Whats the Nestle "hate" all about?

[Snowy Love]

My boycotting of Nestle this easter does nothing as I haven't bought Nestle products for a long time. With the palm oil in the chocolate, if it has the same effect as when Cadbury did it it makes an ordinary tasting choc taste bad so why would you want to buy it even if you don't care about the orangatans?

[Traveller]

I have boycotted all Nestle products for 2 years now. It really is not that hard (although I got caught out when we moved back to Australia as I didn't realise Uncle Toby's came with a Nestle stamp). But in general we boycott everything they make, including cosmetics, and this is a great talking point with friends. In general I think about 1 in 5 start a boycott of their own to some degree (even if it is just coffee).

The boycott works well in the UK, to the extent that Nestle cannot sell baby formula there due to the outcry it would cause. They are aware of the action and (my naive self thinks) will eventually find it more profitable to be ethical everywhere, to increase their profits drastically in developed countries. Profits are all they see, so this is where we have to sting them.

I boycott because of the formula advertising guidelines, which Nestle is consistently the biggest violator of. This vastly contributes to the 1.5 million babies every year who die because of unsafe formula feeding. Baby Milk Action explains it more eloquently than I can though. Interestingly my brother boycotts Nestle due to their use of child labour, and now others are doing the same because of their use of palm oil which, like other morality issues, they are the biggest sinners.

[wysiwyg]

I didn't realise until went to the Zoo (MEL) recently that currently food manufacturers do not have to label palm oil as palm oil and are therefore not giving people the choice as to whether they want to buy products with palm oil in or not. The Zoo are running a campaign to try and get legislation changed so that palm oil must be labelled as palm oil so that we can then all choose whether we want to purchase products containing it. If you google palm oil action there is information on how you can identify unlabelled palm oil if you want to avoid it.

[Trillian]

Traveller, it was only a few years ago that Nestle got their grubby paws on Uncle Toby's. My Aunty works for them in Wagunyah and I joke about her working for baby killers LOL.

[BellyBelly]

Heaps of info in our ethical living forum: Ethical & Aware Living - Pregnancy, Birth & Baby Forums ~ BellyBelly. Here are the brands to avoid and why. https://www.bellybelly.com.au/forums...avoid-why.html

A list of corporate crimes by Nestle, include:

Unethical Marketing of Artificial Baby Milk
Exploiting Farmers
Union Busting
Promotion of GM Food
The Ethiopia scandal
Illegal extraction of groundwater
Pollution
Pyres of Burning Animals
Fraudulent Labeling
Perpetuating Sexism
Promoting unhealthy food
Promoting untested nano-technology
Backlashing against Fairtrade

Yes the Palm Oil thing, check out the short clip on THIS page. Nestle lobbied very hard and got it removed from YouTube. Cadbury stopped using palm oil already due to consumer demand. Nestle say they need til 2015 to stop using it?! What, til the orangutan population has gone?

They are well known for bribery and marketing of formula in third world countries. Picture this: doctor/midwife/nurse tells mother in the Philappines that formula is better than breastmilk and she should try these samples. Mother goes home thinking she's doing something wonderful for her child. She only has dirty, grotty water to make up the formula. Baby gets diahorrea, or worse, even dies. Or, mother gets home, milk has dried up and she cannot afford formula for her baby, and can no longer breastfeed. Or if she can afford it, it costs their entire family salary each month. The WHO estimates that 1.5m babies die every year due to not being breastfed.

Doctors get bribed with air con units, trips, and in poorer areas even food. This unicef mini documentary explains it all: https://www.bellybelly.com.au/forums...countries.html

Then there is the Ethiopia scandal: "Just before Christmas 2002, Oxfam revealed that Nestlé was demanding millions of dollars in compensation from Ethiopia – precisely when the country was in the midst of an extreme drought that put over 11 million people at risk for starvation."

The list goes on. This company is pure evil.

[Nelle]

It's not "hate" like I hate the people who work for them, but knowing about their unethical practices in regard to their aggressive promotion of baby formula in countries where it is just NOT in the best interests of the families, in fact, their careless marketing leads to so many deaths - I can't do nothing.

So I boycott (and have for ages) anything I know to be Nestle. I don't want my money going there if I can help it - obviously there might be a product or brand I don't know about, though I try to educate myself. But I figure boycotting most of Nestle is better than not doing anything.

It's not that hard either, I loved Milo, but have learned to really like (even prefer) other chocolate drinks. I loved Aero but gave it up (and almost cried with happiness when Cadbury Bubbles came out!). Anyway, this is not about how saintly I am, but more about - if I can do it, probably anyone can. It doesn't work out any more expensive to prefer other products either, in my experience.

And as others have said, even to be pro-active, rather than reactive, that's a good thing too - like to be proactive about preferring Australian made and owned to support Australian industry and farming, or to prefer to buy fair trade things. And that's just the stuff that benefits humans (which is my thing). And of course there are options we can choose from that support responsibility regarding the environment too.

[kirsty_lee]

Just a question re; the orangutans. Does that mean everyone is going to throw out their mobile phones too? Its a pretty well known fact that heaps of gorillas and orangatans die due to forests being cleared to get materials used in cell phones

Militias have seized large chunks of gorilla land and logged and mined it. They have done so because the illegal trade in timber and in metals such as gold and coltan -- used in cell phones -- generates between $14 million and $50 million a year for them.

[Lulu]

well im a bad mummy then arent I

we all manage to try and do our bit in one way for our enviroment, our earth, while we fall down in others.

I use cloth on my kids...I use cloth myself in more ways then one. How many people use disposables that clog our earth? How many people flush tampoons down the toilet? How many people leave unneccessary lights on, take the car for a quick trip to the shop? Use throw away bag to put their vegetables in at the supermarket? We wont have to worry about a rainforest for the orangatanges if we dont fix other problems first.

Maz, there isn't time to fix ONE thing first then start on another. Especially endangered species and rainforests. If we stuff up the earth and wipe out species there won't be any food at all and the last thing you will be worrying about is tampons.

[BellyBelly]

Everyone is doing their best. But we can't do it all of course. Thats why there are people dedicated to separate causes, bringing awareness to different things which keeps companies honest by speaking their language (money). I don't think its helpful to shoot the messenger on this one. By saying that why don't we do this or that, well aren't what we are doing a good thing? Sure I wish I could know it all and be able to know what to buy, but I don't. It's things like this that helps spread awareness, Nestle are guilty of having practices resulting in many, many dead babies. If you don't want to join in, fine, that's your choice and good on you. But don't shoot down those trying to make a difference. Absolutely no harm in what we're doing. Its just like the birth work I do. My interest is in birth, parenting and educating for both of those. Its what my passion is and I love it. I don't have any more energy or time to focus on anything like humanitarian work or aid work or anything else - other people have that as their passion. Thank goodness the world is so diverse and people are so diverse, we can cover more topics and problems in the world that way. We all have a passion, follow it, but don't try and shoot down others for theirs.

[Inanna]

Thankyou Nelle for arresting the title Hate"... I don't "hate" Nestle. I dislike what this company (& many other multinational companies standfor/do/create).

I believe each of us has a responsibility to work to save this Earth we have raped for so long. How we each do that as individuals will be different. For me Nestle and the formula issue is my reason. Formula companies have undermined mothers, directly caused the death of infants & this is all done playing on a mothers want to do the "best" for her babies.

Kristy-Lee I am curious at your comment. It seems to be a challenge - is that how you meant it? Do we use mobile phones? Well yes, I do. I use plastic also, though I limit it's useage. I also have undies made in China - though it's my aim not to use these products...

I find it interesting how there is always a comment such as the one you made. I am not pious & don't believe any of those that posted anti Nestle sentiments are. None of us are Saints, perfect. We are trying to do our bit. We are aiming to live ethical lives, not directed by mass consumerisim. Not directed by corporates. But directed by what we feel is ethical.

So, I am not sure what you really meant. Or what your motive was. But one doesn't cancel out the other YK?

[kirsty_lee]

No it wasn't a challeng at all Deb. My point was there is HEAPS of stuff that people use that they probably shouldn't. I'm not shooting any one down at all either. Just that if we were to stop using products from companys that we didn't agree with how they make them/ source them whatever, then really what would we be left with?

[BellyBelly]

Of course we're going to be left with heaps. By boycotting their products you find alternatives. If they lose money (which Nestle are starting to do) then they will HAVE to change if they stay in business. Cadbury changed already! They responded to consumer demand. Nestle think they are too big to touch, well, by a massive worldwide campaign like this, they will realise they are touchable. Its not about not being able to have/buy anything, thats just feeding the behaviour if we continue to buy. But by not buying, they get the message real quick. They will HAVE to change. So having the strength (which I don't think is that hard) to source alternatives, even if you cant do them all, do as much as you can) then you're helping, and they will notice.

[Inanna]

We would be left with an ethically & environmentally sustainable Earth. We would actually need to get our butts up & work a bit harder. We wouldn't have everything necessarily at our fingertips.

We CAN have a forward world without rape, pillage & destruction. It's doing it with compassion. The negativity surrounding how we live is massive. The Karma or "negative energy" that comes with earning money from unethical means is huge. This impacts on the consciousness of our humanity.

It goes a lot further than just choosing where to put your dollars. Your dollars are subsidising the death of babies - essentially that's how it is. So, the Energy around that is very heavy...

We need to change that. We all have our drums to beat. Our causes, our passions. That's why it's important.

To not care is to subsidise. It's a simple equation in my eyes!

[Jennifer13]

No it wasn't a challeng at all Deb. My point was there is HEAPS of stuff that people use that they probably shouldn't. I'm not shooting any one down at all either. Just that if we were to stop using products from companys that we didn't agree with how they make them/ source them whatever, then really what would we be left with?

Um, products from ethical companies that are doing the right thing?

Changes in the unethical companies because actually the last thing they want to do is go out of business?

Doesn't sound like such a bad way to go!

I work in sustainability, advising large companies (mostly multinationals) on how to be more transparent and change their practices. It's not as hard to get some to change as you think and I can guarantee that negative press certainly does make them sit up and take notice. Social networking is gathering momentum, so the Nestle-free Easter campaign on Facebook would definitely make them notice. Since I don't work for them, I'm not sure how this will affect their attitude, but they certainly won't be ignoring it. It gives consultants like me a bit of back-up when I'm trying to convince a company that it's worth changing their sourcing practices so they can operate better and look better. And other companies that do source responsibly can absolutely take advantage of this kind of thing to promote why they are a better alternative.

Palm oil was/is an issue for a former client of mine and it only took one small newspaper article to get that one on the CEO's radar (can't say if they changed their suppliers because of it, but I suspect a process of doing so would be put in place). As silly as it sounds, sometimes it's about what the senior management are made aware of by the broader community. If it comes across their morning news, they know about it. If it doesn't, it's just one of the many, many ways of operation in a subsidiary company's supply chain that doesn't make it onto any internal presentation.

We'll be buying other brands this Easter. Although we probably won't actually be buying any, we're not big chocolate egg people and we're staying with a housefull of chocoholics for the break!

[BellyBelly]

Yup it's about rewarding the companies that make an effort to be ethical, fair and sustainable. Its sending a message to those who cause damage to the environment, lives and even their staff.

[Rouge]

I think that's a a really sad outlook. I think it's awesome when anyone has a cause, whether it's the fight against cancer (even though it could be said there are many other worthwhile diseases to support and raise awareness for), the fight against abuse, the fight against pollution, the ethical fights and so forth.

Just because I don't do every single one of them, in fact I'll be honest I don't do enough, doesn't mean I can't support those that are doing them.

I never used cloth but that doesn't mean I don't respect those that do, same as I've never run marathons to raise money for AIDS but that doesn't mean I hate on those that do.

Every little bit helps, so instead of pointing out what isn't being done maybe appreciate what is and if you can't appreciate that then maybe let people get on with their own cause and find one that suits you.

[Jennifer13]

I've often found with most companies the unsustainable/unethical practices are often a lack of awareness and just the way things were always done, rather than a desire to rape and pillage the earth. They are still run by people, and most do care about what others think of their company (and not just the shareholders).

If it suddently becomes an important issue not to use palm oil (or at least not use very much), then a company will go to all of its suppliers and see if they can change to an alternative. Those that can, they'll consider and source the alternatives. Those that can't, they'll try to find other suppliers in the market that can make up the difference. It doesn't happen overnight (although it doesn't take five years, sorry Nestle!), but it's the start. Where palm oil might be necessary, the company can work with suppliers to find sources that are sustainable and work within their company to try to develop their products so that it's unnecessary. Nestle is already undergoing this process, let's tell them to speed it up!

It's about encouraging Nestle to change because it's the right thing to do and because their reputation is at stake. Any $$ effect on the company is so far down the line (and difficult to measure) that it's not part of the argument now.

[Traveller]

Sniff Sniff

I just found out XXX mints are nestle

I am thoroughly addicted to them. I could seriously cry.

I just hope extra strong tic tacs are ok.