Hugs heaven! I'm so sad to hear you're in so much pain.
I think you've been given the best advice already, but I just wanted to tell you again that I always had the lipstick shape on the left, even after the pain had gone...it only started disappearing after 6 weeks. Sometimes its bub's technique and actually has nothing to do with the way you're positioning her.
Also, Saram's advice about lining up bub's mouth with your nipple is something that rang true for me. My left nipple seems to point out a bit more than my right, so while I was trying to make a mirror image of my right hand positioning, I actually needed to bring her around a bit more (my midwife said to me only porn stars have perfectly symmetrical nipples...lol)
I also couldn't feed lying down until baby could self attach (after a few weeks), so don't beat yourself up about that.
Good luck with the LC tomorrow. BF is hard work, but you're doing such a great job already!!!!!
The ridge comes from not stuffing enough nipple (especially the lower part) far enough in to her mouth. It does improve as mouths get bigger and nipples get softer - but in the meantime, make sure she has as much nipple as you can get in there.
Is a lactation day stay an option for you?? It sounds as though the problems can be different in different feeds, so evaluation of a few feeds might help to really work out what is going on.
Spring- Thankyou, I will try that idea of sitting on the kitchen chair. I don't have a comfy chair to sit in so that could be part of it!!
Skye- Thankyou AGAIN!! Your support means alot!! I can't get the hang of lying down! I will ask the LC about it.
Ren- Thankyou!! I forgot to take the name of that ointment when I went to see the GP last time!! Bugger!! Yep, I think she's definately getting enough, we are going through SO many nappies!! lol. So that's one good thing I guess. Terrible to be having all this pain and no gain!!
Janie- Thankyou so much, I have to spread the love! I am writing those 3 things down on a notepad now. I am going to be foreceful with telling them it hurts and that something is wrong and not let them just say it looks right and will get better because I know it's not right! And I'm going to try standing up too. I can stand up and walk around while feeding on the right nipple, it's completely healed and I hardly have to do anything to attach her she basically gets it right herself. I can't believe there's so much difference.
Sarah- Thankyou! No, I don't think I have flat nipples. And no one's ever said anything about it either?? BUT at the last feed I moved her around more and it didn't hurt as much so maybe like you said my nipple is a bit further that way on that breast and I wasn't bringing her around far enough. Will see if it's still the same with the next feed! I think I have already been feeding her more on the R. I just can't wait to get her off the L and whenever she even looks like she might be finished she's off and onto the next one, lol.
anna- Thankyou again for your advice and support!! It might be I wasn't bringing her far enough around, I hope so, then I will have an answer. We shall see what she has in store for me at the next feed!
kmn- That's the thing, I shove as much as I can in there! lol. And sometimes I can barely see any nipple, and i think I have fairly big nipples, well the areola. So I don't get it!!
But you can't see the underside of your nipple - my problem was that i was carefully stuffing what i could see in, but that made the bottom half come out. Can someone look and see if you have the bottom part in properly?
Yep, it's all in there!! So confusing!! I get DH to push my boob back a bit and check, and you can't see any nipple below! The LC told me to check for that so I have been. That's why I can't work out what the hell is going on!
Oh my I'm having flashbacks reading this thread!
Super huge hugs to you - it's such a hard time. I don't know if it's helpful at all, but there seem to be lots of us with similar issues early on who made it - I hope it can give you a little strength to go on.
Please do try and get help with the nipple shield. I know they're kinda frowned upon, but I dont' know that I would have made it very far without it. Like you I had perfect technique but was in serious pain. but it all came good once he was bigger. There is a knack to using the shields. I found that I had to work very hard to line them up with the nipple just so or else they didn't go on right. Also, there are different kinds. I tried 2 and one worked a lot better for me than the other, so if 1 is no good might be worth trying another.
good luck!
Hunny, do use a pillow?
I just thought if you have a pillow you could use it to help hold her level with your nipple. Maybe even 2 pillows.
Laying down is hard. It did take a bit to get the hang of it. The one thing to remember is to make sure her feet & bottom are right in as close to you as possible.
I can't be right on my side or flat on my back. Sort of in between iykwim. Unless I am on a pillow with DS on the bed. Silly side ways boobs! Lol!!
I only started feeding laying down out of sleep deprivation & desperation!
I've seen those sheild things that Saram(?) was talking about. They are like plastic booby shells that have a hole on the inside layer that your nipple sits in. They looked interesting. I didn't try them though. They weren't what I wanted at the time.
I'm trying hard to think of more ideas to help. Having her higher up on the pillows might bring her chin up so you can actually see the full attachment. You should be able to see the bottom lip & the 'special K' seal.
Has anyone checked that her bottom lip is curling out properly?
I was holding DS's bottom lip down to make sure it curled out. & to hold his mouth open a bit wider to try helping with the attachment.
Hope the LC goes well today.
The worst case scenario is that you have to get a really good pump and express from that side and bottle feed her until:
1) the nipple heals and
2) she stops mangling it (which will most probably happen when she gets a bit bigger and her mouth grows. There are a couple of very determined women here who are expressing long term because their bubs never got the hang of not mangling, but since Grace is doing OK on the other side I think she should get the hang of it pretty well).
And then in a month or so everything hopefully ought to be painless and effective...
Well, maybe I just have to put up with pain and a cracked nipple forever
Saw the LC again. She said technique is good and everything, what a surprise. She just said to make sure she gets lots of the bottom in. We took her off 3 times and my nipple was still ridged every time but getting better each time. I just can't seem to get it. Couldn't work the nipple shields, she really doesn't like them!!
So basically again told to keep doing what I'm doing and persisting and it will get better Whatever. Losing hope now. I will keep trying though.
Jesse didn't like the sheilds at first, it took a few feeds for him to get used to them, but once he realised he still got the good stuff he was ok with them.
Don't loose hope! You and bub are doing brilliantly!! Remember it takes 3 weeks for bf to be considered "established" so you're miles ahead of so many people.
We all believe in you! You can do it! There is hope and there is a solution to this problem.
I think maybe expressing from the sore side and just feeding from the right for a few days will give you a breather and let the nipple heal.
It does get better. Like I said before I was in so much pain and it was for no apparent reason. I blame Ashton having a hard suck. By the 6 week mark it was better. I used to cry thinking about feeding him. The water from the shower hurt. I was so sore and cranky. But it DID get better just like they said it would.
Please, please hang in there, we all believe in you and it really DOES get better. You are in so much pain and feel so hopeless right now that you can't see it. I was exactly the same with DD and then, again at that magic 6 week mark, things just got better. My nipples healed and it didn't hurt anymore.
Sometimes Ava STILL comes off and my nipple is pinched or ridged... left one (flat one!!) seems to often have a pinch in it but it doesnt hurt when she's on so i dont know shes doing it and my R nipple often has a ridge in it like its raised a bit.... i dont know what we're still doing wrong but it doesnt hurt as much anymore.
My Right nipple (badly damaged one) still hurts when she attaches but no way near the horrific pain it once was. (as its healing)
I think some people might just have one "bad" nipple i know someone who is BFing and has been for 6mths and still has a 'sore' nipple side. but I think with time it gets better and toughens up.
You can do this.... keep persisting if this is what you really want you can do it.
I've been persisting and I'm still BFing and now enjoying it more..... much more.
You CAN do this...... I know you can because I've been where you are (and still am there kinda).....
I think as Ava has gotten older, she is feeding more effectively and latches on better as she now knows what to do.... babies are learning to. They get better with it too.
Heaven - that sucks that the LC couldn't help you more!
three things to think about
I firstly it's importatn that your bub has a happy mama so if it really is terrible then maybe you should stop but... maybe just retry a few things first and give it a few more days? Set yourself little goals like the end of this week. Give yourself until Friday and reassess. Maybe on Friday give yourself until next Friday or hell just a few days even and see how you feel.
Bottle feeding is not a bad thing but Bf is much easier - I know your not feeling that way at the moment but think 3am when your baby won't settle BM will do it every time. I once got stuck on a train for 11 hrs instead of 2 1/2hrs with DS when he was 9mths old thank god we were BF!
It is hard to believe but we have all been there and you can get through this. You are doing a fantastic job and as hard as it is to believe you will be sitting here in 6 months enjoying BF and these early days will be a very distant memory.
Try the shields again and insist upon them if that is the way you want to go. What brand did you get, what size?
Have you got a pump? Does it hurt to express? if you don't have one send hubby off right now to get one. i know they are lots of $$$ but cheaper than 2 yrs of formula.
Heaven
I am 4 weeks in front of you
My left nipple was toe curling as well. My right one was fine.
Today it finally has started not to ouchy hurt. Attachment was fine. The reason it was hurting was because my left nipple was a bit flatter than my right and wasnt coming out far enough for levi. It would still come out, but not as far as the right one- only a slight difference mind you. He would suck it into shape and it was the pulling further than it had been pulled before that was cuasing the pain- like a ripping and burning together!
Now that my nipple is coming out as far as it needs to- the pain is starting to go! He has managed to rip my nipple out lol! The pain was always worse when bbs were full as it was more flatter!
Maybe that is what is happening to you as well. I have been putting that cream on that was recommended, which helps the skin stretch easier and lessens the pain a bit so it might be worth a try!
Hang in there hon!!! You are doing a great job!
mwah
Heaven, please don't lose hope. Cracked nipples and pain do go away. The most important thing is to find the cause and fix it. The ridging sounds like you might still have an attachment issue. This could be that the nipple is still not far back enough (and it might be at some feeds and not others). Or it could be that your nipple points outwards so the lining up isn't quite right, or maybe the height. Can you see any areola when she's attached? If so is there more at the top or the bottom? Are both her lips splayed with her head tilted back and her chin against your breast? Check the attachment at each feed - often night feeds can cause a problem as we are too tired to notice if the attachment is off. I know you have been through these things with your LC, but it doesn't hurt to keep them in mind each time.
Another question for you - do you use baby led attachment or do you shape your nipple for her each time? If you are shaping your nipple, it might be an idea to try baby led attachment. This is where you hold your baby, usually upright between your breasts and let her find her way to the breast and attach all by herself - all you do is hold and support her in a comfortable position. If you haven't done this before, it would be worthwhile calling the ABA or getting a copy of one of their booklets that explains this.
In the meantime, while you have the pain, there are some things you can do. You can start every feed from the "good" side and once she is attached and you have let down, then change her over. The hardest sucking is at the beginning of a feed, so by always having that on the good side it can help your sore side get some relief. She will still get milk from that breast after you swap her over, and if she doesn't empty it you can express afterwards. Otherwise, if the pain is too great even for that you can express only on that side for 24 - 48 hours to try and get some healing done that way. Also, it's ok to ask your GP for pain relief if that will help you with feeds.
Hang in there hun. You are doing a fantastic job and it will get better. Very soon she will be bigger, attaching like a champ and you won't be in pain. I know how much it hurts now, I too have BTDT. But it does get better and once you are through the other side you will be so glad that you persisted.
Thankyou all. I have to keep making myself come in here and reading your posts because it's making me keep going.
I went out and bought a medala pump today. I didn't know what else to do. The LC said next mon if things haven't improved we would talk about expressing on that side to give it a break but I couldn't wait that long. But now that I had to buy it and buy a bottle I haven't tried it!! I cried about it because I don't want to give her a bottle. I don't want to confuse her more and it makes me feel bad, even though it's still EBM. I'm a little emotional, lol. But it's like it's just made me more determined instead, what a waste of money if I don't try it, lol. But I guess I will use it down the track anyway when I want to go out. I'm also scared it will hurt it too with all the sucking and stretching...
MR, I haven't done the baby led attachment. I was going to try yesterday, I just had her lying on my chest and she started bobbing around so I thought maybe I should see what she does. But when she got close I got scared she'd hurt me and decided not to. I will give it a go.
Thankyou so much for all your tips everyone. I have read them all and taken note, just don't have time to respond to everyone atm, she is waking!!
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Whatever. Losing hope now. I will keep trying though.
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