BW - there is just to many unanswered questions in all this and despite every statistic the Drs can give, no one knows what will work for each individual. I am just praying and hoping with all my heart that "the plan" works next time. I really had everything pinned on our previous "give it EVERYTHING" approach but guess life just truly isn't that rosy. Sorry if I sound negative but this terrible year is really getting to me. I do find it encouraging that the reduction in egg no's "seemed" to do the trick for you, along with the meds. You will have some good stories to tell your miracle baby about how much Mummy and daddy went through to get them!
CP - Where there is no AF there is still plenty of hope girl. Just got to get through these next few days!
Meredith I completely understand the negative feelings, I've had many, many times there myself! I just wanted to encourage you and let you know that the answer you think you've got doesn't always come out to be the right one. I thought that the increased prednisone would fix things, but I suspect it made things worse. I thought that a frozen blastocyst was the answer, but it wasn't. In the end, for us, it was half the dose of prednisone Dr S was suggesting, aspirin, metformin, avoiding OHSS and a fresh day 3! The negative feelings are totally understandable and I'm sure nobody holds them against you.
CP, I think I missed you earlier - congratulations on the frosty bub, but I'm still not giving up hope that little frosty bub will sit and wait to become a sibling.
Was just doing a little googling and came across a very interesting article on effects of high doses of FSH on egg quality.
Below is just a few brief snippets from the article. Anyone interested in more can PM me.
Indeed, Lord Winston believes it is now time to re-think our reliance on drugs in fertility management. 'We need to reduce the amount of FSH (the follicle-stimulating hormone used to trigger egg production) we give to women because over-stimulation is harmful to their eggs,' he says.
'Using lower doses improves the quality of the eggs. My own research shows that if you reduce the FSH given, you get fewer chromosomal defects.'
Dr Geeta Nargund is head of reproductive medicine at St George's Hospital, London, and a leading proponent of 'natural' IVF. She explains: 'Nearly half of all eggs collected in standard IVF cycles are chromosomally abnormal and so are less likely to result in a healthy, full-term baby.'
She says high stimulation affects the blood supply to the eggs and causes abnormalities, which can lead to embryos failing to implant, or to miscarriages.
Cuddlepie - that is wonderful you have that "backup" frostie (which of course you will not need for a few years until your current li'l bean needs a brother or a sister ) I was very interested in reading about frozen cycles in Japan. It actually fits in with reading I've done that implantation rates for fresh transfers are higher on women who have not had too higher estrogen levels in their stim cycle. Sending you more and hope work chills out for you
Meredith - thanks so much for sharing the fruits of your research with us. I am an avid googler, too! Interesting about the 50% chromosonally abnormal stat you gave. I was told the same figure. I asked my FS about this. Unfortunately, they only have this figure for IVF. I was told we do not know the number of chromosonally abnormal eggs in a natural cycle - as they have to do IVF to get the eggs to do the tests in the first place IYKWIM. So it could be the same figure, or less, or more. But in my head, I do believe in survival of the fittest and can only assume my two Trisomies came from the best follicles in those two cycles. It is a subject DH and I still throw around, particularly after you had some trisomies in your recent PGD cycle which produced faster growing embies than the "normal" ones. Confusing stuff.
Sara - your "at one with nature" break sounded wonderful. You will be nice and energised for the silly season and your potential January cycle
AFM - have been BD'ing ourselves silly. Have been using OPK's (which normally work well for me) but am on CD 16 and still have no idea when O will come... Was warned this cycle may take a little longer. Had meeting with clinic today and came home with all my goodies to start my next cycle while the clinic is closed. Was also given some Pregnyl, which we may give to me in very small doses, as my LH was exceedingly low last cycle and this can contribute to low egg quality. We have to use it very cautiously as I will not be on any Orgalutron until around FSH Day 6 so no protection against an LH surge.
Hey thanks WTH for cheering me up a bit regarding the better implantation rate in fresh cycle when estrogen level is lower...I think my 1st fresh cycle I was borderlining OHSS, so that kind of explain why it didn't took. This cycle estrogen leve is very much under control and I hope will make a difference.
AFM, I was actually quite depressed this morning, don't think this cycle is very hopeful...got AF type of cramps now. I just want to get this over with than in-limbo. Even its a BFN, at least I can start buying leg of ham - my true Xmas spirit! As you can see, mood swing definitely is happening....
Sorry no personls right now, work is still quite busy but I'd rather prefer that...
Hope Sara, Meredith, buliej and Lisa you are all doing well....
Was a bit depressed about the discussion of damage to the embryo because of PGD, since I don't have the option not to do PGD. But thankfully remembered my discussion with the geneticist: the cells that are used for PGD after 5 days are actually cells that would build the placenta not the embryo, so the possibility of damage to the embryo would be much smaller than for PGD after three days when you actually use cells from the embryo.
CP - crossing everything that those cramps are "good" ones. Take it from one who has had plenty of BFPs and plenty of BFNs.... cramping defnitely goes with either. I just find that if I am pg, the cramps come and go and don't get to much worse. If AF is on the way, then they just keep getting more intense. STAY AWAY AF!!
WTH - I must admit, i kind of wish I just lived in ignorant bliss. The research is interesting but just does my head in and probably scares me more! Your E2 stat is interesting too. I have NEVER had an E2 like in this cycle so maybe my body just didn't like it. Hopefully next cycle things will be a bit more settled.
What dose pregnyl have they suggested? I have used 100iu every second day for every cycle I have done this year and has certainly helped my E2 levels ( who knows about egg quality?). Never had an issue with premature LH surge
Sara - Oh sorry! The PGD damage talk is mostly my own speculation as to potential causes for my "dud" cycle and yes, we were biopsied at day3. Mind you, the lab and other sources I have read don't seem to think that doing it at this stage is any more damaging than at day5 because all the cells at day 3 can become anything (placenta or embryo) so one taken is easily replaced.
My current thinking is that probably any extra handling of embryos isn't great for them but if one is truly strong enough, it will survive this and make it to the end. I just don't think I had any really strong enough this time. I am sure you will have a good strong embie in there when it comes time.
I am feeling so "bah-humbug" atm. Just don't want to celebrate at all this year and sick of all the "joy" around. Just want to get this year over and done with so we can get going into next yr!
I am like you Meredith, I haven't even taken out the Xmas tree yet and there is no decoration in our house at all this year. I thought 'what for'? Xmas is really for kids anyway! I just need to clean the house this weekend if I am in the mood.
Thanks for the tips about cramps, you are so right. Last night I was sure the cramps are 'good' ones, because when it came, it was bad enought that I thought ' oh s**** that's intense' then its just gone...feels very much like last time when I was pregnant. So I was very hopeful. But this morning, I haven't felt anything yet. If I can keep AF at bay over the weekend, I think I am in for a chance. Haven't been agonizing too much about POAS either which is good...
Sara, big ...I know sometimes 'ignorance is a blessing', the more you know the more worry you have...but don't let all the figures/stats drag your spirit down, plus like Meredith said, everyone's case is different! So chin up girl and 2009 is going to be great for all of us!
My last day at work before two weeks holidays, very much looking forward to it.
I understand what you're saying about Christmas. But just wanted to tell you that the weekend after my cycle was cancelled DP and I went out to Flowerpower and baought a wollemi pine and a traditional living Christmas tree and decorated them. It made me feel so much better. So maybe try and don't let it destry yoru Christmas for you.
In any case use the sunshine and have a great weekend.
Cuddlepie - glad I made you feel somewhat better. I am crossing everything (except my legs ) for you that these little beanies stick! When is your BT? Meanwhile, can I ask you about your cycles after a BFN? I was told mine might run a bit longer.
Sara - yay for being on a break. Really hope you get to rest up with DH (you deserve much spoiling, you know) Look forward to joining you in Jan to cycle together. Take it easy
Meredith - I know what you mean about putting 2008 behind you! This year has truly sucked! As for the Pregnyl, I will not know until they do the BT's in the cycle. It was just noted that my LH was very low throughout my IVF cycle and apparently this can affect egg quality. The LH surge thingo was that it is more risky to use the Pregnyl when I am not doing the Lucrin (as I won't be starting the Orgalutron until say, Day 6 or so). My clinic told me they normally prefer to do the small doses on the down reg where they have more control.
AFM - going crazy trying to figure out if and when O is going to come this cycle. Temping and using OPK's and not having any luck. Driving me nuts
Had cramps for the last two days so thinking that AF is on its way, if she shows I don't think I'll go for the BT. Just not feeling ready to start this over the break, feeling that I'd prefer to wait until January.
On the other hand feeling that the time is running away from me - will be 40 mid next year - and that I can't just wait a month....
Sara
Last edited by Sara69; December 20th, 2008 at 08:22 AM.
Sara, I know that 'torn' feeling so well...my advice, if you are not feeling ready, then wait! One month in a grand scheme of things is nothing really. I waited 4 months after starting Sharky and AP and hope they will kick into gear and optimize my healthy level before I am back on IVF wagon and then I waited another 2 months because of changing FS as you know. Sometimes I do feel that I have pretty much wasted half of last year, but then would I feel comfortable any other way? No.
Enjoy the silly season and NY, recuperate your body strength and spirit and 2009 will be a brand new start, that sounds so perfect to me. Plus, if you are reluctant to start and force yourself to, you will always have a 'resent' or 'unsure' feeling about the cycle. On top of that, who wants to give up ham and champagne if you can avoid it!
I have been so calm this cycle and didn't have the urge to test until this morning, I just had this dreadful feeling in my gut...so got up really early and went to coles got the Clear blue digital one. Never used this before and I wish I didn't buy this type later on...
Anyway, the test is BFN, to see 'Not Pregnant' displaying on the screen really sucks! Worse than not seeing a line....
I was sure at one stage that I felt pregnant and we've done everything seemingly should but still this, I feel really crushed. But I am kind glad I did it before the b/t tomorrow, I don't think I can handle this in the office. At least now I can just hide in bed and do nothing.
Well, the only upside is that now I really don't need to worry about having ham, prawns or drinks during Xmas any more.
Thought I would drop in a say hello after getting a message on a forum from Red Lady (aka sara69). Well I have some good news to try and brighten everybodies spirit.
I am 9 weeks and 4 days pg. I had an u/s last thursday and got to see the heart beat which was 186bpm and see the little button wriggle.
Everything looks okay as far as they can tell. We have never made it this far before both m/c were at 5.5 weeks.
I here what you all mean about Christmas though I am so worried about having another m/c that I have just wrapped myself up in cotton wool and hiding from the world that this one will stick
Sending everybody lots of
Cuddlepie sorry about your BFN I that tomorrow you get a big suprise. Whats wrong with having ham and prawns when your pg? are you not supposed to?
[COLOR="Purple"]WTH[/COLOR"] Hope you get your lovely temp rise soon. I know how hard it is trying to every day/second day.
Sara Sorry to hear that your cycle was cancelled. All the best for 2009 I hope that we all us ladies get our Miracle babies. I hope that you can still have a wonderf christmas
Meredith I hear what you mean about wanting christmas to come and go. Its a wonderful time of the year and usually I love it and get right into the christmas spirit. But my fear of having another m/c is just to overwhelming and cant seem to do anything but worry. I am also a google freak and research everything that relates to m/c and pregnancy sometimes it pays off and other times I think it just creates more anxiety. Try to have faith and put your worries and stress in gods hands and let hime take care of it for you and your job is not to give up.
Cuddlepie - I am soooooooo hoping the digital test is not overly sensitive! On one of my PG's I could barely see the line on a supposedly sensitive 25 ui one, and my HCG was 131.
I understand why you tested this morning, I was the same. I know everyone says to hold out until the BT, but I would rather do it when I was in an environment where I could react to the news, good or bad.
It is not completely over yet (technically you are still PUPO ) and it is great you have a frostie (which I think you said has worked for you in the past).
The negative feelings are totally understandable and I'm sure nobody holds them against you.
) I was very interested in reading about frozen cycles in Japan. It actually fits in with reading I've done that implantation rates for fresh transfers are higher on women who have not had too higher estrogen levels in their stim cycle. Sending you more 
and hope work chills out for you
As you can see, mood swing definitely is happening....
) for you that these little beanies stick! When is your BT? Meanwhile, can I ask you about your cycles after a BFN? I was told mine might run a bit longer. 
that this one will stick
every day/second day.
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