Toilet training and childcare...

**mambo** · January 14th, 2014, 06:54 PM

DS will start cc in a few weeks...hes almost 3.5 and is still not fully toilet trained. Speaking to the childcare director today I mentioned this to her and she told me that for him to be in the 3 year old room he needs to be toilet trained and that if he isn't he will need to go to the toddler room where they can help assist with training him. She said its due to the staff ratio they basically cant have kids who aren't toilet trained in the 3yo room. Is this a general thing for all cc centres? Im feeling a bit anxious now as I have about 3 weeks to get him up to speed but I think the pressure wont help him or me. So interested to hear others thoughts on this especially if this is something that all cc centres follow...

Thanks!
(anxious mumma

)

**MummyNaomi** · January 14th, 2014, 06:59 PM

I think its pretty standard, however at our centre they are pretty flexible. DS was toilet trained before 3 so moved to the kindy room on his birthday, I know some of the other kids have moved later once they are independent toilet users

**peanutter** · January 14th, 2014, 07:13 PM

DS1 had to be TT (within reason - an accident here and there is accepted as being normal) to go into the "kinder" room when he was 3. He would have had to stay in the toddler room, otherwise.

I *think* it's because there's 4 kids per carer for the older room, but 5 kids per carer in the baby and toddler rooms.

Also, the activities, set up etc are designed for TT kids - change stations, assumptions about them being dry and able to say when they need the toilet (plus regular toilet stops of course) etc.

So yes, I think it will be pretty standard across the board.

Take a breath, it's all fine - either he's ready or he's not, and you'll find out when he's there where he's at.

And if he doesn't like being in the toddler room, then he'll have *great* motivation to become dry!

That was the case with DS1 - his best friends were moving up, and we had to tell him that he could go too - once he was in undies, and staying dry.

He got on board very quickly after that. It was just a question of motivation and encouragement - and at child care, they should get both

Good luck!

**mambo** · January 14th, 2014, 07:42 PM

Thanks ladies...I was just worried that maybe it wasn't the norm but fully understand why its pushed. I'm hoping that by the time he's off to cc we will have mastered it..worse case he may have to go into the toddler room..which as you said peanutter might be just the motivation he needs to stay dry!

**feeb** · January 14th, 2014, 08:06 PM

DS1 was moved up to the kinder room when he was still not toilet trained. He was in the room 2 months before he was, was never an issue at all. He had been at centre year before as well and they knew he wasnt, there view was room is 3-6 year olds some will be some wont be when start in room.
I know to start sessional kinder was told they all had to be TT but I know of 1 child who was at 4 yr old kinder and wasn't TT but they had to ring his mum if he needed changed.

DS2 is in kinder room this year and has been wee TT for a year but poo he still goes and puts a nappy on!, he has amazing hold on skills and has never once asked there for a nappy to do a poo he waits till gets home!! NEVER has a poo accident at all.

**squeezles** · January 18th, 2014, 09:06 PM

Being 3 you might find he is quick to train anyway!

**wysiwyg** · January 14th, 2014, 08:05 PM

I *think* it's because there's 4 kids per carer for the older room, but 5 kids per carer in the baby and toddler rooms.

It is definitely due to ratios but I think the above are not right - the ratio is more kids per carer the older they are, and for over 36 months is something like 1:10 whereas under 3 is 1:5 and under 2 is 1:4. Mixed age groups the ratio is proportional to number of children in each age. As they have high number of children per carer in older rooms (3-5), then is difficult for them to have one go off and to assist with toileting / change nappies etc. (Centers may have more staff per room than the ratio demands)

**Floweryfields** · March 9th, 2014, 07:32 AM

It would be a centre to centre decision. There is no regulatory requirement for toilet training to be complete by a certain age group, however there is regarding toilets/nappy facilities iykwim. Many centres only have toilet access for certain age groups and no nappy facilities so this may well be the reason.
We still have nappys in our 3 year old group because we do have nappy changing facilities in that room still. Our children that go into our kindy group (4 by June) do need to be trained as there aren't facilities for them (or the time needed either really).

**~Gee_Whizzy~** · January 18th, 2014, 09:19 PM

hey matie, when E started 3yr old Kinder (private not cc) being TT wasn't mandatory. The teacher said, in all fairness they can't "discriminate" against non -TT kids as all kids train in their own time!! I'm guessing being cc based though it's different due to the ratios required :?

Z turns 3 next month and still refuses to even sit on the loo but will happily tell me when she's done wees or poos and wants to be changed

so I feel your pain!!

I think we're both struggling because both our E's were easy!!

**mambo** · January 18th, 2014, 10:31 PM

Yeah I don't remember E's kinder teacher telling me it was a must for him to be TT either...but then he was already well trained by the time he started so I might not have asked.

He has been better these last 2 days so im hoping that within the next 2 weeks he will have grasped it..not even attempting night training yet bc he still wakes with a full nappy. one step at a time.

Our 2nd borns are just being stubborn!!

**~Gee_Whizzy~** · January 18th, 2014, 11:36 PM

Yeah I don't remember E's kinder teacher telling me it was a must for him to be TT either...but then he was already well trained by the time he started so I might not have asked.

He has been better these last 2 days so im hoping that within the next 2 weeks he will have grasped it..not even attempting night training yet bc he still wakes with a full nappy. one step at a time.

Our 2nd borns are just being stubborn!!

don't worry about night training, that'll happen when he's ready

lol....except "us" 2nd borns!!

**lee_bee** · January 19th, 2014, 12:01 AM

I was working in a centre last year, their 3yrs + room had children who weren't entirely toilet trained, they just wore pull-ups. We would still send them to the toilet etc. occasionally one would have an accident, but being in pull-ups it wasn't the end of the world. Maybe talk to the senior qualified carer in your LO's room and discuss what would work best.

**Frangipani Lou** · January 19th, 2014, 05:25 AM

I think being TT in the 3 year old room is a bit harsh. They're using a very common practice that's outdated and actually should be changed. The coordinator of the centre can come into the room to cover the supervision aspect while your DS is being changed. I'm thinking its against the regulations or quality practices to exclude because of toileting habits. I'm a sessional kinder teacher with a background in childcare. We change nappies in 4 year old kinder.
Here's a contact page for The Department of Education and Early Childhood Development. They'll be able to give you some clearer info so you know what the requirements are for the centre, which might give you some breathing space.

http://www.education.vic.gov.au/chil.../concerns.aspx