Bought double mountain buggy from ebay but item not as described

[Meercat]

"you are still not happy which leaves me to believe that there was no pleasing you unless you got a ridiculous amount back for the pram."

Um what? A Ridiculous price? Like .... what you paid when you beleived it was the ELITE model she falsley claimed it to be so she could get a higher price for it?

I wouldnt get too stressed. Paypal and Ebay will see both sets of communication and it is clear this seller is a nasty piece of work!

[Kimbles01]

I'd just stick to the fact that she wad going to give you money to fix the handlebars. She makes it sound like she's a generous person to offer, seeing as the damage didn't exist before you collected it, when in fact I'd argue that she's using the 40-odd dollar 'refund' to buy you off in the hopes that you'd take it and not go any further. If she was certain of no damage, she wouldn't offer a refund full stop.

If you want to use her tactic however, you could always offer to accept a refund in total but less the $40 so she can replace the handlebars herself before reselling. Not that you should have to by any means, but then it also shows her that you're on to her and her games...

I love most that in her mind, a $40 replacement is enough to make you happy with a lesser model pram - really love, is that the only difference between the two models?! Duh!

Hate it when other Kimberley's give us all a bad name!!

[meow]

Oh wow! I'd stick to the fact that it's the wrong model. You raised it right at the start, but tried to make compromises if some issues with the pram could be resolved (damage AND the inflated price due to it being a lower model). She has been difficult and you would like to end the transaction with a straight refund. I agree that if things get difficult, then I'd probably accept a refund less the $40 for the handlebars just to get out of the damn transaction and never speak to her again.

[Rivlas]

If you do return it make sure you get something in writing saying you have returned it, state the make, serial no and anything wrong with it and both sign it, her first, by the way. This way if there are any more queries she has signed the form saying she has received the pram back.

Send in your replies and questions to both ebay & paypal and how you you know she has done this and not trying to bully you into paying.

[Babyluv]

Go to ebay about it, open a dispute etc. I haven't read the other responses but I had a similar issue with an item I purchased in 'New Condition, never useed' and I received it used, very well loved, stitching coming apart, tags missing etc. I went to ebay, then had to go through paypal because that's how I payed. I ended up getting my money back and returning the item. If you have received an item clearly different to how it was advertised you can dispute it and you have the right to a refund. I'm pretty sure this is stated in ebays rules. Go and speak to someone on ebays online help.

[Ginger]

How's it all going yael?

[Yael]

hey guys,

Sorry for not updating sooner.

Ok, I got this on Monday from paypal:

The seller has submitted an explanation describing the disagreement with this claim. PayPal will evaluate all available information, including the original listing and both the seller and buyer statements. A final decision will be made on this claim in accordance with our User Agreement.

We will notify you if further action is required.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Thanks,

Protection Services Department

I was really annoyed that they never asked for my side of the story, but I was running an all day fundraiser for DS school, and didn't have time to write back. So on Tuesday I was going to write my side of the story regardless, to make sure my points were stated. But then i got this:

We have determined that you are eligible for a return of your funds for
this PayPal transaction.

However, in order for us to return those funds, you must:
- Send back the purchased item (within ten calendar days of receiving this
email) to the seller at your expense; and
- The purchased item must be received by the seller in the same condition
as you received it.

The amount you are eligible for is based on the terms of PayPal's Buyer
Protection Policy. We may not be able to repay the full amount of your
transaction in certain circumstances where the amount of your transaction
exceeds the maximum amount covered under the Buyer Protection Policy.
Please review the Buyer Protection Policy in our User Agreement before
sending the item back to the seller.

You are responsible for the postage and packing costs of returning the
purchased item to the seller and these are not covered by PayPal's Buyer
Protection.

Anyway, for some reason it didn't have a sent from name in my email, whereas it has always said service@paypal.com.au before that, so I was suss, but I logged onto paypal and the same statement was there.

So on Tuesday afternoon (I had a 2 day religious festival starting), I sent this to the seller:

Dear X,

As per the paypal email, I would like to make a time to return the pram. My husband and I can come on Thursday 9/6 evening, Saturday (11/6) evening, Sunday (11.00am - 8.00pm) (12/6) or Monday (13/6) daytime or evening. Please let me know what is convenient for you. To verify that I have returned the pram I will ask that we both sign a piece of paper verifying this (on 2 copies, so we can each have one).

Anyway, on Wednesday afternoon she wrote back:

The only time I have available is the 9/6 being tomorrow night, before 7pm.

But I can't access my email until our festival finished, which was around 7pm tonight (Thursday), so I sent her this:

I only received this email now, and it is after 7pm. Can you please let me know when is a suitable time within the next 7 day to return the pram. I am available Sunday & Monday, both daytime and evening, or Tues, Wed or Thursday evenings.

And then about 30 mins later I got this:

The email was sent yesterday afternoon, maybe you should have checked for a response. You gave me a list of days and I chose one!
I don't know, I hate pointing out the obvious.
I'll have to get back to you after Tuesday in regards to a date and time as there was obviously a reason that I chose tonight, we're busy the next few days.

I was so annoyed, I got the very obvious feeling that she was stalling so that I couldn't return it within 10 days, as I had to according to paypal. So I called paypal, and said to them that she was being incredible unhelpful in letting me return the item, and that I wanted to return it in person, and get a signed document stating this, so I could make sure it went back to her. I was worried that she would refuse the package, or not be at home, or claimed it was damaged etc. They said that they might not have accepted the signed document, and that all I had to do was provide to them the proof of item sent (i.e. the stamped registered post form from Aust Post or other courier company etc). If she refuses to accept the delivery, or doesn't pick it up that is not my problem.

So I just sent this to her:

Kimberely,

You are clearly trying to be difficult in the return of this item. I have called Paypal to lodge my concerns that you are trying to avoid receiving this pram back within the 10 day period stipulated by paypal. According to paypal, all I need to do is show receipt of shipping to your address via registered post or a courier firm. If you choose to refuse the package, or are not at home, or it is collected from depot (Australia Post or courier etc), this is not my problem according to paypal. All I need to receive my refund is the aforementioned shipping proof. As such, your pram will be posted tomorrow via registered post.

Wonder if I will hear back from her??

At least this way I don't have to face the nasty lady. Hope it isn't too expensive to post, now I just have to find a box. And take photo's of every square inch of the pram before I post it. Would you use bubble wrap or filler? It said in the paypal email it had to be sent in the condition that I received it, so if i need to I will write a stat dec declaring this to be the case. She doesn't have any proof of the condition she left it for me in (like the flat tyre etc)

Ok, so now for the important part - once I get my $$ back I will obviously be leaving neg feedback - I have 80 characters. She left me positive feedback the day I collected the pram, but even if she hadn't I would still leave neg feedback to warn others. What would you write??

[onthefly]

That's good you've almost got it sorted.

Maybe something like: Item returned as different model to described, also with damage. Seller unhelpful.

[~Trish~]

Be aware you won't be able to send it via Aust Post as it will be too large. Try the courier company Smart Send, they are very reasonably priced and are happy to do one off transactions with you. You can get a $$$ quote from their website. It will need to be boxed, so it might be a pain in the backside to find a box it will fit in. I'd probably bubble wrap it inside the box? You could always email Smart Send and ask them the safest way to package it.

I hope it works out and you can get your money back, what a total PITA!

[Rivlas]

Pump up the tyre just before you package it.

[melbel]

and take photos JIC...lots of photos of all the damage and also after you package the pram up so she can't dispute that you packaged it incorrectly or something like that......

[Yael]

Well, pram has been collected by courier & i'm hoping this saga will come to an end. I'm out of pocket $26.50 sending the item back (I think she should have to pay for the postage back, why should I be out of pocket for an item she falsely described in a major way?).

I'm still getting nasty emails from her. The first one was this on Sunday:

So petty....I opted for Thursday which you gave as an option remember!!!!We are on holidays returning tomorrow which is why I said I will contact you then.
We were not about to cancel a holiday for your convenience.
I don't care if you post it to be honest, if it's registered then I'll get it eventually.
You may get your money refunded but I'll be claiming damages that were not originally on the pram so I can resell it in the condition that I sold it to you in.
If it is left at our home and it goes missing then there'll be a whole new set of problems between us.
Your absolutely ridiculous!

And then this yesterday:

Ive just got off the phone from paypal and they have advised me that you have 10 days to send the pram, I suggest you get that organised as they told me that you haven't done it yet.
They have also advised me that you will not receive a refund until A. I and australia post or courier company have provided proof that I have received the pram and B. after my claims have been investigated re: any damage that you have done to the pram.
So the money will stay on hold until after my claim is precessed so the quicker you have it sent or drop it off the better for both of us.

That one was quite tame by her standards!

It took me all Friday to go around to different places and find a box big enough for it (A nice man in a courier place took pity on me and gave me a spare box from a bike delivery, which was really strong cardboard. I still had to cut it down and glue it with a hot glue gun (his tip) and tape it back together).

The Monday was a public holiday, and no courier firms were open for me to get quotes from, now that I finally had box dimensions & weight (the box was 3kg by itself!). So I did that Tuesday morning but I missed yesterdays deadline, so they only picked it up today, and it will be to her by tomorrow. I'm still within my 10 days, but I'm going with the option of ignoring her, I will only respond to paypal directly for now on. I was thinking of calling & asking their policy for dealing with the dispute that she says it wasn't damaged when she left it for me, I say it was like that when i got it. I doubt she has photos of it on the day of collection to prove it's condition, so I'm hoping they will side with me. Anyone ever been through something like this?

Anyway, I need to log onto to paypal and log the tracking details.

Once I had a non payer bidder, so I put in the non-paying bidder dispute, and after that was approved, I went to leave neg feedback and the system wouldn't let me, so I wanted to leave neg feedback for her now before the paypal thing wraps up, incase it won't let me afterwards. But then do you think she can use the neg feedback against me to paypal?

I was going to leave this:

seller falsely sold as higher model. Rude & nasty about it. Paypal issued refund

. Do you think that is too much?

[~Trish~]

I'm glad it's on it's way back, I hope you don't have a huge drama with the dispute, she sounds like such a pain!

The feedback sounds perfect, I'd go with that. Just so you know, eBay changed it so that seller's can no longer leave negative feedback, only positive (this will be why you couldn't leave it for a non-paying bidder). Buyers can still leave negative feedback though . She won't be able to neg you thank goodness.

I hope you get your money back ASAP!

[~Trish~]

How have you been going with this lady Yael? I hope you have your money back!

[Winter]

I'm hanging out to find out the ending of this saga too! I really hope that it all worked out in your favour!

[Yael]

Hey guys,

I'm so sorry I didn't get a chance to update earlier. Despite having massive sagas with the courier company not updating their website tracking for a few days, she did receive it, did sign for it and I could prove it to paypal. Then they took about another 2 weeks to decide to give me back the money (and just one day put it into my account with no notice or email), but they didn't deduct anything for the "supposed damage" I did - so sucks to be her basically - her trick didn't work.

So I was only out of pocket the courier fee & a lot of time and distress, but still a good ending to the saga.

Only thing is she complained about the feedback I left her, and they removed it because apparently you can't make reference to any paypal investigations/refunds. So I have to email ebay and ask to have a chance to leave feedback with the paypal bit edited out, as I feel the main part of it is still relevant, but haven't had a chance due to school holidays (finish tomorrow morning - yeh!)

Thanks for all your help & support through this.

In all the 300+ ebay things I have bought & sold, I have never had an experience even close to this one, and overall I stand by the system and the money I have saved from it, but I guess nothing is ever 100%

[meow]

I'm glad you got a full refund. What a saga! Do you have a new pram?

[Amy_jellybean]

OMG! What a cow is all I have to say! I have just read through the whole saga, so glad you got your money back! Obviously the woman has never heard of a bloody full stop!!!