastfeed/express/top up baby with EBM routine every three hours unless she demands earlier.
On top of that I have a little screamer on my hands who HATES having her swaddled removed which makes BF and attachment hard as she gets so distressed she seems to hate being tilted horizontally and screams blue murder and will not calm down enough so safely attach to my breast (I have developed a couple of blisters and my nipples are sore). I think I've sorted the issue with attachment but when she is that distressed I find myself just desperate to get the nipple in while I compete with her trying to put her hands in her mouth and writhing around. So I don't always attach her correctly.
I have been feeding her swaddled to avoid this drama but she tends to fall asleep like this and stops sucking less than 10 mins in....
Anyway not sure what I'm asking. It is day three blues so I'm a bit down but advice welcomed
Congratulations on your new little girl!
My DS3 had some neck and upper back issues. I had sore bleeding nipples, but worse on one side. It was hurting him to stay in one position to feed so the attachment wasn't quite right. We took him to see a good chiro and after 2 visits he was all good no more sore nipples!
Hope you get it sorted soon. Maybe you could ask the nurses if it's possible your DD is a little sore somewhere which is why she doesn't like being tilted horizontally. They might be able to get her checked out while you're in there.
Hopefully someone else posts with more insight than me
I'd be asking for help too. But ask if they can get a lactation consultant in for you.
You could try feeding her while sitting up, or standing with her head up & feet down. Have her as upright as possible. Maybe even the football hold would help.
Congratulations on the birth of your baby! And congratulations on starting your bfing journey. I would start the bf with her swaddled to keep her relaxed. Once she's on and has a few sucks, remove her and reattach if it's not right. Then to keep her awake and feeding you could slowly unswaddle her or change her nappy midway through the feed. I would absolutely ask to see a lactation consultant. Most imPortantly feed feed feed and that will make more milk. Hang in there, you are both learning and the initial start up time is the hardest in my opinion.
11% weight loss is just one feed or one less wee from being the required 10%- not a big problem at all.
It is also quite normal for your milk not to be in fully yet, day 3 - 5 is quite common.
Little baby hands can be painful getting in the way! If it helps to get bub started with her wrapped, just do it! After the initial frenzy, you can loosen the wrap off again.
If bub doesn't like being horizontal, you can sit her in front of you and let her attach sitting up.
Congratulations on your baby!
There's lots for the both of you to learn right now, and it takes time to get the hang of being a mum. You'll get there in time and with a bit of help! Do you have access to an LC there (not just a regular midwife)? 11% is sooooo close.. It's a really arbitrary figure. Of course we need to be careful with little ones and ensure they're growing well, but 1% over the recommended amount is not cause for immediate panic! Is she pooing? That's often the best way of telling whether she's getting enough milk. If your milk is on its way in, then all may sort itself out very soon.
She will also need some time to get used to being on the outside. If she wakes to feed and is done in 10 minutes, that may be all the time she needs. Try and follow her lead, unless there's some other medical concern or she's particularly sleepy and not waking to feed often enough - 8-12 times in 24 hours would be a good minimum goal.
Feed her as soon as she wakes or shows hunger signs - so mouthing, bobbing, moving her head around (kind of like those old clowns at the fair whose mouths you had to put balls down). By the time they're crying and worked up it can be much harder to get them on.
You might also like to try baby led attachment. You'll find a lot of useful information HERE. Remember the ABA helpline is also available 24 hours a day if you have any questions or need help 1800-686-2-686
I also concur about getting a chiro to come adjust baby. One of my gf's had a bubby who screamed lots as a BB and when she got an adjustment at 5 weeks he suddenly stopped and slept for 8hrs straight. I got a chiro I had been visiting for awhile to come to my home when dd was 2 days old and get her adjusted. Good luck love.
I would try feeding her with either a football hold or while you're both lying in bed - she may feel more secure with a big flat surface under her. When she's latched on nicely and happily feeding you can quietly and slowly start unswaddling her so she gets used to it. Once you both get the hang of it you'll probably find you can switch around her feeding position to whatever suits you both best.
Your hospital has (or at least had) a fantastic LC. I know the midwives on the ward there tend to just duck in and out without really giving too much unless you ask for help, so maybe ask for them to arrange for the LC to come and see you. I'd also raise it with her paed in case she does have any underlying issues that you need to see a chiro for.
Hang in there. She is so tiny and with so much to learn. You'll both get there.
BellyBelly Life Member - Love all your MCN friends
Jun 2004
The Festival State
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three days in, the perfect time for LOTS of questions.
establishing bf-ing takes time, as you're finding out, don't feel shy to ask questions.
bfing issues are very time sensitive, when you need help, you need it immed.
i found joining the ABA very helpful.
- you have access to groups local to you, to visit with your bub
- if you're not well enough to go there, or live remotely, you can still have their magnets on your fridge, read their bimonthly magazine called ESSENCE
- and i loved having the ABA calendar on my kitchen wall, it was my daily inspiration to keep going.
ring the helpline 1800 686 2 686
scour the aba website, post an email question if you prefer
contact a private lactation consultant
contact your local aba group
i found asking each midwife, on each shift, in hospy, very confusing - they all suggested different things. I needed consistency.
Post your questions, even if you don't think they make sense - other mums who have been, where you are right now, will not judge your lack of coherence, they will just understand and try to help.
1% over - really, i think whoever told you that is a concern, is putting the wind up you. Are their charts about bf babies or ff babies?
If baby has an even skin tone, alert eyes, having a good number of wet and poo nappies per day - that tells you if all if well or not, not a 1%.
i got so much mis-information IN hospital, and from gp's, mchn's OUT of hospital, etc (all people who i felt certain would know about bf-ing). It was such a relief to get clear info from the ABA, their consultants and counsellors actually get bf-ing training - unlike many medicos.
breastfeeding does have some challenges - i found anti-bfing people, their first port of call is, "oh, you have a problem, better put them on formula". Whereas pro-bf-ing people, their first port of call is usually information. Do you know this is quite common? And here are some solutions for you to choose from.
i got so much anecdotal "well my cousin/lady down the street/the neighbour over the road's child did x" type stuff from medical people (which shocked me, until i found out they don't get taught about bf-ing in medical degrees).
The aba groups (in real life) and the aba magazine (where you can read the stories), are full of "X happened to us, this is what we tried, this is what worked" - so you realise other people go thru the same thing, and there ARE things to try.
best of luck, you need help NOW, don't wait til it gets really bad. Google lactation consultants and your city (one idea).
about the little hands that she puts in her mouth - my nb scratched herself and bopped herself in the head alot, slightly diff, but i put tiny socks on her for that.
a long shot.
Thanks everyone. I've taken notes if all your suggestions. So this morning tiny lady was weighed again and had put on 60 grams putting her well within the healthy range. I was SO relived as yesterday when the MW said she was under and I should go for formula top ups while continuing to BF AND express I actually burst into tears as I thought I was not being given a chance to test my own body's capability, which I needed as at that point I was doubting my body myself. She even had the formula already waiting and made up among my stash of EBM bottles etc. my husband was EXCELLENT. I was so tired and upset I was thinking maybe I do need to be practical and think about her well being but hubby stated very firmly to the MW that we would not be using formula as there was no reason why BF and EBM would not be enough. I was so proud of him. I must add though that that particular MW was the only non supportive one. The hospy is pro BF which is why this assumption i'd go straight to formula top ups was odd to me... And later i looked at the medical notes in my folder and it listed formula as a last resort and only if advised by a paed. Yet formula was presented to me as the first resort....despite this my has a great reputation with midwives and I found this to be true ... I have received lots of conflicting information but I like that I can trial and adopt as needed. In fact the MW I was assigned for the last two nights is a LC so she has been amazing. Really warm and enthusiastic and light hearted about it... Which I need at 4am! I've also got a referral for at-home LC from the hospy.
Re attachment I know I can attach properly as yesterday BF was comfy despite a little sting from the existing blisters. But I still have the issue of the baby then readjusting so that correct becomes quickly incorrect. This happens when she's upset and irritated so writhing her head or sort of frowning and chomping AFTER I've attached her correctly.
The other issue is the sleep thing still... I'm feeding three hourly during the day and four hourly at night as suggested by the hospital but she tends to be so sleepy on the breast day or night that it takes an hour or more just to get 10 minutes worth of productive sucking from both breasts. Then when I feed her the EBM that adds more time feeding as I first have to wake her enough to put the bottle in otherwise she just sits there not drinking or lets the EBM pool in her mouth without swallowing. So by then it's been at least an hour and a half and since I'm supposed to be timing three hourly feeds from the beginning of the first feed, it's like she's barely finished one cycle before I'm having to get her up for the next.
I just don't know if she's sleepy because she's NOT hungry or if she's too lethargic or underfed and therefore sleepy. She does seem heaps more settled when she's awake now that I've been topping up with EBM which I think is a good sign as is the weight gain in 24 hours. That said, something that doesn't add up is wet nappies- since 2am this morning she's only had about three wet nappies and about four poo nappies. The lack of wet ones suggests not enough liquid thus milk to me...
Last edited by Ladylove; February 19th, 2012 at 05:47 PM.
I am under the impression that any nappy which has poo is also considered to be wet at this stage so that sounds like a reasonable amount to me. My DD1 sounds like your daughter, she was very sleepy at first and took over an hour each feed. She also lost more than the recommended amount of weight (although we were never encouraged to use formula or even pump, just feed more regularly). I just fed her as often as possible (2hrly around the clock if possible and let her 'hang out' on the breast if she was happy to) in those early days and by about 2 weeks she had 'woken up' which meant I could start following a demand led feeding pattern. Attachment was difficult for us until around 12 weeks when she had grown a little as she was so small.
Does DH have much time off work? I would suggest once you get home to just focus on resting and feeding, let him take care of you and the house while you just feed, feed, feed. Expressing is really hard work, I hope you can find a way to cut that back soon
There will come a time when you will yearn for your sleepy baby again. Around 5 weeks babies have their first wonder week at which they tend to 'wake up' and turn into screaming banshees. You won't have any problems feeding then!!
Ad for the 'lethargic' issue, just keep an eye on the nappies. That will tell you if your LO is getting enough. Sleep can be very deceptive at this age.
Just a tip on the falling asleep. My DD did that initially too. The midwives actually told me to strip her down to just her nappy and wipe her with a wet flannel if possible to keep her awake. Otherwise she was just too warm and comfy and kept falling asleep after a few minutes lol
Baby is three days old and already a question
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