I apologise profusely for not getting back to you ladies i really do appreciate your replies. I have just started back at work and things have been slightly crazy.

Rosa thanks for the example of your routine. Things have been ok here if i keep well on top of things and get the sleep times timed perfectly. DS still needs some encouragement for afternoon, and sometimes night but for the most part he's been pretty good the last week or two. How are you finding things?

Jasp i loved massage but i stopped it when he was about 5ish months maybe (once he started rolling) because he just wouldn't stay still and i didn't feel it was having a calming effect on him. I could give it a go here and there though which he may enjoy. I wish i could enlist DH to be here at a certain time to help with the bedtime routine but it's so difficult. It'd really help if he could read to DS1 while i settle DS2

Marcellus i have started staying in with him rather than leaving him to try and just drif off to sleep. I hum and little tune and it really does seem to calm him. So much of every day (even 11 months later) is trial and error and continually trying to figure out what works best for you LO isn't it!?!

Thank you all for your suggestions, at desperate times it's so great to be able to type in a question and get some great advice