Anyone else not worried about listeriosis?

[Willow]

^ Just goes to show you how careful you need to be

I am as worried about it this prg as I have been in my last 3 - just because it's a subsequent prg, doesn't lower the risk any. I don't really understand the theory of 'relaxing this time around'.

I have found it a LOT easier being at home for the majority of this prg. Working and trying to safely transport and store food at work or eating in food courts in the city was a bit of a nightmare.

[Inanna]

Mmmm you may or may not have more chance of being in a car accident but you still put on your seatbelt - yes???

Lulu is spot on. Once a fruit has been diced and refrigerated even in your FP at home it has a much higher risk of listeriosis...

Deli ham is a nightmare and I wouldn't eat it and did not.

Most hospitals have a disclaimer when you choose a meal and any meal with fruitsalad or fresh salad and meat is deemed unsuitable for pregnant women and the immuno suppressed...

It is not rare to contract listeriosis - it is not common either. It happens and when it does it's an awful tragedy with terrible outcomes.

It's wise to be cautious but not paranoid. Tempting fate I would not do - but if you do eat something and think later... Don't panic just learn from it and file it for wisdom.

Takeaway shops with salads in bain maries and the salads in these at supermarkets are asking for trouble. Sliced ham at the deli is something I wouldn't risk. Feta, Ricotta and soft moulded cheeses I would steer from too. Fresh juices from Boost etc I would also steer away from. The fruit is pre cut and cold... Warning there!!!

I have had 11 pregnancies and I was cautious with every one. It's not long to abstain from these things in my opinion. I have seen fetal deaths from listeriosis and it's awful. I don't think it's worth being casual about it.

[rufalina]

I am as cautions as I was first time round, and would be any time I am pregnant. I know it is not a common issue, but I don't want to be the one it happens to, and to know it was something I could have avoided.

I agree with Flowerchild, 9 months is such a short timeframe in the grand scheme of things, that I would prefer to know I was doing everything I could to protect the precious bundle I am nurturing what ever the cost to myself. It is hard and I miss foods and activities, but I can deal. And can catch up later. Plus, the anticipation of tucking into raw salmon sushi rolls after this baby is born can keep me going...

[Sagres]

I would say I am aware of it and follow a few simple rules but would say I am a long way short of being worried. I mean it is a risk thing, there are degrees of risk. It's not like exposure to a very low level risk is GOING to be detrimental. There are big risks and small risks....and with any risk there is likelyhood and likely outcome. If I have 1 piece of ham that was not cut as recently as I thought it was, the likelyhood that I have some reaction to it may be reasonably high, but the likely outcome is that I feel a bit iffy until my next trip to the toilet and nothing more.

I could never quite understand my friend who wouldn't buy a larger tub of yoghurt (only individual tubs) while pregnant, but happily walked to the shop to buy it crossing a couple major roads that didn't have pedestrian crossings or drove her car. I think the perceived risk/likelyhood/likely outcome of listeriosis is vastly overestimated - well it was for my friend.

[Inanna]

You are quite right not to be worried but be cautious.

Do you realise though that many cases of listeriosis are asymptomatic?
There are no low level or high level cases. You either have listeriosis or you do not. How it affects an individual will vary. There are documented cases of women contracting listeriosis without affect on the fetus also. (however, the risk to the fetus is very high)
Listeriosis is dangerous throughout pregnancy in the first trimester contracting it usually ends in miscarriage. In later pregnancy the result can be stillbirth or premature birth...

As for it being vastly overestimated I couldn't be cofident in agreeing with that statement. If you develop listeriosis the risk to the fetus is very high. By following some fairly simple guidelines your risk is incredibly low. I've never really understood the difficulty with just erring on the side of caution. Nor do I understand why we think it's odd when a woman is quite strict with her dietary choices in pregnancy. I was - losing babies in the second trimester (& the first & third) is incredibly traumatic. Each time the likely cause was listeriosis. However that was discredited after pathology.

We all come at life from our own experiences. My experiences showed me that caution isn't too hard for a few months of my life.

[bon]

I am careful, but not worried. I am definite about staying away from deli meats and salads and those roast chickens they have in the deli. I remember a story they once did on today tonight, where they tested those chooks for salmonella and listeria, amongst other things, and just about every chicken they tested was positive for one or both of those bugs. So there is no way I will eat one now, pg or not. Much safer to cook your own.

I am craving smoked salmon atm though - haven't had any, but oh how I would love a plate of smoked salmon pasta, or a bread roll with smoked salmon and cream cheese. I have actually told DH that when I come home from hospital I want a cheese platter waiting for me.

[FabFiona]

I am craving smoked salmon atm though.

I had a dream about smoked salmon.... I am also missing this very much. I used to have a sushi box at least once a week and I am missing that.

Like someone else said, I'm alert but not alarmed. It's not a very long time to go without and to be honest I've gone off a lot of those foods anyway. I think it's the bodies natural way of saying stay away.

[Sagres]

As for it being vastly overestimated I couldn't be cofident in agreeing with that statement.

Yeah, I agree I didn't say that very well. I think most people have a healthy approach to minimising the risks, but there are some groups of people who overestimate how likely it is to happen, I mean the people who take the approach that if you have any exposure to any risk factor at all, you WILL be affected adversely, as opposed to thinking that you are increasing your risk, which is a more realistic.

[krysalyss]

when I come home from hospital I want a cheese platter waiting for me.

Ha ha! I actually had three people bring me soft cheese in the hospital or soon after I got home. It was heaven! Blue cheese in cooked dishes just isn't the same as on a cracker.

[buliej]

I personally think that understanding the rules about what you can or cannot eat are very important - I just have trouble remembering all of them and also figuring out what to eat for lunch in the CBD. In the winter, hot soup is easy but in the summer...very hard plus it's easier for food to go off in the summer. During my very short lived pregnancies I tried to be very careful - it was so hard for me to get pregnant, I wasn't going to be cavalier about contracting something that has the potential of harming the baby.

By washing fruit, veggies, salad at home - do you mean rinse with cold water and dry? or do you mean scrub as you would a potato? curious - what do you do when you are invited to someone's house and you aren't ready to tell them that you are pregnant...do you just hope that they practice proper food handling? do you avoid anything that has a chance of being iffy (like a salad)? What about if they put feta cheese in the salad - do you pick it off (is that enough) or refuse the whole salad? See, I get very confused.

With eggs - I assume eggs cooked through are fine (like scrambled) but poached and other eggs with running yolks are not. Is this right?

With re-heating rice/quinoa/cous cous and other foods that soak up a lot of water - I think I was told as long as it re-heated to steaming hot, then it is ok. Can someone let me know if this is correct.

PS - I mean my silly questions...

[Willow]

Fresh juices from Boost etc I would also steer away from. The fruit is pre cut and cold... Warning there!!!

Oh my goodness - I'd never thought of that!! I have had heaps of Boost smoothies whilst prg Only twice this time though.

You live and learn though. I have at least one of these experiences every prg, where I eat or drink something and then later think 'oh oh...'

[LimeSlice]

By washing fruit, veggies, salad at home - do you mean rinse with cold water and dry? or do you mean scrub as you would a potato?

You just need to rinse them well and pat them dry, no scrubbing necessary

curious - what do you do when you are invited to someone's house and you aren't ready to tell them that you are pregnant...do you just hope that they practice proper food handling? do you avoid anything that has a chance of being iffy (like a salad)?

Ensure they practice proper food handling, most people actually do. If the food is cooked, make sure it is hot, if it is cold, make sure it is actually cold. If it is a dressed salad, make sure it is freshly made at home, not bought form a shop.

What about if they put feta cheese in the salad - do you pick it off (is that enough) or refuse the whole salad? See, I get very confused.

It is easy to get confused! But basic common sense is enough. If you can remove the offending item, do so, if not, simply dont eat the salad.

If you are really concerned though, I would host the dinner parties, rather than attend them until you are ready to tell people.

With eggs - I assume eggs cooked through are fine (like scrambled) but poached and other eggs with running yolks are not. Is this right?

That is correct.
You need to remember though that you should avoid things like homemade mayonaise and things made from raw eggs.

With re-heating rice/quinoa/cous cous and other foods that soak up a lot of water - I think I was told as long as it re-heated to steaming hot, then it is ok. Can someone let me know if this is correct.

You can reheat rice ONCE only, and it has to be within 24 hours. This will make sure you are safe. And yes, it must be STEAMING hot, make sure you stir it to see if it is evenly heated all the way through


PS - I mean my silly questions..

There is no such thing as a silly question

HTH

[Life is Good]

I am quite vigilant about what I eat and figure that, although rare, listeria infections need to happen to somebody and pretending that it won't be me seems somewhat wishful In my opinion, ingnorance is bliss until you are equipped with specific knowledge i.e. what you can and can't eat. Once you are, it is very difficult to go back and pretend you never heard the information. Flowerchild, very well said - I do share you opinions

On the whole re-heating front, I have a question that has bugged me from day one. No matter how much research I have done, I have never got an answer! According to the professionals, the rule for left-overs is to eat them within 12 - 24 (times seem to differ depending on sources) and to heat them until "piping hot". So this is what I have done for my entire pregnancy so far because I daren't tempt fate!

My question is: If listeria is killed by heating until piping hot, then why can't you keep left-overs for longer than the prescribed timeframe if you are going to heat it until piping hot anyway? Even if something is riddled with the listeria bacteria, would it all be killed if it is totally nuked?

[luna moth]

I am quite vigilant

Something of an understatement there, Sam!

I think to respond to the reheat question - by reheating to "piping hot" you kill a significant proportion of bacteria (say 99.994% - figure pulled out of my backside) If left for more than 12-24 hours, the bacteria have time to grow to much larger numbers, so that killing this proportion is no longer "safe"

Oh, yeah, and the fruit salad thing. I've never forgotten that from my food handling course - how many people wash melons? You figure "Oh, well, you don't eat the rind..." BUT you do use the same knife to cut through it as you do to cut the fruit. And when you buy a cut melon from a grocer, do you have any idea whether they have washed it? At the course, we were told that melon is a really high risk food for the immune-suppressed.
also that hospitals wash lettuce in a weak bleach solution. Mmmmmmm....

[Life is Good]

Thanks so much for such a helpful and logical answer, snugglybean Makes lots of sense...and yes, I have developed a listeria hysteria reputation lol!

[Emma1979]

hmmmmm i'm eating loads of ham and cold sliced meat like chicken loaf etc as we speak..... am i not meant to eat this? i can't remember not eating anything with my first pregnancy... i have also been eating pasta salad from coles... hmmmmmmmmmmmm. oh well will hope for the best.

[Arimeh]

I didn't know you couldn't have roast chooks from coles!!! Awwww.... I love them....

[Life is Good]

Arimeh, I had some once because they literally took it out of the oven, put in the bag and handed it to me. I went straight home and ate it (well some of it, anyway haha!) while it was still really hot. I think the problem is when the chooks stand around in their bags at room temperature for a period of time. Still best to just roast one of them yourself